Originally posted by MERCILOUS
So let's just ignore the characters other abilities right?
Strength : Spider-Man
Speed: Spider-Man
Reflexes: Spider-Man
Durability: Spider-Man
Jumping: Spider-Man
Agility: Spider-Man
Extra-senses, powers : Spider-Man
Intelligence: Batman, but SM is no idiot either
Experience: I think, but I am not sure, that SM has appeared in more comics that are in continuity, than Batman, but Batman has been longer around, so I give it to Batman. Only just, because both have been around for decades.
So, that makes SM 7, and Batman 2.
Did I forget anything ?
Well what a nice way to avoid the issue, here I thought that we were discussing which characters each of these two have beaten but if you really want to.
You forgot fighting ability (how convenient of you,) will power, resourcefullness, tactics, powers (argueably chi and sakki manipulation.) So I tie your 1 and add 4. That makes it 6 to 6.
I didn't forget a thing, my Lobo-worshipping friend.
I only mentioned the most important abilities, but if you insist:
1. willpower : equal. Both are extremely stubborn. No points here.
2. resourcefulness : nice try, but that is in the intelligence package. I already gave Batman a point there. Same for tactics.
3. powers (argueably chi and sakki manipulation) : oh man, you really are desperate if you throw that on the table. NO points for Batman, and if you really really insist on giving Batman some powers, give him something that would make a difference.
Originally posted by who?-kid
I didn't forget a thing, my Lobo-worshipping friend.I only mentioned the most important abilities, but if you insist:
In your opinion.
Originally posted by who?-kid
1. willpower : equal. Both are extremely stubborn. No points here.
You only wish
Originally posted by who?-kid
2. resourcefulness : nice try, but that is in the intelligence package. I already gave Batman a point there. Same for tactics.
How nice of you to group things together to your advantage. Are we assumming intellegence is knowledge? Or the ability to adapt? Both very different things. And tactic, the ability to plan, all of a sudden a good plan isn't important either?
Originally posted by who?-kid
3. powers (argueably chi and sakki manipulation) : oh man, you really are desperate if you throw that on the table. NO points for Batman, and if you really really insist on giving Batman some powers, give him something that would make a difference.
Batman can manipulate his chi allowing him to complete astounding feats of strength (for a human) and strike objects with incredible force causing no damage to himself. Sakki is "blood lust." Batman can project and control it causing an aura of fear around himself.
Originally posted by MERCILOUS
How nice of you to group things together to your advantage. Are we assumming intellegence is knowledge? Or the ability to adapt? Both very different things. And tactic, the ability to plan, all of a sudden a good plan isn't important either?
Intelligence will not keep you safe from two lightning fast fists who can punch through steel doors.
Batman can manipulate his chi allowing him to complete astounding feats of strength (for a human) and strike objects with incredible force causing no damage to himself. Sakki is "blood lust." Batman can project and control it causing an aura of fear around himself.
Originally posted by who?-kidIt isn't a game of chess they play, it's a fight...You know, seeing each other and beating the crap out of each other, those kinds of things.[/B]
Let's say you have two equal fighters, one goes in with a game plan and the other just hopes for the best, who's more likely to win?
Originally posted by who?-kid
Intelligence will not keep you safe from two lightning fast fists who can punch through steel doors.[/B]
But a fighting ability on par with anyone in the entire world will.
Originally posted by who?-kid
So much for the "Batman is cool because he's only human"-theory 😉 [/B]
Nothing out of the ordinary, Sakki and Chi are both said to have been used quite commonly in the Eastern world, and still are as displayed by those wonderful touring monks. But thanks for admitting my point stands.
Originally posted by MERCILOUS
Let's say you have two equal fighters, one goes in with a game plan and the other just hopes for the best, who's more likely to win?
BUT ! The problem in your theory is "two equal fighters" => the difference in physical abilities in this particular fight is so big, we can hardly say they are "equal fighters".
But a fighting ability on par with anyone in the entire world will.
Nothing out of the ordinary, Sakki and Chi are both said to have been used quite commonly in the Eastern world, and still are as displayed by those wonderful touring monks. But thanks for admitting I my point stands.
And concerning those travelling monks : I've seen better acts.
Originally posted by who?-kidThe guy with the plan should win 🙂 [/B]
Now you've just admited tactics count, thanks again.
Originally posted by who?-kid
BUT ! The problem in your theory is "two equal fighters" => the difference in physical abilities in this particular fight is so big, we can hardly say they are "equal fighters". [/B]
Right again who?-kid! That's a great point, Batman is a far superior fighter!
Originally posted by who?-kid
Again, when you roughly on the same level.1. I was being ironic.
2. You said it :"Sakki and Chi are both said to have been used quite commonly in the Eastern world". It is also said that Europe was a part of Atlantis. And that Zeus one night came to Earth 😉. And it has been said that the Tooth Fairy existed.And concerning those travelling monks : I've seen better acts. [/B]
But none more relevent.
All the Bat's supporters are going to hate this post but I'm prepared for all insulting responses.
Batman will be beaten badly by Spider-man because he is NOT capable of compensating for the Super-human abilities of Spider-man. Batman is a human so he doesn't have access to any feats of Super-human caliber at all. He may be able to raise the bar on what a human is considered capable of doing but only to the point of maximum human potential, perfect in every way possible straight down to genetic make-up. Batman has been branded as only human and the most powerful human ever will surely have the same label. "Only human" means that a limit has been set and it is far below what a superhuman has access to.
