Silver Surfer & Thor vs JLA

Originally posted by aliveinboston
I said Shazam's is MORE than a hundred times stronger. How much more we cannot know. What we do know is that one bolt didnt kill superman outright. However, we do know that 100 times stronger is enough to hurt Superman to the point where he cries. Assuming Superman is like humans but much tougher, the jump from electricity that hurts a lot to electricity that kills is less than 15 times. So Shazam's lightning (on that occasion) is probably much less than 1500 times stronger than earth's lightning. Perhaps he can summon stronger lightning perhaps not. We cannot know.

What we do know is that Thor can summon lightning millions of times stronger than earth's lightning (strong enough to kill himself if he allowed himself to be struck by it) and we also know that he can concentrate and direct all that energy with his hammer.

We also know that Thor can summon lightning such that it blankets a wide area which means that each individual will be struck by multiple bolts continuously.

Ok, my bad, i'm just curious as to why the jla are standing still to allow thor to cast such lightning...

dontgetit

thor and ss v hal and kyle would be a GREAT match. flash, ww AND superman too?

jla.

and there is a VERY common misconception in the forum that states thor (and hercules for that matter) is immune to telepathic assault. that is completely and ENTIRELY untrue. j'onzz would be able to thoroughly screw with thor's head and either beat him outright or delay him for PLENTY long enough to let someone else administer the coup de grace.

another point -- shazam's lightning is MAGICAL -- hence its impact on superman. someone please show PROOF that thor uses lightning that is MAGICAL. he controls the elements. he calls down NATURAL lightning. and natural lightning ain't gonna do JACK to superman or any of the others -- most especially if they are FLYING!! besides, before thor does ANYTHING, flash grabs the lasso and wraps him up taking him out of the fight. hell, he couldn't hit spiderman or mongoose! then everyone battles ss. he's good but TWO gls + the others??

c'mon . . .

Originally posted by Avalonofthewind
No kinetic energy means Thor is frozen completely..he won't be doing a damn thing...

1) Thor controls lightning with his thoughts. He won't have to do a "damn thing" to kill them all.
2) How the hell will anyone steal his "kinetic energy" when they are already electrocuted? If anything it would be the other way around as Mjolnir can absorb any kind of energy including Flash's life force.

and why do you keep insisting that lightning will do anything?

Thors lightning = crap to most of these guys. GL turns thor into a frog. End of fight for him.

Shazam (skyfather) blasted Superman over and over with magic lightning... and Superman kept coming.

I already explained why. Go back and read. Shazam hit him three times with unexceptionally powerful lightning and Superman was not only unable to dodge even one lightning bolt, he was physically hurt by each one.

Superman has already KO'd Thor. Hal has jacked energy from Surfer.

And batman beat the hulk. What's your point? None of that crap is canon.

Hell, they had to tone down flash when he went to the Marvel U.

According to you guys the JLA can easily take down all the Celestials.

Originally posted by pr1983
Ok, my bad, i'm just curious as to why the jla are standing still to allow thor to cast such lightning...

It doesnt matter what they are doing because as even Superman isnt capable of dodging a single lightning bolt. When the lightning is coming down like rain and fills the sky and ground, there is nowhere to go. Thor doesnt need to "do" anything to make lightning happen, he just wills it. As such it can't be stopped. What's more, Thor can be in space trading golfing tips with the Surfer (I never understood how superheroes can hear each other when there is no air for sound to travel) while he indiscriminately saturates the ground and air with lightning killing the JLA and anyone else.

Originally posted by aliveinboston
According to you guys the JLA can easily take down all the Celestials.

*ducks to dodge rattler being thrown from buggy*

Seriously... shit like that is not productive...

Originally posted by aliveinboston
It doesnt matter what they are doing because as even Superman isnt capable of dodging a single lightning bolt. When the lightning is coming down like rain and fills the sky and ground, there is nowhere to go. Thor doesnt need to "do" anything to make lightning happen, he just wills it. As such it can't be stopped. What's more, Thor can be in space trading golfing tips with the Surfer (I never understood how superheroes can hear each other when there is no air for sound to travel) while he indiscriminately saturates the ground and air with lightning killing the JLA and anyone else.

You really underestimate the jla don't you? it was already explained that thor's lightning isn't magical... without magic it won't hurt superman as much as you claim...

Originally posted by aliveinboston
1) Thor controls lightning with his thoughts. He won't have to do a "damn thing" to kill them all.
2) How the hell will anyone steal his "kinetic energy" when they are already electrocuted? If anything it would be the other way around as Mjolnir can absorb any kind of energy including Flash's life force.

