Originally posted by Dinalfos
Uhm....No, I didn't.
Yes you really did. The scan had shown Hulk fighting his shadow, for a day. The shadow at the end of the day gloated when Hulk was tired and down. The shadow then kicked the Hulk down a hill.
You posted the pic because you were trying to show us how much stamina Hulk has.
Originally posted by Soujaboy
Yes you really did. The scan had shown Hulk fighting his shadow, for a day. The shadow at the end of the day gloated when Hulk was tired and down. The shadow then kicked the Hulk down a hill.You posted the pic because you were trying to show us how much stamina Hulk has.
I really, really didn't.
Originally posted by Soujaboy
So thats the best you could come up with? It's not important so Marvel didn't state it? Im sorry but I base my facts off of what Marvel gives there characters, not your whack theory.It doesn't matter how focused he is on getting stronger. His rage still has limits, thus limiting his strength. Until Marvel states your theory as true, im not buying Hulk can increase his strength without being enraged but through focus. No offense but that sounds like you got that from Juggernauts power.
It really doesn't matter what your theory or opinion of how Hulk can increase his strength. Marvel says he increases his strength through rage, you say he increases his strength through focus. I think im going to take Marvels word for it. 😉
The reason Mindless Hulk is stronger than Savage Hulk is because Savage Hulk cannot reach the lv of rage Mindless Hulk was at without outside help.
Who has Hulk faced who's on Onslaughts lv?
I didn't compare Hulks physical characteristics to those of a humans(Although he is one) I compared there minds to one another. Marvel hasn't stated that the Hulk's mind is any different than any other humans. It's just that Hulk's mind is like a 2 years old's on roids. Thus limiting his rage and adrenalin.
The only reason you find my arguments flawed is because unlike your's they make sense, and you really can't Deni them. So instead of saying your wrong you call my argument flawed.
So your basically just assuming Hulk has these powers without any evidence and against Marvels characteristics for the character. How would you feel if I just made up a power for say... Colossus without any proof or Marvels word, what would you say?
It seems like your the only Hulk fan that thinks Hulk can increase his strength through focus.
I can't prove to you that Hulk's strength and rage have a limit because you refuse to accept it. You just dont want to hear that Hulk's strength is limited, so you just ignore the facts and continue to argue a point that makes no sense and gets you no where.
I never said that Hulk couldn't increase his strength with rage, I just said that his rage has limits which I have proved. You just continue to ignore my arguments, and give false information.
In the Hulk vs Juggernaut thread Dinalflos posted a scan of Hulk fighting his shadow. After fighting his shadow for a day, Hulk collapsed from being so tired. I don't know why your acting like you didn't see the pic.
Here, Marvel says that no force is stronger than the Hulk after he struggles to destroy a celestial-level device...
http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/8582/featsflameoflife1c6gm.jpg
This helps lead me to believe that Hulk can get madder and increase his strength to accomplish any task, supporting that neither his strength nor his anger have their limits. If Hulk is too weak to do something, he get angrier as a result and get stronger until he reaches the level of strength he needs to accomplish a task.
In other words, if Hulk feels too weak to pull of a strength task, then he'll get pissed that he's too weak, and that anger will make him stronger until he reaches the appropriate level of strength he needs.
And here, Beyonder (written by a Marvel writer of course) states that not only is Hulk rage personified, but he is "an infinity of power..."
http://img145.exs.cx/img145/1226/beyonder6ca.jpg
Here, Marvel uses Beyonder to outright state that Hulk has unlimited rage and power and you say you'll take Marvel's word for it, so...
I said your argument that Hulk is limited because he's like a normal human is flawed. Humans also can't regenerate brain stems, see ghosts, or breathe underwater, but that hasn't stopped Hulk either.
Was Hulk tired during his fight with the shadow? I said Hulk never tires as long as he is enraged and fighting. Chances are, after the fight ended, his rage subsided.
Originally posted by Accel
Well, look at this...Here, Marvel says that no force is stronger than the Hulk after he struggles to destroy a celestial-level device...
http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/8582/featsflameoflife1c6gm.jpg
This helps lead me to believe that Hulk can get madder and increase his strength to accomplish any task, supporting that neither his strength nor his anger have their limits. If Hulk is too weak to do something, he get angrier as a result and get stronger until he reaches the level of strength he needs to accomplish a task.In other words, if Hulk feels too weak to pull of a strength task, then he'll get pissed that he's too weak, and that anger will make him stronger until he reaches the appropriate level of strength he needs.
