Originally posted by jinzin
HAHAHAHAHAHA....oh man you are one funny matha ****a. lol. After all that and still you just reform with insults at me. as I said before, pathetic.
Without using the characacters' life experiences......THAN THEY AREN'T THE SAME F***ING CHARACTERS......it's.....that.....simple.
You have facts? please,,,,opinions hardly count as facts, and stats from the marvel handbook or whatever change on an annual basis.
You want a plausible scenario? okay.Trio sends wolive in full bore spiderman dances around him a little, DD chucks his billy club, while spiderman's busy not trying to get tangled or gutted, Cap chucks his sheild beaming him in the back of the head (spider sense or no, Spidey's been taken suprise by less) sending spidey into a face full of claw.
That's it. Spiderman will not take this entire trio, if EVERYONE is fighting at their best. Like I said spidey has no defense for caps reason and logic appeal, spidey lets down his guard and he gets gutted.
You wanted to use comic examples before and now that I've given multiple "FACTS" about events that have actually taken place in the continuity of the MU, you want to say hey, lets not use the comics at all for these things, you know the books that are the reason why we're here debating now. Spiderman's gonna get his ever loving ass kicked get over it. It's not pride or whatever else you want to call it, go ahead and check to boards I'm not a fanboy I accept when a character can't beat someone period. But as far as "facts" go spidey ain't winning this one. sorry.
Honestly, lying to get a point across...that's just beyond pathetic.
Spidey speedblitzing Cap. and DD IS LETHAL (that means fatal or deadly, in case you didn't know). He's the fastest, most maneuverable, most durable, most perceptive, highest jumping, most elastic, etc. out there! What you presented is not plausible, he would sense any attack coming from any angle! Spidey could just as easily KO Wolvie before an opportunity for Wolvie to counter came into questioning, turn and catch the billy club, dodge the shield, snap the billy club, leap off to the side where a shieldless Cap. stood and pummel him silly when entering bkitz mode, and repeat the process with DD.
How would Cap "strategize" for a defense against a full bore blitz attack utilizing all of Spidey's speed, agility, maneuverability, and strength? That would most definitely reduce him to a pile of jelly.
Same thing goes for DD, no pre-cog (unlike Spidey) to know a blitz from Spidey was coming before it came, and once heard Spidey coming he'd be coming MUCH too fast and much too strong for him to counter with any attack. It's not like he could just throw the billy club at him as he came, even if he could it wouldn't do much to even slow Spidey much less stop him.
Wolvie's out via a KO victory. He's not fast enough, strong enough, or durable enough to concur (he can't "heal" from a concussion).
And I only used comic examples when they were appropriate i.e. logical. Don't tell me to get over something you can't prove. I debated your examples because they were illogical. They were written to happen in the manner of which they did, sure, but it's not fact from a vital standpoint. How can you explain DD beating Spidey in the manner of which he did those times when so any examples are vitally to the contrast? How can you explain Cap. flooring Spidey when Spidey shrugging off Rhino's charges, Ock's tentacle shots, trading shots with Green Goblin, falling five stories, says different? How can you explain Wolvie stalemating Spidey after Spidey backhanded Wolvie in an earlier issue, dismantled Iron Man 2020, hung with Morlun twice after being beaten within an inch of his life, and contorted his way around Ock's tentacles to rip the harness from Ock's waists with his bare hands? There are so many examples to counter your one examples I can scarcely stand to see you put yourself out there in the manner of which you are.
Check yourself at the door before calling me pathetic, jinzin. I'm not the one who skipped around my statements only to post one or two sentences to which you could make a small, insignificant point.
Originally posted by StrawNilla
Maybe we should accept Cap. using his fist as a wrecking ball despite having peak durability (debatable) and strength...again 800 lbs.... Withstanding hits from Thor by standing behind a sheild? And he was lifted off his feet at all?... Come on now, I don't even have to explain just how beyond Cap's abilities that feat is... If a writer said that Captain America could floor Spidey with one punch, what explanation could he have for it besides Cap. America doing it?
You know, I have sat back and watched you guys argue back and forth, and I have figured out TWO things; one, YOU know absolutely diddlysquat about Captain America, and two, you are IN LOVE with Spider-Man.
Point 1: If you are referring to my post, it wasn't his hand, it was his head that I made that statement about. He was in a fight with a "Suped-Up" Red Skull and an entire apartment building was brought down by the battle when Red Skull ambushed him.
