Originally posted by -Pr-
This isn't the vs forum. It's pre-reboot Superman in a contest of strength with Hulk.You don't have to agree, but that's what the thread is.
i know you enjoy one sided arguments but the thread only says superman. other threads in this same forum specify which version of superman the are talking about. this one never did and only addressed whatever was current.
plus the thread was dead for almost a year.
Originally posted by jedi90
i know you enjoy one sided arguments but the thread only says superman. other threads in this same forum specify which version of superman the are talking about. this one never did and only addressed whatever was current.plus the thread was dead for almost a year.
Bashing me isn't going to make me agree with you. 😬
Originally posted by jedi90
well, which one? superman was rebooted with birthright in 2003. get specific. i don't want to hear you or anyone crying foul later.
Superman wasn't rebooted with Birthright; his origin was just altered.
This is Superman from COIE in 1986 - to the reboot at Flashpoint. Obviously he got stronger as time moves on, but still, that's the general period.
Stay your swords Gentlemen,
The title never specified what version of Superman, HOWEVER lets say Mr PR wants to change rules on the fly....Fair enough just state your ground rules for a "fair and balanced" debate.
You can also take the liberty of adding PRE-Crisis Superman to the title.
Just a suggestion. 🙂
Originally posted by -Pr-
Superman wasn't rebooted with Birthright; his origin was just altered.This is Superman from COIE in 1986 - to the reboot at Flashpoint. Obviously he got stronger as time moves on, but still, that's the general period.
oh contraire mon fraire, me thinks DC comics disagrees with you but hey, what do they know.
http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=3256
for your reading pleasure from the link:
The one thing that hasn't been clear to fans, new and old, is the place of "Birthright" in the Superman mythos. DC has never commented publicly on whether or not this 12-issue series is the new Superman origin or just a new take to see if readers enjoy it. Ponder this no longer, as Waid himself admits that "Superman: Birthright" is the new official origin of Superman and a "calculated" reboot. "If by 'calculated' we mean 'thought out in great detail to the Nth degree by creators who love the character,' then yes. Accept no substitutes-'Birthright' is officially the DC Comics Origin of Superman. I wish we could have simply said that up front nine months ago when the series began, but overall plans for Superman in 2003 were still somewhat in flux, so DC decided to be a little more circumspect about it and instead surprise fans with the building falllout to 'Birthright' as it pops up in the regular ongoing Superman monthlies. Readers seem very surprised, in a very good way. 'Birthright' is very much the foundation of everything DC's planning for Superman in the future.
Originally posted by jedi90
oh contraire mon fraire, me thinks DC comics disagrees with you but hey, what do they know.http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=3256
for your reading pleasure from the link:
The one thing that hasn't been clear to fans, new and old, is the place of "Birthright" in the Superman mythos. DC has never commented publicly on whether or not this 12-issue series is the new Superman origin or just a new take to see if readers enjoy it. Ponder this no longer, as Waid himself admits that "Superman: Birthright" is the new official origin of Superman and a "calculated" reboot. "If by 'calculated' we mean 'thought out in great detail to the Nth degree by creators who love the character,' then yes. Accept no substitutes-'Birthright' is officially the DC Comics Origin of Superman. I wish we could have simply said that up front nine months ago when the series began, but overall plans for Superman in 2003 were still somewhat in flux, so DC decided to be a little more circumspect about it and instead surprise fans with the building falllout to 'Birthright' as it pops up in the regular ongoing Superman monthlies. Readers seem very surprised, in a very good way. 'Birthright' is very much the foundation of everything DC's planning for Superman in the future.
They rebooted his origin, yes. But that's all. And DC themselves basically shelved Birthright later when Johns got on the book.
Things as far back as Death of Superman and Hunter/Prey were referenced as late as Countdown and even Final Crisis, which were after Birthright. Quite long after.
Originally posted by -Pr-
They rebooted his origin, yes. But that's all. And DC themselves basically shelved Birthright later when Johns got on the book.Things as far back as Death of Superman and Hunter/Prey were referenced as late as Countdown and even Final Crisis, which were after Birthright. Quite long after.
here, i'll post the most relevant part of that article again for you.
" Ponder this no longer, as Waid himself admits that "Superman: Birthright" is the new official origin of Superman and a "calculated" reboot"
They also gave him new powers and brought back some of his silver age elements, with some the donner film elements.
you seem to be struggling with what a reboot is and what it means. allow me to help you.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reboot_%28fiction%29
In serial fiction, to reboot means to discard all previous continuity in a series and start anew
Originally posted by jedi90
here, i'll post the most relevant part of that article again for you.[B]" Ponder this no longer, as Waid himself admits that "Superman: Birthright" is the new official origin of Superman and a "calculated" reboot"
They also gave him new powers and brought back some of his silver age elements, with some the donner film elements.
you seem to be struggling with what a reboot is and what it means. allow me to help you.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reboot_%28fiction%29
In serial fiction, to reboot means to discard all previous continuity in a series and start anew [/B]
Firstly, patronising me is a bad idea.