And here, Beyonder (written by a Marvel writer of course) states that not only is Hulk rage personified, but he is "an infinity of power..."
http://img145.exs.cx/img145/1226/beyonder6ca.jpg
Here, Marvel uses Beyonder to outright state that Hulk has unlimited rage and power and you say you'll take Marvel's word for it, so...I said your argument that Hulk is limited because he's like a normal human is flawed. Humans also can't regenerate brain stems, see ghosts, or breathe underwater, but that hasn't stopped Hulk either.
Was Hulk tired [B]during
his fight with the shadow? I said Hulk never tires as long as he is enraged and fighting. Chances are, after the fight ended, his rage subsided. [/B]
Originally posted by Accel
Well, look at this...Here, Marvel says that no force is stronger than the Hulk after he struggles to destroy a celestial-level device...
http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/8582/featsflameoflife1c6gm.jpg
This helps lead me to believe that Hulk can get madder and increase his strength to accomplish any task, supporting that neither his strength nor his anger have their limits. If Hulk is too weak to do something, he get angrier as a result and get stronger until he reaches the level of strength he needs to accomplish a task.In other words, if Hulk feels too weak to pull of a strength task, then he'll get pissed that he's too weak, and that anger will make him stronger until he reaches the appropriate level of strength he needs.
And here, Beyonder (written by a Marvel writer of course) states that not only is Hulk rage personified, but he is "an infinity of power..."
http://img145.exs.cx/img145/1226/beyonder6ca.jpg
Here, Marvel uses Beyonder to outright state that Hulk has unlimited rage and power and you say you'll take Marvel's word for it, so...I said your argument that Hulk is limited because he's like a normal human is flawed. Humans also can't regenerate brain stems, see ghosts, or breathe underwater, but that hasn't stopped Hulk either.
Was Hulk tired [B]during
his fight with the shadow? I said Hulk never tires as long as he is enraged and fighting. Chances are, after the fight ended, his rage subsided. [/B]
Marvel also says that Juggernaut is unstoppable, Iron Man is invincible, Hercules is the strongest avenger, admantium is unbreakable ext . It really doesn't matter what the narration of a comics says, it matters what there powers are and how they show them.
Look here, this scan says that when Juggernaut was physically fighting Stonecutter that never had a fury of that magnitude been unleashed upon the Natural world. That includes all Marvel characters who have ever physically fought on earth.
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e101/Soujaboy/jug8thdayp332kl.jpg
Does that automatically mean that Juggernaut is physically the strongest being on earth? According to the narration of that comic he is.
I already told you that Hulk can increase his strength. I just said that he has a limit to his rage and adrenalin, but you refuse to accept it.
Since when did humans get healing factors of Hulks magnitude? Since when couldn't Humans see spirits and ghost? Since when did breathing underwater have anything to do with the brain and mind?
He was fighting and couldn't fight anymore because he was tired. He than fell down, and his shadow kicked him.
Originally posted by Accel
Also, I'd like to add in regards to Hulk's stamina that I quoted a handbook AND I showed Hulk fighting for days and even weeks, so why are you basing your entire opinion off of one vague scan that he can be tired after a day of fighting?
I quoted the most recent Hulk handbook, and it said nothing about Unlimited durability or stamina. Hulk fighting for days and weeks doesn't prove that he has unlimited stamina, so that point is moot. You posted one scan where it said Hulk's strength is unlimited and you based your last argument on it, so don't be hypocritical.
Originally posted by Soujaboy
Marvel also says that Juggernaut is unstoppable, Iron Man is invincible, Hercules is the strongest avenger, admantium is unbreakable ext . It really doesn't matter what the narration of a comics says, it matters what there powers are and how they show them.Look here, this scan says that when Juggernaut was physically fighting Stonecutter that never had a fury of that magnitude been unleashed upon the Natural world. That includes all Marvel characters who have ever physically fought on earth.
