Captain America vs. Wolverine

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
You know what you obvoulsy dont know what the hell you're talking about and you are a complete waste of time. Im not even going to give you the time of day.

Wolverine has a reduced HF and Cap has stunned Professor Hulk and KOed Namor underwater. Both those guys are harder to stun or KO than Wolverine presently.

and is much slower and less skilled. The thing that you fail to realize is that wolverine WILL land a lick on cap and its most definitely going to be a claw stab. The only way that cap could prevent wolverine from tagging him is by being a lot more faster then him in which is isnt.

Even though wolverine healing factor has been reduce, he could still manage from a hit from cap but the same cant be said for captain america. A stab any where on cap body would affect the fight but again we all know that its going to be more then one slice, for every hit that captain america can land wolverine could also land one. For every 10 hits that cap get one claw swipe could equal 20 of them. The only way I can see cap winning this is through a plot device. Wolverine is everything cap is but with a healing factor and a one shot tool.

I agree, cap would fight and fight hard, cap would give anyone a fight, when I say anyone, I mean anyone (not galactus, people seem to over exaggerate on people post) but its kind of hard to beat your equal that has a weapon. Any other street leveler I would give cap the majority but this fight he's going to lose more then win.

Originally posted by jinzin
How was Cap unaware of Moonstone being there when he's talking full sentences to Wolverine about his success over Cap?

And there's nothing to indicate that Cap was surprised in the least... 😬

"Must move! nnnn---"

He knew it was coming and couldn't do anything about it. He wasn't about to defend himself against Wolverine.

I said he did'nt expect to get shot in the neck with a stun dart. Yes he was suprised.

"Must move! nnn----?!?" Note the question marks.

Anyway I dont have a problem if you think he would not have made it in time. I think its ubjective he only got into that position because he was trying to talk to him.

Originally posted by jinzin

And.. Uh.. no I didn't. 🤨

If you think that Wolverine would need to do some months of training to get 5/10 gainst Cap with skill obvoulsy you think that Cap is more skilled.

Originally posted by carver9
and is much slower and less skilled. The thing that you fail to realize is that wolverine WILL land a lick on cap and its most definitely going to be a claw stab. The only way that cap could prevent wolverine from tagging him is by being a lot more faster then him in which is isnt.

Im aware of that im just point out than he can KO him not that he wil win the majority. Cap is capable of hitting Wolverine many times and he could get a KO

Originally posted by carver9

Even though wolverine healing factor has been reduce, he could still manage from a hit from cap but the same cant be said for captain america. A stab any where on cap body would affect the fight but again we all know that its going to be more then one slice, for every hit that captain america can land wolverine could also land one. For every 10 hits that cap get one claw swipe could equal 20 of them. The only way I can see cap winning this is through a plot device. Wolverine is everything cap is but with a healing factor and a one shot tool.

Yes I know.

Originally posted by carver9

I agree, cap would fight and fight hard, cap would give anyone a fight, when I say anyone, I mean anyone (not galactus, people seem to over exaggerate on people post) but its kind of hard to beat your equal that has a weapon. Any other street leveler I would give cap the majority but this fight he's going to lose more then win.

Wolverine is not equal to him in skill he wins via HF and claws. Wolverine 7/10.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
I said he did'nt expect to get shot in the neck with a stun dart. Yes he was suprised.

"Must move! nnn----?!?" Note the question marks.

Anyway I dont have a problem if you think he would not have made it in time. I think its ubjective he only got into that position because he was trying to talk to him.

If you think that Wolverine would need to do some months of training to get 5/10 gainst Cap with skill obvoulsy you think that Cap is more skilled.

Im aware of that im just point out than he can KO him not that he wil win the majority. Cap is capable of hitting Wolverine many times and he could get a KO

Yes I know.

Wolverine is not equal to him in skill he wins via HF and claws. Wolverine 7/10.

marvel says otherwise. Cap and wolverine are equals, hell marvel say that wolverine is the best there is but I think that they are equals. In the fighting skill scale that was made by marvel, both cap and wolverine is at the top which is 7. It was stated that wolverine mastered every fighting style on the planet but it didnt state that same thing for cap but cap has mastered every fighting style that he knows which put him in the same league as logan.