Comic books have characters that have fantasy abilities BUT the world that they live in is depicted as a real world that we could very well live in. It is not a world of cartoon logic where the laws of science and physics are cast aside in EVERY way. Even the most fantastic scenarios are explained using real world reasoning.
Batman is no exeption to the laws of nature that apply in the real or comic world. He has taken no serum to give him abilities beyond human level and was born with no mutant gene. He could have truly mastered every form of martial art with intense training but he takes no performance enhancing drugs.(venom)
Having said that, anything that he has done that the perfect human specimen wouldn't be capable of is contradictory to the statement-Batman is of the human race- UNLESS there is an immediate explanation.
for example, Superman is pissed off and goes to hit batman for the kill, hits him, Batman survives, then immediately Superman says " I couldn't kill him" or " I'm just toying with you ". It's a given that there is no way that a perfect human who has 100% of all human capabilities could survive any killing strike from Superman due to a layer of padded armor. A punch at half power would rupture everything inside a perfect human and send that human many many miles away. also without kryptonite no perfect human could move at a small fraction of Supermans Speed to defend themself from ANY attack of his choosing.
Spider-man is not a human BUT that doesn't mean that he has no limits. He can be killed by a bullet just like Batman. The obvious cannot be ignored when it comes down to who has the most relevant advantages in combat close or ranged. Spider-man can press ten tons and has Super-human durability due to non-human physiology. Batman cannot budge a ton and has a human physiology= No excess durability+ A very well armored but pliable suit= Some excess durability. But nothing that would protect his human insides from being liquified by a half strength kick or punch from a man who can lift 20,000 pounds.
Spider-man's speed and agility is by far superior to a PERFECT humans so Batman's limits would be made evident quickly. Spider-man has mastered a unique style of fighting ( who no-one else could duplicate )
that uses his strength, speed, and agility along with an advanced sense of balance and vision to compensate for fighting foes far MORE powererful than him. The spider-sense, heightened reflexes, and webbing versatility create a total package that a MAXIMUM POTENTIAL human would be useless against.
I've heard the rebutall that Batman's weapons will compensate and I strongly disagree after considering the fact that Spider-man has dodged ALL of the lethal blasts of firelord and those blasts dwarf the speed and match the accuracy of anything Batman can produce. Batman has nothing to depend on to give him a victory except for his weapons and a contradictory assesment of what he's capable of.
😮💨
My posts are long because I don't own a computer and I have a lot to say. sorry but this must be said.
NO ONE REPRESENTING EITHER SIDE HAS TO BE A HARDCORE FAN TO NOT WANT ANTHING GIVEN TO OR TAKEN FROM THE CHARACTERS WITHOUT ANY LOGICAL EXPLANATION.for example I was not pleased with the organic webbing in the movie and I doubt any other spidey fan was either. But I was positive that the fight with Ock was represented perfectly. Batman can only attain a level of power and speed that is inarguably inferior to a guy who began his career at 20x as strong as the peak human ( Cap. America maxes at 1000 pounds). Spidey wouldn't need much experience to jump right on Batman(even if he evaded the first leap Spidey's fast enough to leap again.) and rip his head off. He has years and years experience and can end this with skill and not luck. I take a little pride in saying that I know the Batman character well enough to be able to tell when he's being reduced to Tom&Jerry logic and Spider-Man as well. ( His cartoon series was a total disgrace and a stain on his reputation) When you read a comic book you're not supposed to say "That couldn't happen". You're given detailed explanations on how these events could very well happen. Batman beating Spider-man in a hypothetical battle? That couldn't happen. At least not at over 5-10% of the time
Originally posted by who?-kid
Yeah, but both Spider-Man and Batman have appeared in sooo many comics, that it's not that hard to find a battle in which a character was humiliated or so.It's a vicious circle !
To avoid that, it's better only to focus on their best fights. And a Batman on his best day can not defeat a Spider-Man on his best day. Why ? Because SM on his best day can hold his own against the Hulk, while Batman on his best day will be farted away by Hulk
It is a vicious circle with spiderman getting off worse than batman. And you know what I mean. Batman on his best day beat superman while spiderman I am sorry to say would not. You see batman on his best day is when he has info on who ever and he has studied that person. See what I mean. As a matter of fact that will never happen because he will not even have to fight.
Intelligence will not keep you safe from two lightning fast fists who can punch through steel doors.
I wonder how batman has been able to avoid deadly blows from beings who are ten times stronger than he is. Blows from the likes of a mind controlled flash, superman, wonderwoman and so on and so forth. I can tell one thing batman did not use is super strength or speed.
"I wonder how batman has been able to avoid deadly blows from beings who are ten times stronger than he is. Blows from the likes of a mind controled flash, superman, wonderwoman and so on and so forthe. I can tell one thing batman did not use is super strength or speed."
I can tell u how he did it...inconsistent DC writing
Did anyone read the Mister's posts? It was too long for me, can anyone give me the jist of it?
Anyway, I did read the part about "human limitations" and how it was impossible for Batman to do anything to spidey. Just like it was impossible for Punisher, DD and several others.. oh wait, that's not how it happened at all is it? Oh well, silly me!