Originally posted by abhilegend
I retracted it awhile ago. No need to get your hopes up pal.Show the scan where they were stated to be going FTL then. It'd be easy.
For the record, Skuttlebutt can go many times the speed of light. Although since the Annihilator's I should probably check if it's gone faster.
So Bill/Surfer were fighting at faster then light combat speed according to your logic.
Originally posted by h1a8
It's 100% relevant to what you said. You are reaching because you don't want Superman to not be unhittable or win this fight. You are making stuff up that Superman could have used some strange powers other than speed to do the feat.
And you have poor reading comprehension. Which is probably why you tend to put your foot in your mouth a lot. The basic debate and point of what I posted was the admissibility of the "feat" and its non-usability as a "battle feat". Which is a fact. It is not a "combat feat".
It's funny that you use "make stuff up" and "reaching" when that's exactly what you want to do (as below).
FYI, I "didn't make stuff up" with Superman using different powers. I made a comment about how we don't know IF HE DID use any of his other powers as it would make sense for superspeed to not be sufficient for him to be able to read and memorize what he did.
Again, as one of the person's known as the guiltiest in "making stuff up" and "reaching", you might wanna tone down your accusations to not make yourself sound too stupid.
Originally posted by h1a8
You are copping out by implying that since the feat can't be quantified then it is unusable for combat speed. In debating we are not lawyers, arguing the letter of the law, but rather we argue what makes sense in the realm of suspension of disbelief. It makes 100% sense to throw a punch within the time frame of reading a whole page and then turning the page.
This entire line of thought makes no sense. In any kind of debating environment, we use as much evidence and proof as we have in order to arrive at reasonable conclusions snf to prove our assertions. You're saying that if a lot of the variables that would allow us to quantify a "feat" is missing, we should just go ahead and make things up in our head according to how we see the "feat" because of "suspension of disbelief". And then you accuse ME of "making things up"? SMFH.
And I'm not saying that this evidence is unusable. I'm saying that it cannot be the primary platform for making an speed argument. More like corroborative evidence if primary evidence exists that prove that he fights at this speeds due to its unquantifiable nature and the fact that it is not a "battle feat".
If you think he's untouchable by the Hulk, that's fine. Post actual "battle feats".
Many characters have been portrayed not using their full range/capacity of their abilities in comics. What you're suggesting is that we take the max level capacity of their powers (even the ones they haven't used in combat) and extrapolate the best possible interpretation of said "feat" and ignore actual in-combat "feats" that said characters have actually demonstrated in combat.
Which will make characters like Surfer godlike.
Originally posted by h1a8
In fights like this, it doesn't matter exactly how fast Superman can fight when he know he is magnitudes faster than Hulk.
If it takes 2 tons of force to lift a car then arguing whether a feat shows 100tons of force or more, when we know it is much over 2 tons, is irrelevant.
Stop posting assumptions and presenting them as fact. Again, if you think he is, then post evidence, don't stop reaching in trying to come up with a reason to include a "feat" that we can neither measure properly nor can determine if it is applicable in a combat scenario.
I will provide similar fts.
Hulk dodged a Mjlonir throw and at the same time makes it over there to Thor with a right punch.
http://s1096.photobucket.com/user/Fernando072295/media/hulkvsavengers01_zps487bcb53.jpg.html
He thens grab Captain America shield and blocks Tony Rays at the same time.
http://s1096.photobucket.com/user/Fernando072295/media/hulkvsavengers02_zps78838d4b.jpg.html
He thens throw Cap shield back at him while Tony is trying to sneak up on him with a blitz. He turns around in enough time to punch a blitzing Tony in the face.
http://s1096.photobucket.com/user/Fernando072295/media/hulkvsavengers03_zpsdfec4c64.jpg.html
Tony blasts at Hulk again but Hulk catch the repulsors out of the air.
http://s1096.photobucket.com/user/Fernando072295/media/hulkvsavengers08_zpsd4b431dc.jpg.html
Thats better than using fts from a Lizard as evidence for Superman.