Second, this has already been discussed, at length, on the vs forums. And the CB forums. And was decided long ago.
Superman's history wasn't discarded. In the slightest. Anyone reading the comics would know that even up to the reboot itself, events from the 80s and 90s were still referenced as having happened, and as such were still canon.
This isn't just my opinion, this is a mod ruling, and you can ask any other comic-book mod; Pre Reboot Superman, on these forums, is considered to be Superman from the reboot after COIE, up until Flashpoint. Inclusive.
Lets put it on the table.
I firmly believe Hulk is stronger.
To those who say Superman is stronger, by all means please make a believer out of me.
Please provide a NON biased explanation and
Make sense of comparing strength vs continuous rising anger x strength.
OH AND YES Delta 1938, I got my eye on you.
I'm watching for a smarmy reply from the likes of you Sir.
Originally posted by -Pr-
Firstly, patronising me is a bad idea.Second, this has already been discussed, at length, on the vs forums. And the CB forums. And was decided long ago.
Superman's history wasn't discarded. In the slightest. Anyone reading the comics would know that even up to the reboot itself, events from the 80s and 90s were still referenced as having happened, and as such were still canon.
This isn't just my opinion, this is a mod ruling, and you can ask any other comic-book mod; Pre Reboot Superman, on these forums, is considered to be Superman from the reboot after COIE, up until Flashpoint. Inclusive.
wait a minute, didn't you earlier claim that birthright wasn't a reboot? then when i prove to you it was you now say i'm patronizing you. you're funny.
you also made it a point earlier to state that this is not a VS forum. so a ruling there means what here?
like i said, you enjoy one sided arguments. i'm not going to search through 5 years worth of comic debates to figure out what type of general consensus you guys came to, make it a sticky, or make it known at the beginning.
Originally posted by jedi90
wait a minute, didn't you earlier claim that birthright wasn't a reboot? then when i prove to you it was you now say i'm patronizing you. you're funny.you also made it a point earlier to state that this is not a VS forum. so a ruling there means what here?
like i said, you enjoy one sided arguments. i'm not going to search through 5 years worth of comic debates to figure out what type of general consensus you guys came to, make it a sticky, or make it known at the beginning.
Birthright changed/rebooted his origin. It didn't reboot his entire history. There's a difference. The comics themselves showed this. And yes, you were.
I mentioned more than the VS forum. In the VS forum, the "most recent version" is the rule unless otherwise stated. However, this isn't one of those threads, and deals with something else entirely. On the VS forum, though, Superman between 1986 and Flashpoint is considered one single entity, with all feats applicable therein.
No, I really don't, and I really don't know where you're getting that from.
Mr. PR,
I just HAVE to cut in on this one...
(your quote)
"No, I really don't, and I really don't know where you're getting that from."
I have seen many one sided debates in these forums and in turn many were closed with the moderator leaving their closing argument and signature statement CLOSED!!!
No, I am not pointing the finger at you but it does seem to be some hostility toward someone who disagrees with the biased fanboys.
Originally posted by -Pr-
Birthright changed/rebooted his origin. It didn't reboot his entire history. There's a difference. The comics themselves showed this. And yes, you were.I mentioned more than the VS forum. In the VS forum, the "most recent version" is the rule unless otherwise stated. However, this isn't one of those threads, and deals with something else entirely. On the VS forum, though, Superman between 1986 and Flashpoint is considered one single entity, with all feats applicable therein.
No, I really don't, and I really don't know where you're getting that from.
you were back peddling your statements and i called you on it, you need to grow some tougher skin.
you can't change the definition of a reboot. DC and Waid called it a reboot, and can bring forward any elements they choose but a reboot erases anything before.
Originally posted by jedi90
you were back peddling your statements and i called you on it, you need to grow some tougher skin.you can't change the definition of a reboot. DC and Waid called it a reboot, and can bring forward any elements they choose but a reboot erases anything before.
You can believe that's what happened, it doesn't make it so.
Or else you're just taking what you want out of the article, considering that the comics themselves showed no indication of the character being completely rebooted. Unless you want to claim that Johns changing the origin wiped out everything that came before, too.
Either way, the thread is what I said it was TWICE already. You arguing your point isn't going to make a difference to that.
Originally posted by -Pr-
You can believe that's what happened, it doesn't make it so.Or else you're just taking what you want out of the article, considering that the comics themselves showed no indication of the character being completely rebooted. Unless you want to claim that Johns changing the origin wiped out everything that came before, too.
Either way, the thread is what I said it was TWICE already. You arguing your point isn't going to make a difference to that.
you were but we can get back to that later.
you can read the article for yourself, i posted the link. DC and Waid OFFICIALLY called it a reboot. the rules of a reboot are clear (link also posted). they can bring forward whatever elements they want, just like in the new 52 green lantern comic, but the history is gone........DC gave johns his own reboot it's called the new 52. so unless you can provide an official statement about johns contributions after birthright, your argument is moot.
statements like that is why you come across one sided, birthright superman is a new superman with new powers and a new background. DC called it a reboot, period. all i asked was for you to get specific.
you mad?