1. Another KOTOR error, that simple. Or Atris was already lost to the Darkside.
2. No. No. no no and NO. The Jedi didn't know the Sith EXISTED until 5000 BBY, then thought they were extinct until 4000 BBY when Kun attack, then believed them gone forever until Revan when the order was pummeled...and the Dark Witches of Dathomir didn't exist in those time.
Ommin was a special case, Naddists were generally not Force users, only Nadd's own blood were. Name ONE group full of Dark Side users before the Jedi civil war, between Kun and Sadow, ONE group. It was the same thing as the Jedi in the PT. Hadn't faced in a thousand years.
3. Using the Force and sabers are perfectly acceptable. Giving someone the equivalent of massive steroids is not. In a fight of who is stronger, technology doesn't count to strength. It may be an advantage they'd use, but it doesn't make them stronger on their own.
4. Durge'd move fast enough to kill before someone finished the saber strike and proof he'd be affected by powerful Force users? Four Jedi-two of whom being Anakin and Obi-wan-couldn't do anything to him at once. Durge won't be sitting there letting them swing the lightsaber. He'd probably be flying with his jetpack. Durge was killing ruusan Sith and Ruusan Jedi who'd been facing Sith for 1000 years straight. That's more experience than anyone else thus far.
5. Take out WOTC, you lose a lot of Jedi/Sith history, most of the lightsaber forms, numerous histories...
6. When did ANY Reborn or reasonably skilled Dark Jedi find Ancient Sith armor? And making a Holocron isn't hard? Why did Vodo call it exceptionally difficult and known to true masters only? Andeddu found Ancient Sith armor on a market somewhere? With a Sith holocron in exact shape and design as the Ancient Sith HOlocrons? and in EE, it was stated not since the Ancient Empire had a Sith been entombed on Korriban. Especially as Quinlan went into the TOMB of Darth Andeddu...you think his apprentice dropped him off at Korriban after he murdered him if he was post Bane? And in the NegtC, it said Bane's line took Darth to honor him, not that he was the first Darth
7. Name one Mandalorian who accomplished what Jango did. Durge killed Mandalore Jaing who was described as one of the most fearsome Mandalores ever in Sw Insider 80, history of the Mandalorians-which gave us the names The Indomitable, the Ultimate and made a LOT of things on the Mandos canon-Jango killed four Jedi with his bare hands, he killed the second in command of the Death Watch at age 10, he destroyed the Death Watch on his own-completely on his own- he tore down criminal guilds and fought his way through the armies of Kolma to defeat a monster like Baron Montross to defeat Dooku's Padawan...he saved Coruscant from being destroyed by Asharr Khorda, he was heavily respected by Ghez Hokan and Durge even...he went toe to toe with Obi-wan...
8. The future's always in motion and unless you're about to die like Vodo, you ain't seeing it. Frobo was wrong. He didn't 'see the future' and screw the other people you mentioned, Revan couldn't see the future. PERIOD. And Marka Ragnos? Naga Sadow?
Originally posted by Lightsnake
1. Another KOTOR error, that simple. Or Atris was already lost to the Darkside.
Or you are in error. It takes solid evidence to prove something to be an EU continuty problem and not enough has been shown to support that.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
2. No. No. no no and NO. The Jedi didn't know the Sith EXISTED until 5000 BBY, then thought they were extinct until 4000 BBY when Kun attack, then believed them gone forever until Revan when the order was pummeled...and the Dark Witches of Dathomir didn't exist in those time.
Ommin was a special case, Naddists were generally not Force users, only Nadd's own blood were. Name ONE group full of Dark Side users before the Jedi civil war, between Kun and Sadow, ONE group. It was the same thing as the Jedi in the PT. Hadn't faced in a thousand years.
Queen Amanoa(spelling?) was also a force using Naddist. Nadd had plenty of decendents during that time. Say there he had 6 kids(more is likely for a royal line), as did each of his kids and their kids and you find that there could have been over a thousand of his decendents with two or three hundred years. That's also assuming that he doesn't find another force user on the planet.
There were also a lot more dark jedi in those times because Jedi were allowed to marry and such.
Don't believe me that Nadd could have over a thouand decendents in less then 300 years?
Nadd = 6 kids = 36 kids = 216 = 1296 force using Naddist after just four generations. Assuming a 30 year generation, that 120 years. Royal blood lines have a problem with doing this, meaing their could have been several hundred fully trained Naddist ready to kill the Jedi at any moment.