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e101/Soujaboy/jug8thdayp332kl.jpg
Does that automatically mean that Juggernaut is physically the strongest being on earth? According to the narration of that comic he is.
You asked me to show proof of Marvel outright stating Hulk has unlimited strength and I did. Now you dismiss it, stating Marvel was exaggerating. What do you want me to do? Prove Hulk has unlimited strength by showing him NOT reaching his limit?
Originally posted by Soujaboy
I already told you that Hulk can increase his strength. I just said that he has a limit to his rage and adrenalin, but you refuse to accept it.
Here, Iron Man states, "there is no limit to his rage!"
http://img235.echo.cx/img235/8779/avengersih316g5ee.jpg
Beyonder: "you're nothing but raging power personified! An infinity of power..."
http://img54.imageshack.us/img54/6527/beyonder6ca6iz.jpg
Originally posted by Soujaboy
He was fighting and couldn't fight anymore because he was tired. He than fell down, and his shadow kicked him.
Originally posted by Soujaboy
I quoted the most recent Hulk handbook, and it said nothing about Unlimited durability or stamina. Hulk fighting for days and weeks doesn't prove that he has unlimited stamina, so that point is moot. You posted one scan where it said Hulk's strength is unlimited and you based your last argument on it, so don't be hypocritical.
In the Hulk guide, it states on page 12 under "Hulk's Powers", "the longer a battle lasts, the stronger he gets and there doesn't seem to be any limit to his strength."
Under "Super-Stamina" on page 13, it states, "The Hulk never seems to tire. His endurance appears to be as unlimited as his strength... No matter how the odds are stack against him, he can outlast or grow strong enough to conquer any opponent."
It's there for any handbook quoters. Word. For. Word. So look it up if you want. It's Marvel yet again regarding Hulk has unlimited strength.
As for unlimited durability, here it states that Hulk becomes more durable when he gets madder...
http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/8982/dynamicdurability5yh.jpg
http://img145.exs.cx/img145/4783/genis5qn.jpg
http://img119.imageshack.us/img119/2314/durevolutionaryav175ns9vf.jpg
... and I've already proved he has unlimited rage, so guess what? Unlimited rage = unlimited strength and unlimited durability.
Hulk fighting for days and weeks like here...
http://img226.echo.cx/img226/4408/stamina63qe.jpg
shows that him tiring during a battle after only a day is bull.
Here's Prof Hulk (a genius who would know Savage Hulk better than any one else) stating that as long as Hulk is angry, he can keep going.
http://img162.imageshack.us/img162/6390/stamina29fp.jpg
Again, since I've proved that Hulk's rage is unlimited and he can keep fighting as long as he is angry, so guess what? This means unlimited stamina.
What am I being hypocritical about? I posted several scans of Marvel regarding Hulk's unlimited strength and for some reason, you just choose to ignore them. Marvel has CONSISTENTLY regarded Hulk's strength as unlimited.
http://img155.exs.cx/img155/1342/unlimited16hl.jpg
http://img113.echo.cx/img113/8347/leader5tests6mn.jpg
http://img115.echo.cx/img115/8563/avengersih322d5oz.jpg (read the sixth panel)
http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/8582/featsflameoflife1c6gm.jpg (read last panel)
http://img54.imageshack.us/img54/6527/beyonder6ca6iz.jpg
It's also been stated in the two previously mentioned handbooks. Not to mention Hulk has proved it time and again by never failing to pull off a strength feat. Call it hyperbole all you want, but when Marvel consistently states and shows this, you can't deny it to be wrong.
I've already provided evidence to back up my points, so now it's your turn to provide evidence to back up your points. Show me proof that actually outweighs my proof to make your point that Hulk has limited rage, strength, durability, or stamina. If you can't do so... well... your statements that he is limited in those areas are just your theories.
Originally posted by Accel
It just says that never has such a fury been unleashed. It says nothing about Juggernaut being the strongest.You asked me to show proof of Marvel outright stating Hulk has unlimited strength and I did. Now you dismiss it, stating Marvel was exaggerating. What do you want me to do? Prove Hulk has unlimited strength by showing him NOT reaching his limit?
