Originally posted by Cosmic Cube
Then why has it worked in space, demi? If Hulk has had this ability all along, why would he need an oxygen mask?
That's the thing...I don't ever remember it working in space. He can hold is breath in space, yes, but I don't remember any references whatsoever to his breathing in space. Tell ya what, I provided references of him not being able to breathe and getting KO'ed as a result. You provide references to him BREATHING (not just existing, because he can hold his breath, but BREATHING) in space, and we'll chalk the whole thing up to inconsistency. But as it stands, I've been reading Hulk for awhile and have yet to see an example of him somehow being immune to the needs of air.
The whole perflurocarbon emulsification process is a poor explanation. The answer is simple. Inconsistency. Hulk is just as inconsistent as any other superhero. It tends to happen when multiple writers are involved. It has been explicitly stated and shown that Superman needs to breath. Then, he goes on to live in the sun for thousands of years. Explanation? Inconsistency.
I agree, but the thing is, the references I gave you I selected from multiple eras. Superman needing to breathe and then not needing to breathe can be divided into two separate eras. He hasn't needed to breathe for years, now. And it's been consistent. Not so for Hulk.
I know exactly what perfluorocarbon emulsion does. It merely improves oxygen absorption, which would allow Hulk to breath underwater. Water is not a necessary agent. I don't want to make this a biology debate. Is there any explanation why Hulk has been able to 'breath' in space?
If you know what perflurocarbon emulson does, then you'd know that in order for it to absorb oxygen, there would have to be oxygen. Therefore, my original point that it was an explanation to explain his underwater breathing, stands. As for breathing in space...you're still going to have to show that. (I didn't read all the posts yet, so maybe one of your scans has it, I'll edit later if it does).
Peter David has not been the Hulk's only writer for years, so inconsistency is bound to occur. Hulk has been 'breathing' underwater and in space since Tales to Astonish. It's nothing new. He has, however, been very inconsistent with this ability. That doesn't mean that he didn't possess it.
Assuming you're correct and Hulk has shown the ability to breathe in space, then the suffocation argument and the BFR to space argument are still valid points for debate, because if it's happened before, it's canon. And I've shown where it's happened before. I can actually produce even more references, but I picked and chose from different eras to avoid a "well, he evolved" rebuttal.
In case you can't make out the text...Surfer: How interesting. Now that I have a chance to study the quantum-flux around you at close range, the phenomenon grows more baffling. The energy that you are generating appears to have a quality that is almost inter-dimensional.
That's just one instance. It isn't jargon simply because you were unaware of it.
You may not have been aware of this, or you're being intentionally misleading, I have that issue and that was from the post HR-Hulk, when he was emitting energy from the Heroes Reborn universe. That was what Surfer was referring to, nothing more.
ok, I looked over the scans. I chalk that up to artist/writer error. There's no mention that he's actually able to breathe in space. It's like in Superman IV, when that bad guy took Lois into space and she's able to breathe and scream!!!. They just...forget that sometimes that sort of thing is impossible. Like Hulk actually having a conversation with that other character in space. It's impossible. There's no sound...no conversation to have. Ditto with them hearing rockets and blasters and all that...no sound!
The way I see it, if a writer can forget that you can't talk in space, the writer can forget that you can't breathe there, either. So the only viable explanation to show that sound can travel enough for them to hear each other is that they're not really in space...they're still high up in the atmosphere to the point where they're approaching space and the artist just interpreted it to the best of his ability.
It's been long established that Hulk can hold is breath for hours, right? I mean, it's like Hulk 101. If he doesn't need to breathe...that wouldn't be the rule. And who here hasn't heard of that "Hulk holds breath" ability before? You haven't, Cosmic? Really? REALLY?!?!
Let me ellaborate a bit on these brain tickling and lung clogging issues.
Hulk is invulnerable, through and through. He isnt tough on the outside, squishy on the inside. Every cell of his body are hulk cells, so hes got hulk blood, hulk veings, hulk this hulk that. This is common knowledge.
The reason us humans dont have our brains falling out of our heads, is because the brain is completely enclosed. There is no cavity from the outside of the ear to the brain. The ear opening is enclosed with the tympanic membrane (among other things like ear wax and stuff) If Plasticman were to reach a itty bitty feeler in his ear, he would have to find a way to bust through Hulk's invulnerable eardrum, Hulks invulnerabile laybrinth, go up through his Invulnerable nerve endings to get finally get to his invulnerable brain, were he could "tickle" Hulks invulnerable auricle processing center of his brain. Chances are however, he doesnt have the strength to bust through the Invulnerable eardrum, since after all, its invulnerable.
Now, if he goes through the nose and mouth into the lungs, first he must contend with the Hulk throats Hulk sized gag reflex, which happens when something goes down your throat that you dont want to. That brings Hulk vomit with Hulk acid which I think the consesus is is bad for plasticman. MY acid is acidic enough to do some impressive feats, Hulks is no joke.
But for the sake of argument, lets say he does get into the lungs. He has to deal with Hulks muscles doing hulk coughing to expell him, littly hulk cillia to get PM out of there. Plastic man would have to have the power of being supremely sticky, to the molecular level, since he would have to bond to mucus and tissues, and he doesnt seem to have that power. If he manages to stay longer then the Hulk antibodies will attack. Antibodies dont just stay in the major blood vessels, they have to extend to the cells of the body to bring through cappilaries, thats how they take the oxygen to the cells and stuff. Worst case scnario to the hulk, he gets a PM size case of pnemonia.