Also note that there were huge numbers of Dark Jedi and the Order did not think the Sith extinct. That was why they trained in full armor and such. They each expected to engage someone in real lightsaber combat in their lives.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
3. Using the Force and sabers are perfectly acceptable. Giving someone the equivalent of massive steroids is not. In a fight of who is stronger, technology doesn't count to strength. It may be an advantage they'd use, but it doesn't make them stronger on their own.
Oh my god, anything can make someone stronger or weaker. If you had been beaten as a child and had your legs permanetly broken, you would be weaker then someone who had good parents and played foot ball rather then moan about being weaker.
A lightsaber is technology.
If you do not accept that Amulets that they will always have with them as part of their power, leave. I'm serious. You seem to have realized that Ancient Sith at their peak are the best we know of and are now trying to cripple them with this new BS you have made up. They are that powerful, they always will be. You don't see me making threads like Marka Ragnos vs. Mace with no lightsaber, clothes, or use of the force. It's simply stupid.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
4. Durge'd move fast enough to kill before someone finished the saber strike and proof he'd be affected by powerful Force users? Four Jedi-two of whom being Anakin and Obi-wan-couldn't do anything to him at once. Durge won't be sitting there letting them swing the lightsaber. He'd probably be flying with his jetpack. Durge was killing ruusan Sith and Ruusan Jedi who'd been facing Sith for 1000 years straight. That's more experience than anyone else thus far.
No, because no one lived long enough to get hold of all that experince. Anyone from the Hundred Year Darkness has just as much.
Obi-wan was able to effectively fight Durge off for a long time. Malak, who is a ton stronger will win, even if he has to toss a few grenades at him and vaporize all of Durge's mass, something he can't regenerate from.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
5. Take out WOTC, you lose a lot of Jedi/Sith history, most of the lightsaber forms, numerous histories...
Almost everything else in WOTC is mentioned somewhere else too.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
6. When did ANY Reborn or reasonably skilled Dark Jedi find Ancient Sith armor? And making a Holocron isn't hard? Why did Vodo call it exceptionally difficult and known to true masters only? Andeddu found Ancient Sith armor on a market somewhere? With a Sith holocron in exact shape and design as the Ancient Sith HOlocrons? and in EE, it was stated not since the Ancient Empire had a Sith been entombed on Korriban. Especially as Quinlan went into the TOMB of Darth Andeddu...you think his apprentice dropped him off at Korriban after he murdered him if he was post Bane? And in the NegtC, it said Bane's line took Darth to honor him, not that he was the first Darth
What is EE?
When did Vodo say it was a hard thing to do? Someone nowadays can make a USB drive with only a few months of training, same should be true for the Sith.
Freedon Nadd, who was not an Ancient Sith, or Sith at all for that matter, had Ancient Sith armor. In KOTOR, Krath armor, which looks similar to what Adeddu was wearing, was commonly avaliable for a high price, but nothing a few mind tricks could get you.
It says that Bane STARTED the tradition of naming apprentices Darth, not that they took it up to honor him. Frankly, I'm get sick of you adding in your stupid BS everywhere you can, and I doubt that I am the only one. This is a perfect example of something you made up as I am looking at the New Essential Guide to Characters at this very moment and it says that Bane started the traditiobn. Cut the crap for now on.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
7. Name one Mandalorian who accomplished what Jango did. Durge killed Mandalore Jaing who was described as one of the most fearsome Mandalores ever in Sw Insider 80, history of the Mandalorians-which gave us the names The Indomitable, the Ultimate and made a LOT of things on the Mandos canon-Jango killed four Jedi with his bare hands, he killed the second in command of the Death Watch at age 10, he destroyed the Death Watch on his own-completely on his own- he tore down criminal guilds and fought his way through the armies of Kolma to defeat a monster like Baron Montross to defeat Dooku's Padawan...he saved Coruscant from being destroyed by Asharr Khorda, he was heavily respected by Ghez Hokan and Durge even...he went toe to toe with Obi-wan...
I already did. The one Revan killed caused 3 wars. That alone is bigger then everything Jango and Boba did.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
8. The future's always in motion and unless you're about to die like Vodo, you ain't seeing it. Frobo was wrong. He didn't 'see the future' and screw the other people you mentioned, Revan couldn't see the future. PERIOD. And Marka Ragnos? Naga Sadow?
Marka and Sadow both had teachings in their tombs. There was writings in their that Revan could have read.