I already explained why. Go back and read. Shazam hit him three times with unexceptionally powerful lightning and Superman was not only unable to dodge even one lightning bolt, he was physically hurt by each one.

And batman beat the hulk. What's your point? None of that crap is canon.

According to you guys the JLA can easily take down all the Celestials.

You my freind are insufferable. What the hell makes you think that the Jla is going to stand still while Thor and Silver Surfer cast energy and rain down lighting? What the freak makes you think that the Jla who constantly faced foes much more powerful than surfer and thor comboned is going to be put down by Thor and Surfer? When did Thor and Surfer become powerful enough to take out 7 Heralds. Cuz that is exactly what it would be like them fighting. Only these heralds ( the JLA) are the best fighting team in comics history. Every one should really just over look you as you dont' know anything about DC. Go read some respect threads and some DC comics.

Originally posted by aliveinboston
1) Thor controls lightning with his thoughts. He won't have to do a "damn thing" to kill them all.

His thoughts are frozen along with everything else. He's a statue. A stiff..etc. There are far too many ways to take out Thor.

And Thors lightning is nothing to write home about to these characters. GL ring>Mjolnir. Skyfather level weapon vs Most powerful weapon in the universe. I know which one I'm going with.

Originally posted by aliveinboston
2) How the hell will anyone steal his "kinetic energy" when they are already electrocuted? If anything it would be the other way around as Mjolnir can absorb any kind of energy including Flash's life force.

Besides the fact that most of them are invulnerable and far faster than lightning? Thor will be KO'd long before he could even try to mount an offensive.

Originally posted by aliveinboston
I already explained why. Go back and read. Shazam hit him three times with unexceptionally powerful lightning and Superman was not only unable to dodge even one lightning bolt, he was physically hurt by each one.

Shazam magic lightning>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Thors magical weather creation ability. Nothing in Thors arsenal will even begin to compete with Shazam himself.

Originally posted by aliveinboston
And batman beat the hulk. What's your point? None of that crap is canon.

Weapon than can do anything vs a human kicking a superpowered being and not breaking his leg. Yep..bad comparison there.
By the way, Cyborg and Parallax DO remember that encounter with each other in the Marvel U...

Originally posted by aliveinboston
According to you guys the JLA can easily take down all the Celestials.

According to you, Thor can take out the JLA and probably Surfer as well with his super lightning.

Originally posted by leonidas
dontgetit

thor and ss v hal and kyle would be a GREAT match. flash, ww AND superman too?

jla.

and there is a VERY common misconception in the forum that states thor (and hercules for that matter) is immune to telepathic assault. [b]that is completely and ENTIRELY untrue. j'onzz would be able to thoroughly screw with thor's head and either beat him outright or delay him for PLENTY long enough to let someone else administer the coup de grace.

another point -- shazam's lightning is MAGICAL -- hence its impact on superman. someone please show PROOF that thor uses lightning that is MAGICAL. he controls the elements. he calls down NATURAL lightning. and natural lightning ain't gonna do JACK to superman or any of the others -- most especially if they are FLYING!! besides, before thor does ANYTHING, flash grabs the lasso and wraps him up taking him out of the fight. hell, he couldn't hit spiderman or mongoose! then everyone battles ss. he's good but TWO gls + the others??

c'mon . . . [/B]

Thor can summon lightning where there are no clouds to generate it. This is called magical lightning. This lightning is also far more powerful than normal lightning.

Shazam's lightning is also far more powerful than normal lightning. Just one bolt was enough to humble superman. It's not because it was magic that it hurt Superman, but because of it's intensity. Even natural lightning just 100 times greater than normal has hurt Superman. Thor and, presumably, Captain Marvel can call upon lightning far more powerful than that.

Being in the air wont protect superman anymore than it protects an airplane caught in a storm. In case you forgot, lightning has to travel through the air to reach the ground.

Originally posted by pr1983
*ducks to dodge rattler being thrown from buggy*

Seriously... shit like that is not productive...

You really underestimate the jla don't you? it was already explained that thor's lightning isn't magical... without magic it won't hurt superman as much as you claim...

Lightning isn't even an issue for Superman...here he is standing in the most powerful electric storm the upper atmosphere has even seen..created by Supes himself.

Hell, Supes just created enough static electricity by rubbing his hands to seal of a dimensional rift. Superman and most of the JLA can play with Thors weather ability.

