trancendence...well then....
Chronomancer
T-Ray
Apocalypse
The Cuccoos
X-Man
Iceman
Emma Frost
Jean Grey
Marvel Girl
Shadow King
Deadpool
Cable
Stryfe
Sinster
Quentin Quire
Holocaust
Onslaught
Huntsman
Fantomex
Ultomiton (or whatever the hell Weapon XV was)
Madeline Pryor
Typhoid
among others, hell, even bullseye on one occassion
Chronomancer attempted to merge with time and ended up dead.
T-Ray was a mystical Deadpool character with about zero ties to mutants and mutant classification.
Apocalypse hasn't ascended.
The Cuckoos have two dead sisters and haven't shown signs of transcendence.
X-Man is dead, so there's nothing conclusive.
Iceman is a confirmed omega. look at that...
Emma Frost can turn to diamond the same way colossus turns to steel. what's your point?
Jean Grey is another confirmed omega.
Marvel Girl is not confirmed, and likely IS NOT an omega simply because her mother is.
Shadow King was killed and took over a decade to pull himself together in the astral plane.
Deadpool isn't a mutant.
Cable has shown no signs of transcendence.
Stryfe is dead
Sinster has, also, shown NO SIGNS OF TRANSCENDENCE.
Quentin Quire is a third confirmed omega.
Holocaust at best underwent a secondary mutation. and now he's dead.
Onslaught wasn't a mutant.
Huntsman is a genetically manipulated weapon gone wrong. how does that at all factor in?
Fantomex made a machine out of his nervous system. GO WEAPON PLUS. how does that at all factor in?
Ultomiton (or whatever the hell Weapon XV was) also has no ties to mutants or mutation. have you been paying attention to this 'weapons' theory i've been presenting? ahem... how does that at all factor in?
Madeline Pryor is DEAD.
Typhoid won't ever transcend. deal with it.
you are not at all grasping the idea of transcendence. it's not just 'hey, they're not human anymore.' they EVOLVE into their potential past the boundaries of the human form. and, considering their potential is defined as "infinite," that specifically rules out all limited mutations, whether they're in human bodies or not.
madison jeffries was a mutant transmutator whose powers affected synthetic materials in the same way his brother's powers affected organics. he's always been limited to manipulating outside sources and has shown no ability to manipulate himself, unless you falsely include the idea that him merging with box is anything but a plot device... he's strong, yes. and now he's brainwashed and his entire character's been washed away by the weapon x project... don't expect a big "omega" revelation.
as for the scarlet witch, she certainly has incredible powers. but that doesn't specifically make her an omega. she's been described as the marvel of the lehnsherr bloodline, but that doesn't qualify her either. so, until she's either shown ascending to some higher form, or confirmed as an omega (who may or may not have already ascended,) we can't say.
as for the others that have transcended, there are big differences between BEING human still and imitating the human form. bobby's ice form is in the shape of his previous, flesh-and-blood body. but, he's easily able to leave that shape, and had shown the ability to alter his body's shape even before the "omega" classification was introduced. he could walk around as an ice dog, or a dragon, or a car, if he really wanted to. but a theme with bobby through the years is that he settles for a comfortable level beneath his potential, and that's an easy explanation as to why he hasn't been so inventive with his powers.
quentin quire went through a secondary mutation and became some variety of energy/gas. he reassumed a "human" form only in shape when he reappeared in endsong. he'd been stabbed through the shoulder by wolverine's claws and battered by archangel, and he just shrugged it off. the body itself was not flesh and blood, and only returned to a human shape because its a familiar form. whether quentin could be as creative as iceman when assuming a corporeal form, i have no idea. that's just the nature of the beast.
jean hasn't even been shown to ascend to her "transcendental level" yet, considering it was eluded that her ascension would allow her to replace the phoenix force in the cosmic hierarchy. so it's excusable that she's still very human-esque. and since we can't say either way what elixir's transcendence would look like, he's very much excused from speculation.
wanda was able to heal herself in a manner much akin to kid omega. but her powers are so very different than his, and considering the countless other things she's done without the "omega" label, it's not scientific to assume that because she healed her spine, she's suddenly omega. like i said, you can consider her to be schroedinger's cat for now. just wait for those quantum possibilities to collapse into one reality, whenever that may occur, and we'll have our answer.
cable was able to destroy the skornn and unceremoniously split the aspects of his personalities across various other dimensions. if that counts as transcendence, and not desperation in death, then cable has some variety of omega potential. but since our cable's back to being a regular mutant with metal pieces to him, it's pretty null and void at this point...
alright, i have foind some very suprising news. here is a link that says that magneto, pyro, juggernaut, jean grey, and callisto are omega mutants. the link is for the third x-men film, so does this mean that they are omega in the movie? or omega in the comics as well, which wouldn't make sence because juggeraut is there.
you didn't really post the link. and considering how badly the movie has looked on canon policy, you can't take the "omega" term to mean anything. how would callisto, a woman whose only powers were enhanced senses and some extra strength, be an omega-level mutant? in canon, the only contender on that list is magneto, besides the confirmed jean, but he's shorted out too often for a sensible "magneto's an omega" revelation. pyro's not only dead, he had finite control over his power source. juggernaut's not a mutant. and i already moaned about callisto. none of that has any implications toward the comics, nor will it ever.
