Originally posted by olympian
"Now can you show me SS owning 4 Black adam or WW tier characters at the same time?"What 4 black adam level guys you have there?
Orion i grant you that, and he did well one on one against that Supes.
But who else? Steel? early Superboy? Pad Supergirl? MM?
So MM, Orion, Matrix Supergirl, GL, and WW don't count in that tier?
We aren't going to get in a silly debate... so can you find a scan of SS owning that many characters in their respective tiers at once?
Originally posted by R.O.T. Yahman
5 people ? Bollocks ! .... I'll agree that the general consensus from D.C. writers is that Jonn could beat him and Orion would probably stalemate him on a good day, but there is no one else there who could . I disagree with the idea that any Green lantern would destroy him (A fallucy that is of popular opppinion on this forum), because it really isn't the case. If Superman is not fighting Wonder woman in her own book, she's rarely ever holding her own and Flash and steel dont really stand a chance (Unless Flash is doing the Infinite mass thing.) 🙂
If they are both trying to defeat/kill/KO the other with bloodlust and not fighting like retards, Flash would kick Superman's ass. In my opinion (and really, I've seen nothing at all to contradict this thinking), Flash is easily the most powerful of the JLA.
Originally posted by Avalonofthewind
By their example...the Eradicator should whoop anyone who isn't Thanos in the Marvel universe since he is basically the same character on a higher level and with little morals.
I cant understand the general D.C ignorance that is prolific through out the threads. Do these people actually read any D.C. ? I mean if Marvel where consistently portrayed as more powerful, i would have no problem in backing them up, but this really is not the case.
And yet everyone else seems adamant about conveying how powerfully superior marvel characters are ? Why ?????????
I use to believe it was because everyone favoured marvel due to theirs superiorly written comics, but this isn't the case. The only marvel comics that have superior writing, are the individual street level books such as Moonknight, Dare Devil, Powers, Captain America and Spider man. On the whole (With the exception of Joss Wheeldons Astonishing x-men) the D.C. teams books are literally works of art compared to the marvel stuff. 🙂
Originally posted by Metalmanx
If they are both trying to defeat/kill/KO the other with bloodlust and not fighting like retards, Flash would kick Superman's ass. In my opinion (and really, I've seen nothing at all to contradict this thinking), Flash is easily the most powerful of the JLA.
Do you read any JLA ? If you dont i strongly reccomend the Mark Waid and Grant Morisson stuff beacuse its sublime. Since Grant Morisson started this JLA volume, Flash has NEVER, EVER been depicted as the most powerful JLA member. I'd love to know where you get all this 'Well written' information you keep referring to, beacuse on the whole, it doesn't get much better than Grant Morisson. 🙂
Originally posted by R.O.T. Yahman
I cant understand the general D.C ignorance that is prolific through out the threads. Do these people actually read any D.C. ? I mean if Marvel where consistently portrayed as more powerful, i would have no problem in backing them up, but this really is not the case.And yet everyone else seems adamant about conveying how powerfully superior marvel characters are ? Why ?????????
I use to believe it was because everyone favoured marvel due to theirs superiorly written comics, but this isn't the case. The only marvel comics that have superior writing, are the individual street level books such as Moonknight, Dare Devil, Powers, Captain America and Spider man. On the whole (With the exception of Joss Wheeldons Astonishing x-men) the D.C. teams books are literally works of art compared to the marvel stuff. 🙂
I agree with you 100%. If the Marvel character is indeed stronger...I don't think ANY of the "DC supporters" here would object to it. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem to happen the other way around... I wonder why that could be?
Originally posted by R.O.T. Yahman
Do you read any JLA ? If you dont i strongly reccomend the Mark Waid and Grant Morisson stuff beacuse its sublime. Since Grant Morisson started this JLA volume, Flash has NEVER, EVER been depicted as the most powerful JLA member. I'd love to know where you get all this 'Well written' information you keep referring to, beacuse on the whole, it doesn't get much better than Grant Morisson. 🙂
Actually, yes. I've read very much JLA. Clearly you're basing your opinion on the writings of Grant. Which is fine. You prefer Superman, it's understandable.
But really, when you realize what Flash can do and does in the comic...it's not really up for debate anymore. From the very get-go, Flash can steal his speed. There. Superman is a damn statue. From here, Flash IMPs him a few times. Maybe a few hundred times, just cuz he can.
If Flash wanted to, he could defeat the entire JLA. Not one of them is fast enough or has the right power-set to stop him.
Originally posted by MetalmanxThing about the JLA is. . . is in the right scenario, any of them could beat up the whole rest of the team. lol. A few of them have proved it.