You state that he has a limit to his rage, but you don't back it up with any thing. When Bruce went into his own mind and faced the Guilt Hulk, his subconscious (where his repressed emotions like rage lay) was an endless world that resembled the Crossroads, a dimension with limitless roads. Endless world = no limit to rage.
http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/83/hulk3012pic5mr.gif
(BTW, this is inside Bruce's mind)Here, Iron Man states, "there is no limit to his rage!"
http://img235.echo.cx/img235/8779/avengersih316g5ee.jpgBeyonder: "you're nothing but [B]raging power
personified! An infinity of power..."
http://img54.imageshack.us/img54/6527/beyonder6ca6iz.jpgYou got your facts wrong there. He fell down because the shadow knocked him down, causing him to lose his balance...
http://img147.exs.cx/img147/7043/stamina7a5ka.jpg
In the same scan, it says Hulk wasn't even breathing hard, so he didn't stop fighting because he was tired.There's also the handbooks, "Hulk: The Incredible Guide," and "Avengers: the Ultimate Guide," where it DOES state he has unlimited strength, endurance, and stamina. If you don't believe me, look them up. In the Avengers one, it states on page 24, "the Hulk never tires. The longer a battle lasts. the stronger he becomes."
In the Hulk guide, it states on page 12 under "Hulk's Powers", "the longer a battle lasts, the stronger he gets and there doesn't seem to be any limit to his strength."
Under "Super-Stamina" on page 13, it states, "The Hulk never seems to tire. His endurance appears to be as unlimited as his strength... No matter how the odds are stack against him, he can outlast or grow strong enough to conquer any opponent."
It's there for any handbook quoters. Word. For. Word. So look it up if you want. It's Marvel yet again regarding Hulk has unlimited strength.
As for unlimited durability, here it states that Hulk becomes more durable when he gets madder...
http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/8982/dynamicdurability5yh.jpg
http://img145.exs.cx/img145/4783/genis5qn.jpg
http://img119.imageshack.us/img119/2314/durevolutionaryav175ns9vf.jpg
... and I've already proved he has unlimited rage, so guess what? Unlimited rage = unlimited strength and unlimited durability.Hulk fighting for days and weeks like here...
http://img226.echo.cx/img226/4408/stamina63qe.jpg
shows that him tiring during a battle after only a day is bull.Here's Prof Hulk (a genius who would know Savage Hulk better than any one else) stating that as long as Hulk is angry, he can keep going.
http://img162.imageshack.us/img162/6390/stamina29fp.jpg
Again, since I've proved that Hulk's rage is unlimited and he can keep fighting as long as he is angry, so guess what? This means unlimited stamina.What am I being hypocritical about? I posted several scans of Marvel regarding Hulk's unlimited strength and for some reason, you just choose to ignore them. Marvel has CONSISTENTLY regarded Hulk's strength as unlimited.
http://img155.exs.cx/img155/1342/unlimited16hl.jpg
http://img113.echo.cx/img113/8347/leader5tests6mn.jpg
http://img115.echo.cx/img115/8563/avengersih322d5oz.jpg (read the sixth panel)
http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/8582/featsflameoflife1c6gm.jpg (read last panel)
http://img54.imageshack.us/img54/6527/beyonder6ca6iz.jpgIt's also been stated in the two previously mentioned handbooks. Not to mention Hulk has proved it time and again by never failing to pull off a strength feat. Call it hyperbole all you want, but when Marvel consistently states and shows this, you can't deny it to be wrong.
I've already provided evidence to back up my points, so now it's your turn to provide evidence to back up your points. Show me proof that actually outweighs my proof to make your point that Hulk has limited rage, strength, durability, or stamina. If you can't do so... well... your statements that he is limited in those areas are just your theories. [/B]
It's my turn to back up my points? ok. The only thing I need to prove you wrong is the Official handbook of the Marvel Universe for 2005.
The rage thing im not going to adress since you have failed to prove that Hulk's mind is any differnt than the mind of a normal humns thus limiting his rage and adrenalin.
Unlimited strength? It's really hard to consider that Hulk has unlimited anything when he is constantly overpowered by characters.
