Originally posted by Soujaboy
The glow ment he was drawing power I thought? They were all draing power from Cyttorak, and thats where the crimson glow came from.You see how Cain told Spite that she was using his powers?
meh, could be. it's certainly not conclusive proof by any means. juggs was never shown with the glow at all anywhere else is all and the feat is sufficiently . . . strange to warrant some sort of odd explanation.
he has shown to have the glow in another comic book. See the fight with war hulk. You notice a similar artist and similar power spillage of a similar color.
Really TP can be thought of in multiple ways. I peronally view it as the person invades the victims mind and doesn't cause a sensory overload so much as an emotional breakdown. They use the power to manifest every painful and conflicting memory that they can and this overloads the opponents ability to handle the trauma of the severe emotion.
I know it isn't cannon but you see something similar in that dubbed over juggernaut B**** cartoon. When charles attacks him he sees his father and that kind of stuff. His father was a main point of his bad childhood which (if it was cannon) would support this thesis.
So i am just saying that it is possible that it has nothing to do with actual senses overloading but causeing a mental breakdown.
Colossus has stopped a train, even with juggs "inertia manipulating unstoppable-ness" i think it would only take 3 colossia to stop the juggernaut, they could eventually rip his helmet off and find away to overload his senses, if not three colossai is a stalemate at least.
J/k 1 mil collossai and the juggernaut would wade thru them, three-shotting all of them. JUGS OWNS.
Soujaboy, why are you so unopen to the sensory thing? Sonics can cause a pressure change in a person's inner ear making them dizzy. It doesn't cause any damage whatsoever. It may even be the body's own reaction to the frequency. Why wouldn't it work on Juggernaut?
This is regarding frequency attacks like Nimrod's.
Originally posted by leonidas
hmm, i went back and checked out that juggy one-shot with d'spayre. i still am not totally sure, but i wonder if he was able to keep going even as a skeleton because of spite? he is surrounded by a pink glow, the same power glow that surrounds spite. the glow around him is the same colour as her power throughout the book as well. juggs also says that the only thing keeping him going was HATE! hate and spite are of course, pretty much the same things, and juggs seemed pretty sure that spite was about to kill him at the end. it's just such a bizarre showing that it seems it needs some sort of explanation, and it makes perfect sense that spite would keep juggs alive so she could draw off more power from d'spayre. look at the last panel in the first scan, (the glow that surrounds all of them) then in the second, see the colour of spite's power? conincedence? personally, i don't think so . . .
Originally posted by Soujaboy
Who ever said his brain wasn't as resistant to injury as the rest of his body? these sensory attacks aren't the same as tp.
Telepathy is a sensory attack. Telepathy is an extra sensory ability. Juggernaut has been conclusively proven to be vulnerable to sensory manipulation, either via telepathy or sonics.
That's my whole point.
It can't be disputed, it's canon fact.
Originally posted by Soujaboy
My only problem is that Marvel has never stated that these things work on Juggernaut. The only attack that works on Juggernaut are tp based attacks. Tp does not include these attacks that you are bringing up.It's Magic, I cant explain it
👇
http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/8241/xmennimrod00074it.jpg
^Marvel states per visual depiction in canon continuity that Juggernaut is vulnerable to sonics.
A picture is worth a thousand words.
Juggernaut is vulnerable to sensory stimuli via sonics or telepathy.
Originally posted by superman41082
Very good point.Or, 1 million colossi could pick Juggernaut up and throw him into the sun. I'm sure that will harm him. Or, 1 million Colossi could rip the suit to shreds and wait for him to lose his powers. Guys..... Juggernaut is not unbeatable. You're all out of your minds......
It doesnt matter if you put one billion trillion gazillion collossus's up against him, and it doesnt matter whether he even gets thrown into the red sun of krypton.... he is invincible!
Originally posted by illadelph12
👇http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/8241/xmennimrod00074it.jpg
^Marvel states [b]per visual depiction in canon continuity
that Juggernaut is vulnerable to sonics.A picture is worth a thousand words.
Juggernaut is vulnerable to sensory stimuli via sonics or telepathy. [/B]
What do you think of my theory though. You pretty much ignored it and i would like to know what the other side of the coin thinks.
Originally posted by outarddwarf
he has shown to have the glow in another comic book. See the fight with war hulk. You notice a similar artist and similar power spillage of a similar color.Really TP can be thought of in multiple ways. I peronally view it as the person invades the victims mind and doesn't cause a sensory overload so much as an emotional breakdown. They use the power to manifest every painful and conflicting memory that they can and this overloads the opponents ability to handle the trauma of the severe emotion.
I know it isn't cannon but you see something similar in that dubbed over juggernaut B**** cartoon. When charles attacks him he sees his father and that kind of stuff. His father was a main point of his bad childhood which (if it was cannon) would support this thesis.
So i am just saying that it is possible that it has nothing to do with actual senses overloading but causeing a mental breakdown.