Point 2: If you can easily explain Spider-Man's abilities, why are Cap's so hard for you to comprehend? Thor struck Cap's shield with his blow, a weapon that Thor himself has expressed his admiration of and has even compared it to Mjolnir. The Vibranium composition of the shield's construction absorbs impact; the stronger the force, the more it absorbs. The disc shape of the shield, with the thick mid-section and the tapered edge causes energy generated by impact to dissipate outward to the edges. Simple physics with a little Marvel magic thrown in (the same Marvel magic that allows your boy to climb walls and such).
Point 3: Captain America is a HIGHLY TRAINED and SKILLED martial artist, with a superb sense of weak points and a general knowledge of "how to whip ass 101". Why is it so surprising to you that Cap can knock him down if practically every single opponent Spider-Man has ever fought has been able to land at least ONE punch. Prowler hit Spidey. Tarantula hit Spidey. Cap is one of the BEST at landing a blow in the MU. I can't think of anyone MORE qualified to hit Spidey!
The fact that you don't like Captain America, which has become rather obvious in this thread, should not color the fact that Spider-Man COULD NOT handle these 3 SUPER HEROES in a fight. They have ALL beaten him in some fashion at one point or another by themselves; to think they couldn't do it as a team is ridiculous.
One other question for you: what exactly is "debatable" about Cap's durability? I can't even begin to fathom where you're going to dig that opinion out of.
yeah Capt.JK's right about the shield being able to absorb impacts (although in avengers disassembled he takes hits from the she-hulk from behind the shield and still say's "aargh" and get's knocked down....... she kicked his ass big style)
using his head as a battering ram? i won't comment much as i haven't read that one but it doesn't sound like he meant to do it on purpose....... did he get a concussion from it?
Cap is a great martial artist but i wouldn't rate him above cat (some guy with an iron fist style logo on his chest.............. but of a cat) and spidey avoided all of his attacks
if........ and i do mean IF, cap managed to hit spidey it is conceivable he would knock him down, as spidey probably only weighs around 150 pounds, that said, it isn't the same as knocking him out
yes the trio probably could beat spidey if they worked as a team.......... but i think spidey would win the majority of encounters so i'm sticking to his side of the debate (no pun intended 🙂 )
Originally posted by Capt.JK
You know, I have sat back and watched you guys argue back and forth, and I have figured out TWO things; one, YOU know absolutely diddlysquat about Captain America, and two, you are IN LOVE with Spider-Man.
Jk's back..Yaaaay..lol...time to dismantle some arguments...(*joke)
Point 1: If you are referring to my post, it wasn't his hand, it was his head that I made that statement about. He was in a fight with a "Suped-Up" Red Skull and an entire apartment building was brought down by the battle when Red Skull ambushed him.
Whether it was the Captain's head, hand, or big hairy ass..the fact remains that it was a case of PIS/CIS...much like the SMvsFL battle. Stories that aren't really consistant with the overall character and their abilities..shouldn't be considered in the context of these debates..
However if we do choose to accept the "entire history" of one character as valid...as you have stated multiple times..its only fair that we are to use the "entire history" of the other...
Point 2: If you can easily explain Spider-Man's abilities, why are Cap's so hard for you to comprehend? Thor struck Cap's shield with his blow, a weapon that Thor himself has expressed his admiration of and has even compared it to Mjolnir. The Vibranium composition of the shield's construction absorbs impact; the stronger the force, the more it absorbs. The disc shape of the shield, with the thick mid-section and the tapered edge causes energy generated by impact to dissipate outward to the edges. Simple physics with a little Marvel magic thrown in (the same Marvel magic that allows your boy to climb walls and such).
Well let me ask you that same question..Why is it so difficult for you to comprehend SM's capabilities? We've already stated multiple times that SM can..(*note these are all facts)
Detect beforehand any attack used against him..
Move up to 40 times faster than a normal human...
lift 10 tons over his head...(he's been shown to lift more)
Jump up to 3 stories from a standing position...
Web's which have enabled him to hold the likes of the Hulk, Thing, Rogue, and others of similar strength levels...
Why would you believe that a character with these obvious physical advantages...would have difficulty incapacitating individuals who more or less have human level abilities/vulnerabilities?
Given the right circumstances..I could see this battle going in the favor of the Trio..however..regardless of any circumstance/setting...I can't see them defeating a "no holding back" SM easily...
Point 3: Captain America is a HIGHLY TRAINED and SKILLED martial artist, with a superb sense of weak points and a general knowledge of "how to whip ass 101". Why is it so surprising to you that Cap can knock him down if practically every single opponent Spider-Man has ever fought has been able to land at least ONE punch.