By seeing the future, he could see wars in the long run. It was stated by the Handmaided that the best Echani generals could see the course of wars years in advance. She also said Revan had mastered it to a higher degree then any Echani.
1. However, how many of Nadd's kids were psychotic, evil power abusers? Most of Amanoa's family was dead by her own admission...others were beastriders, even. Nadd didn't spare his own blood. Most naddists were Ommin loyalists, that was it....please, proof they expected to engage the Sith? Even Vodo scolded Exar, saying they were gone forever.
2. That's FIRMLY different. Use their Sith powers and force ability with no way to amplify it: Just them without artifacts or amplifiers.
3. Durge has been hit with grnades before, an army's worth. It doesn't 'vaporize' him, it impacts on his armor and pisses him off.
4. Ok, Glentract, I'm confused....can we stop picking and choosing what we want to keep from WOTC? First it's 'well, the Sith Empire being 2000 years old is wrong', now it's 'well, it's appeared other places'...that's a bit frustrating.
5. EE= Empire's End. And Vodo said to the Kun. and page 25 of the NECG...it says Bane started the tradition of handing Darth to successors, not that he was the first Darth. Nothing claims he was the first Darth, and KOTOR disproves the idea that he was. Moreover, Nadd's armor wasn't Sith like...Nadd's armor was just armor. And krath armor is not similar to Andeddu's nor does it have a big, elaborate Sith headress.
7. Mandalore the Ultimate did not take out massive factions on his own...and he caused one war. ONE war. Just because Revan and Malak decided to carry on others doesn't mean he should be praised for it. In overall impact, Jango's clones had a bigger impact than the Ultimate, and in martial feats, Jango certainly outdid him.
8. Sadow shouldn't even HAVE a tomb! He was on Yavin at the time, and why would Ludo Kressh, in the two days it took him to usurp Sadow's throne, let them build a massive tomb to honor the Sith who got them wiped out?
And if revan could see the outcome of wars, didn't he notice the Sith losing?
Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
By seeing the future, he could see wars in the long run. It was stated by the Handmaided that the best Echani generals could see the course of wars years in advance. She also said Revan had mastered it to a higher degree then any Echani.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
1. However, how many of Nadd's kids were psychotic, evil power abusers? Most of Amanoa's family was dead by her own admission...others were beastriders, even. Nadd didn't spare his own blood. Most naddists were Ommin loyalists, that was it....please, proof they expected to engage the Sith? Even Vodo scolded Exar, saying they were gone forever.
Vodo was trying to keep Exar away from the darkside as much as possible. Telling him it was gone for good would be a good way to do this.
The Naddist could have become random Dark Jedi who the Jedi fought one at a time. The Jedi had to face non, force weilders too, that were far less powerful in PT times, such as the Gank Mercenaries. According to the New Essential Guide to Chronology, this eventually became a full-scale war.
Also, I can't believe that you missed this, during the Vultar Cataclysm in 4250 B.B.Y. there was what the New Essential Guide described as the 3rd Great Schism amoung the Jedi Order and a big war on Coruscant.
There was also the Great Droid Revolution in 4015 B.B.Y., during which thousands of droids rebelled against their leaders and the Jedi were called into action to defeat them.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
2. That's FIRMLY different. Use their Sith powers and force ability with no way to amplify it: Just them without artifacts or amplifiers.
A lightsaber is an extension of a Jedi though. It amplifies their fighting capability just as a Sith Amulet does. If you don't want the Sith to be using their amulets, then KMC just isn't the place for you, I guess.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
3. Durge has been hit with grnades before, an army's worth. It doesn't 'vaporize' him, it impacts on his armor and pisses him off.
Thermal detonators will have a different effect, I believe.
In anycase, you have in no way shown how Dooku is more powerful then Malak. I suggest you do so.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
4. Ok, Glentract, I'm confused....can we stop picking and choosing what we want to keep from WOTC? First it's 'well, the Sith Empire being 2000 years old is wrong', now it's 'well, it's appeared other places'...that's a bit frustrating.
You know, it be a lot easier to do this if you put what part of my post you are actually referring to in quotes just above your post. Just put, "
Originally posted by Darth_Glentract" at the end of each section of my post you are talking about. Make sure to leave a space between the "[/B][/QUOTE]" and the end of the paragraph or else it won't work.
" at the beginning and "
What exactly am I picking from the WOTC?