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e101/Soujaboy/incrediblehulk118187ji.jpg
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e101/Soujaboy/incrediblehulk118195ly.jpg
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e101/Soujaboy/incrediblehulk118200el.jpg
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e101/Soujaboy/incrediblehulk118211kg.jpg
Here go's Marvel backing my statements
"Universe Marvel Universe
Real Name Robert Bruce Banner
Aliases The Green Scar, Green Goliath, Jade Giant, Joe Fixit (gray Hulk), War
Identity Publicly known
Occupation Unemployed, former nuclear physicist
Citizenship United States of America
Place of Birth Los Alamos, New Mexico
Known Relatives Betty Ross Banner (wife, deceased), General
Thaddeus "Thunderbolt" Ross (father-in-law), Jennifer Walters (She-Hulk, cousin), Morris Walters (uncle), Elaine Banner Walters (aunt, deceased), Brian Banner (father, deceased), Rebecca Banner (mother, deceased)
Group Affiliation Defenders; formerly the Avengers, Fantastic Four, the Pantheon, and the Horsemen of Apocalypse
Education Banner has a PhD in Nuclear Physics. The various Hulk personas have demonstrated different intelligence levels, from brutish to average to the same level of intelligence as Banner.
Height 5'9" as Banner, 6'6" as gray Hulk, 7' as green Hulk
Weight 128 lbs. as Banner, 900 lbs. as gray Hulk, 1,040 lbs. as green Hulk
Eyes Brown as Banner, gray as gray Hulk, green as green Hulk
Hair Brown as Banner, black as gray Hulk, greenish black as green Hulk
Powers
The Hulk possesses an incredible level of superhuman physical ability. His capacity for physical strength is potentially limitless due to the fact that the Hulk's strength increases proportionally with his level of great emotional stress, anger in particular. The Hulk uses his super humanly strong leg muscles to leap great distances. The Hulk has been known to cover hundreds of miles in a single bound and once leaped almost into orbit around the Earth. The Hulk has shown a high resistance to physical damage nearly regardless of the cause, and has also shown resistance to extreme temperatures , poisons, and diseases in addition to regeneration of damaged or destroyed areas of tissue at an amazing rate.
The Hulk's body also has a gland that makes an "oxygenated per fluorocarbon emulsion", which creates pressure in the Hulk's lungs and effectively lets him breathe underwater and move quickly between varying depths without concerns about decompression or nitrogen narcosis.
Abilities
Dr. Bruce Banner is a genius in nuclear physics, possessing a mind so brilliant that it cannot be measured on any known intelligence test. When Banner is the Hulk, Banner's consciousness is buried within the Hulk's, and can influence the Hulk's behavior only to a very limited extent.
Weapons
Paraphernalia"
So according To Marvel he has the potential of unlimited stamina, meaning that for some reason he can't reach that potential. He doesn't have unlimited durability, he just has a high resistance to damage. I may be incoorect on this but If Hulk had unlimited stamina he would be able to close his mouth and never have to breath again, yet he still needs to breathe.
is that the proof you wanted?
Okay I spent hours reading through this and I am astonished at what I've read. But before I start I'd like to know the official stance on what is and isn't valid evidence.
Handbooks acceptable, Crossovers, What If's, etc
Something I will say is that I'm glad yet sad that some things never change.
Another is that I'm pretty sure I'm a BIIIG reason Souja hates Hulk.
And the Last is Losing to a cosmic is not a measure of how weak you are by ANY means 😄
Originally posted by Soujaboy
It's my turn to back up my points? ok. The only thing I need to prove you wrong is the Official handbook of the Marvel Universe for 2005.
Originally posted by Soujaboy
The rage thing im not going to adress since you have failed to prove that Hulk's mind is any differnt than the mind of a normal humns thus limiting his rage and adrenalin.
Originally posted by Soujaboy
Unlimited strength? It's really hard to consider that Hulk has unlimited anything when he is constantly overpowered by characters.http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e101/Soujaboy/incrediblehulk118187ji.jpg
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e101/Soujaboy/incrediblehulk118195ly.jpg
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e101/Soujaboy/incrediblehulk118200el.jpg
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e101/Soujaboy/incrediblehulk118211kg.jpg
Seriously, what does this have to do with any thing? Again, you’re confusing unlimited with infinite. We’ve covered this already. No matter how strong or durable Hulk becomes, it has to begin and end somewhere.
