Originally posted by whobdamandogHe's pinned him to a wall and is spraying him with more webbing and he's not trying to incapacitate him?
Now your being a bit misleading. It's fairly obvious that he's not taking the battle seriously based on the expression "Now that was funny" It's fairly obvioius that he is not trying to completely incapacitate him with the webbing..
Originally posted by whobdamandog
Now your being a bit misleading. It's fairly obvious that he's not taking the battle seriously based on the expression "Now that was funny" It's fairly obvioius that he is not trying to completely incapacitate him with the webbing..
Right, slamming him against a wall with webbing is in no way a serious attempt. You're being more than a bit misleading.
Originally posted by Wanderer259
But how would you change the direction without running to either side to make the line go taut again? If he's rushing towards Spidey, the line's slack will keep increasing. If Spidey stands in one spot and moves his arm that way or this way, it'll do nothing but move the bit of string Spidey has in his hand.I have, however, made a miscalculation in distance here, but that makes my point all the more valid. At long distance, his web-shooters not only could be dodged, but they also lose their ability to move in a straight line at 60 feet, which according to you, is a pretty short amount of distance. Hell, all three of the trio could clear 20 yards relatively easily just by running, if not by leaping as well. If Spidey decides to go long-range, or to reiterate an earilier used example, stand on top of a building and rain webbing down on his opponents, he'd hit nothing, as his web-lines simply aren't that accurate.
He's accurate though his web lines aren't on their own, they are like a squirt gun, but Peter has had much experience shooting and pinning small objects from far away, large men would be easier to pin down.
Have you ever went target shooting, and tried to hit a small bottle or something, thats not far away, or a coke can? It can be difficult, especially in windy conditions, a large man however no. Peter could do both with ease.
Also on the slack, the webbing is more or less a rope, superstrong though it is. He could swing them around his head, but he couldn't lift them overhead first, because the webbing isnt' rigid, so I see your point there.
Originally posted by Wanderer259
I saw, and I agree, somewhat. It, however, is the only number I have to go on and there's really nothing comic-wise to dispute it, unlike the faulty physics attributed to Spidey's webbing whilst contradicting itself with the Hulk having problems pulling it apart.In any case, really, it does show that Spidey doesn't have pre-cog, but an insanely swift reaction speed. Basically, with his Spider-Sense guiding him, Peter's reaction speed is technically .003 seconds, which is just unimaginably fast.
That is considered knowing before though, so its a watered down precog...
As far as another thing, MMX pointed out that he can choose what is the greatest threat, which is very useful in this situation.
Originally posted by MERCILOUS
I see you didn't bother reading the last few pages of this thread since you've posted, I suggest you do, there are some enlightening arguements on them.Secret Wars! HAHAHAHHAHAHA! You mean where his powers where augmented while being on battle world?
And Thor had peek human speed at the time at best.
Wanderer and marvel don't seem to agree, they seem to think what I've thought all along. But you would have known that had you bother to do any reading.
Another gross misunderstanding on your part. He originally planned to stay until the webbing dissolved so as to save himself some displeasure but found that he had to break free and did so immediatley.
Sorry bub, (hehe i said bub) you either stick to marvel stats or you don't at all. Your double standard here just isn't helping you.
And yet that's the way they're portrayed in all of Spidey's books? So which are correct, the books, or the stats which you say we should use but then only selectively when it benifits you? And Wolvie has been described to move faster than the eye can see. Several Notches? Now that's just a blatant lie.
And yet you chose to ignore my question...
Out of character? Well that's not the forum rules, but if you insist, Wolvie kills in one hit, Cap uses his shield to decapitate Spidey, and DD times a punch to Spidey's heart so as to kill in one hit.
So you mention Secret Wars but fail to realize that indeed they have? Are you sure you read it?
You seem to enjoy doing this so "refer to the above"
again, refer to the above.
Even though I just owned you with your own arguements.