Okay I'll agree with you...it's not surprising that Cap would be able to land "one" punch on Spidey....but using the same logic..I could say the same of Spidey when it comes to dodging a punch thrown by Cap/DD/Wolvie...seeing as how SM conistantly dodges people faster than any of them..
It's also not surprising for SM to land "one" unpulled puch/kick on them as well... and one non-pulled punch will take Cap or DD out of the fray rather easily...after all..they're only human..
I can't think of anyone MORE qualified to hit Spidey!
I can't think of anyone more qualified to overcome overwhelming odd's than SM..the guys entire character is essentially based on this concept...
The fact that you don't like Captain America, which has become rather obvious in this thread, should not color the fact that Spider-Man COULD NOT handle these 3 SUPER HEROES in a fight. They have ALL beaten him in some fashion at one point or another by themselves; to think they couldn't do it as a team is ridiculous.
I like Captain..but I don't rely on "random" one-time scenarios in a characters history as testimony to their overall abilities...Captain beating Scorpian ain't the bible on Cap..Neither is SM beating Firelord the the bible on SM.
Not to be offensive..but thus far your argument seems to be centered more around how great Cap is and how the Trio are icons...rather than how they will overcome a "no holds barred" Spidey...
Anyway this has been an interesting topic and its been fun debating with everyone....we've all definately carved a notch in the comic book forumn history books..lol...
Originally posted by Capt.JK
You know, I have sat back and watched you guys argue back and forth, and I have figured out TWO things; one, YOU know absolutely diddlysquat about Captain America, and two, you are IN LOVE with Spider-Man.Point 1: If you are referring to my post, it wasn't his hand, it was his head that I made that statement about. He was in a fight with a "Suped-Up" Red Skull and an entire apartment building was brought down by the battle when Red Skull ambushed him.
Point 2: If you can easily explain Spider-Man's abilities, why are Cap's so hard for you to comprehend? Thor struck Cap's shield with his blow, a weapon that Thor himself has expressed his admiration of and has even compared it to Mjolnir. The Vibranium composition of the shield's construction absorbs impact; the stronger the force, the more it absorbs. The disc shape of the shield, with the thick mid-section and the tapered edge causes energy generated by impact to dissipate outward to the edges. Simple physics with a little Marvel magic thrown in (the same Marvel magic that allows your boy to climb walls and such).
Point 3: Captain America is a HIGHLY TRAINED and SKILLED martial artist, with a superb sense of weak points and a general knowledge of "how to whip ass 101". Why is it so surprising to you that Cap can knock him down if practically every single opponent Spider-Man has ever fought has been able to land at least ONE punch. Prowler hit Spidey. Tarantula hit Spidey. Cap is one of the BEST at landing a blow in the MU. I can't think of anyone MORE qualified to hit Spidey!
The fact that you don't like Captain America, which has become rather obvious in this thread, should not color the fact that Spider-Man COULD NOT handle these 3 SUPER HEROES in a fight. They have ALL beaten him in some fashion at one point or another by themselves; to think they couldn't do it as a team is ridiculous.
One other question for you: what exactly is "debatable" about Cap's durability? I can't even begin to fathom where you're going to dig that opinion out of.
To say that I'm in love with a character just because I've provided credible proof of him being able to beat a character you like so much is just sad.
So Cap's bones are harder than concrete you say? So...that would make him more than durable enough to be a superhuman would it not? So then, why isn't he labeled a superhuman?
I don't know what blinds you so when it comes to arguing Cap. Maybe when it comes to Cap. fighting Juggernaut you're eyes are not shielded as worse as now, but when it comes to someone like Spidey beating him...it's out of the question. Even when there's proof of Spidey beating him given to you you can't (won't) accept it.
I really don't know what sickens me more about you. Maybe it's the fact that your fanboyism troubles you in such a way....or the fact that even after I've argued this over and over again for page after page, you still think you're more qualified to say I'm in love with a character for facing and explaining facts after arguing nothing for ten or more pages.
Cap's abilities are not hard for me to comprehend, nor is it hard for me to comprehend that Spiderman could rip the shield from his grasp and beat him bloody with it. Cap can have all the training in the world and still not be up to Spidey speed, agility, perceptiveness, strength, durability, etc. You can't seem to comprehend this. Honestly, don't you realize that Cap's abilities or training wouldn't allow him pre-cognition that of Spidey's calibur, it wouldn't give him pre-cognition period. Shang Chi trained almost all his life with the slightest of superhuman strength to show for it, even with the chi. What makes you think that Cap, who didn't train for a fourth that time, could do better? Especially when combating Spidey, honestly, simple logic should tell you that someone who's at a superhuman level in every field of every abilty outclasses someone with Cap's peak abilities.
