Batman vs. Daredevil (no weapons)

Originally posted by SpunkySmurph
umm... no

Bats with gadgets- 6-7/10

bats w/o gadgets- 2-3/10

Daredevil has been able to fight (and beat once, though just barely) Spiderman. Often quite close matches.

Bats wont touch any nerve spots. He wont get a chance to properly grapple. And when he does manage to hit DD (if at all), Matt will jjust roll with the punches, greatly decreasing the impact damage, which he has been shown to be capable of doing with much faster opponents.

Originally posted by Juntai
Lets not even try to get into a who has beaten who between Daredevil and Batman, that would be a losing debate for Daredevil fans.

?? He has beaten white martians with fire, and has beaten Superman so long as he has kryptonite or a major plot device going for him?

Or the legions of people he's outsmarted?

Who has Batman beaten down, without prep, weapons, gadgets, or the rest of his team that is comparable to Spiderman? Who has Batman gone hand to hand with that would make Spiderman look like such a joke?

He's sparred with Dianna(while she was holding EVERYTHING back) and can tangle with a Kryptonite-sickened Superman.

This is impressive...why?

Originally posted by darthgoober
Spidey holds back in many of his street level fights(as made evident by the fact that if he didn't and he connected AT ALL with DD in their battles, DD would be dead), so that doesn't prove much.

Spiderman DID connect. And mentioned that, while he was hitting Daredevil, Matt was just rolling with his punches, mostly nullifying their effect.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Spidey holds back in many of his street level fights(as made evident by the fact that if he didn't and he connected AT ALL with DD in their battles, DD would be dead), so that doesn't prove much.

To add on to what Soljer said, he was still going a heck of alot faster then Batman would. I'm not trying to prove anything about DD's durability, more about his reflexes, agility, skills, etc.

Originally posted by Soljer
?? He has beaten white martians with fire, and has beaten Superman so long as he has kryptonite or a major plot device going for him?

Or the legions of people he's outsmarted?

Who has Batman beaten down, without prep, weapons, gadgets, or the rest of his team that is comparable to Spiderman? Who has Batman gone hand to hand with that would make Spiderman look like such a joke?

He's sparred with Dianna(while she was holding EVERYTHING back) and can tangle with a Kryptonite-sickened Superman.

This is impressive...why?

Spiderman DID connect. And mentioned that, while he was hitting Daredevil, Matt was just rolling with his punches, mostly nullifying their effect.

Originally posted by darthgoober
You aren't honestly be suggesting that Spiderman was swinging as hard as he could in their battles are you? Your talking about Mr. Responsibility himself, there's NO WAY he'd go all out against another hero, who'd be killed if he(Spiderman) landed a single square punch.

No, I'm not suggesting that.

I'm suggesting that a Spiderman who is holding back is still one HELL of a lot stronger and faster than a Batman operating at peak efficiency.

Originally posted by Soljer
?? He has beaten white martians with fire, and has beaten Superman so long as he has kryptonite or a major plot device going for him?

Or the legions of people he's outsmarted?

Who has Batman beaten down, without prep, weapons, gadgets, or the rest of his team that is comparable to Spiderman? Who has Batman gone hand to hand with that would make Spiderman look like such a joke?

He's sparred with Dianna(while she was holding EVERYTHING back) and can tangle with a Kryptonite-sickened Superman.

This is impressive...why?

Etrigan the demon?

How many do you need?

Originally posted by Soljer
No, I'm not suggesting that.

I'm suggesting that a Spiderman who is holding back is still one HELL of a lot stronger and faster than a Batman operating at peak efficiency.

Then Batman is far and away the better fighter here, imo.

Originally posted by Soljer
No, I'm not suggesting that.

I'm suggesting that a Spiderman who is holding back is still one HELL of a lot stronger and faster than a Batman operating at peak efficiency.

But seriously, DD vs SM is a high showing for DD, and a low showing for SM. But if you look at the averages, DD has shown difficulty with street level martial arts hero's is the past, WAY more often than he's shown the ability to hang with people like Spiderman.

Now after giving it some thought, I will admit that DD's radar sense WOULD give him an advantage over Bats, but I still can't really see him taking more than 6/10.

Originally posted by Juntai
This isn't about Spiderman, it's about Daredevil and Batman. Batman's "Mental Invisibility" techniques and stealth are enough that those with heightened and supersenses can't find him/follow him. There's no reason to believe Daredevil could, given the circumstances.

Then Batman is far and away the better fighter here, imo.

Key phrase in that last sentence: "In my opinion."

That is all very well and good, but we really lack the evidence to qualify that statement as fact. It is very arguable, and I guarantee you'll have plenty of people telling you that the difference in skill is negligible, or even in Daredevil's favor.

Anyways; when the hell did he go hand to hand with a powered up Billy and come out on top? Are you one of those who also believes that Deathstroke tagging the flash is all well and good? Considering Captain Marvel's strength, speed, and durability, Batman should have imploded by being in his mere presence. Get serious for a moment.

