Cloud vs Squall

Originally posted by SpadeKing
I over compensated and posted the entire thing 😐

But it starts at 4:55 where he fights the troops, they really don't even seem to reach 50, just well spread out to look like a lot. But that one he survives that encounter just to get sniped.

Cool, thanks.

That's absolutely different from Crisis Core... He left Cloud laying there... Those are some soldiers, those does not constitute an army, at all. He fought with his fists...? Weird, I think I'm going to watch the whole thing. That's actually the SAME scene? I think nope. I can notice the scene at the end of the video, when Cloud is about to get killed by an sniper, but, it ends there.... Weird. 😐

Yea Last Order basically ends with Zack getting headshotted. FF7 ends with Zack laying Cloud down, running off and coming back to get Cloud and getting gunned down. Crisis Core ends with Zack dying to a few remaining soldiers.

I think they're going to stop there 😐

Really? You think Last Order ends with Zack taking the sniper shot for Cloud? Hmm... I think that's the part where Crisis Core explains the moments AFTER that scene, which it is not seen in Last Order. Yeah, that's it, remember Crisis Core came after Last Order.

Go watch FFVII: the last order.
Watch Zacks fight with the shinra army.
He dodges bullets
Senses that they are there
and destroys them even though he has been brought down a shit load by the tests run on him.

Cloud should be able to do the same

your argument about clouds jenova cells are stupid. Squall had enhancements as well so it means nothing. Even though cloud was trash before the enhancements, doesnt mean he will stay trash. Squall went from good to better.
Cloud went from shit to amazing.

Originally posted by TacDavey
Let's be fair, here, Indridcold. You say that the fact that Zack can take out armies by himself somehow solidifies the point that Squall can to? How? The only way it would do that is if you were presupposing that Squall was stronger than Zack, and presuppositions are never good.

While Zack has shown to take out armies practically by himself, Squall has never done so. You can only reach that conclusion by assuming that Squall could have done the job alone, and that needs a little bit more support than "Squall is just so much better than everyone else, it would take more than 8 or 9 other people to do what he can alone." That may or may not be true, but it needs more support. Has Squall ever done something by himself that a group of seeds couldn't? Make special note of the "by himself" requirement. I don't remember the game well enough.

+1 well said
it never happened in his game.

Anyway, crisis core is not a spin off. IT IS A PART OF THE STORY.

Originally posted by GrieverSquall
Any SeeD member or student are far stronger than any G-Soldier, check their Scan, it reveals they are nowhere as strong as any of the SeeD members. The Galbadian Soldiers kicked the Dollet's army asses. Seifer took several G-Soldiers by himself and they were running away near the Communication Tower, no to mention that is the first Disc of the game. Squall is by far the strongest of all the SeeDs. So Indridcold's argument sounds pretty much plausible to me. Squall could take armies by himself.

Zack couldn't take an army by himself, if I recall correctly, he was beaten, and it was at the end of Crisis Core.

Wow that just shows that you never played crisis core

First off, Zack weakend due to the Mako tests. He fought countless troops on his way to midgar with cloud to look after.
After he got to banora, he FOUGHT GENESIS A FIRST CLASS SOLDIER AND ALL OF HIS MINIONS. Genesis was the 3rd strongest SOLDIER member before Zack came into the picture. After he fought genesis he took Cloud with him all the way to the outskirts of midgar. THEN he was gunned down by Shinra. It was almost their entire army vs zack.
He killed most of them but was stopped by the last few left.
Squall has never done that, he never will do that and its all because he CANT do that.

Originally posted by FFVII Zack Fair
Wow that just shows that you never played crisis core

First off, Zack weakend due to the Mako tests. He fought countless troops on his way to midgar with cloud to look after.
After he got to banora, he FOUGHT GENESIS A FIRST CLASS SOLDIER AND ALL OF HIS MINIONS. Genesis was the 3rd strongest SOLDIER member before Zack came into the picture. After he fought genesis he took Cloud with him all the way to the outskirts of midgar. THEN he was gunned down by Shinra. It was almost their entire army vs zack.
He killed most of them but was stopped by the last few left.
Squall has never done that, he never will do that and its all because he CANT do that.

Funny though, the ultimania mentions Genesis as a combat equal on par with Sephiroth he is ranked 3rd? ermm

Before Crisis Core and Last Order, Zack was killed quite easily by gun shots. Which he should've easily dodged apparently. 😬

So saying that is something he never will do because he doesn't have an expansion in the FF8 series to prove so is a bad point. Cause once again that is the same logic that would have the FF7 verse destroying every other verse despite not having one of the top 5 characters in power in the entire Series.