And I say Cap's durability is debatable because he has showings of durability that ranges redicoulously from one field to the next. Just to call the guy a peak human judging from your comic book examples is hypocritical. Face it, your boy has been overrated in every aspect of his life from working solo to leading the Avengers. Why is it that he's always the last one standing on the field of battle, like when facing universal threats? I don't care how strong-willed you are, when you're human you're human, and when facing someone who's more than human, and they have the edge over you in a battle, and he's strong enough to kill you, then you know that it should be the human that is defeated.
It's pretty obvious that when a person that can press 800 lbs breaks the Hulk's grasp then something's up. It's hard enough to explain how something like could happen, much less credit it to be fact. That's like saying I could destroy Iron Man's Hulk Buster armor (or any armor for that matter) just by being more resilient to an attack than the average human. That the OPINION of the writer, I'll admit it's better for the comic becuase who would want to see Hulk hold Cap in one place for an entire issue? But to call it fact? No, that I won't accept.
I stand corrected. It's not Captain America you don't like, it's the human race in general! Why is it so hard for you to grasp the concept of Captain America? You spew page after page of Spideyisms, but you can't/won't seem to grasp the ENTIRE concept of Captain America? He's the last one left standing BECAUSE of who he is. He is the very exemplar of the human race. He is the PEAK of what it can accomplish. That's why Cap is almost ALWAYS the LAST MAN STANDING. Why would this fight be any different? Seems pretty simple to me.
Yes, I do have a problem accepting your version of what would happen, because your version just doesn't have any REAL hold in the reality of the MU, which is who created these guys in the first place! You've got Spider-Man snatching organs out of people like he's Dr. Kevorkian, Wolverine, an ER Surgeon, Steven Seagal and the Flash all rolled into one!!! You've got him ducking and dodging at super-speed (4 seconds I think you said to beat up the 3 of them?)! The entire CONCEPT is ridiculous!!! Since when does Spider-Man run around snatching out people's organs?!! All of a sudden he changes his entire style of fighting?
Your arguments are ludicrous. You're so blinded by your sheer infatuation of the little teenager in webbed tights that you can't see the facts as laid out by MARVEL COMICS!!! We've given you reasons and scenarios and ways he would be defeated, you just don't want to accept it. You prefer to throw insults or scream "Bad writing! Bad writing!" just because you don't like a certain scenario.
And I STILL believe that you just have a personal dislike for Cap, and it is clouding your judgement. In the "Cap vs. Juggernaut" thread you referred to, I said "Cap could not beat Juggs". Then you came in, quoted me, and STILL argued with my post! Your infatuation with Spider-Man has spilled over into other threads!
Pitiful.
Spider-Man loses. Badly and painfully.
"Jinzin, I'm going to say this once. YOUR NAME DID NOT COME UP IN MY POST! I WAS NOT THINKING ABOUT HOW YOU REACT TO SUCH A POST!
Honestly, lying to get a point across...that's just beyond pathetic."
hmmmm, reeeeeeaalllly? het straw, remember quote time,,,lets have a refresher course shall we?
"Jinzin, no matter how ignorant, pig-headed, stuffy, and stuck up with pride your posts appear when it comes to arguing something ALOT OF PEOPLE (if not Cap., DD, and Wolvie fans and supporters) feel has been proven wrong, but they're good for a laugh or two. "
hmmm well there's my name and there's the insults and oh hey the entire post was directed at me!,,,,,,seriously, don't you ever get tired of being wrong?
"How would Cap "strategize" for a defense against a full bore blitz attack utilizing all of Spidey's speed, agility, maneuverability, and strength? That would most definitely reduce him to a pile of jelly. "
the same way he stratagizes a way to beat practically EVERYONE ELSE.
"Same thing goes for DD, no pre-cog (unlike Spidey) to know a blitz from Spidey was coming before it came, and once heard Spidey coming he'd be coming MUCH too fast and much too strong for him to counter with any attack. It's not like he could just throw the billy club at him as he came, even if he could it wouldn't do much to even slow Spidey much less stop him."
maybe,,,,,,if spider-man was 4 feet infront of the guy. from any decent amount of distance, well it's not like spidey's gonna be traveling at light speeds. I'm actually thinking that moie quote DOES apply here. lol.
"(he can't "heal" from a concussion)."
not that there's any garantee that spidey would give him one. but yes,,,,tech. he should be able to heal from that.