Originally posted by stormfront13
alright, i have foind some very suprising news. here is a link that says that magneto, pyro, juggernaut, jean grey, and callisto are omega mutants. the link is for the third x-men film, so does this mean that they are omega in the movie? or omega in the comics as well, which wouldn't make sence because juggeraut is there.
I thought Juggernaut is not a mutant??? Or I am just wrong??? and what makes callisto OMEGA? cannot understand that. Heehe, can someone fill me in.
Originally posted by Disappear
you didn't really post the link. and considering how badly the movie has looked on canon policy, you can't take the "omega" term to mean anything. how would callisto, a woman whose only powers were enhanced senses and some extra strength, be an omega-level mutant? in canon, the only contender on that list is magneto, besides the confirmed jean, but he's shorted out too often for a sensible "magneto's an omega" revelation. pyro's not only dead, he had finite control over his power source. juggernaut's not a mutant. and i already moaned about callisto. none of that has any implications toward the comics, nor will it ever.
yes, i realize all of this, and it was only a question. though since there is no definite term of omega, you can't really justify who is, or who isn't omega till they are confirmed or it is stated they aren't omegas. though i agree with you that no one on the list is omega.
except jean. and, if we consider apocalypse's classification of "alpha" as a group that cannot be "omegas," then we know magneto's not an omega. so really, the only "omega" anywhere near that list is jean, with cain being a non-mutant, pyro being dead and relatively low-level, and callisto being a very "common" mutant, in that her powers are not powerful nor unique.
the only "definite" terms for omega are "unlimited potential" and "ability to transcend the boundaries of human existence," the latter being metaphysical as well as physical and thus discluding mutants such as malice. and, while it's true that you cannot definitively say "such and such is not an omega" unless they've been classified otherwise, or explicitly confirmed or denied, you can easily make educated guesses along the known facts. callisto hasn't had any different powers emerge on her own since her initial appearance, and has only had different "looks" thanks to masque. not omega material. pyro had very limited powers, which he applied interestingly enough, until he died of the legacy virus. magneto has great powers, but there appears to be a limit as he's "shorted out" numerous times. [this is up for debate, considering claremont's recent excalibur series, but making him an omega would likely be a bad move, and would contradict the "alpha" classifications dealt during the 'twelve' story.] and juggernaut HAD "unlimited strength" and whatnot, but he was never a mutant.
Originally posted by Disappear
except jean. and, if we consider apocalypse's classification of "alpha" as a group that cannot be "omegas," then we know magneto's not an omega. so really, the only "omega" anywhere near that list is jean, with cain being a non-mutant, pyro being dead and relatively low-level, and callisto being a very "common" mutant, in that her powers are not powerful nor unique.the only "definite" terms for omega are "unlimited potential" and "ability to transcend the boundaries of human existence," the latter being metaphysical as well as physical and thus discluding mutants such as malice. and, while it's true that you cannot definitively say "such and such is not an omega" unless they've been classified otherwise, or explicitly confirmed or denied, you can easily make educated guesses along the known facts. callisto hasn't had any different powers emerge on her own since her initial appearance, and has only had different "looks" thanks to masque. not omega material. pyro had very limited powers, which he applied interestingly enough, until he died of the legacy virus. magneto has great powers, but there appears to be a limit as he's "shorted out" numerous times. [this is up for debate, considering claremont's recent excalibur series, but making him an omega would likely be a bad move, and would contradict the "alpha" classifications dealt during the 'twelve' story.] and juggernaut HAD "unlimited strength" and whatnot, but he was never a mutant.
no, transcending is not a requirement for omega, all of the confirmed mutants have the ability to transcend, but it's not a requirement. you came right out and said that no, they definitley were not omega, which isn't excactley true yet due to the fact that it hasn't been confirmed wether or not they are. yes, i know it's a small thing, but it's true.
if you can find a quote where i said "transcendence is not a qualification for being an omega," go for it. until then, i'll keep what was said by xavier himself, and the beyonder, as my source that says "omega mutants will transcend the boundaries of human existence." if you can find a canon source that says otherwise, you're welcome to point that out as well.
multiple man's powers have acted differently ever since one of his dupes died of the legacy virus, though there's absolutely nothing to suggest he possesses "omega" level potential. he's surely an alpha. same goes for sebastian shaw, though his powers have been more or less the same ever since their introduction.
and if you want to follow up on what madrox's powers might "evolve" into, i'd suggest you pick up the madrox mini-series, and begin picking up the new x-factor book when it comes out this month, and in all the months to come. PAD more than suggests that there's something to jamie's powers, if not his very existence, that neither he nor we have any idea of. should be interesting, especially for apparent multiple man fans like us.
and stormfront, i'm really not sure what you're trying to say there... omegas are classified by their unlimited potential and the fact that their genetics will, at some point, grant them the ability to transcend beyond the limitations of human existence. examples: iceman, kid omega. jean's ever-redefined phoenix connection could possibly be considered a "transcendence," though the beyonder made a point to imply she may "one day" replace the phoenix, also implying her "transcendence" has not fully occurred yet. whether elixir has transcended (highly unlikely) or not yet is immaterial in the argument that he will at one point, as he is an omega.