I disagree with this due to a few things.
Firstly, Juggernaut is vulnerable to Psylocke's psi dagger which isn't a telepathic manipulation attack that conjures up past memories. It's a manifestation of psions focussed into the shape of a blade.
Secondly, Juggernaut is vulnerable to psi bolts which are simply bolts of psychic energy (psions). They aren't controlled probes of the psyche, they're basically just energy blasts composed of mental energy.
Thirdly, telepathy is an extra sensory ability. It works directly with sensory input and the higher functions of the brain. You can cause the victim to go blind, become paralyzed, forcible cause them to percieve images that aren't there or react to stimuli that aren't actually present, access their memories, etc. It doesn't deal primarily with emotions (empathy), it deals with the functions of the brain as a whole.
Originally posted by illadelph12
Telepathy [b]is a sensory attack. Telepathy is an extra sensory ability. Juggernaut has been conclusively proven to be vulnerable to sensory manipulation, either via telepathy or sonics.That's my whole point.
It can't be disputed, it's canon fact. [/B]
Very well said.......
Originally posted by illadelph12
Telepathy [b]is a sensory attack. Telepathy is an extra sensory ability. Juggernaut has been conclusively proven to be vulnerable to sensory manipulation, either via telepathy or sonics.That's my whole point.
It can't be disputed, it's canon fact. [/B]
Originally posted by Soujaboy
My only problem is that Marvel has never stated that these things work on Juggernaut. The only attack that works on Juggernaut are tp based attacks. Tp does not include these attacks that you are bringing up.It's Magic, I cant explain it
Your thoughts on Telepathy are interesting.
On the Magneto TP idea I thought that Magneto didn't have TP in accordance to most Telepathic users. As in he can only control the nervous system thus he can't do what other TP users can such s read minds just mess the the electrical pattern which is in quite different in terms of actual TP. I would say that Telepathy as presented normally in Marvel is a not exactly a normal physical concept. As shown in the use of aspects like the Astral Plane or astral projections which seem to promote some kind of energy concept more along the lines of magic and cosmic power presented in Marvel. In fact most poeple with magical power and cosmic power also have TP like Silver Surfer and Dr. Strange.
Ill the arguement with Nimrod is mute in only that Marvel itself says if he had his shield up the attack wuold basically have no effect. The big matter here is that Cain as a character has been shown to not need the basic needs of a human. Air to breath, vocal chords to talk and muscles or organ systems to function. Since in this appearance it seems that Cain doesn't need these things then it is therefore a simple idea to see that effecting them would in turn have no effect if he doesn't use them. While the Nimrod event seems to take these notions and dismiss them. what this leads to is a contradiction of the same character in two canon sources. This normally means on these forums that the higher feat is the one that is to be used. Unless it is an example of SvFL in which a character goes completely beyond their capabilites but in this feat nothing of that sort takes place therefore it can be used.
Originally posted by newjak86
Your thoughts on Telepathy are interesting.
On the Magneto TP idea I thought that Magneto didn't have TP in accordance to most Telepathic users. As in he can only control the nervous system thus he can't do what other TP users can such s read minds just mess the the electrical pattern which is in quite different in terms of actual TP. I would say that Telepathy as presented normally in Marvel is a not exactly a normal physical concept. As shown in the use of aspects like the Astral Plane or astral projections which seem to promote some kind of energy concept more along the lines of magic and cosmic power presented in Marvel. In fact most poeple with magical power and cosmic power also have TP like Silver Surfer and Dr. Strange.Ill the arguement with Nimrod is mute in only that Marvel itself says if he had his shield up the attack wuold basically have no effect. The big matter here is that Cain as a character has been shown to not need the basic needs of a human. Air to breath, vocal chords to talk and muscles or organ systems to function. Since in this appearance it seems that Cain doesn't need these things then it is therefore a simple idea to see that effecting them would in turn have no effect if he doesn't use them. While the Nimrod event seems to take these notions and dismiss them. what this leads to is a contradiction of the same character in two canon sources. This normally means on these forums that the higher feat is the one that is to be used. Unless it is an example of SvFL in which a character goes completely beyond their capabilites but in this feat nothing of that sort takes place therefore it can be used.
I disagree.
The premise of Juggernaut has always been that that he is physically invulnerable, but certain attacks, be they magical or mental, effect him.
People are confusing the effects of sonics; sonics are not simply a concussive attack. The properties of sonics are multi-faceted.
There are soundwaves of such a magnitude that they can shatter matter and cause shockwaves for miles, and there's also the sensory stimuli of sonics that directly effect the brain and central nervous system of people in the effected area.
A thunderclap in the real world can both shake a city and cause people and objects to fall over, as well as deafen a person and cause sensory overload. Multi-faceted effects.
Comparing sonics to other energy attacks is a lost cause. All energy attacks have different properties.