Originally posted by aliveinboston
Thor can summon lightning where there are no clouds to generate it. This is called magical lightning. This lightning is also far more powerful than normal lightning.

Shazam's lightning is also far more powerful than normal lightning. Just one bolt was enough to humble superman. It's not because it was magic that it hurt Superman, but because of it's intensity. Even natural lightning just 100 times greater than normal has hurt Superman. Thor and, presumably, Captain Marvel can call upon lightning far more powerful than that.

Being in the air wont protect superman anymore than it protects an airplane caught in a storm. In case you forgot, lightning has to travel through the air to reach the ground.

When lightning hits a human being, the person has to be touching the ground for them to be actually fried. That is why Cm was hitting superman on the ground. if the human being is not grounded, and they are some how in the air, the lighting passes thru them. The reason a plane can be hit by lighting is becuase it is metal. THis one reason why storm beating wonder woman in the dc vs marvel book was crap. they were flying. and no human being can ever be struck by lighting in the air. Thor's lighting means the big donut when every one can fly. and we all know lighting to the flash is a joke, it is the very thing that gave him his powers.

Originally posted by Avalonofthewind
His thoughts are frozen along with everything else. He's a statue. A stiff..etc. There are far too many ways to take out Thor.

By dead people who can't dodge a lightning bolt?

And Thors lightning is nothing to write home about to these characters. GL ring>Mjolnir. Skyfather level weapon vs Most powerful weapon in the universe. I know which one I'm going with.

So you are saying the GL ring can overwhelm the Celestials? Are you saying it's like the infinity gauntlet? You're no different than people who think hulk can kill exitar with his "infinite rage and strength"? Actually worse since you're claiming the GL ring can take all celestials.

Besides the fact that most of them are invulnerable and far faster than lightning? Thor will be KO'd long before he could even try to mount an offensive.

Superman can't even dodge a single lightning bolt. keep dreaming.

Shazam magic lightning>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Thors magical weather creation ability. Nothing in Thors arsenal will even begin to compete with Shazam himself.

Magical weather creation ability? You have no clue. Shazam's lightning didnt even kill Superman or create a huge crater. Thor has created lightning that is hundreds, maybe even thousands of times more powerful many times.

Weapon than can do anything vs a human kicking a superpowered being and not breaking his leg. Yep..bad comparison there.
By the way, Cyborg and Parallax DO remember that encounter with each other in the Marvel U...

Do you think Hulk remembers getting beaten by Batman?

According to you, Thor can take out the JLA and probably Surfer as well with his super lightning.

Yes and decades of Marvel comics support this view. On the other hand, there is very little precedence for claims that the GL ring can do things that are beyond the power of Celestials except as PIS.

Originally posted by Avalonofthewind
Lightning isn't even an issue for Superman...here he is standing in the most powerful electric storm the upper atmosphere has even seen..created by Supes himself.

Hell, Supes just created enough static electricity by rubbing his hands to seal of a dimensional rift. Superman and most of the JLA can play with Thors weather ability.

Superman's durabilty is not resilient against magical items. Againts normal items he is but not magical. Its the main reason why Superman would not do well against Thor, but Captain Marvel would do well against Thor. Thor's hits are gonna hurt, moreso than anything else superman's tasted. magical lightning is not normal lightning.

Ie. a repulsor blast would have almost no effect on superman
but a magical bolt would have superman on his knees.

its not that the magically summoned bolt of lightning is 100 times stronger than normal. its because its magical in nature. hence. it hurts superman.

It doesn't mean team marvel is gonna win. they'll still lose... but... one on one. thor has the means to put down superman.

Originally posted by aliveinboston
By dead people who can't dodge a lightning bolt?

So you are saying the GL ring can overwhelm the Celestials? Are you saying it's like the infinity gauntlet? You're no different than people who think hulk can kill exitar with his "infinite rage and strength"? Actually worse since you're claiming the GL ring can take all celestials.

Superman can't even dodge a single lightning bolt. keep dreaming.

Magical weather creation ability? You have no clue. Shazam's lightning didnt even kill Superman or create a huge crater. Thor has created lightning that is hundreds, maybe even thousands of times more powerful many times.

Do you think Hulk remembers getting beaten by Batman?

Yes and decades of Marvel comics support this view. On the other hand, there is very little precedence for claims that the GL ring can do things that are beyond the power of Celestials except as PIS.

Anything Thor's Hammer can do, A Gl ring can do better. So I don't know where you are getting your info from.