"I only used comic examples when they were appropriate i.e. logical."
Spidey beating up firelord? oh yeah you got me there. pffft.
"How can you explain Cap. flooring Spidey when Spidey shrugging off Rhino's charges, Ock's tentacle shots, trading shots with Green Goblin, falling five stories, says different?"
Spiderman manuvers around rhino charges, he doesn't take them full bore or he would die, He hardly "shrugs off" dok ock's tentacles, unless you mean why does spidey avoid those tentacles like the plague. Green goblin isn't exactly a good street fighter, and wolveine's fallen 11 stories and just got up running, there ya go.
"How can you explain Wolvie stalemating Spidey after Spidey backhanded Wolvie in an earlier issue"
wasn't like wolverine was really trying to fight spidey, besides the last time I checked falling down like that doesn't count as a loss, I've just as easily slipped on the floor while sparring, I guess I should consider that a loss for myself then too huh?
"Detect beforehand any attack used against him.."
just like he's also been shown to be taken by suprise by ridiculously slower people than these three. I don't know why you an' understand that. I could post literally hundreds of examples where street leveled, or normal speed character have hit spidey, no reason this group can't.
"Not to be offensive..but thus far your argument seems to be centered more around how great Cap is and how the Trio are icons...rather than how they will overcome a "no holds barred" Spidey..."
honestly, you act as if spidey will be the only one going all out.
"No they haven't ! Stop making up stories !"
by the spiderman group logic,,,,they have. these members have at LEAST all stalemated spidey by themselves.
"I don't know whether to call you immature, ignorant, or both. I'm leaning towards the last option."
we have to take this from a kid who centers half of his arguments on insults of the board members themselves? please.
"So Cap's bones are harder than concrete you say?"
not nessassarily, a peice of straw can go through a lightpole with the right amount of force.
"Even when there's proof of Spidey beating him given to you you can't (won't) accept it. "
lol. once again opinions are not proof. the only comparible example or "fact" as you might say is where these two have fought is the one I gave and cap floored spidey, accept that first.
"I really don't know what sickens me more about you. Maybe it's the fact that your fanboyism troubles you in such a way....or the fact that even after I've argued this over and over again for page after page, you still think you're more qualified to say I'm in love with a character for facing and explaining facts after arguing nothing for ten or more pages."
At least he can accept and admit he's a good old fanboy, unlike some other people, bu i'm not going to name names,,,,strawnilla.
"Spiderman could rip the shield from his grasp and beat him bloody with it".
and this is so easy to do, it happens to captain america all he ti----oh wait that's right, this has never happened.........ever!
"What makes you think that Cap, who didn't train for a fourth that time, could do better?"
The same reason some little kids are better at sports than their proffessional adult counterparts,,,,life isn't fair and some people are just better.
"The entire CONCEPT is ridiculous!!! Since when does Spider-Man run around snatching out people's organs?!! All of a sudden he changes his entire style of fighting?"
hmmmm lets see there was that time that he-------oh yeah,,,,,NEVER! Besides, that would imply Spidey is possessed, or something, Spiderman has never....ever....been so pissed he didn't appeal to logic, or his own weakness for sympathy or whatever keeps him from killing his enemies.
Originally posted by jinzin
[B"The entire CONCEPT is ridiculous!!! Since when does Spider-Man run around snatching out people's organs?!! All of a sudden he changes his entire style of fighting?"hmmmm lets see there was that time that he-------oh yeah,,,,,NEVER! Besides, that would imply Spidey is possessed, or something, Spiderman has never....ever....been so pissed he didn't appeal to logic, or his own weakness for sympathy or whatever keeps him from killing his enemies. [/B]
i keep having to refer back to the thread starting post where it states "any means necessary"......... i think that's why the organ thing was brought up (at least i hope that's why)
of course they've all stalemated him, most superheroes stalemate others that don't completely outclass them ie: cap V's silver surfer, at one point or other, it's all done for sales and storyline....... you couldn't have DD and spidey team up at the end of a story if DD was lying in the intensive care ward with massive internal injuries........ but this thread battle isn't in continuity so it doesn't matter if DD dies or if someone is fighting more aggressively than normal when using the stipulated "any means necessary"...... whether or not marvel would allow a main character to die becomes irrelevant here, so let's stop bringing it up and discuss the situation under the ONLY boundaries placed upon it
and this is how it started
Originally posted by MatchesMalone
Everyone uses their usual weapons and abilities. Spiderman will use any means necessary to take out this team, the trio will do the same towards Spiderman. Who wins?
so ............FIGHT, FIGHT, FIGHT 💃 💃 💃 💃 💃
Spiderman manuvers around rhino charges, he doesn't take them full bore or he would die
honestly, you act as if spidey will be the only one going all out.