Even though there's an instance where (3 in Wolvie's case) where each of these heros has owned Spidey and your best arguement is stats which you don't even beleive. And I'm the fanboy, sure buddy.
Here we go with these " coolenss arguments again."
You like the characters fine, you like human like characters with skill, fine, but you consistently try to put down spiderman as a guy that gets owned by kingpin, and wolvie as a guy that beat namor in a one shot.
I'm not looking at the "wow" factor of these characters, I'm looking at facts, subject A and subject B, looking at what all is capable of.
All your conclusions are "they're better", they beat xxxx, cap is this or that, which stats neither convertly or overtly how they can win, which they can, but its only in your subjective mind. You've yet to refute any of the questions and chances of something happening, but resort to flaming and trolling others opinions as usual, 2 can play that game boy.
There has been situations where spiderman has owned greater than what the trio has to offer, sinister six comes to mind, but you don't see it as my only argument.
Its made to look good, Icons always put up good fights against guys they shouldn't, your point? You've yet to say "how they'd win in a hypothetical debate, so you point to a when argument. You think spiderman can't hurt any of them anyway, for some odd reason.
DD: said peter is better than him, wolvie said peter could beat him, and cap is no different here.
DD and Cap are like 8/10 for spiderman, and the fact that he puts up good fights against multiple enemies, and owns them with one hit (cap and DD)_, this match will go down fast for one or the other, period.
Originally posted by Pointinel
cordera do you really believe he can take this three?if you do, my actions would be
"Rolling on the floor, laughing my ass off."
The thing people are missing about this whole scenario is that despite the feats of the "near human trio" they are ONLY human and Wolverine is only slightly above human as far as physical capabilities go.
In the comics there is nothing off limits when it comes to " What can they DO?" because they can do ANYTHING period. It's fiction so anything can happen whether it's likely or not. Cap could have his stats changed tomorrow. Buuuuuuut..
The stats are what damns the trio because we're not trying to come up with a plot where they will beat the odds we're trying to figure out whether the odds are in their favor or not.
The odds are stacked highly against the trio due to their lack of strength and durability.
The only way that you can say that they have a chance is to dismiss the stats and say that they can do ANYTHING and take EVERYTHING as they do and will continue to due in the comics.
Somebody who's weaker and faster than their opponent can defeat them with that speed alone and nobody on the team has superhuman speed. Spidey does.
Somebody who's 10x stronger and slower than their opponent will destroy their opponent if they get their hands on them. (if their opponent is pressing 300 lbs and they're pressing 3000 lbs).
Spider-man is benching 20,000 lbs and his adversaries combined can't lift 3000. He's solid and even experienced blows are not going to take the same toll on him as they would someone who's only halfway as strong as him.
His experience level is equal to the trios as well and his webbing is capable of incapacitating humans and near human opponents otherwise it's been misrepresented. I dare anyone who keeps saying that the organic webbing is weaker to prove it with a stat instead of just displaying that same picture of Wolverine being a superhuman when he needs to be. (like standing while taking a punch from Namor)
I think what most people are doing is just assuming that just being a comic HERO is the power to always win and since there are three heroes vs on then Spider-man is beaten by the numbers + hero power. 3 heroes vs one in the comics usually means that the one is in the wrong or that three are in a trance. There is no right or wrong in this fight so more hero power doesn't count, it's not a factor.
These three are slower and far far far weaker than Spider-man has been for at least 23 years of his life.
He knows how to use his powers in synch with his weapon and when he's fighting to the death (bloodlust doesn't mean enraged) then he's a very very deadly opponent for these three slower weaker opponents. He's not trying to talk his friends out of fighting with him, he's trying to kill them because he want's them dead and vice versa.
Add in that he can walk on walls & ceilings and attack off of a web swing with even greater speed than a leap, he's got them all beat in maneuverability. The trio need to fight him in a field to put the odds more in their favor.