Originally posted by JBLLOL at your desperate attempts to hate on Superman.
Seems that one did. Spiderman dodged lasers and HV. Do you think that just because you dodge something you are faster than it.lol. I can dodge a 95 mph fastball, so i guess i was moving at 96 mph.
Yes you can move with less speed to dodge something sent to you from more than 3ft away. Superman shot HV at him at a distance of at most 30ft. He seemed to move about 3 feet to dodge. So he needs to be 1/10th as fast as HV. So he is 10% the speed of HV which is hella impressive.
Originally posted by Nibedicus
Your entire post is irrelevant to what I said.
It's 100% relevant to what you said. You are reaching because you don't want Superman to not be unhittable or win this fight. You are making stuff up that Superman could have used some strange powers other than speed to do the feat.
You are implying that since the feat can't be quantified then it is unusable for combat speed. In debating we are not lawyers, arguing the letter of the law, but rather we argue what makes sense in the realm of suspension of disbelief. It makes 100% since to throw a punch in the time frame Superman reads a whole page and turns a page.
In fights like this, it doesn't matter exactly how fast Superman can fight when he know he is magnitudes faster than Hulk.
If it takes 2 tons of force to lift a car then arguing whether a feat shows 100tons of force or more, when we know it is much over 2 tons, is irrelevant.
P.S. I can prove, based off the feat, the minimum speed in which Superman can fight at.
Premises
1. It took about 300 seconds for Superman to read every medical book.
2. The average medical book is over 1500 pages (most over 1500 pages and fewer less than 1500 pages). I've seen some easily over 3000 pages.
3. One can throw a punch in less time than reading and comprehending a page.
4. One can throw a punch in less time than turning a page.
5. Every medical book implies more than 50 medical books.
If these premises are accepted then the conclusion below follows. If they are not then state which one and why.
Conclusion,
So Superman read over 50,000 pages and has turn over 25,000 pages. This equates to being able to throw more than 75,000 punches in 300 seconds, or more than 250 punches in 1 second. But this is not considering Superman's ftl flight speed.
Originally posted by h1a8If hating on superman is pointing out when people make false statements about superman or any other characters abilities, then so-be-it. No other character has this problem but superman and i blame his fans. The minute you say he cannot or he lose, you are deemed a superman hater.
LOL at your desperate attempts to hate on Superman.Yes you can move with less speed to dodge something sent to you from more than 3ft away. Superman shot HV at him at a distance of at most 30ft. He seemed to move about 3 feet to dodge. So he needs to be 1/10th as fast as HV. So he is 10% the speed of HV which is hella impressive.
It's 100% relevant to what you said. You are reaching because you don't want Superman to not be unhittable or win this fight. You are making stuff up that Superman could have used some strange powers other than speed to do the feat.
You are implying that since the feat can't be quantified then it is unusable for combat speed. In debating we are not lawyers, arguing the letter of the law, but rather we argue what makes sense in the realm of suspension of disbelief. It makes 100% since to throw a punch in the time frame Superman reads a whole page and turns a page.
In fights like this, it doesn't matter exactly how fast Superman can fight when he know he is magnitudes faster than Hulk.
If it takes 2 tons of force to lift a car then arguing whether a feat shows 100tons of force or more, when we know it is much over 2 tons, is irrelevant.P.S. I can prove, based off the feat, the minimum speed in which Superman can fight at.
Premises
1. It took about 300 seconds for Superman to read every medical book.
2. The average medical book is over 1500 pages (most over 1500 pages and fewer less than 1500 pages). I've seen some easily over 3000 pages.
3. One can throw a punch in less time than reading and comprehending a page.
4. One can throw a punch in less time than turning a page.
5. Every medical book implies more than 50 medical books.If these premises are accepted then the conclusion below follows. If they are not then state which one and why.