Spider-Man won’t, but IF he goes apeshit, it’s hiding time for the Icon Trio. Ever imagined what a non-holding back Spider-Man is able to do ? He can rip of DD’s head, make Captain America eat his shield and fill the lungs and mouth of Wolverine with his web.
The big problem here, the reason why SM is underestimated in this particular thread, is that he’s a nice guy, he always holds back, tells jokes, bounces around and will try to make his opponent look like an ass. But he also has a temper, and when playtime is over, the Icon Trio will have to face an enraged Spider-Man.
- What difference does it make if DD does not hold back ? None, he never holds back lol.
- What difference does it make if Wolverine does not hold back ? None, he never holds back lol.
- What difference does it make if CA does not hold back ? None, he never holds back lol.
But...what difference does it make when SM doesn’t hold back anymore ? A LOT !! One punch (one people, not two or three) and DD is out of the picture. Same with CA. They just can NOT take a powerpunch from Spider-Man, I hope nobody will argue about this.
Originally posted by jinzin
"Jinzin, I'm going to say this once. YOUR NAME DID NOT COME UP IN MY POST! I WAS NOT THINKING ABOUT HOW YOU REACT TO SUCH A POST!Honestly, lying to get a point across...that's just beyond pathetic."
hmmmm, reeeeeeaalllly? het straw, remember quote time,,,lets have a refresher course shall we?
"Jinzin, no matter how ignorant, pig-headed, stuffy, and stuck up with pride your posts appear when it comes to arguing something ALOT OF PEOPLE (if not Cap., DD, and Wolvie fans and supporters) feel has been proven wrong, but they're good for a laugh or two. "
hmmm well there's my name and there's the insults and oh hey the entire post was directed at me!,,,,,,seriously, don't you ever get tired of being wrong?
"How would Cap "strategize" for a defense against a full bore blitz attack utilizing all of Spidey's speed, agility, maneuverability, and strength? That would most definitely reduce him to a pile of jelly. "
the same way he stratagizes a way to beat practically EVERYONE ELSE.
"Same thing goes for DD, no pre-cog (unlike Spidey) to know a blitz from Spidey was coming before it came, and once heard Spidey coming he'd be coming MUCH too fast and much too strong for him to counter with any attack. It's not like he could just throw the billy club at him as he came, even if he could it wouldn't do much to even slow Spidey much less stop him."
maybe,,,,,,if spider-man was 4 feet infront of the guy. from any decent amount of distance, well it's not like spidey's gonna be traveling at light speeds. I'm actually thinking that moie quote DOES apply here. lol.
"(he can't "heal" from a concussion)."
not that there's any garantee that spidey would give him one. but yes,,,,tech. he should be able to heal from that.
"I only used comic examples when they were appropriate i.e. logical."
Spidey beating up firelord? oh yeah you got me there. pffft.
"How can you explain Cap. flooring Spidey when Spidey shrugging off Rhino's charges, Ock's tentacle shots, trading shots with Green Goblin, falling five stories, says different?"
Spiderman manuvers around rhino charges, he doesn't take them full bore or he would die, He hardly "shrugs off" dok ock's tentacles, unless you mean why does spidey avoid those tentacles like the plague. Green goblin isn't exactly a good street fighter, and wolveine's fallen 11 stories and just got up running, there ya go.
"How can you explain Wolvie stalemating Spidey after Spidey backhanded Wolvie in an earlier issue"
wasn't like wolverine was really trying to fight spidey, besides the last time I checked falling down like that doesn't count as a loss, I've just as easily slipped on the floor while sparring, I guess I should consider that a loss for myself then too huh?
"Detect beforehand any attack used against him.."
just like he's also been shown to be taken by suprise by ridiculously slower people than these three. I don't know why you an' understand that. I could post literally hundreds of examples where street leveled, or normal speed character have hit spidey, no reason this group can't.
"Not to be offensive..but thus far your argument seems to be centered more around how great Cap is and how the Trio are icons...rather than how they will overcome a "no holds barred" Spidey..."
honestly, you act as if spidey will be the only one going all out.
"No they haven't ! Stop making up stories !"
by the spiderman group logic,,,,they have. these members have at LEAST all stalemated spidey by themselves.
"I don't know whether to call you immature, ignorant, or both. I'm leaning towards the last option."
we have to take this from a kid who centers half of his arguments on insults of the board members themselves? please.
