Battlefield SW

Originally posted by Darth Avis
if they could aim... The massasi also get some strong beasts (refer to the end of page 3 and the begining of page 4 and wookiepeia)

I'm tried of everyone dissing the storm troopers on the basis that they have no aim . This opinion is formed only because in the movies because the good guys are always getting shot at and no one ever gets hit. This is BS IMO because it's a frigan movie, think logically people the Storm troopers didn't become the most feared soldiers in the galaxy for nothing. We all know for real that in almost every incident in those movies were it's storm troopers vs. the heroes that the heroes should be getting their asses kicked. How does a farm boy, a senile old man, a scruffy smuggler, and a spoiled princess manage to not only escape from a maximum security battle station. But they even manage to gun down several members of the most "elite fighting force" in the galaxy. Every bad guy in every book and movie has to have bad aim or else their would be no movie as the hero would get cooked in the opening scene. The storm troopers probably have excellent aim and probably have topnotch weapons and armor as well.

Well my little rant is over, not to my opinion on the who would win...

Since the setting is in the Jedi Temple that means that everyone will be fighting inside yes? That means that the conditions will be close quarters mostly and low ceilings and such. This forces both sides to have to travel in clumps, this making it easier for Sids team because if the enemy is traveling in clumped than the Storm troopers don't have to aim as well anyways. If ten storm troopers are walking down a hallway, slightly huddled together, and they come upon ten massasi warriors who are huddled down the hallway 30 feet away, all the storm troopers have to do ids fire into that concentrated mass of men, and because the hallways are close they wont have as much space to dodge the bullets. By the time the Massasi reach the storm troopers they will probably have lost at least like six guys, in which the remaining four perhaps will take out two or three troopers before going down as well.

And everyone is under the speculation that Sids will actually be among his soldiers in the battle, waiting for Sadow to take him out. We all know Sids is a coward, and he will probably be hiding in an AT-ST several miels away from the battle, using battle meditation and commanding his troops via comlink and cooking up a force storm, safely out of reach of any harm from the Massasi or Naga himself.

Once the enemy forces have been weakened enough and Sids has a good storm cooked up he'll mosey on down to the Temple, give off a few bursts of his storm, killing a bunch, than he'll leave and make his way back to the safety point. Repeat the process and the battle will be over in probably a couple of days.

Youre forgetting Revan and the Mandalorians.

Originally posted by tdtd
Youre forgetting Revan and the Mandalorians.

Oh I'll find make a ant on that later...I have starcraft to play...

Originally posted by Blaxican_Hydra
I'm tried of everyone dissing the storm troopers on the basis that they have no aim . This opinion is formed only because in the movies because the good guys are always getting shot at and no one ever gets hit. This is BS IMO because it's a frigan movie, think logically people the Storm troopers didn't become the most feared soldiers in the galaxy for nothing. We all know for real that in almost every incident in those movies were it's storm troopers vs. the heroes that the heroes should be getting their asses kicked. How does a farm boy, a senile old man, a scruffy smuggler, and a spoiled princess manage to not only escape from a maximum security battle station. But they even manage to gun down several members of the most "elite fighting force" in the galaxy. Every bad guy in every book and movie has to have bad aim or else their would be no movie as the hero would get cooked in the opening scene. The storm troopers probably have excellent aim and probably have topnotch weapons and armor as well.

Well my little rant is over, not to my opinion on the who would win...

Since the setting is in the Jedi Temple that means that everyone will be fighting inside yes? That means that the conditions will be close quarters mostly and low ceilings and such. This forces both sides to have to travel in clumps, this making it easier for Sids team because if the enemy is traveling in clumped than the Storm troopers don't have to aim as well anyways. If ten storm troopers are walking down a hallway, slightly huddled together, and they come upon ten massasi warriors who are huddled down the hallway 30 feet away, all the storm troopers have to do ids fire into that concentrated mass of men, and because the hallways are close they wont have as much space to dodge the bullets. By the time the Massasi reach the storm troopers they will probably have lost at least like six guys, in which the remaining four perhaps will take out two or three troopers before going down as well.

And everyone is under the speculation that Sids will actually be among his soldiers in the battle, waiting for Sadow to take him out. We all know Sids is a coward, and he will probably be hiding in an AT-ST several miels away from the battle, using battle meditation and commanding his troops via comlink and cooking up a force storm, safely out of reach of any harm from the Massasi or Naga himself.

Once the enemy forces have been weakened enough and Sids has a good storm cooked up he'll mosey on down to the Temple, give off a few bursts of his storm, killing a bunch, than he'll leave and make his way back to the safety point. Repeat the process and the battle will be over in probably a couple of days.

