Originally posted by Scoobless
note the complete lack of insults at people or charactersand captjk, the only thing i'd like to add to your earlier post is that it wasn't just england the US finally joined the war to help
First off, most excellent. No insults. Thank you.
Secondly, I realize that. Scotland (your home country I believe; very beautiful place too, I might add), was also in the game, as were many, many other countries. I simply said England as most people recognize it as America's most prominent ally (then AND now). No slight intended.
Originally posted by jinzin
"no he can't" or "no they can't" or "spider man would win" doesn't dismantle our arguements you loon! lol.and what circumstances?! it's not like the trio is fighting in a tag team, or with a hand behind their backs, he only "circumstance" is spidey being outnumbered, out gunned, and outclassed, thus getting his ass kicked.
so what if these guys are peak human (although logan is still debatable) they all fight guys Times more powerful, stronger, dangerous, than spiderman and come out on top most of the time, (Like i said spidey does too) but the fact that all you have to fall back on is "their peak humans" therefore they will lose is utterly ridiculous.
THE END? yeah it will be the end for spidey after this ass whompin.
Well I believe these facts to be a little bit more than "no he can't" "yes he can" but you tell me what you think of them...
*note I've posted this before...
Spiderman has proven consistantly to be able too..
Avoid multiple bullets while being fired at...
Avoid multiple people on Strength/Speed levels greater than Cap/Wolvie/DD(ie sinister six..Syndicate Sinister...the X-men..etc)
Detect suprise/sneak attacks on a pre cognitive level...
Lift cars, tanks(in an old issue, can't remember which one), and destroy concrete walls/buildings with his fists, lift massive amounts of rubble...
Jump up 30 to 40 feet in the air..and across buildings...
Withstand blows from the Hulk, Namor, Thing, Morlun, Rhino..etc..etc...etc...
Nigh indestructable webbing..strong enough to hold the likes of the Hulk, Thanos, Colossus..etc..
keep in mind..he does stuff like this when he's not going all out.....
Now its time for my best JK impression..lol...
The Trio looses...deal with it!!!!(joke)
Originally posted by whobdamandog
BWahahaha.. more crap...
Dude, don't you ever get a hint?
Anyway, Spider-Man loses. Cap, Wolverine, and DD are far too powerful for Spidey to just run roughshod over them. All of these heroes are great, which is why a 3-on-1 just ain't fair to Spider-Man.
And just so everyone knows, Cap can sling his shield at over 200 mph with pin-point accuracy, even if he has to bounce it to hit his target. Vulture ain't got nothing on that, and HE was able to hit Spidey from BEHIND!
Originally posted by Zahit
Spiderman IS capable of beating the three of them.
On the same token, the three of them CAN beat Spiderman, depending
on the circumstances and surroundings.
this is exactly the point that's causing so much friction, i agree it could go either way but i decided to back spidey in this battle as he was outnumbered, it just seemed more interesting to argue for his case.
most know that every one of these guys have beaten bigger, stronger, faster and meaner foes in their time, just as they have at some point, all had embarrasing losses to people they outclassed (through some twist or something) it's easy to say spidey beat firelord or the sinister 6, when at other times he's had losses to the looter or spot, wolverine has recorded wins against some big guns and held up well against the hulk but lost to weaker people like punisher
depending on the story and how long the writer needs it to last all of these guys have had more trouble than they should at various times
i'm still backing spider-man and have posted various scenarios to explain why, some of which even got responded to, most didn't and people just continued with their own viewpoint without debating mine or others, the whole point of debating this in this forum IS to DEBATE, not just dismiss and throw around insults like "fanboy" ...... if, in fact "fanboy" can be classed as an insult on a comic forum..... 😉
Originally posted by Capt.JK
And just so everyone knows, Cap can sling his shield at over 200 mph with pin-point accuracy, even if he has to bounce it to hit his target.
Now that I think of it, it has been caught by lots of people, Doom, Puma, Quicksilver and even Punisher if I'm not mistaken (not sure though).
spiderninja008
you're the worst spidey fanboy ever, SINCE 3RD GRADE like yoy said.