Originally posted by Lightsnake
5. EE= Empire's End. And Vodo said to the Kun. and page 25 of the NECG...it says Bane started the tradition of handing Darth to successors, not that he was the first Darth. Nothing claims he was the first Darth, and KOTOR disproves the idea that he was. Moreover, Nadd's armor wasn't Sith like...Nadd's armor was just armor. And krath armor is not similar to Andeddu's nor does it have a big, elaborate Sith headress.
Just look at some pictures of them!
Here is Nadd:
Here is Andeddu:
Here is Nadd again:
They look the SAME! You can't argue that they don't have the same armor.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
7. Mandalore the Ultimate did not take out massive factions on his own...and he caused one war. ONE war. Just because Revan and Malak decided to carry on others doesn't mean he should be praised for it. In overall impact, Jango's clones had a bigger impact than the Ultimate, and in martial feats, Jango certainly outdid him.
Jango caused zero wars. ZERO wars. Zero is less then one last time iI checked. And if the Mandalore hadn't started the Mandalorian War neither the Sith Civil War, nor the Jedi Civil War would have happened because it was him who got Revan and Malak to turn to the darkside.
It's also noted in the New Essential Guide to Chronology that the Mandalore we are talking about took the Mandalorians from control over just a single world to an Empire that dwarfed the Hutts. It also said that he would be forever honored in Mandalorian War songs.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
8. Sadow shouldn't even HAVE a tomb! He was on Yavin at the time, and why would Ludo Kressh, in the two days it took him to usurp Sadow's throne, let them build a massive tomb to honor the Sith who got them wiped out?
Yes, Sadow did have a tomb on Korriban. It was dedicated to him. The Sith still existed a thousand years later, as seen in KOTOR 2 and also in KOTOR we can clearly see their tombs on the surface of the planet.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
And if revan could see the outcome of wars, didn't he notice the Sith losing?
Did I say outcome or did I say course. He couldn't see the end result, no one can see everything with perfect clarity, it's just that Revan could far more then Mace or Mundi.
Originally posted by §cooter
😆 I never said I didn't like them, now did I? I asked a question... and your dodging around it leads me to believe I was right.EDIT: And to be more clear, I never actually read any of them.
If they bothered me, why would I make so many of them? In short, they don't.
If you don't read the 'meat' of the thread, why bother posting in it or looking at it?
Originally posted by Darth_GlentractI didn't ask if they bothered you 😐
If they bothered me, why would I make so many of them? In short, they don't.If you don't read the 'meat' of the thread, why bother posting in it or looking at it?
I was reading the begining of the thread until it turned into a gigantic "Super-post" war.
Originally posted by §cooter
I didn't ask if they bothered you 😐I was reading the begining of the thread until it turned into a gigantic "Super-post" war.
You asked, "Do you guys get all hot and bothered with the super-posts?" Who is you guys then? I take it now that wasn't a general question out to everyone.
Originally posted by Darth_GlentractHot and Bothered = Turned on. It was sarcasm 😛
You asked, "Do you guys get all hot and bothered with the super-posts?" Who is you guys then? I take it now that wasn't a general question out to everyone.
Originally posted by calvin44Super-posts aren't nessecary to prove your point.
he makes super-posts cause he knows how to prove his point, unlike you.
Okay just going to adress one thing now.
Mandalore.
He fought a war for more then 40 years, 40 years in which his warriors killed Jedi killed army's 10x their size and were based purely and only on fighting. The Mandelorians are ruld by the most powerful. After 40 years of constant fighting you are going to have some very freaking powerful people. Canderous for instance was feared in the entire Outer Rim and incredibly famous. Its to bad Kotor didn't really carry it out, but still its said so on Taris by several people that could know.
Thats one freaking Mandelorian, known throughout a large section of the galaxy. Canderous has killed Jedi too, other Mandelorian champions have as well. The Mandelorian Champions in Kotor II have both killed Jedi, the last one you beat does say he lost his last fight and still has a lot to learn but that was in a fighter. Canderous lead those guys. He was weaker then the previous Mandelore, he admits to it himself.
40 years of constant warfare against opponents that could destroy you, against army's that you face only to challenge you and for no other reason... Well thats going to make some very powerful warriors. Both in space and on the ground, with swords and with guns. Energy shields made the shields very usefull, and still Mandalore was more powerful. Those Mandelorians managed to kill Jedi in a war, managed to make the republic shake with fewer troops but far better trained, thats why they did what they did. Mandalore was even greater then all of those people. He freaking pwned.