I agree, if there is any street level out there that could get some wins out of wolverine, it is cap. Cap is a powerful character and again he will put up a hell of a fight. Thats why I dont understand why in the hell people are trying to give spiderman the majority over him. Spiderman just isnt skilled enough. Whoever is saying 10/10 needs to rethink there answer because thats impossible with cap.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
I said he did'nt expect to get shot in the neck with a stun dart. Yes he was suprised.

"Must move! nnn----?!?" Note the question marks.

Anyway I dont have a problem if you think he would not have made it in time. I think its ubjective he only got into that position because he was trying to talk to him.

Fair enough, but I think he was trying reason because force was doing no good.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
If you think that Wolverine would need to do some months of training to get 5/10 gainst Cap with skill obvoulsy you think that Cap is more skilled.

It's not about not having skills, it's about what's comfortable to a character.

I know sword forms I learned 5 years ago, but I couldn't do it perfect right off the top of my head if my teacher asked. Does that mean I then don't know it? No.. it just means that I've grown accustomed not to practice it because I haven't had to.

Wolverine's gotten lazy and careless.. He still pulls off impressive feats when he has to but he doesn't have to a majority of the time.

His wealth of hand to hand knolwedge is more versatile and greater than Caps as is his experience.
But Cap's a natural at h2h, and Wolverine's used to fighting with claws and a HF. that changes the way he fights, it doesn't detract from his knowledge though.

Wolverine would also need the month or two to readjust to fighting strictly without claws. Seeing as he's been using them for the better part of 4 decades that causes great discrepencies with his ability to negotiate reach against his oponnents and such.

There's a wealth of reasons why he'd lose 6/10 to Cap if he was simply stripped of his claws and healing factor at the drop of a hat, Cap being more skilled ain't one of em.

Originally posted by carver9
marvel says otherwise. Cap and wolverine are equals, hell marvel say that wolverine is the best there is but I think that they are equals. In the fighting skill scale that was made by marvel, both cap and wolverine is at the top which is 7. It was stated that wolverine mastered every fighting style on the planet but it didnt state that same thing for cap but cap has mastered every fighting style that he knows which put him in the same league as logan.

That proves absolutely nothing. Marvel have been saying that Cap has peak human speed for years ie his maximum speed is 35 mile per hour.

Originally posted by carver9

I agree, if there is any street level out there that could get some wins out of wolverine, it is cap. Cap is a powerful character and again he will put up a hell of a fight. Thats why I dont understand why in the hell people are trying to give spiderman the majority over him. Spiderman just isnt skilled enough. Whoever is saying 10/10 needs to rethink there answer because thats impossible with cap.

You do realise that if they were equal in skill Cap would not get any wins?

Originally posted by jinzin

Fair enough, but I think he was trying reason because force was doing no good.

Yes but he only punched him once, he could have posibly Koed him but yes since Wolverine was mind-controlled he thought talking was an easier option.

Originally posted by jinzin

Did you not also read the reasoning for WHY he would need the training?

It's not about not having skills, it's about what's comfortable to a character.

I know sword forms I learned 5 years ago, but I couldn't do it perfect right off the top of my head if my teacher asked. Does that mean I then don't know it? No.. it just means that I've grown accustomed not to practice it because I haven't had to.

Wolverine's gotten lazy and careless.. He still pulls off impressive feats when he has to but he doesn't have to a majority of the time.

His wealth of hand to hand knolwedge is more versatile and greater than Caps as is his experience.
But Cap's a natural at h2h, and Wolverine's used to fighting with claws and a HF. that changes the way he fights, it doesn't detract from his knowledge though.

Wolverine would also need the month or two to readjust to fighting strictly without claws. Seeing as he's been using them for the better part of 4 decades that causes great discrepencies with his ability to negotiate reach against his oponnents and such.

There's a wealth of reasons why he'd lose 6/10 to Cap if he was simply stripped of his claws and healing factor at the drop of a hat, Cap being more skilled ain't one of em.

Look im not going to get into how much knowledge Wolverine has. Knowledge does not make you more skillful.

Ive been saying for hundred years one of the reasons why Wolverine is less skillful is because he is used to using claws. If hes more comfortable using claws and needs to readjust his skills that obvoulsy means he less skillful at H2H.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Look im not going to get into how much knowledge Wolverine has. Knowledge does not make you more skillful.

Ive been saying for hundred years one of the reasons why Wolverine is less skillful is because he is used to using claws. If hes more comfortable using claws and needs to readjust his skills that obvoulsy means he less skillful at H2H.