1.-What can spidey's punches can do to hurt the Hulk? spidey it's only that to the hulk a little insignificant spider that he could just step over. All spidey could do is run and jump around the hulk like he always does, and then what? who does he beat him? punching him? jajajajajaja
Why did you poste that pic of spidey vs. hulk it's pointless.
2.-wolverine vs. spidey. this is really a close one, i agree, but really, what can a punch from spidey can do to him when he has taken punches from guys like the hulk, and being torn apart from inside when magneto took his adamantium from him. All he could do is what he always does, jump-run-jump-run-punch-jump-punch-run
Sooner or later he has to be close enough to wolverine, and that is no safe place to be.
Originally posted by Capt.JK
Dude, don't you ever get a hint?Anyway, Spider-Man loses. Cap, Wolverine, and DD are far too powerful for Spidey to just run roughshod over them. All of these heroes are great, which is why a 3-on-1 just ain't fair to Spider-Man.
And just so everyone knows, Cap can sling his shield at over 200 mph with pin-point accuracy, even if he has to bounce it to hit his target. Vulture ain't got nothing on that, and HE was able to hit Spidey from BEHIND!
Why does Spiderman lose?
Just stating that the other 3 outclass him DOES NOT create a valid arguement. You stated your cute little conclusion, now do you have any premises to make your arguement sound?
And where exactly did you get this information regarding Captain America's ability to throw a 50 some odd pound shield at a speed of 200 mph?
Pin-point accuracy? Sure...I can believe that. But then what would you call Bullseye's accuracy?
And just so everyone knows. The numbers being thrown out in the post i'm replying to should be considered absoulte bullsh!t until proven otherwise. Site a comic.
Originally posted by maese
2.-wolverine vs. spidey. this is really a close one, i agree, but really, what can a punch from spidey can do to him when he has taken punches from guys like the hulk, and being torn apart from inside when magneto took his adamantium from him. All he could do is what he always does, jump-run-jump-run-punch-jump-punch-runSooner or later he has to be close enough to wolverine, and that is no safe place to be.
I wouldn't go mentioning that little incident with Magneto as if Wolverine actually walked away from the incident. Wolverine was completely trashed after Mags ripped up the adamantium.
What is Spiderman going to do to Wolverine?
Put on a car on top of the little runt.
Now what's Wolverine going to do?
Originally posted by jinzin
okay first off lets drop the whole steroid thing, since it really has nothing to do with this topic whatsoever.
Second, stop making fun of the cap because he loves a comic book character, if we didn't love comic book characters we wouldn't be here trying to debate why we think they would be winning imaginary fights.
Third, I think if you're a US citizen and you're going to love a comic character Captain America is a good a character as any.that being said lets get back to the fight.....
I don't know if you really want to take these characters for how they're supposed to be written,,,,,,,it's kind of an impossible feat since comic characters power levels and general achievments over one another change at a constant rate,,,,but lets say we DO choose to go the way you want.
The whole "this team couldn't work together" arguement is a nullified point by the fact that the cap is written to be a greatest of leaders, and also by the fact that these guys have worked together in the past at one time or another.
In the way that the cap is SUPPOSED to be written he could calculate where spiderman would be bouncing around and he could chuck his sheild in a way to hit spiderman on a rebound while spidey was in mid-air.
In the way that DD is SUPPOSED to be written, his senses should provide him enough reaction time to dodge ALMOST anything spidey throws a him, he should also be able to potentially kill spiderman by punching him at the perfect moment according to spideys heartbeat.
In the way that wolviie is SUPPOSED to be written,,,,,oh man this is gonna be a long one......His super enhanced senses should nullify spidermans spidey sense (meaning they're on an even playing feild) Wolverine's hand to hand techniques shouldn't even be challengable for how is supposed to be written, His healing factor and adamantium skeleton should be able to take anything spiderman hits him with, he's also a trained tactician for how he is supposed to be written.In the way that these three are supposed to be written spiderman still really doesn't stand a chance,,,,,,well maybe a slim chance,,,,,about as much as a snowball in hell.