Heck, even Flash has unlimited speed and he's been tagged God knows how many times.
Originally posted by Soujaboy
Here go's Marvel backing my statements"Universe Marvel Universe
Real Name Robert Bruce Banner
Aliases The Green Scar, Green Goliath, Jade Giant, Joe Fixit (gray Hulk), War
Identity Publicly known
Occupation Unemployed, former nuclear physicist
Citizenship United States of America
Place of Birth Los Alamos, New Mexico
Known Relatives Betty Ross Banner (wife, deceased), General
Thaddeus "Thunderbolt" Ross (father-in-law), Jennifer Walters (She-Hulk, cousin), Morris Walters (uncle), Elaine Banner Walters (aunt, deceased), Brian Banner (father, deceased), Rebecca Banner (mother, deceased)Group Affiliation Defenders; formerly the Avengers, Fantastic Four, the Pantheon, and the Horsemen of Apocalypse
Education Banner has a PhD in Nuclear Physics. The various Hulk personas have demonstrated different intelligence levels, from brutish to average to the same level of intelligence as Banner.Height 5'9" as Banner, 6'6" as gray Hulk, 7' as green Hulk
Weight 128 lbs. as Banner, 900 lbs. as gray Hulk, 1,040 lbs. as green Hulk
Eyes Brown as Banner, gray as gray Hulk, green as green Hulk
Hair Brown as Banner, black as gray Hulk, greenish black as green HulkPowers
due to the fact that the Hulk's strength increases proportionally with his level of great emotional stress, anger in particular. The Hulk uses his super humanly strong leg muscles to leap great distances. The Hulk has been known to cover hundreds of miles in a single bound and once leaped almost into orbit around the Earth. The Hulk has shown a high resistance to physical damage nearly regardless of the cause, and has also shown resistance to extreme temperatures , poisons, and diseases in addition to regeneration of damaged or destroyed areas of tissue at an amazing rate.
The Hulk possesses an incredible level of superhuman physical ability. His capacity for physical strength is [B]potentially limitlessThe Hulk's body also has a gland that makes an "oxygenated per fluorocarbon emulsion", which creates pressure in the Hulk's lungs and effectively lets him breathe underwater and move quickly between varying depths without concerns about decompression or nitrogen narcosis.
Abilities
Dr. Bruce Banner is a genius in nuclear physics, possessing a mind so brilliant that it cannot be measured on any known intelligence test. When Banner is the Hulk, Banner's consciousness is buried within the Hulk's, and can influence the Hulk's behavior only to a very limited extent.
WeaponsParaphernalia"
So according To Marvel he has the potential of unlimited stamina, meaning that for some reason he can't reach that potential. He doesn't have unlimited durability, he just has a high resistance to damage. I may be incoorect on this but If Hulk had unlimited stamina he would be able to close his mouth and never have to breath again, yet he still needs to breathe. [/B]
Do you know what unlimited potential means? It means Hulk can keep increasing his strength without limit.
Basically, unlimited potential = unlimited strength. Hulk never reached that potential because he doesn’t have a max potential; in other words, he doesn’t have a limit.
Also, notice that it says, "the Hulk's strength increases proportionally with his level of great emotional stress, anger in particular." Now, remember when I said Hulk isn't limited to his anger?
What the hell does breathing have to with unlimited stamina? Saying his need to breathe disproves he has unlimited stamina is REALLY grasping at straws here.
Besides, he adapted to the vacuum of space already.
Originally posted by Soujaboy
is that the proof you wanted?
Yeah, you sure proved me wrong. 😆
It really comes down to a couple of things. All your arguments are really good. SInce it is the savage huk, Thor will get pummeled. Thor wont lose easy, but Hulk many times has defeated Thor and smacked him around. Hulk super rage vs Thor warrior thing is hard to debate. You forget right away Hulk is classified as someone who as a level 7 strength. They are almost even strength to begin with.
Thor battling the hulk is allways lowered to the level of a brawler which he shouldent be. he has one of, if not the most powerful weapon in the universe. He knows how to use it but seems to always "forget" when he fights the hulk. Slugging it out with the hulk hes gonna get beat. Thor useing a mjolnir to its potential and fighting like someone with thousands of years of combat exp, then hulk will lose every time.