Originally posted by aliveinboston
Thor can summon lightning where there are no clouds to generate it. This is called magical lightning. This lightning is also far more powerful than normal lightning.

😕 no, that is called summoning lightning from the sky. why would the lord of lightning need clouds . . .? basically, you have no proof the lightning is magical.

Shazam's lightning is also far more powerful than normal lightning. Just one bolt was enough to humble superman. It's not because it was magic that it hurt Superman, but because of it's intensity.

i suppose you have proof that it was intensity rather than the magical nature that caused it to hurt him . . .?

Being in the air wont protect superman anymore than it protects an airplane caught in a storm. In case you forgot, lightning has to travel through the air to reach the ground. [/B]

😕

and what keeps flash from wrapping him up a hundred times before the first bolt is called? what keeps the gls from teleporting outside of the lightning strike area right behind thor and doing any of a thousand things to him?

Originally posted by aliveinboston
By dead people who can't dodge a lightning bolt?

They don't need to dodge lightning..and even if they did, Thor is considerably slower than just about everyone in the JLA team.

Originally posted by aliveinboston
So you are saying the GL ring can overwhelm the Celestials? Are you saying it's like the infinity gauntlet? You're no different than people who think hulk can kill exitar with his "infinite rage and strength"? Actually worse since you're claiming the GL ring can take all celestials.

A GL ring can do anything. Willpower is it's only limitation. It's been stated many many many times. A human may have problems with a celestial because of the insane willpower it would take to battle one, but then again so would Thor.

Originally posted by aliveinboston

[QUOTE=7126035]Originally posted by aliveinboston
[B]Superman can't even dodge a single lightning bolt. keep dreaming.

What planet are you on? OK, Thor can barely hold up a building.
Metallo can beat him.

Originally posted by aliveinboston
Magical weather creation ability? You have no clue. Shazam's lightning didnt even kill Superman or create a huge crater. Thor has created lightning that is hundreds, maybe even thousands of times more powerful many times.

I grew up reading a LOT of Marvel. Even the Marvel guidebook says that he simply can create storms out of nowhere unlike Storm who has to manually manipulate them. Otherwise, it's the same ability..it's not magic for either one of them...

Originally posted by aliveinboston
Do you think Hulk remembers getting beaten by Batman?

And this had to do with?

Originally posted by aliveinboston
Yes and decades of Marvel comics support this view. On the other hand, there is very little precedence for claims that the GL ring can do things that are beyond the power of Celestials except as PIS.

Decades of Marvel comics have also shown Thor to have trouble with the wrecking crew, and chick made out of quicksand, spider-man, mongoose, etc... 😆

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
When lightning hits a human being, the person has to be touching the ground for them to be actually fried. That is why Cm was hitting superman on the ground. if the human being is not grounded, and they are some how in the air, the lighting passes thru them.

That contravenes the laws of physics. Lightning cannot pass through without affecting the medium unless the medium is a perfect conductor. Human's are not perfect conductors and neither is superman.

The reason a plane can be hit by lighting is becuase it is metal.

Planes are made primarily of a metal that transmits electricity efficiently so that they can be conductors instead of resistors. Resistors heat up really fast. Ever seen an electric stove top? That swirly thing is a resistor caught between two conductors. If planes were not made of metal, they would still get hit by lightning but instead of lightning almost harmlessly passing through, it would cause the aircraft to melt or explode. This is why there is a growing concern about all the kit planes flying around made almost entirely of non-conductive parts, not to mention the new passenger airliners with alternative materials.

THis one reason why storm beating wonder woman in the dc vs marvel book was crap. they were flying. and no human being can ever be struck by lighting in the air.

Anything in the way of two irresistably powerful charges will become a conduit, whether its a human, wonder woman, or air molecules.

Thor's lighting means the big donut when every one can fly.

Sorry try again. Go read your physics text book.

and we all know lighting to the flash is a joke, it is the very thing that gave him his powers.

You ever heard of there being too much of a good thing? How about a million times too much?

Originally posted by rotiart
Superman's durabilty is not resilient against magical items. Againts normal items he is but not magical. Its the main reason why Superman would not do well against Thor, but Captain Marvel would do well against Thor. Thor's hits are gonna hurt, moreso than anything else superman's tasted. magical lightning is not normal lightning.

Ie. a repulsor blast would have almost no effect on superman
but a magical bolt would have superman on his knees.

its not that the magically summoned bolt of lightning is 100 times stronger than normal. its because its magical in nature. hence. it hurts superman.