No peak human, not even Cap., could precisely calculate Spidey's movements wehn Spidey kicks it into high gear. His reflexes are 30-40 times faster than that of a human, and the spider sense excells it beyond even those regions.
And DD? No, he ain't as fast as Spidey, nor is he as strong, agile, durable, etc. as Spidey. Spidey weilding the spider sense completely outclasses DD weilding superhuman senses. Spidey's had armed gunmen believing they were fighting four people when Spidey really put the speed on. This is not crap writing, for there is plenty of evidence in comics that backs this accompishment and others, and looking at Spidey's vital statistics it's more than enough to prove it credible. Spidey's just too fast to dodge Spidey's movements, he could have marked four different places in "bob and weave" mode in like two or three seconds. How's DD gonna percieve Spidey's exact movements when Spidey is just that fast?
And again, with Wolvie it comes down to reflex speed and agility, both of which Spidey has in abundance beyond all comic book characters of the Marvel and DC universe. Wolvie may sense Spidey's presence but he, along with DD and Cap, can not percieve his exact movements. They can pinpoint where he's going to attack becuase he's going all around them. I'm not one to call someone a fanboy just because they believe something like Cap., DD, or Wolvie percieving and pinpointing Spidey's attacks, but I do not, and I do plan, to believe it for myself. The only thing Cap., DD, and Wolvie are going to percieve is Spidey cracking jokes after he's driven 'em to the ground with a well-placed and lethal speedblitz, and that's gonna be like a second or so before they die.
MAESE, if you want to know what spider-man could do to wolverine read the posts by the people who say he's got a shot at winning, trust me, there's been a few. I could go into it right now but i'd just be repeating myself and others, plus i'm a little tired and can't be bothered, but seriously, take a look through the last ten pages or so and you should find a few, you don't even have to read them all, just skim it untill you find the pro spidey scenarios
Originally posted by Capt.JK
It's really disturbing that you are on this thread posting, and you know so little about the characters involved that you make comments like this.The entire CONCEPT of Captain America was to be the epitome of the selfless American, willing to do anything for his country. To protect the innocent. To do what was right. This is the whole CONCEPT of this character. The epitome of the American HERO. Steve Rogers was a scrawny kid who tried to enlist in the Army, even though he was sickly and knew that he probably wouldn't be accepted. He knew that if he did get in, he had a very good chance of dying. But he also knew that he could not stand by and watch while Hitler's armies marched across Europe, killing thousands of innocent people in the process. It was this selflessness, along with his weak body and constitution, that attracted the organizers of the Super Soldier project to choose him in the first place.
Captain America came out in March, 1941. On the cover of Issue #1 (which I own a very beaten up copy of), he is shown punching the face of Hitler. On December 7, 1941, the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor and the US declared war on Japan. Shortly thereafter they declared war on the Nazis as well. Captain America and his shield were designed as a symbol of most of America's desire to enter the war against Germany and aid England. He was designed as America saw itself: selfless; strong; courageous; and willing to die for what was RIGHT.
You people ask why I like him so much. It is because he stands for something. He was created in a time of war, when much of the world was being destroyed or taken over by a group of madmen, and the strongest nation in the world stood by and watched because the politicians were Isolationists and didn't want to get involved. No one wanted another World War, but Captain America's creators, Joe Simon and Jack "King" Kirby, at Timely Comics (now known as Marvel) took a chance and released a character who said what most of America was already thinking; "It is time to take a stand." Name ONE other character who fits this bill. You might say Captain America was the ORIGINATOR of the thought, "With great power comes great responsibility." The United States, the most powerful nation on Earth, needed to act.
My grandfather carried the issue I mentioned above, along with several others, into war against the Japanese at Iwo Jima in his rucksack, rolled up in a rubber band. He told me that Captain America was the most popular comic amongst the service men, because he epitomized how the men felt about what they were doing, and that the guys would trade the books back and forth and pass them on to others when they went home. He gave his copy to me before he passed away.