"So Cap's bones are harder than concrete you say?"
not nessassarily, a peice of straw can go through a lightpole with the right amount of force.
"Even when there's proof of Spidey beating him given to you you can't (won't) accept it. "
lol. once again opinions are not proof. the only comparible example or "fact" as you might say is where these two have fought is the one I gave and cap floored spidey, accept that first.
"I really don't know what sickens me more about you. Maybe it's the fact that your fanboyism troubles you in such a way....or the fact that even after I've argued this over and over again for page after page, you still think you're more qualified to say I'm in love with a character for facing and explaining facts after arguing nothing for ten or more pages."
At least he can accept and admit he's a good old fanboy, unlike some other people, bu i'm not going to name names,,,,strawnilla.
"Spiderman could rip the shield from his grasp and beat him bloody with it".
and this is so easy to do, it happens to captain america all he ti----oh wait that's right, this has never happened.........ever!
"What makes you think that Cap, who didn't train for a fourth that time, could do better?"
The same reason some little kids are better at sports than their proffessional adult counterparts,,,,life isn't fair and some people are just better.
"The entire CONCEPT is ridiculous!!! Since when does Spider-Man run around snatching out people's organs?!! All of a sudden he changes his entire style of fighting?"
hmmmm lets see there was that time that he-------oh yeah,,,,,NEVER! Besides, that would imply Spidey is possessed, or something, Spiderman has never....ever....been so pissed he didn't appeal to logic, or his own weakness for sympathy or whatever keeps him from killing his enemies.
Your second argument for Cap. is pitiful. It's not like he didn't have prep time for those OTHER battles anyway, this is a battle on their feet, a type of battle in which Cap. COULD try barking orders to his comrades a second or so before Spidey's blitzes him into the dust. Spidey's fast enough, agile enough...oh man, I really don't want to get on with all that again, but those abilities combined are too much for that trio to counter.
So what if Spidey doesn't move at LT speeds or anything remotely close to it...neither does DD, Wolvie, or Cap. And seeing that Spidey has a GREAT speed edge over them already, as well as greater leaping ability, he could use that to close distance between him and his comrades. And seeing that Spidey's always moving at the beginning, during, and (more often than not) after a battle. It's nothing different here. Only now he's not holding back like he often does.
Cap. and DD aren't safe once Spidey gets up, around, or through them with a few hops here and there to a single leap to cover ground.
And you're in no position to call anyone a fanboy jinzin. Capt. JK attacked ME in his post. Just because I've been stating my case about how Spidey could beat his favorite character, he felt the right to come in and say I'm in love with the guy for doing so. If you don't find anything wrong with that, that's you. Just try growing a backbone 1st before you try and scold me for standing up for myself.
And how can you actually argue that Wolvie can "heal" from a concussion?! Unless you're talking about waking up from it. Actually, I'm beginning to feel more amused by this than annoyed.
And if Cap is the pinnacle of HUMAN performance that you label him, then a building falling on him should've crushed him, despite what any straw could do.
I never centered half my arguments on insults directed at memebers of the board. And for when I did insult some (from their understanding not mine) I apologized. Yes, I retailiated rather hostily towards Capt. JK's argument for it was directed primarily at me. Same goes for you. And you talk as though I haven't gone the distance in my arguments on this thread, to call me a "kid" for arguments you either took out of context or added you're little sniveling crap to for your own self-benifit just exemplifies the jackass you've expemplified yourself to me as in your argument methods.
And your retortion to my post saying that Cap. should have more to show for his training than Shang-Chi, who WORKED ALL HIS LIFE for every ability he has, saying that "The same reason that some little kids are better than professional adult counterparts,,,life isn't fair some people are just better?" is as rediculous as it is fanboyish. PLEASE quote me on this.
And I never said Spidey snatches out people's organs. I said that he could and if worse came to worse he would...he is, after all, fighting to the best of his abilties. Since when is it impossible for him? I just feel the need to remind this to someone who thought Wolvie could heall from getting KO'ed.
And Spidey being shown to be tagged by people rediculously slower than the trio is just one of MANY examples of Spidey holding back. YOU HAVE SAID YOURSELF THAT SPIDEY IS FASTER THAN THE TRIO, so how is it that someone oh so much slower than them could tag hi, them? In the words of jinzin "Hmmm intersting."