1 You cant leave the temple
2 Sadow will kill sids because he is stronger and, if his power can travel a few miles and make a star deonate, it can travel a few miles and kill sids.
3The massasi are infused with the dark side. they will sense the troops and ambush them.

They are infused with the dark side, so what? They have no idea how to use it, nor control it

1. Did Wesker say that?

2. Detonating a star and killing everyone, including all his troops, yeah right.

3. The Stromtroopers have infrared and motion sensors as well, they will see the Massasi coming and they to can form an ambush.

First off, I agree on the perception that Storm Troopers get a particularly poor rap. Wong at Stardestroyer.net's offered possible motives for their lack of performance, such as them not really being out to kill the heroes of the story because they lead the empire to the rebellion, and because those weren't frontline troops; they were reserves.

However, I disgree with your assessment on the ease at which the Storm troopers will win. I don't think the Imps have ever faced two thousand force sensitive warriors in a small temple without sufficient artillery and heavy tank support. I mean, even the Clone Troopers who attacked the jedi temple used BIG weapons to level parts of the temple in their siege, but they at least had a good gauge of their enemies' abilities. And they didn't have to confront a Sith Lord who plays with stars for fun.

Let's face it- they're primarily deployed for keeping the peace or suppressing uprisings. The real strength of the Empire lies in its vast navy. Even the attacking forces on an ISD died in droves to a defensive enemy (Beginning of ANH). Even if they have AT-STs and mortars, there's nothing to suggest they can storm this palace and put down every massassi within.

And I'd LOVE to see Sidious cook up a Force storm while in a little tiny AT-ST. That would be hilarious.

hahahahaa well...that depends, Im guessing that when he cooks one up he starts to like...brim with energy? I thought at first that it was like a meditationel thing like:

"Im a good person, I'ma good person, I can do this I can do this,,,I feel the energy coming I feel it I-(Unleashes the energy) F*CK YO COUCH ******!!!" And kills everyone. I guess that's wrong?

1. how does being empowered by the massassi possibly help them?
2. does it really matter if Sidious is in a cramped area or in an open area, for him to create a force storm?

Aleema ripped the core of a sun off causing a supernova. If you have a look at the beginning of DLotS (when Exar has a look at the Holocron) you just see Sadow closing his hands destabilizing two stars to destroy his persuers with the comments "Sith care nothing for the natural order of the universe" and "Naga Sadow considers the death of a star system a small price for his own survival". At the very least he created and manipulated solar flares with a handmovement.

That holocron is a dubious source at best, considering it was both compiled by Vodo and also portrayed Sadow as having human-colored skin.

Aleema clenched her fist when using the ship in this manner as well. Were there no dialogue or narration, we'd assume that she did it on her own power as well.

It's not a stretch to assume that the ship's weapon can be used in more than one way. Dialogue and narration indicate that the ship allows a Force-based attack, and The Force certainly doesn't seem to have limitations in number of different uses.

I don't get what all this fandom of the Massasi came from. They were weaker then jedi (Sylvar, a jedi knight in THE SITH WAR was able to kill three of them in seconds with her claws and these were the stronger Massasi that Kun controls). Sadow's Massasi would also be at a huge disadvantage with the location. And they were clearly not used to dealing with blasters as at the time as melee weapons were generally used in war and Sadow and his troops were easily able to deal with some Massasi guards using blasters that they found on the Daragons' ship. I think that the clone troopers would be superior to the Massasi in this instance as they would have the tight confined spaces of the temple to their advantage and they would be able to use the fact that they have range to their advantage as well.

The Massassi are strong warriors and specialize in hand to hand combat, but they would get curbstomped by superior weaponry.

Numan, don't post in my thread, I'm serious. GTFO.

Originally posted by Wesker
First off, I agree on the perception that Storm Troopers get a particularly poor rap. Wong at Stardestroyer.net's offered possible motives for their lack of performance, such as them not really being out to kill the heroes of the story because they lead the empire to the rebellion, and because those weren't frontline troops; they were reserves.

However, I disgree with your assessment on the ease at which the Storm troopers will win. I don't think the Imps have ever faced two thousand force sensitive warriors in a small temple without sufficient artillery and heavy tank support. I mean, even the Clone Troopers who attacked the jedi temple used BIG weapons to level parts of the temple in their siege, but they at least had a good gauge of their enemies' abilities. And they didn't have to confront a Sith Lord who plays with stars for fun.