Actually, yes. I've read very much JLA. Clearly you're basing your opinion on the writings of Grant. Which is fine. You prefer Superman, it's understandable.But really, when you realize what Flash can do and does in the comic...it's not really up for debate anymore. From the very get-go, Flash can steal his speed. There. Superman is a damn statue. From here, Flash IMPs him a few times. Maybe a few hundred times, just cuz he can.
If Flash wanted to, he could defeat the entire JLA. Not one of them is fast enough or has the right power-set to stop him.
But yeah, written to his highest feats alone, Flash is like the god of time and kinetic energy. If that's how you take him, but that's not how he's written.
It's just not fair to do that and consider Superman as "Heat vision, Fast, Flies, and is Durable/Strong"...
But written to his highest feats, Superman gets frozen, uses T-Vo instead and creates a virtual vertigoed environment, regains his speed after a moment, while Flash thinks he's in slow-motion running through one of those pipe levels in Sonic for Sega collecting the coints to get the gems, then him with the flurry of punches would bring Satan to his knees..even though one could do it.
See?
Pretty much any of them in full on force is rediculous.
Originally posted by Juntai
Thing about the JLA is. . . is in the right scenario, any of them could beat up the whole rest of the team. lol. A few of them have proved it.But yeah, written to his highest feats alone, Flash is like the god of time and kinetic energy. If that's how you take him, but that's not how he's written.
It's just not fair to do that and consider Superman as "Heat vision, Fast, Flies, and is Durable/Strong"...
But written to his highest feats, Superman gets frozen, uses T-Vo instead and creates a virtual vertigoed environment, regains his speed after a moment, while Flash thinks he's in slow-motion running through one of those pipe levels in Sonic for Sega collecting the coints to get the gems, then him with the flurry of punches would bring Satan to his knees..even though one could do it.
See?
Pretty much any of them in full on force is rediculous.
I see what you're saying. But, in my opinion, even with all of the JLA written to their very best potential (No CIS/PIS/Plot Devices), Flash is still the most powerful and could take out the entire JLA, Superman and Martian Manhunter included.
Originally posted by Avalonofthewind
I agree with you 100%. If the Marvel character is indeed stronger...I don't think ANY of the "DC supporters" here would object to it. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem to happen the other way around... I wonder why that could be?
This statement goes beyond the debate and takes a "I am better than thou!" stance. So, what is it, because you read more DC you are more enlightened than the rest of us? Your OPINIONS mean more?
"So MM, Orion, Matrix Supergirl, GL, and WW don't count in that tier?"
What you said an i quote:
"Now can you show me SS owning 4 Black adam or WW tier characters at the same time?"
Lets see. You make here a clear distinction between BA and WW level, even if they are in the same tier. Clear?
The one that managed to go toe to toe with Superman was Orion who can be classfied as such. But who else besides Kyle and him?
None.
- - -
"So is "Fully confidence" Gladiator, like that ultimate-fanboy-rendition-Gladiator that doesn't normally exist in comics?
The one that flies billions of times lightspeed and can punch Eternity in half type of crap?
[exaggeration, a bit.]"
So in a certain type of debates you "can use" a version of Superman thats above any other top tier physically and in bloodlust mode and that will certainly figth -always at the speed of ligth- or even faster.
And yet the other side cant?
THAT Superman doesnt show up in comics either Juntai. Whats up with that?
Originally posted by Cubicks
This statement goes beyond the debate and takes a "I am better than thou!" stance. So, what is it, because you read more DC you are more enlightened than the rest of us? Your OPINIONS mean more?
Last I remembered, asking a question about an observation didn't imply superiority. If you took it personal, that's your issue. Try reading it again.
Originally posted by olympian
"So MM, Orion, Matrix Supergirl, GL, and WW don't count in that tier?"That wasent what you said.
Your quote:
"Now can you show me SS owning 4 Black adam or WW tier characters at the same time?"
Glad you noticed. I worded it that way to see if you would simply post proof or dance around the issue.
So is there any proof of Surfer doing anything similar? No bs, no going around it. Simply post it if you have it.
Originally posted by Avalonofthewind
Last I remembered, asking a question about an observation didn't imply superiority. If you took it personal, that's your issue. Try reading it again.
I don't take it personal. And after reading it again I stick with what I said. You saying that DC fans have the ability to know when they are beat while Marvel fans are incapable of such a thing, in itself proves your better than thou attitude.
"what the hell is happening in this thread . . .?"
Superman in some scans above owned four BA level guys according to Avalon, and at the same time.
Even tho among the crowd who went against him, two at best are at that level, and one of them went toe to toe with Superman and wasent beaten.
Odd. Very Odd.
Originally posted by olympian
"what the hell is happening in this thread . . .?"Superman in some scans above owned four BA level guys according to Avalon, and at the same time.
Even tho among the crowd who went against him, two at best are at that level, and one of them went toe to toe with Superman and wasent beaten.
Odd. Very Odd.
😐