It doesn't mean team marvel is gonna win. they'll still lose... but... one on one. thor has the means to put down superman.

Superman's magic resistance is due to his willpower...if he believes he can overcome it, he does a LOT better against it...besides...mystical storms didn't even hurt Byrne Supes..the weakest version of the character...

Unfortunately for Thor, he has mystical control over storms...but the storms themselves aren't mystical.

Not like it helps his case anyway.

Originally posted by aliveinboston
That contravenes the laws of physics. Lightning cannot pass through without affecting the medium unless the medium is a perfect conductor. Human's are not perfect conductors and neither is superman.

Planes are made primarily of a metal that transmits electricity efficiently so that they can be conductors instead of resistors. Resistors heat up really fast. Ever seen an electric stove top? That swirly thing is a resistor caught between two conductors. If planes were not made of metal, they would still get hit by lightning but instead of almost harmlessly passing the lightning through, it would melt or explode. This is why there is a growing concern about all the kit planes flying around made almost entirely of non-conductive parts.

Anything in the way of two irresistably powerful charges will become a conduit, whether its a human, wonder woman, or air molecules.

Sorry try again. Go read your physics text book.

You ever heard of there being too much of a good thing? How about a million times too much?

Actually Physics was one of my minor's in school. I know what I'm talking about. Any way, It seems that the majority of the forum has decided with me. We all know the truth. The JLA can beat Thor and Surfer. If thor was so good with magical lighting, he would have done it so many times before when absorbing man was kicking his ass. Or when gladiator beat the hell out of him and wonder man at the same time. Or how about the time juggernaut showed Thor a reall good ass whoopin. Just stop it with the BS ur cranking out. Thor is a non factor in this battle as Wonder Woman could battle Thor for hours before either would fall. Leaving the rest of the Jla to pick the silver surfer apart. and the two best gl's ever would crack open surfers silver body suit and take nudy pics for the corps back home.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
Actually Physics was one of my minor's in school. I know what I'm talking about. Any way, It seems that the majority of the forum has decided with me. We all know the truth. The JLA can beat Thor and Surfer. If thor was so good with magical lighting, he would have done it so many times before when absorbing man was kicking his ass. Or when gladiator beat the hell out of him and wonder man at the same time. Or how about the time juggernaut showed Thor a reall good ass whoopin. Just stop it with the BS ur cranking out. Thor is a non factor in this battle as Wonder Woman could battle Thor for hours before either would fall. Leaving the rest of the Jla to pick the silver surfer apart. and the two best gl's ever would crack open surfers silver body suit and take nudy pics for the corps back home.

not exactly the way i'd have put it, but, the conclusion is correct. 😄 in any event, ww can shield from lightning by crossing her bracelets, superman wouldn't be bothered as the lightning is NOT magical, gls would have teleported away.

NOT that thor would have the chance to CALL his lightning -- either flash wraps him in the lasso or j'onzz f**** with his mind. the 2 greatest gls ever would be enough to take ss.

Originally posted by Avalonofthewind
They don't need to dodge lightning..and even if they did, Thor is considerably slower than just about everyone in the JLA team.

Superman is the toughest of the lot and a single pansy lightning bolt made him cry like a baby and bleed. As for Thor's speed, he is quite fast, but it's irrelevant in this conversation as he wont be fighting them hand to hand.

A GL ring can do anything. Willpower is it's only limitation. It's been stated many many many times. A human may have problems with a celestial because of the insane willpower it would take to battle one, but then again so would Thor.

So now that you've said the GL Ring is equivalent to the Infinity Gauntlet it is apparent that not even the combined power of Eternity, Celestials, Chaos, Order, etc.... are enough to stop a single Green Lantern, let alone the JLA! 😆

What planet are you on? OK, Thor can barely hold up a building.

Balancing a building is different from carrying it. I can barely balance a broom but thats not because the broom weights too much.

I grew up reading a LOT of Marvel. Even the Marvel guidebook says that he simply can create storms out of nowhere unlike Storm who has to manually manipulate them. Otherwise, it's the same ability..it's not magic for either one of them...

Creating storms out of nowhere is magic, not nature, and as such the power of that storm is determined by magic, not by nature.

And this had to do with?

The discussion on what is canon.

Decades of Marvel comics have also shown Thor to have trouble with the wrecking crew, and chick made out of quicksand, spider-man, mongoose, etc...

Sure, while he was holding back and not using his most powerful attacks of the sort he used against enemies far more powerful.