I couldn't agree more. These X-men are much more powerful than the FF. Iceman literally can't be beaten by any means these guys have. And let's theoretically say that Jean isn't Phoenix, even though she is. The only way for her not to mindwipe everyone but the invisible person is for them to all be in the bubble, which means that they'd have to hide in a bubble to not be beaten, which I would say makes them losing anyways...
"I couldn't agree more. These X-men are much more powerful than the FF. Iceman literally can't be beaten by any means these guys have. And let's theoretically say that Jean isn't Phoenix, even though she is. The only way for her not to mindwipe everyone but the invisible person is for them to all be in the bubble, which means that they'd have to hide in a bubble to not be beaten, which I would say makes them losing anyways.."
The X-Men, regardless of current or classic, are not MUCH more powerful than the F4. It's debateable as to whether they are at all. Jean isn't Phoenix, that's not theoretical so for crying out loud, quite clinging to it like a baby with no pacifier.
They're losing by being in a bubble? How the hell did you work that out? Oh, because it renders your mindwipe theory irrelevant.
-AC
Not to be a dick, but couldn't Iceman just trap them in ice? I mean, if they are inside the invisible bubble, what's to stop Iceman from incasing the invisible bubble/shield in a block of ice that he could continually reinforce? Sue or Johnny would have to let the bubble down or create an opening in it to use flame powers to melt the ice, and that would be the opening Jean would need to mind wipe the the invisi-power user.
Just a thought.
I still like the FF in this marticular matchup though.
Apparently, Alpha Centauri, you can't read very well, because you missed me saying that the FF's only way out of being mindwiped is by being in the bubble, but if they have to hide in the bubble, which would mean they can't attack the X-men offensively, then they are just staying on the defensive to save their own hinds. In my opinion, if they aren't able to attack, they don't win. If the X-men are keeping them on the defensive, the FF don't win.
And besides, I've yet to hear one plausible scenario that the FF could take out Iceman, but all he has to do is flash freeze them, even around these fun bubbles...
"In my opinion, if they aren't able to attack, they don't win. If the X-men are keeping them on the defensive, the FF don't win."
If the X-Men can't attack them? Exactly.
"And besides, I've yet to hear one plausible scenario that the FF could take out Iceman, but all he has to do is flash freeze them, even around these fun bubbles..."
If it was that simple, would there be 22 pages of thread? No.
Think. It helps.
-AC
i would pick for the x-men cyclops,nightcrawler, iceman and collosus.
the fantastic 4 have way more fighting experince as a group then the x-men do. this might prove to be the key to there victory.
mr. fantastic is ff weakest link as far as it comes to power. a optic blast from cyclops at a distance and mr. fantastic is gone. although what reed richards lack in power, he is an excellent mind and a great tactician.
they ff usually fight together as a team, and reed is at the command. so if he is taken out i think the fantastic 4 would kind of be running all over the place trying to figure out what to do.
sue can use her invisibile sheild, but i do think nightcrawler can teleport in there and slice her to ribbions, sue can only hold her shield for so long before she drains herself. torch and iceman are stalemates, either one of them can win. fire melts ice, ice freezes fire
i think the wildcard would be thing vs collosus for the win. Thing has more experince than the big russian but if its true that collosus is at level 100, then thing might be in some big trouble. thing has fought alot of heavyweights, hulk,juggernaut,thor but he usually ends up kicking his ass kicked. i remember juggernaut blasting thing in 3 punches.
i dont know i cant even decide its to close to call, i give ff a slight edge and i do mean slight, due to there experince.
Well, Alpha, first off, stop being an ass in everything that you say, I've been trying to stick to the fight, but your sarcasm and rude comments bring out the worst in me, so stop it.
Why don't you think and come up with a plausible way that Iceman could go down in a fight against the FF, because your last one, Johny's nova blast, that wouldn't erase all of the moisture from the air, nor would it take out every lake, river, and ocean. All Iceman really "needs" there is a little bit more water with which to reform his body... ...after that he's cool again and ready to flash freeze some more people.
Also, exactly what could the FF do to stop Iceman's flash freezing?