The odd's are not in the trios favor when they are weaker, slower, have less maneuverability and are in a domed arena fighting someone who is as experienced as they are ( due to having access to UNIQUE powers) and is 20x as strong as the strongest one on their team.
Oh yeah... I forgot about the spider-sense 😮💨
Exactly, thats the point there, if this is looked at as subject A and subject B, and not looked at like, he's an icon!! Then it would make more sense.
If these three guys were all no names, and it was just a list of what one can do versus the other, spiderman wins this fight, right here on paper.
Going by intangibles and plot devices in a comic, the trio win.
Couldn't have said it better myself.
Originally posted by The MISTERThe same stats that have Spiderman's webbing being weaker than High grade steel, or Doc Ock's tentacles moving slower than baseball pitches?
The thing people are missing about this whole scenario is that despite the feats of the "near human trio" they are ONLY human and Wolverine is only slightly above human as far as physical capabilities go.In the comics there is nothing off limits when it comes to " What can they DO?" because they can do ANYTHING period. It's fiction so anything can happen whether it's likely or not. Cap could have his stats changed tomorrow. Buuuuuuut..
The stats are what damns the trio
Originally posted by The MISTERSpiderman is more durable than Wolverine?
because we're not trying to come up with a plot where they will beat the odds we're trying to figure out whether the odds are in their favor or not.The odds are stacked highly against the trio due to their lack of strength and durability.
Originally posted by The MISTERSo in this case we discard what they do beyond what is in their described abilities, despite the complete glaring flaws within the described abilities such as what I described above?
The only way that you can say that they have a chance is to dismiss the stats and say that they can do ANYTHING and take EVERYTHING as they do and will continue to due in the comics.
Originally posted by The MISTERBut we don't know by how much more.
Somebody who's weaker and faster than their opponent can defeat them with that speed alone and nobody on the team has superhuman speed. Spidey does.
Originally posted by The MISTERNot always. . . not if the person is fast enough and can get passed the other's durability.
Somebody who's 10x stronger and slower than their opponent will destroy their opponent if they get their hands on them. (if their opponent is pressing 300 lbs and they're pressing 3000 lbs).
Originally posted by The MISTERBecause he has some sort of invulnerability as well?
Spider-man is benching 20,000 lbs and his adversaries combined can't lift 3000. He's solid and even experienced blows are not going to take the same toll on him as they would someone who's only halfway as strong as him.
Originally posted by The MISTERIncluding Cap and Wolvies?
His experience level is equal to the trios as well
Originally posted by The MISTERWhat's the stat on the tensile strength of his webbing?
and his webbing is capable of incapacitating humans and near human opponents otherwise it's been misrepresented. I dare anyone who keeps saying that the organic webbing is weaker to prove it with a stat
120 pounds per square millimeter
120 (pounds / (millimeters squared)) = 38.7096 short tons per (square inch)
64.4693 tonf/in2 (US) ton force (short) per square inch is the tensile strength of high grade steel.
High grade steel is 64, Spiderman's webbing stat is 39.
64>39
Originally posted by The MISTER
instead of just displaying that same picture of Wolverine being a superhuman when he needs to be. (like standing while taking a punch from Namor)
Originally posted by The MISTERSo numbers, discarding the who and what, doesn't matter in a fight? . . right. . .
I think what most people are doing is just assuming that just being a comic HERO is the power to always win and since there are three heroes vs on then Spider-man is beaten by the numbers + hero power. 3 heroes vs one in the comics usually means that the one is in the wrong or that three are in a trance. There is no right or wrong in this fight so more hero power doesn't count, it's not a factor.
Originally posted by The MISTERSpiderman's 41?
These three are slower and far far far weaker than Spider-man has been for at least 23 years of his life.
Originally posted by The MISTER"He fights the way I want him to. And so do his opponents"
He knows how to use his powers in synch with his weapon and when he's fighting to the death (bloodlust doesn't mean enraged) then he's a very very deadly opponent for these three slower weaker opponents.