Originally posted by FFVII Zack Fair
Go watch FFVII: the last order.
Watch Zacks fight with the shinra army.
He dodges bullets
Senses that they are there
and destroys them even though he has been brought down a shit load by the tests run on him.

Cloud should be able to do the same

your argument about clouds jenova cells are stupid. Squall had enhancements as well so it means nothing. Even though cloud was trash before the enhancements, doesnt mean he will stay trash. Squall went from good to better.
Cloud went from shit to amazing.

This is more of the same "argument". It's like using Advent Children to prove Cloud's dominance over the rest of the FF characters from the series. Now you're using an Anime.

Seriously, stop it.

By that logic, Squall fights soldiers with, rifles, bayonets, machine guns, lasers, pistols, futuristic vehicles of military combat and robots with heavy artillery almost all the time during the game, so he would be able to do the same.

Squall went from a master swordsman and Elite to the best of the bests. Cloud went from crap to good. You sir, have no point.

I haven't made any "stupid" argument, so you're talking nonsense here.

Originally posted by FFVII Zack Fair
Wow that just shows that you never played crisis core

First off, Zack weakend due to the Mako tests. He fought countless troops on his way to midgar with cloud to look after.
After he got to banora, he FOUGHT GENESIS A FIRST CLASS SOLDIER AND ALL OF HIS MINIONS. Genesis was the 3rd strongest SOLDIER member before Zack came into the picture. After he fought genesis he took Cloud with him all the way to the outskirts of midgar. THEN he was gunned down by Shinra. It was almost their entire army vs zack.
He killed most of them but was stopped by the last few left.
Squall has never done that, he never will do that and its all because he CANT do that.

I have never played Crisis Core, true, SO?

I bet you don't know ANYTHING about Final Fantasy VIII seeing your previous responses in this thread.

More of the same garbage. Read above.
Also, I don't care what Zack does, you have to support Cloud, not Zack. Do it.

Originally posted by FFVII Zack Fair
Squall has never done that, he never will do that and its all because he CANT do that.

But argueably speaking YES Squall has fought an army. With 7 or 8 other SeeD initiates at the very BEGINNING of his game. I say again, at the very BEGINNING of his game. So YES definitively speaking, Squall can fight an army when all is said and done. Especially "end game" Squall.

It should also be noted that Zack LOST. He could NOT fight an army. That point really isn't going to well for you, because one of your mako enhanced superhuman SOLDIERS died doing what 8 or 9 SeeD initiates did at the very beginning of FF8

Originally posted by FFVII Zack Fair
+1 well said
it never happened in his game.

Anyway, crisis core is not a spin off. IT IS A PART OF THE STORY.

Originally posted by FFVII Zack Fair
+1 well said
it never happened in his game.

Anyway, crisis core is not a spin off. IT IS A PART OF THE STORY.

As it stands and looking at only the original games (FF7 and FF8). Squall wins.

And I'm sorry for the double posts, havin to do a lot of running back and forth here

Originally posted by GrieverSquall
This is more of the same "argument". It's like using Advent Children to prove Cloud's dominance over the rest of the FF characters from the series. Now you're using an Anime.

Seriously, stop it.

By that logic, Squall fights soldiers with, rifles, bayonets, machine guns, lasers, pistols, futuristic vehicles of military combat and robots with heavy artillery almost all the time during the game, so he would be able to do the same.

Squall went from a master swordsman and Elite to the best of the bests. Cloud went from crap to good. You sir, have no point.

I haven't made any "stupid" argument, so you're talking nonsense here.

I have never played Crisis Core, true, SO?

I bet you don't know ANYTHING about Final Fantasy VIII seeing your previous responses in this thread.

More of the same garbage. Read above.
Also, I don't care what Zack does, you have to support Cloud, not Zack. Do it.

Wow, looks like everything anyone brings up that clearly supports Cloud is either "nonsense" or "illogical"
If you played FFVII then you would know why Cloud is superior.
You clearly haven't
Nothing I can do then. You will never accept anything we say so whatever. Im already tired of this.
Besides Cloud is winning in the poll. So it doesn't even matter what you say
anyway.

OHHH. You say Genesis is on par with Sephiroth??
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Go watch Genesis vs Sephiroth.
There is a nice cg vid waiting for you. It absolutely destroys that BS you brought up from ultimania.
And... I'll say it again...IF YOU WOULD HAVE PLAYED CRISIS CORE THEN YOU WOULD UNDERSTAND HOW SEPHIROTH DESTROYS GENESIS.