And perhaps you haven't used the word "icon" in your arguments, jinzin, but you have stayed loyal to your argument methods and talked about how Cap. could do this and that in comics, MOST FREQUENTLY things you KNOW (or should know, at this point I can't tell with you) are well beyond his abilities. It's fine to plug in Cap breaking Hulk's grasp when it comes to NOT WANTING Cap to struggle and squirm in Hulk's grasp, it's not fact then. But using it in an argument in which you're supposed to present something useful? Heh.
And you must think that Cap. is stronger than Spidey? He's not, need I explain this more? Anyway, my "Spidey ripping the shield from Cap's grasp and he beating him bloody with it" is definitely within his vital statistical limits.
Originally posted by Capt.JK
I stand corrected. It's not Captain America you don't like, it's the human race in general! Why is it so hard for you to grasp the concept of Captain America? You spew page after page of Spideyisms, but you can't/won't seem to grasp the ENTIRE concept of Captain America? He's the last one left standing BECAUSE of who he is. He is the very exemplar of the human race. He is the PEAK of what it can accomplish. That's why Cap is almost ALWAYS the LAST MAN STANDING. Why would this fight be any different? Seems pretty simple to me.Yes, I do have a problem accepting your version of what would happen, because your version just doesn't have any REAL hold in the reality of the MU, which is who created these guys in the first place! You've got Spider-Man snatching organs out of people like he's Dr. Kevorkian, Wolverine, an ER Surgeon, Steven Seagal and the Flash all rolled into one!!! You've got him ducking and dodging at super-speed (4 seconds I think you said to beat up the 3 of them?)! The entire CONCEPT is ridiculous!!! Since when does Spider-Man run around snatching out people's organs?!! All of a sudden he changes his entire style of fighting?
Your arguments are ludicrous. You're so blinded by your sheer infatuation of the little teenager in webbed tights that you can't see the facts as laid out by MARVEL COMICS!!! We've given you reasons and scenarios and ways he would be defeated, you just don't want to accept it. You prefer to throw insults or scream "Bad writing! Bad writing!" just because you don't like a certain scenario.
And I STILL believe that you just have a personal dislike for Cap, and it is clouding your judgement. In the "Cap vs. Juggernaut" thread you referred to, I said "Cap could not beat Juggs". Then you came in, quoted me, and STILL argued with my post! Your infatuation with Spider-Man has spilled over into other threads!
Pitiful.
Spider-Man loses. Badly and painfully.
My organ snatching theory is just that, a theory. It COULD happen. But I never said it would. You're completely ignoring my other arguments and are instad calling them ludicrous. Honestly, you couldn't really sit here and tell me that EVERY ONE OF MY POSTS have been fileld with NOTHING ELSE but Spidey snatching out this organ and that, could you? It's not like he couldn't, but he probably won't.
You need to grow up and get your head out of the good Cap's a**. Why does it have to be with the "infatuation" when your signature, your user name, and apparently your persona comes from something you picked up from Captain America? I never claimed I would jump off of a bridge for Spidey or anything like that, do you see any mention of Spider-Man in MY user name, or MY signature, or MY persona....please. If I had half the personality of Spidey, do you honestly think I wouldn't sit here and take the insults you had for me in your posts?
And in your little setup (for the sake of board terms and logic, I'll call it a post) has only proven how much you think about Cap. "He's the one left standing BECAUSE of who he is?" THAT's pitiful.
I'll tell you why this fight is different Capt. JK ("Capt." JK pfft. People see this and yet I'm the "fanboy".) THIS fight is based on logic, not the opinion a writer has that Cap's honor and loyalty to his country is enough for him to stand alone and fight Thanos.
And my posts doesn't have logic straight out of the mind of a writer, or the "MU", do you wanna know why? Because the MU ISN'T REAL! How can you call Cap. survive having a building collapse on him (Captain America, the perfect HUMAN, not Captain Marvel) a REAL outcome to such a scenario? I'm a fanboy for rebuking this? 😕 You've got alot of nerve. That's no compliment by the way, in case you can't tell.
And I know you said Juggernaut would beat Cap (why say my so-called "Spidey infatuation" has spilled into other threads in a thread that didn't even mention Spidey?) you also said that Cap. could just keep dodging and dodging Juggernaut's attacks until Juggs got tired of trying to hit him and left. Did you not post those words "Cap."? I said that would only happen if Juggs had somewhere else to be, in fact, I think the first line of my post clearly read "If Juggernaut had somewhere else to be.....you're right." AFTER THAT I argued your post by saying that if he didn't have anywhere else to be he could fight for as long as it took before hitting Cap., especially if he was really focused on doing so. Seems pretty simple to me Cap., how about you?