Originally posted by Soljer
Key phrase in that last sentence: "In my opinion."

That is all very well and good, but we really lack the evidence to qualify that statement as fact. It is very arguable, and I guarantee you'll have plenty of people telling you that the difference in skill is negligible, or even in Daredevil's favor.

Anyways; when the hell did he go hand to hand with a powered up Billy and come out on top? Are you one of those who also believes that Deathstroke tagging the flash is all well and good? Considering Captain Marvel's strength, speed, and durability, Batman should have imploded by being in his mere presence. Get serious for a moment.

I told you "lets not get into a who's beaten who", because Batman wins that battle, like it or not, a millions times over.

The very idea that Batman can conceal his movements, which is the strongest case of how Daredevil could beat Batman, is nullified.

Now quit running off on tangents.

We're comparing Batman with Daredevil.

Originally posted by Soljer
No, I'm not suggesting that.

I'm suggesting that a Spiderman who is holding back is still one HELL of a lot stronger and faster than a Batman operating at peak efficiency.

Originally posted by Juntai
The very idea that Batman can conceal his movements, which is the strongest case of how Daredevil could beat Batman, is nullified.

http://img5.imagevenue.com/img.php?loc=loc129&image=7e5_batstealth10.jpg
http://img46.imagevenue.com/img.php?loc=loc76&image=b03_batstealth11.jpg

Not even the Spectre nor his mystical defenses, or the fact it's invisible to the human eye, can stop Batman from entering and escaping his inner sanctum unnoticed, amongst a large group of superheros as well.

Originally posted by brainchild81
Daaaaaayum! That's truth right there. DD has this quite easily. Batman may have learned more styles, but anybody w/a brain knows that doesn’t mean you’re a better fighter than one who’s learned less styles. It’s about how you apply what you know. Bats can pull the wool over the eyes of Supes because Supes is a drooling idiot when it comes to dealing w/Bats. There’s no PIS/CIS here to save him. DD will beat Batman more often than not. Bats is fighting a Nightwing who’s more experienced, has super senses(the key) and doesn’t have fighter’s block(copyright brainchild81) because he feels like he’s fighting his dad Run that back. I must have missed how Bats is gonna conceal his movements from one such as DD w/out PIS

Dammit Jun!!

You broke logic!!

You mean to tell me, that The Wrath of God, isn't proof against the BatGod??

Originally posted by UniOmni
Dammit Jun!!

You broke logic!!

You mean to tell me, that The Wrath of God, isn't proof against the BatGod??

Originally posted by Juntai
http://img5.imagevenue.com/img.php?loc=loc129&image=7e5_batstealth10.jpg
http://img46.imagevenue.com/img.php?loc=loc76&image=b03_batstealth11.jpg

Not even the Spectre nor his mystical defenses, or the fact it's invisible to the human eye, can stop Batman from entering and escaping his inner sanctum unnoticed, amongst a large group of superheros as well.

Originally posted by Juntai
Batman fights and defeats lots of people who on the forum are considered out of his league, just like Cap in outer space fighting Thanos in hand to hand.

I told you "lets not get into a who's beaten who", because Batman wins that battle, like it or not, a millions times over.

The very idea that Batman can conceal his movements, which is the strongest case of how Daredevil could beat Batman, is nullified.

Now quit running off on tangents.

We're comparing Batman with Daredevil.

What tangents? The fact that you can't find a single legit combatant that Batman has taken in hand to hand that is on Spiderman's level?

Besides that, I think that sneaking in and out of a building is HARDLY the same thing as cloaking your utter PRESENCE from someone whilst trying to effectively engage them in combat. Comparing apples to oranges, my friend.

Originally posted by Juntai
People were saying they'd hear his movements[punches through the moving muscle and nerves]. But it's consistantly portrayed that those with heightened and supersenses still can't do it, why would anyone try to entertain the idea that daredevil could in light of Batman's portrayals?

That is because it is either PIS or superman wasn't paying much attention or being aware (I didn't read that comic). Sometimes Clark can filter the sounds he wants when many people are in the vicinity. And when sometimes he doesn't, he basically just hear a lot of jumble. This happens when he is just thinking to himself.

With that said
You know as well as I do that Batman can't sneak up on superman (without it being PIS) if superman is aware.

Neither can batman hide his heartbeat or electrical and chemical impulses used to move from DD.

Originally posted by brainchild81
That screams PIS, but maybe not. Those defenses are for threats right?

Batman has also broken through the JLA Watchtower defenses, which is based off of New God and Apokaliptian Tech, as well as earth's best tech, and magical detection and defense because of Jason Blood.

Originally posted by Soljer
What tangents? The fact that you can't find a single legit combatant that Batman has taken in hand to hand that is on Spiderman's level?

Besides that, I think that sneaking in and out of a building is HARDLY the same thing as cloaking your utter PRESENCE from someone whilst trying to effectively engage them in combat. Comparing apples to oranges, my friend.