Conclusion,
So Superman read over 50,000 pages and has turn over 25,000 pages. This equates to being able to throw more than 75,000 punches in 300 seconds, or more than 250 punches in 1 second. But this is not considering Superman's ftl flight speed.
Originally posted by JBL
If hating on superman is pointing out when people make false statements about superman or any other characters abilities, then so-be-it. No other character has this problem but superman and i blame his fans. The minute you say he cannot or he lose, you are deemed a superman hater.
What has Superman done to you that you hate him so much?
Originally posted by Rage.Of.OlympusSurfer was but Bill wasn't. Surfer had to react to the change of directions of skuttlebut.
Here you go:For the record, Skuttlebutt can go many times the speed of light. Although since the Annihilator's I should probably check if it's gone faster.
So Bill/Surfer were fighting at faster then light combat speed according to your logic.
And what you are saying is not what Abhi is saying. Otherwise we all can fight with 50% of the speed of light since we are moving on Earth and around the Sun and around the Galaxy and around other Galaxies. It's about frame of reference. It's called relative velocity and not absolute velocity.
Originally posted by h1a8
Surfer was but Bill wasn't. Surfer had to react to the change of directions of skuttlebut.And what you are saying is not what Abhi is saying. Otherwise we all can fight with 50% of the speed of light since we are moving on Earth and around the Sun and around the Galaxy and around other Galaxies. It's about frame of reference. It's called relative velocity and not absolute velocity.
Bill was reacting to Norrin just fine and even struck him without much problem:
Yes it is. How is the fight in Sacrifice any more conclusive then this scuffle? Especially as evidence of light speed combat? As far as I'm concerned, using either of these instances as evidence of light speed combat speed or more is flat out retarded.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.OlympusNo. LOL
Bill was reacting to Norrin just fine and even struck him without much problem:Yes it is. How is the fight in Sacrifice any more conclusive then this scuffle? Especially since the largest gaps were covered by Superman flying Diana into space and then punching her back down.
Well I'm sorry I don't know what you guys are arguing then. I'll stay out of it. If you want my honest opinion just bring me up to speed on it. I don't want to go searching and reading you and abhis old posts.
Originally posted by h1a8
No. LOL
I'm talking about Surfer chasing Skuttlebut. He had to have light speed reactions to do that. Surfer, using his speed and reactions, MADE the relative velocity between him and Bill almost 0. Bill just had to hit a seemingly still opponent.Well I'm sorry I don't know what you guys are arguing then. I'll stay out of it. If you want my honest opinion just bring me up to speed on it. I don't want to go searching and reading you and abhis old posts.
If you say so, as long as you're applying the same standards to both examples, I don't give a shit. It's just not really possible to accept one as evidence but not the other.
What? Your previous comment made it seem like you were well aware of his example.
Regarding the Hulk's speed. While I enjoy Waid pushing Hulk's less utilized stat, I don't think he should be speed blitzing people like the Flash.
That being said, I don't think Hulk should be perceived as slow either. He should have an explosive element to his speed (Which he does) and if Superman isn't careful, he should be in trouble. For example:
Basically, Superman can dance around the Hulk, but it would have to require effort and not something he can do indefinitely without being hit by Banner. Anyways, that's just my opinion of how it should go ideally and there's at this point sufficient evidence to justify it being written that way.
Originally posted by juggerman
Kinda off topic in this thread wouldn't you agree? My stance on this matter is that Hulk's speed does not outclass Juggernaut's like Superman's does Hulk's.
It is off topic. I can open up a thread if you want (you would lose). We dont have a estimate on what Hulk speed is currently at. The guy is currently a blitz master and has been displaying super speed in every last one of his showings.
just to chime in...
is the current argument here , that superman will not be touched or punched by hulk?
because in in almost 100% of superman showing he is always tagged/punched by tons and tons of characters of various speeds.
cis/pis off or whatever, you cant ignore the way the character is shown in almost every comic appearance hes ever been in. He is not untouchable and super speed doesn't always = autowin.
as far as the fight, I dont care ATM