A skill is a learned application and Wolverine hasn't lost any of what he's learned. Like you said he's more comfortable fighting with different tools. He'd need to readjust away from those comfort levels, that doesn't make Cap more skilled.

That's like me saying Venom can't use his symbiote very well because he opts for slugfest mode in 99% of his fights. 😬

They are obviously both very skilled at combat. Whether who is the better fighter is just a matter of opinion for the most part I believe. Also, its not like either of them would be THAT much superior to the other.

The way I see it is that Wolverine can naturally afford to make a few mistakes (not major mistakes obviously), the same cannot be said for the Captain.

8/10 Wolverine IMHO.

Originally posted by jinzin
What you're saying doesn't make any sense. Wolverine's less skilled because he's used to having tools he won't have in a h2h fight?

A skill is a learned application and Wolverine hasn't lost any of what he's learned. Like you said he's more comfortable fighting with different tools. He'd need to readjust away from those comfort levels, that doesn't make Cap more skilled.

That's like me saying Venom can't use his symbiote very well because he opts for slugfest mode in 99% of his fights. 😬

Im not going to argue with you. Im asking you to politely think about what you are saying, pretty please with sugar on top.

Originally posted by Placidity
They are obviously both very skilled at combat. Whether who is the better fighter is just a matter of opinion for the most part I believe. Also, its not like either of them would be THAT much superior to the other.

The way I see it is that Wolverine can naturally afford to make a few mistakes (not major mistakes obviously), the same cannot be said for the Captain.

8/10 Wolverine IMHO.

If Wolverine was supeior or equal to Cap in skill Cap would not win anything.

What if he repeatedly got smashed in the head while down? Eventually a KO I would think. Keyword: Eventually.

Originally posted by Battlehammer

Wait now your trying to tell me he was not min controlled and was doing it by his own free will?

Sorry, but it a fatc mind control effects ones skills

He was acting completely mindless and unrational during the fight. Druidmond knows nothing of wolverine berserker nor his fighting skills.

They saw Logan's performance on the other wolfs and Druidmond was vastlyimpressed by his abilities. So yes and with Druidmond mastery of the mind it isn't that far feached to have checked Logans mind. Actually know there is no fact that a mind control effects one skills. Its just the assumption given the moonknight was mind controlled as well and he did extremely well against Cap and bring proper prep to put down Logan.

Again your assumption without actual proof.

You obviously know little of berserker wolverine.

He retains all his fighting skills and intellect while berserker and does not act like a mindless beast which he was acting like during his fight with capt. It also amps his stats which were not amp during his fight with capt or capt be dead. He also next to impossiable to control while berserker.

Yeah just like I know little that Logan had a mind of a wolf. Again I know that Logan berserk makes him stronger IIRC Xavier even stated his mind is like a calculator in that state. You only assume he wasn't amped because Cap did so well. But Cap can somewhat amp himself too as its been stated with his sheer will/adrenaline because the SSS makes him recieve more he can surpass Peak-Human. Plus his mind is enhanced unlike Logan.

Capt speculated he was berserker, because Logan was attacking him. How the hell would capt know what berserker wolverine looks like? He did not even see a berserker wolverine untill wolverine origins issue 5 which happen years after this fight.

Cap has a enhanced memory and lets face it he reads up on most files on character from Avengers headquarters. That fact that he mentions berserk shows he knows about Logans abilities.

Most of my comics are in storage and I can not get to them. I was attempting to dl the run, but the link failed.

My stances is that Logan was not berserker. He was not in his right mind. He was acting wilded and unskilled.

Which is how Logan seems to act under berserker to the common eye. Fact of the matter is Wolverine was him self but just doing the bidding of Dr.Druidmond just like Moonknight.

[QUOTE]What?

\you mean like logan sneaking attacking DD during secret war which never happened..................and I still wondering why you stated such a thing

I meant after Civil war in Fallen Son logan attempted that on Daredevil. You first thought Logan had the mind of a wolf.

And that was wrong as neither did Moonknight who was being controlled. Now you claim it wasn't berserk despite no evidence.

Now you argue his skill and berserk was gone yet Moonknight attained all his skills while under the influence and did well against Cap. So now that is a wash for you. Seriously. You lost the mind of the wolf angle since you have no proof. But now you lost the loses skill and berserk angle. You don't have much to use now for this regard.