Originally posted by The MISTERSo no more sucker punch webbing shots of wolverine?
He's not trying to talk his friends out of fighting with him, he's trying to kill them because he want's them dead and vice versa.
Originally posted by The MISTERBecause the trio can't hide behind objects or in buildings. . .
Add in that he can walk on walls & ceilings and attack off of a web swing with even greater speed than a leap, he's got them all beat in maneuverability. The trio need to fight him in a field to put the odds more in their favor.
Originally posted by The MISTERI still doubt the experience thing. . .
The odd's are not in the trios favor when they are weaker, slower, have less maneuverability and are in a domed arena fighting someone who is as experienced as they are ( due to having access to UNIQUE powers) and is 20x as strong as the strongest one on their team.
Originally posted by The MISTERWhich has been discussed in detail previously.
Oh yeah... I forgot about the spider-sense 😮💨
I wonder if anyone will actually bother to try to argue with this anymore, no doubt there will be fanboys who still think by some strange miracle Wolverine has a chance, I mean besides the obvious fact that in comics anyone can beat anyone under the right circumstances. I'm fairly satisfied that this is now dead though I must admit I find it hilarious just how many people admitted on here that even if they thought the trio would win, they accepted that if spidey took them on one by one then he'd take them down, and yet there is still a running Spidey versus Wolverine thread. Does this make sense to anyone else cos I fail to see the logic.
Originally posted by FarseerIf you had a better grasp of what logic actually was it might not seem as strange to you.
I wonder if anyone will actually bother to try to argue with this anymore, no doubt there will be fanboys who still think by some strange miracle Wolverine has a chance, I mean besides the obvious fact that in comics anyone can beat anyone under the right circumstances. I'm fairly satisfied that this is now dead though I must admit I find it hilarious just how many people admitted on here that even if they thought the trio would win, they accepted that if spidey took them on one by one then he'd take them down, and yet there is still a running Spidey versus Wolverine thread. Does this make sense to anyone else cos I fail to see the logic.
Originally posted by Farseer
I wonder if anyone will actually bother to try to argue with this anymore, no doubt there will be fanboys who still think by some strange miracle Wolverine has a chance, I mean besides the obvious fact that in comics anyone can beat anyone under the right circumstances. I'm fairly satisfied that this is now dead though I must admit I find it hilarious just how many people admitted on here that even if they thought the trio would win, they accepted that if spidey took them on one by one then he'd take them down, and yet there is still a running Spidey versus Wolverine thread. Does this make sense to anyone else cos I fail to see the logic.
I fail to see it too, you got me there...
Its fanboys, thats all you need to know.
Originally posted by Creshosk
The same stats that have Spiderman's webbing being weaker than High grade steel, or Doc Ock's tentacles moving slower than baseball pitches?Spiderman is more durable than Wolverine?
So in this case we discard what they do beyond what is in their described abilities, despite the complete glaring flaws within the described abilities such as what I described above?
But we don't know by how much more.
Not always. . . not if the person is fast enough and can get passed the other's durability.
Because he has some sort of invulnerability as well?
Including Cap and Wolvies?
What's the stat on the tensile strength of his webbing?
120 pounds per square millimeter
120 (pounds / (millimeters squared)) = 38.7096 short tons per (square inch)
64.4693 tonf/in2 (US) ton force (short) per square inch is the tensile strength of high grade steel.
High grade steel is 64, Spiderman's webbing stat is 39.
64>39
So numbers, discarding the who and what, doesn't matter in a fight? . . right. . .
Spiderman's 41?
"He fights the way I want him to. And so do his opponents"
So no more sucker punch webbing shots of wolverine?
Because the trio can't hide behind objects or in buildings. . .
I still doubt the experience thing. . .
Which has been discussed in detail previously.
All of these questions are answered with a damned question, or are irrelevant, and just blah blah banter.
Which is why I'm waiting for a certain someone...