THAT is why I like this hero the best. THAT is why I take it personal when people make DUMB comments about the character. And THAT is why Spider-Man would not win this fight. Captain America is an ICON. He and the other 2 heroes would beat the web-slinger. PERIOD!
usaflag
Second off, Cap fought in a war, fine. But that was when he was fighting REGULAR humans, not someone like Spidey.
And please, don't try to dwindle Spidey's integrity just because he was he was written to be a man with human emotions who made humanly mistakes, but unlike some if not most humans, he tried so hard (most of his life in real world time) to make up for it. Spidey's an icon because he's one of the most relatable characters around, and if you asked the general media which character they knew more, they'd probably lean towards Spidey. Some if not most regular comic book readers (obviously not you, no offense) would probably be torn between the two. And if you wanted to question their integrity and you asked these minorities to do so, then they would most likely be torn once more. Cap's a guy who has put it all on the line to defend this and other countries, but does that put him above Spidey? No. Spidey has put all on the line out there despite false stories piledriving his should-be-good-name into the ground, a criminal record (under false pretenses), a woman he loved that would cheat on him with his arch-nemisis, and a murdered uncle. Spidey's made mistakes, sure, but he fights for his life and others of all nations and creeds to make up for them. Spidey is the epitome of the phrase "with great power comes great responsibility" in the MU (Marvel Universe) maybe moreso than others because, here's a guy who in the course of teenagehood to adulthood has been given the opportunity of going from guy with no two nickels to rub together to a superhuman guy with incredible superhuman abilities that could've sold out every show he could've cared to partake in, the opportunity to kill the robber who killed his dearly departed Uncle Ben, having MJ all to himself despite putting her in the "line of fire", among many other things. But did he? No. C'mon! This guy was (and still is) fast enough, strong enough, smart enough, and agile enough to have robbed any bank in the entire state of New York. He CHOSE not to, among not performing the many crimes he could've performed with the powers at his disposal, he CHOSE to live the life of the civil servant, a dangerous, self-sacrificing, and thankless job. That's integrity.
Originally posted by Linkalicious
Why does Spiderman lose?Just stating that the other 3 outclass him DOES NOT create a valid arguement. You stated your cute little conclusion, now do you have any premises to make your arguement sound?
And where exactly did you get this information regarding Captain America's ability to throw a 50 some odd pound shield at a speed of 200 mph?
Pin-point accuracy? Sure...I can believe that. But then what would you call Bullseye's accuracy?
And just so everyone knows. The numbers being thrown out in the post i'm replying to should be considered absoulte bullsh!t until proven otherwise. Site a comic.
I've been in this thread almost from jumpstreet. I've posted a million times in here. Read the whole damn thing before you ask me any about stating any arguments. I already have - several times over for the last several pages. And yeah, Bullseye is probably one of, maybe even the BEST, marksman in the MU. What's your point?
Secondly, Cap's shield is made of a composite metal consisting of Vibranium and an Adamantium-type metal (only even HARDER) that tops out at a little over 12 pounds. Where the hell did you get YOUR information from? (Just so you're not left feeling TOO inadequate, here's some schooling for you for next time):
http://www.medinnus.com/winghead/shield_faq.html
(or this):
http://www.marveldirectory.com/individuals/c/captainamerica.htm
(or try this one):
http://free.hostultra.com/~jarvis/shields.html
I could keep going, but what's the point? Word of advice, and you can ask anyone here: I don't have all the answers about all of the characters, but don't EVER question my knowledge of the shield slinger!