Originally posted by Darth_Glentract" and the end of the paragraph or else it won't work.
Vodo was trying to keep Exar away from the darkside as much as possible. Telling him it was gone for good would be a good way to do this.The Naddist could have become random Dark Jedi who the Jedi fought one at a time. The Jedi had to face non, force weilders too, that were far less powerful in PT times, such as the Gank Mercenaries. According to the New Essential Guide to Chronology, this eventually became a full-scale war.
Also, I can't believe that you missed this, during the Vultar Cataclysm in 4250 B.B.Y. there was what the New Essential Guide described as the 3rd Great Schism amoung the Jedi Order and a big war on Coruscant.
There was also the Great Droid Revolution in 4015 B.B.Y., during which thousands of droids rebelled against their leaders and the Jedi were called into action to defeat them.
A lightsaber is an extension of a Jedi though. It amplifies their fighting capability just as a Sith Amulet does. If you don't want the Sith to be using their amulets, then KMC just isn't the place for you, I guess.
Thermal detonators will have a different effect, I believe.
In anycase, you have in no way shown how Dooku is more powerful then Malak. I suggest you do so.
You know, it be a lot easier to do this if you put what part of my post you are actually referring to in quotes just above your post. Just put, "" at the end of each section of my post you are talking about. Make sure to leave a space between the "
What exactly am I picking from the WOTC?
Just look at some pictures of them!
Here is Nadd:
Here is Andeddu:
Here is Nadd again:
They look the SAME! You can't argue that they don't have the same armor.
Jango caused zero wars. ZERO wars. Zero is less then one last time iI checked. And if the Mandalore hadn't started the Mandalorian War neither the Sith Civil War, nor the Jedi Civil War would have happened because it was him who got Revan and Malak to turn to the darkside.
It's also noted in the New Essential Guide to Chronology that the Mandalore we are talking about took the Mandalorians from control over just a single world to an Empire that dwarfed the Hutts. It also said that he would be forever honored in Mandalorian War songs.
Yes, Sadow did have a tomb on Korriban. It was dedicated to him. The Sith still existed a thousand years later, as seen in KOTOR 2 and also in KOTOR we can clearly see their tombs on the surface of the planet.
Did I say outcome or did I say course. He couldn't see the end result, no one can see everything with perfect clarity, it's just that Revan could far more then Mace or Mundi. [/B][/QUOTE]
1. As opposed to even Odan-Urr thinking the Sith had been exterminated 1000 years back?
2. The Jedi didn't commit their entire forces to wars with the Ganks and the Kanz...they sent in small forces and then used knights to finish it...notice the wars didn't last long with Jedi involved.
3. The third great Schism amongst the Jedi goes in direct contradiction of other sources, as well as being 300 years before....and droids are not dark siders. And The Jedi had only just come to Onderon since Nadd...the Naddists died out after Kun
4. A lightsaber doesn't amplify force powers. If you're comparing power, than don't give them kaiburr crystals, sith amulets, force crystals etc.
5. The entire little detail about WOTC and Xendor's schism...reducing the SE to a 2000 year empire.
6. I see no similarities and the headress. holocron and tomb on Korriban remain...though considering Nadd could have plundered Sadow's corpse, or the corpses of the long dead Sith Lords on Yavin...
7. In the Character Guide, they were talking about Mandalore the First, the Ultimate didn't even exist yet in SW continuity. And Jango was arguably responsible for the Clone Wars...did Mandalore the Ultimate ever wipe out the Death Watch singlehandedly? Did he ever kill Jedi when massively outnumbered with his bare hands? Did he ever fight his way singlehandedly through kingdoms and crime lords to kill a dark jedi and her entire army along with a man like Montross?
In a mano a mano, martial feats are greater than tactical feats...not only that, Jango never got the Mandalorians nearly exterminated and forced to become bootlickers for crime lords
1. As opposed to even Odan-Urr thinking the Sith had been exterminated 1000 years back?
2. The Jedi didn't commit their entire forces to wars with the Ganks and the Kanz...they sent in small forces and then used knights to finish it...notice the wars didn't last long with Jedi involved.
3. The third great Schism amongst the Jedi goes in direct contradiction of other sources, as well as being 300 years before....and droids are not dark siders. And The Jedi had only just come to Onderon since Nadd...the Naddists died out after Kun
4. A lightsaber doesn't amplify force powers. If you're comparing power, than don't give them kaiburr crystals, sith amulets, force crystals etc.