Question: How do the Fantastic 4 have more experience than the Xmen? Jean and Iceman are 2 of the original Xmen, and though Colossus and Nightcrawler are later additions, they put in thousands of hours in the Danger Room and Colossus has extensive combat training directly from Wolverine. The Russian is not a pushover.
"How do the Fantastic 4 have more experience than the Xmen? Jean and Iceman are 2 of the original Xmen, and though Colossus and Nightcrawler are later additions, they put in thousands of hours in the Danger Room and Colossus has extensive combat training directly from Wolverine. The Russian is not a pushover."
The Fantastic Four have much more battle experience, especially in high stakes situations, than the X-Men do.
"Well, Alpha, first off, stop being an ass in everything that you say, I've been trying to stick to the fight, but your sarcasm and rude comments bring out the worst in me, so stop it."
Stop letting in bring out the worst in you. Stop bringing in stuff not relevant to the thread and I'll have less to tear into. Like Tron said, keep it topic.
"Why don't you think and come up with a plausible way that Iceman could go down in a fight against the FF, because your last one, Johny's nova blast, that wouldn't erase all of the moisture from the air, nor would it take out every lake, river, and ocean. All Iceman really "needs" there is a little bit more water with which to reform his body... ...after that he's cool again and ready to flash freeze some more people."
You are insinuating that Ice-Man is capable of controlling every single water molecule on Earth and I'm sorry, but he's just not that powerful. You continue to ignore all the stuff I say because you know what you've said is pointless, so you now rely on Ice-Man. You've tried to make this A) A bubble battle now B) A flash freeze fight. What the hell? Unless you plan to get a job at Marvel and write the comic I suggest you stop with the set fight fold out.
"Also, exactly what could the FF do to stop Iceman's flash freezing?"
As I've said, Torch is more than capable of removing all the moisture that Ice-Man is capable of reaching. You can assume that Ice-Man is some kind of celestial powered jobber, but he's not. F4 have means of protections. This fight has, does and always will, go to the F4.
Sorry that it's consumed you.
-AC
Originally posted by savagerampage
mr. fantastic is ff weakest link as far as it comes to power. a optic blast from cyclops at a distance and mr. fantastic is gone. although what reed richards lack in power, he is an excellent mind and a great tactician.
i dont know i cant even decide its to close to call, i give ff a slight edge and i do mean slight, due to there experince.
This isn't a bad thread, but why oh why is Nightcrawler included ? Replace him with any other X-Man (no not Kitty Pride or Jubilee. And you can forget Gambit too 😉 ) and we have a much better fight.
FF would get their arses kicked!!! The only one that's worth mentioning is Sue. She is arguably the most powerful member but powerful or not, she has nothing on Jean's telepathy. I've been reading this topic and interestingly enough, you guys think that Sue's focefield is impenetrable but it's not. Telepathy as it's name implies transcends through time, space, and matter. Sue's forcefield is a manisfestation of light manipulation and light is matter.....tiny particles of EM. Jean and Sue are the deciding factor. Both women, ironically, are the two most powerful members of their respected teams. Granted, Sue's forcefield is more powerful than Jean's and she can manipulate them in various of ways but Jean has telekinesis and telepathy. Telepathy alone can take out all of the FF. She can filter the amount of light that Sue manipulates, nullifying her power, gives The thing a cardiac arrest, manipulate the air molecules around Johnny, and make Mister Fantastic do the Ka Ka Karacha dance.
Jean is the deciding factor, however, if they decided to take Jean out, they have a good chance of pulling this off, knowing Mister fantastic. Jean can have a bunch of crap fly at Sue while she attacks her mentally, the amount of will power to erect and deflect numerous objects and fight Jean in an astral plane is taxing. I highly doubt she's an accomplished telepath and Jean would fry her synapses before she calls for help. It depends who gets the first shot first. Jean or Sue.
I can't see how Sue could get a shot off before Jean can. All Jean has to do is think, "Off" and Sue is off. Sue, on the other hand, would have to target Jean, create a bubble around her, and do something with the bubble to take her out right away (but in a manner that's still non-lethal). Too much thinking. Jean wins. And if Jean wins, the X-men win.