Originally posted by Capt.JK
I've been in this thread almost from jumpstreet. I've posted a million times in here. Read the whole damn thing before you ask me any about stating any arguments. I already have - several times over for the last several pages. And yeah, Bullseye is probably one of, maybe even the BEST, marksman in the MU. What's your point?Secondly, Cap's shield is made of a composite metal consisting of Vibranium and an Adamantium-type metal (only even HARDER) that tops out at a little over 12 pounds. Where the hell did you get YOUR information from? (Just so you're not left feeling TOO inadequate, here's some schooling for you for next time):
http://www.medinnus.com/winghead/shield_faq.html
(or this):
http://www.marveldirectory.com/individuals/c/captainamerica.htm
(or try this one):
http://free.hostultra.com/~jarvis/shields.htmlI could keep going, but what's the point? Word of advice, and you can ask anyone here: I don't have all the answers about all of the characters, but don't EVER question my knowledge of the shield slinger!
Originally posted by StrawNilla
First off, allow me to apologize for insulting your favorite character.And please, don't try to dwindle Spidey's integrity... thankless job. That's integrity.
First off, thanks. Apology accepted, but not necessary. I tend to get a bit heated up some times during a good debate (according to my girlfriend, anyway), but I appreciate the comment.
Secondly, I think maybe I have mislead you guys somewhere with my zealous support of Cap and my belief that the trio would win. I DO believe they would defeat Spider-Man, but I take nothing away from Spidey. He's a great character, with a real connection to his fan-base because of his human qualities. He pulled Marvel out of a dry spell and near bankruptcy, and is arguably the most recognizable comic character in the world (along with Bat Man and Supes). If this thread were Spider-Man versus just one of these guys, all out, I would probably have to say he would win quite handily. I think any one of them could give him a good fight, but in an all out brawl, he would probably be too much for just one of them.
But against all three... No. Cap is a master strategist; he WOULD come up with a plan to nullify Spider-Man's advantages. Wolverine is a killing machine, especially when he gets pissed. DD has given Spider-Man a run for his money many times over in the past. All three of these heroes are MASTER combatants, with highly trained skills in the martial arts. Spidey has developed his own unique style which basically consists of flailing and jumping around, throwing kicks and punches. A well-placed nerve strike from either Cap or DD, or a good slice by Wolverine, would quickly put an end to that.
All of these guys have taken on stronger foes in the past. Wolverine has fought the Hulk and Omega Red. DD has run circles around Venom. Cap knocked out the Absorbing Man, who usually dances with the likes of the Hulk and Thor, with a single punch to the jaw. These guys are NOT going to roll over and be defeated by Spider-Man. Sorry, but I still see Spider-Man losing this one. Badly.
"Spiderman's spidersense not going off while fighting Dr. Doom?
These are hardly what I would call examples of consistant writing."
first off I never said spidey's sense wasn't going off I just said it didn't help him when dr. doom was pummeling him in the face.
Second, I would really try and not use the crap writting aguement, as it really doesn't matter what kind of quality writing it was at point or another,,,,,it happened.
and third, as far as the dr. doom example goes,,,,,,,inconsistant writing? yeah I guess STAN LEE (the writer and creator) wouldn't know jack about the characters HE made up, what a bunch of crap writing huh?
really, a little bit of research might help you to not look so bad my friend.
Originally posted by jinzin
Second, I would really try and not use the crap writting aguement, as it really doesn't matter what kind of quality writing it was at point or another,,,,,it happened.
and third, as far as the dr. doom example goes,,,,,,,inconsistant writing? yeah I guess STAN LEE (the writer and creator) wouldn't know jack about the characters HE made up, what a bunch of crap writing huh?
really, a little bit of research might help you to not look so bad my friend.
I feel your pain, man. I had to deal with the same exact comment about Cap. Jack "King" Kirby and Joe Simon, the CREATORS of Captain America, didn't know anything about Cap either according to the Spider-guys. "Bad writing" is always the argument of those who have no argument.
lol yeah, i mean for fan voted things like marvel vs. dc I can understand (which theoretically (sp?) are as valid as any other comic due to reasons I won't even go into right now) but man that excuse is used all to often around here.
I could very well argue that a spider that suffered radioactivity didn't just die but gave a teenager superpowers instead of a stay at the hospital (and eventually the morgue) is crap writing too....but that takes all the fun out of what we're doing here.