Originally posted by Nephthys
No, it says ''A technique that uses outward-directed meditation to smooth the tangles of hyperspace [b]and penetrate territories believed to be off-limits.' [/B]
Which says nothing about not controlling the ship through hyperspace, Neph. 😉
I'll give you one more shot before collecting your concession.
Me
Try harder, bro
Originally posted by Nephthys
As I said, you cannot physically pilot a ship while meditating.
The operative phrase indeed: As you said. The New Essential Guide to Vessels and Vehicles, on the other hand, says that Tiin controls his starfighter through the Force.
Originally posted by Nephthys
And one cannot perform meditation in combat, so he would not be afforded these abilities in his duel with Sidious.
The Essential Guide simply says he need only focus his thoughts to do this; focusing one's thoughts, which may very well be what The Jedi Path (an in-universe document, by the way, written by a score of Jedi) means by meditation.
PM me when you have a point, bro. Until then, I'll have to cut you off at 7 miserable attempts. You're going to need something much more than egregious bias and wishful thinking to make your case here. 😉
Originally posted by The_Tempest
The operative phrase indeed: As you said. The New Essential Guide to Vessels and Vehicles, on the other hand, says that Tiin controls his starfighter through the Force.
Thank you for conceding that. In that case, Sidious did not necessarily need to move faster than Tiin's reactions, only faster than he could physically move. 😉
Originally posted by The_Tempest
The Essential Guide simply says he need only focus his thoughts to do this; focusing one's thoughts, which may very well be what The Jedi Path (an in-universe document, by the way, written by a score of Jedi) means by meditation.
Irrelevent. It is clearly something he needs to activate. Unless you can prove that he was meditating before Sidious blitzed him, you cannot use it as an argument that Sidious outperformed lightspeed reflexes. 😉
Game, Set and Match I think.
Originally posted by Nephthys
Thank you for conceding that. In that case, Sidious did not necessarily need to move faster than Tiin's reactions, only faster than he could physically move. 😉
facepalm
...Obviously he uses the Force to control the ship, Neph. Doesn't mean his hands aren't on the controls. What's next? "lol sidious used the force to move at super speeds, but not his feet?"
Originally posted by The_Tempest
The second part is physically reacting to the information: he, not a computer, “control[s] his starfighter even while traveling through hyperspace”—travels that include taking “hyperspace shortcuts and flying dangerously close to mass shadows.”
I don't know HOW I could possibly get confused on this point.
Originally posted by Nephthys
I don't know [B]HOW I could possibly get confused on this point. [/B]
Neither do I.
Conjure what limited brain activity your lethargic, diabetes-riddled body can produce and remember your basic understanding of Star Wars combat: with few exceptions, Jedi are not physically blessed with superhuman abilities. Their talents derive from the Force. Bane is not able to move at blurring speeds without the Force.
Likewise, Tiin requires the Force to control his starship at hyperspeed (duh). But like Bane running, the presence of the Force does not indicate the absence of physical movement.
Ok, now I understand your point. What I believed you meant was that he was piloting it with the Force (telekinetically or otherwise), not his actual body. So my bad for misunderstanding you. Though you probably should have distinguished the two more clearly.
You're still wrong though. The quote from The Jedi Path and The Essential Guide to the Force notes that Tiin 'uses outward-directed meditation to smooth the tangles of hyperspace' and 'seek out information from the stars themselves'. Meaning that he does not need to dodge planets at lightspeed or anything, he knows where they are because of the technique and can chart a course that does not intersect with any planets, as one would with a standard nav-computer, which is clearly why all the quote mention nav-computers. Likewise he can use this to change course during hyperspace. A feat not requiring heightened reflexes, instead only needing heightened awareness of where to change course to.
Go ahead and apologize like the b1tch you are. uhuh
Again, that's not the case. Per the text, he flies through shortcuts and "dangerously close" to mass shadows, all flying at him at the speed of light. There is no evidence to the claim that the "information from the stars" gives him a fully detailed and complete map or path prior to departure. Even if so, he still has to react to these obstacles at lightspeed.
"Shades of Reason" is going to be very hard to top, but this looks great:
Why Jedi need reflexes at all? They have anticipation. Predict things before they even happen.
In fact FIsto's feat has nothing to do with reflexes. Similar feat was done by Kyp Durron. Before he was trained he could navigate through warm holes. It's just guidance from the Force, nothing to do with reflexes.
Originally posted by The_TempestA New Hope, A New Hope, A New Hope.
"Shades of Reason" is going to be very hard to top, but this looks great:
lol I just noticed the reference. Good Lord. facepalm
Originally posted by Arhael
Why Jedi need reflexes at all? They have anticipation. Predict things before they even happen.In fact FIsto's feat has nothing to do with reflexes. Similar feat was done by Kyp Durron. Before he was trained he could navigate through warm holes. It's just guidance from the Force, nothing to do with reflexes.
Because all the precognition in the world is useless if you're not fast enough to exploit it. Which is why Qui-Gon refers to "Jedi reflexes" in TPM to describe Anakin's abilities.
Originally posted by Arhael
Force users are fast enough even to react to blaster bolts. I believe blaster bolt to be faster than any known Force user.
I'm not saying precognition doesn't play an integral role, but the idea that they're just regular Joes who can see the future is consistently and utterly debunked by source material at all levels. Prior knowledge, physical perception, and fast muscle-response are all clearly intertwined.