Let's face it- they're primarily deployed for keeping the peace or suppressing uprisings. The real strength of the Empire lies in its vast navy. Even the attacking forces on an ISD died in droves to a defensive enemy (Beginning of ANH). Even if they have AT-STs and mortars, there's nothing to suggest they can storm this palace and put down every massassi within.

And I'd LOVE to see Sidious cook up a Force storm while in a little tiny AT-ST. That would be hilarious.

Uh... armed with that knowledge, Janus, I have to ask how the hell you're going to give Sidious a good chance. So far, the odds are stacked against him. Sadow's more powerful and his troops are flat out better than Imperial Stormtroopers. Hell, Sidious doesn't even have his usual advantage - which is the typical numerical one.

I'm trying to remain as open as possible regarding the outcome. If I just made a thread and demanded that people change my mind on the outcome or else, it would be pointless. If a lot of people can provide a good enough argument, or find holes in my arguments and others for Sadow, I'll entertain Sidious winning.

Originally posted by Wesker
I'm trying to remain as open as possible regarding the outcome. If I just made a thread and demanded that people change my mind on the outcome or else, it would be pointless. If a lot of people can provide a good enough argument, or find holes in my arguments and others for Sadow, I'll entertain Sidious winning.

Entertain the thought? Look: Sidious has no chance. Look here, it's me: the so-called Sidious uber-fanboy. I'm telling you, he has no shot - which makes me wonder why in the hell you made it possible. If you actually give him a shot, I think I might have a heart-attack.

Naga Sadow is flat-out better than Sidious. He's stronger, smarter, more powerful - and his forces are as well. He can replicate the same Force feats that Sidious can, and then some of his own that Sidious can't. In a one-on-one confrontation, Sidious gets owned to a degree that I feel uncomfortable discussing.

Then, let's take a look at the ground-forces. Ah, what's this? Look who has the advantage again. Sadow. His men are empowered by the Dark Side - your own words. That means the Dark Side has augmented them. The stormtroopers may have superior technology, but that hasn't saved them in every battle they got in. I recall Ewoks owning them on Endor.

To top it all off, you have Sadow on the defensive. So all he has to do is wait until his considerably weaker opponent draws near, and then uses his Force-powers and his Massassi to wipe out the stormtroopers and slaughter Palpatine.

The only way Sadow's going down is if there's a space-fight. Then, he gets his ass kicked. But Sidious is owned here. He becomes a Dark Side grease spot on the grass...

Sadow ftw.

I wouldn't say flat-out that Sadow is smarter than Sidious. I'll give Sidious that.

Originally posted by IKC
I wouldn't say flat-out that Sadow is smarter than Sidious. I'll give Sidious that.

Actually, I've come to the conclusion that Sidious wasn't as smart as I thought. Based on all the arguments that Janus, Sorgo, etc. gave me before - I went back and re-read. You know, Sidious lost his first elections on Naboo. He was stupid to kill Plageuis before he learned his master's secret. He also underestimated a lot of his opponents which earned him several staggering defeats. I dunno, my opinion changed a lot recently. I would argue if Sidious is even a considerable player in feat wars.

Escape 81 give some reasons please. All you did in that last argument is say over and over again that Sadows forces are better, but you didn't actually give any proof . I gave tactics and even gave an example to back up my statement. You have not. I can say: Rotj Luke is better than Marka Ragnos over and over again until I'm blue in the face but mu opinion will be moot unless I give some actual reasoning.

[QUOTE=6271169]Originally posted by Blaxican_Hydra
Escape 81 give some reasons please. All you did in that last argument is say over and over again that Sadows forces are better, but you didn't actually give any proof . I gave tactics and even gave an example to back up my statement. You have not. I can say: Rotj Luke is better than Marka Ragnos over and over again until I'm blue in the face but mu opinion will be moot unless I give some actual reasoning.

Sadow > Sidious. If you want proof, go back and look at Wesker's posts. Sidious's feats are nothing new to Sadow, who can replicate those and then some of his own.

Now, Stormtroopers possess superior technology, granted. But Massassi are empowered by the Dark Side. They are augmented by it. Palpatine's men are flesh-and-blood human without any other Force assistance other than Palpatine's Battle Meditation - which, wouldn't ya know - Sadow can do as well.

In melee combat, the Massassi slaughter the stormtroopers. And, now, the kicker!

Sadow is on the defensive. That means all he has to do is sit and wait. Palpatine is coming for him. So, that means that the Stormtroopers advantage of blasters won't be much good when they're in arm's reach of the Massassi.

Sadow > Sidious

Massassi > Stormtroopers