5. The entire little detail about WOTC and Xendor's schism...reducing the SE to a 2000 year empire.
6. I see no similarities and the headress. holocron and tomb on Korriban remain...though considering Nadd could have plundered Sadow's corpse, or the corpses of the long dead Sith Lords on Yavin...
7. In the Character Guide, they were talking about Mandalore the First, the Ultimate didn't even exist yet in SW continuity. And Jango was arguably responsible for the Clone Wars...did Mandalore the Ultimate ever wipe out the Death Watch singlehandedly? Did he ever kill Jedi when massively outnumbered with his bare hands? Did he ever fight his way singlehandedly through kingdoms and crime lords to kill a dark jedi and her entire army along with a man like Montross?
In a mano a mano, martial feats are greater than tactical feats...not only that, Jango never got the Mandalorians nearly exterminated and forced to become bootlickers for crime lords [/B][/QUOTE]
Originally posted by Lightsnake
1. As opposed to even Odan-Urr thinking the Sith had been exterminated 1000 years back?
Like I said, there were other problems such as the Ganks and Droid Uprising.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
2. The Jedi didn't commit their entire forces to wars with the Ganks and the Kanz...they sent in small forces and then used knights to finish it...notice the wars didn't last long with Jedi involved.
In the New Essential Guide to Chronology, it was described as a full-scale war. I would like to see where you got this information that it was just a minor one.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
3. The third great Schism amongst the Jedi goes in direct contradiction of other sources, as well as being 300 years before....and droids are not dark siders. And The Jedi had only just come to Onderon since Nadd...the Naddists died out after Kun
What are these other sources? Unless it's a quote directly from Lucas, Lucasfilm, or the moives, it's canon because the Essential Guides are higher level canon then even regular EU novels or comics.
Just because the droids aren't darksiders means nothing. CIS droids weren't darksiders either. Neither was the Mandalorians. Those each had a huge effect on the Jedi and they weren't darksiders. If you want to make the Great Droid Revolution not count, you can't count the Clone Wars either because darksiders were primarily not involved.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
4. A lightsaber doesn't amplify force powers. If you're comparing power, than don't give them kaiburr crystals, sith amulets, force crystals etc.
Having amulets is part of their power. No one has any clue about how powerful they would be without their amulets and I doubt many people care because they would never be caught without their amulets, making it never matter in EU times.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
5. The entire little detail about WOTC and Xendor's schism...reducing the SE to a 2000 year empire.
Xendor's Schism is also mentioned in some of the older Essential Guides and the Han Solo Trilogy.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
6. I see no similarities and the headress. holocron and tomb on Korriban remain...though considering Nadd could have plundered Sadow's corpse, or the corpses of the long dead Sith Lords on Yavin...
Nadd could have, but as far as we know he didn't.
It wouldn't be very hard to get a tomb on Korriban. He could have built it himself or highered someone or something. It's really not a very hard thing to do.
Also note that the armor more closely resembles Nadd's armor then Sadow's armor or Ludo's armor.
Vodo Baas made a holocron too, but many Ancient Sith would take him.
I don't know wy you are still talking about the headress. Andeddu's looks more like Nadd's then any of the Ancient Sith's.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
7. In the Character Guide, they were talking about Mandalore the First, the Ultimate didn't even exist yet in SW continuity. And Jango was arguably responsible for the Clone Wars...did Mandalore the Ultimate ever wipe out the Death Watch singlehandedly? Did he ever kill Jedi when massively outnumbered with his bare hands? Did he ever fight his way singlehandedly through kingdoms and crime lords to kill a dark jedi and her entire army along with a man like Montross?
Read Fishy's post. It answers this quite well.
Jango was not responsible for the Clone Wars. They would still have happened without him because he was one out of dozens of people who could have been cloned. No one else could have led the Mandalorians into wars like the Mandalore who Revan fought. No one else would have gotten Revan and Malak to fall to the darkside. Jango certainly couldn't have done it.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
In a mano a mano, martial feats are greater than tactical feats...not only that, Jango never got the Mandalorians nearly exterminated and forced to become bootlickers for crime lords
Jango did get the Mandalorians exterminated completly. Rather then training new Mandalorians, he bounty hunted and got the Mandalorians destroyed until Boba restarted them, but by then they weren't very powerful. Jango completly failed as a Mandalorian.
Mandalorians pwned Jedi all the time and this Mandalore is better then all them. If all his lacky's can kill someone, he should be able to also.