Originally posted by Daredevil1
They saw Logan's performance on the other wolfs and Druidmond was vastlyimpressed by his abilities. So yes and with Druidmond mastery of the mind it isn't that far feached to have checked Logans mind. Actually know there is no fact that a mind control effects one skills. Its just the assumption given the moonknight was mind controlled as well and he did extremely well against Cap and bring proper prep to put down Logan.

Again your assumption without actual proof.

Yeah just like I know little that Logan had a mind of a wolf. Again I know that Logan berserk makes him stronger IIRC Xavier even stated his mind is like a calculator in that state. You only assume he wasn't amped because Cap did so well. But Cap can somewhat amp himself too as its been stated with his sheer will/adrenaline because the SSS makes him recieve more he can surpass Peak-Human. Plus his mind is enhanced unlike Logan.

Cap has a enhanced memory and lets face it he reads up on most files on character from Avengers headquarters. That fact that he mentions berserk shows he knows about Logans abilities.

I meant after Civil war in Fallen Son logan attempted that on Daredevil. You first thought Logan had the mind of a wolf.

And that was wrong as neither did Moonknight who was being controlled. Now you claim it wasn't berserk despite no evidence.

Now you argue his skill and berserk was gone yet Moonknight attained all his skills while under the influence and did well against Cap. So now that is a wash for you. Seriously. You lost the mind of the wolf angle since you have no proof. But now you lost the loses skill and berserk angle. You don't have much to use now for this regard.

Bruv im pretty sure in that issue they said that Wolverine had the mind of the werewolf. Its ages since I read it but it kinda stuck in my mind because I kinda got the feeling the writer was making a point. I could be wrong though.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Bruv im pretty sure in that issue they said that Wolverine had the mind of the werewolf. Its ages since I read it but it kinda stuck in my mind because I kinda got the feeling the writer was making a point. I could be wrong though.

Dude I just looked through it and no were to my knowledge was it stated. If you gladly remember the scene on who said it and around the time were I'll gladly check and concede my point if its there.

But so far it has not been there.

Originally posted by Daredevil1
Dude I just looked through it and no were to my knowledge was it stated. If you gladly remember the scene on who said it and around the time were I'll gladly check and concede my point if its there.

But so far it has not been there.

Well like I said it was ages ago, so yeah I'll take your word for it....sure it wasn't stated in the issue straight after...if not....yeah baby! w00t

I also agree people assume that because somebody is mind-controlled it afffects their fighting ability, this is not always the case.

Okay, a few things. First, Wolverine is one of Marvel's elite fighters. Not only is this stated in his biography, but it's been demonstrated countless times in cannon. People who don't acknowledge that have either not read the relevant issues or are simply choosing to be ignorant. Secondly, Wolverine has demonstrated an ability to defeat opponents that are faster/more skilled such as Ogun when he's berserk. For the record, I think only someone like Ogun would be more skilled. He also retains his skill while he's berserk (the whole performing Olympic routine while beating four chess players in his head thing) and is stronger/faster while he is berserk. So I guess the conclusion I'm drawing here is that he would win based on the fact that one shot is all he needs to finish Cap off for good

Oh, and the last time they fought, Wolverine out-fought Cap pretty badly and showed overall that he is superior.

Originally posted by The Real Wolvie

Oh, and the last time they fought, Wolverine out-fought Cap pretty badly and showed overall that he is superior.

Thats a goddamn low showing for Cap. Cap fought off a beserk Wolverine how the **** is a starving and sleep deprived going to beat Cap via skill when Cap is superior via skill?

The writer was stroking Wolverine bigtime.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Thats a goddamn low showing for Cap. Cap fought off a beserk Wolverine how the **** is a starving and sleep deprived going to beat Cap via skill when Cap is superior via skill?

The writer was stroking Wolverine bigtime.

Originally posted by Ha-Son
We've been through this before. Cap did not fight off werewolf Wolverine, he almost got killed.

The point I was trying to make was not that Cap beat Wolverine but that he did better against a more dangerous Wolverine so hes not getting beaten by a weakened Wolverine.

Wow you actually sit at your computer waiting for me to post.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
The point I was trying to make was not that Cap beat Wolverine but that he did better against a more dangerous Wolverine so hes not getting beaten by a weakened Wolverine.

Wow you actually sit at your computer waiting for me to post.

Originally posted by Ha-Son
Yes, because im a troll.

Yeah I know.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Yeah I know.