Now we about the more, unpleasant routes. If PM attempts to infiltrate the Urethra or the anus, he first must pass through the Hulk strength sphincters, that are made to prevent things like PM from going up in there. Even if he managed to penetrate into the cavities, Hulk's bladder and large intestine are still invulnerable, and PM lacks the strength to do any damage from there, besides making him get the sensation to urinate or pass his bowels. A Hulk size Fart would expell him, and if PM tries the Urethral route, he will just look very stupid. I would go into how he can expell PM using the muscles used to expell ejaculate, and how those muscles will be very strong since hulk is going to be VERY mad about now, but thats would be pressing even MY boundry of good taste.
Plasticman, however, cant really be hurt, despite being able to get smacked around some by Hulk. I think it will be a strange looking fight, ending in some kind of stalemate, unless Hulk gives up in disgust when Plastic man says the words "Lets see how invulnerable your prostate gland is!"
If he's able to talk in space, and remain there for hours, what other explaination is there?
Superman has needed to breath in space since the Infinite Crisis retcon. It was reiterated during the Imperiex War. When was it established that he could?
Hulk has shown that he can do without breathing for an indefinite length of time. At other times, he cannot. That's inconsistency. Can you provide scans of any of the issues you've mentioned?
That is post-heroes reborn Hulk. I genuinely did not realize it. What comic is it from?
Originally posted by demigawd
ok, I looked over the scans. I chalk that up to artist/writer error. There's no mention that he's actually able to breathe in space. It's like in Superman IV, when that bad guy took Lois into space and she's able to breathe and scream!!!. They just...forget that sometimes that sort of thing is impossible. Like Hulk actually having a conversation with that other character in space. It's impossible. There's no sound...no conversation to have. Ditto with them hearing rockets and blasters and all that...no sound!The way I see it, if a writer can forget that you can't talk in space, the writer can forget that you can't breathe there, either. So the only viable explanation to show that sound can travel enough for them to hear each other is that they're not really in space...they're still high up in the atmosphere to the point where they're approaching space and the artist just interpreted it to the best of his ability.
It's been long established that Hulk can hold is breath for hours, right? I mean, it's like Hulk 101. If he doesn't need to breathe...that wouldn't be the rule. And who here hasn't heard of that "Hulk holds breath" ability before? You haven't, Cosmic? Really? REALLY?!?!
You can't hold your breath and talk simultaneously.
Comic Book Science vs Real Science.
These two seem to be talking rather easily. Are they in the upper amosphere as well?
Originally posted by Onikirimaru
Plasticman, however, cant really be hurt, despite being able to get smacked around some by Hulk. I think it will be a strange looking fight, ending in some kind of stalemate, unless Hulk gives up in disgust when Plastic man says the words "Lets see how invulnerable your prostate gland is!"
Gross.
Originally posted by snoopdogg
Monguls exact words were "were it not for my tutoring, you would not even be able to breathe this far out in space"He said breathe not hold his breathe 😉
Scan?
Earlier, you told me that he could not breathe in space, when we were discerning Superman's speed. The Ultimate Guide to Superman says that because of Mongul's training, Superman can hold his breath in space for extended periods.
Proof would be appreciated.
Originally posted by Cosmic Cube
If he's able to talk in space, and remain there for hours, what other explaination is there?
That he's not really in space. In the case of the missle, it's pretty easy to believe that he hadn't actually officially broken out of the atmosphere yet - he was in the 50 mile range or so, so that it looks "space like". Certainly, it's beyond the capability for a regular person to live, but Hulk can still breathe there AND talk there and have the conversation understood.
In the case of the scan where he's escaped into space, I'd conjecture that it should actually be thought bubbles, since he's not talking to anybody. And in that case, he's holding his breath, too.
Or, we could say that the PFC is a temporary aid to explain away doing what he's doing for some length of time, which is what I guess PAD was angling for.
Either way, it seems there's a more credible argument for Hulk, on a regular basis, needing to breathe than not needing to breathe, unless there are explicit statements beyond just artwork that say otherwise. The topic has been explicitly addressed in Superman...the same would have to happen for me to believe that it was intentional that Hulk was made to not need to breathe, ever.
Hulk has shown that he can do without breathing for an indefinite length of time. At other times, he cannot. That's inconsistency. Can you provide scans of any of the issues you've mentioned?
Sorry, no scanner handy. But I provided issue numbers for you, so it's easy to research and prove whether or not I'm lying.
I do believe that Hulk can hold his breath for a very long time if he takes a deep breath in. When he chooses to go out in space or underwater, I imagine he takes in a breath and can hold it for hours. It's when he's caught by surprise that he seems to struggle. Our scans all seem to dovetail nicely to show that, so it's not entirely inconsistent.
If you get the jump on Hulk and cut his air supply off, he can be put down.
If Hulk enters an airless environment, he can stay there with the air he's collected beforehand for a VERY long time (but he still ultimately needs to breathe).
That's the conclusion I've reached from all of this. What's your conclusion?
That is post-heroes reborn Hulk. I genuinely did not realize it. What comic is it from?
Some annual or other. I've read it, that's how I remember the details about it, but I'm going to have to go through my collection (again) to find the exact issue number.
Originally posted by Cosmic Cube
You can't hold your breath and talk simultaneously.Comic Book Science vs Real Science.
These two seem to be talking rather easily. Are they in the upper amosphere as well?
Quasar's bio says that he surrounds himself with a field that enables himself and others to breathe, similar to what GL does. Most likely, Surfer is in that field with him, not because Surfer needs to breathe, but because he can communicate with Quasar.
Originally posted by Cosmic CubeCan you read it?
Scan?Earlier, you told me that he could not breathe in space, when we were discerning Superman's speed. The Ultimate Guide to Superman says that because of Mongul's training, Superman can hold his breath in space for extended periods.
Proof would be appreciated.