Originally posted by IndridCold
Just because Squall has never fought an army doesn't mean he never will and doesn't mean that he can't. ALL it means he hasn't fought an army. Because it has never happened doesn't take it out of his capabilities to do it...lol If we wanted to we could use this same line of thinking on Cloud. Cloud's never fought an army, he never will fight an army, and it's all because he CANT do it. Does that sit well with you?

But argueably speaking YES Squall has fought an army. With 7 or 8 other SeeD initiates at the very BEGINNING of his game. I say again, at the very BEGINNING of his game. So YES definitively speaking, Squall can fight an army when all is said and done. Especially "end game" Squall.

It should also be noted that Zack LOST. He could NOT fight an army. That point really isn't going to well for you, because one of your mako enhanced superhuman SOLDIERS died doing what 8 or 9 SeeD initiates did at the very beginning of FF8

OMG. You obviously did not read anything I just said. You are just like that othe guy. Zack because "see my other post"
but my othe post doesn't matter to you does it?
Its got facts in it, which show what happened. If you can't accept them, then forget you and your argument. Now you just look ignorant.

Been playing FF7 lately for awhile and still nothing Cloud has done overly impressive or shown to be superior, you clearly must have played your own version.

He is winning in the poll due to this logic 😐

That further proves how logical he is haermm

Seph and Genesis fought to a stalemate in that battle until Angeal jumped in.

The Ultimania is fact they were combat equals, you're telling me to believe you over the creators?

Originally posted by FFVII Zack Fair
If you played FFVII then you would know why Cloud is superior.
You clearly haven't

Funny, except you're not basing anything you've said of from Final Fantasy VII.

And yes, I've played Final Fantasy VII.

Have you played Final Fantasy VIII...?

Originally posted by FFVII Zack Fair
Nothing I can do then. You will never accept anything we say so whatever. Im already tired of this.
Besides Cloud is winning in the poll. So it doesn't even matter what you say
anyway.

I don't give enough of a little shit about the "poll".

Logic is what works here, mate, you don't seem very familiar with it.

Originally posted by FFVII Zack Fair
OHHH. You say Genesis is on par with Sephiroth??
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Go watch Genesis vs Sephiroth.
There is a nice cg vid waiting for you. It absolutely destroys that BS you brought up from ultimania.
And... I'll say it again...IF YOU WOULD HAVE PLAYED CRISIS CORE THEN YOU WOULD UNDERSTAND HOW SEPHIROTH DESTROYS GENESIS.

Wrong quote, SpadeKing said it, not me.

Originally posted by SpadeKing
Funny though, the ultimania mentions Genesis as a combat equal on par with Sephiroth he is ranked 3rd? ermm

Before Crisis Core and Last Order, Zack was killed quite easily by gun shots. Which he should've easily dodged apparently. 😬

So saying that is something he never will do because he doesn't have an expansion in the FF8 series to prove so is a bad point. Cause once again that is the same logic that would have the FF7 verse destroying every other verse despite not having one of the top 5 characters in power in the entire Series.

FFS in FFVII it only showed THE VERY END OF ZACK.
I suggest you go play Crisis core or at least watch some videos on it before you come here.
Crisis core is the back story to FFVII. The developers themselves said " we've been cooking up Zack's story for about 10 years now"
So quit dismissing all evidence relating to crisis core. As far as I know, FFVIII has had no back story game waiting to be released.
VII was popular because it didn't suck and had a HUGE story, one that was mysterious with mamy twists. That's why people liked it. Not because "it was their first FF game".

People call BT bad 😐
I say we make a Zack vs Kain thread just to see what happens.

Originally posted by GrieverSquall
Funny, except you're not basing anything you've said of from Final Fantasy VII.

And yes, I've played Final Fantasy VII.

Have you played Final Fantasy VIII...?

I don't give enough of a little shit about the "poll".

Logic is what works here, mate, you don't seem very familiar with it.

Wrong quote, SpadeKing said it, not me.

My bad. Im doing this from my phone

Originally posted by GrieverSquall
Funny, except you're not basing anything you've said of from Final Fantasy VII.

And yes, I've played Final Fantasy VII.

Have you played Final Fantasy VIII...?

I don't give enough of a little shit about the "poll".

Logic is what works here, mate, you don't seem very familiar with it.

Wrong quote, SpadeKing said it, not me.

Again, you refuse to accept anything as logical. You think you're smart when you say logical? Haha, go look it up in a dictionary then tell me if I really am being illogical.

You are 😬