Mace and Depa vs. Exar and Ulic

Originally posted by Lightsnake
A. PRove it. He's called the first known user. DBLs don't require different forms to use them.

What? What do you mean double blades don't require a different form? If I'm understanding what you said correctly (probably not), say you were to use Djem So with a double blade - you'd have to incorporate the moves, and fit them into the blade's movements itself, so basically you are using a unique form because you are changing the moves, and integrate them so they can work in conjunction with the double blade.

Originally posted by Lightsnake
A. Insulting beats actually proving your points, doesn't it?

B. So, once Malak took the helm, then. The Sith and the Republic both say differently. And KOTOR II said nothing about it being the bloodiest war ever

C. Once again, insults beat facts.

A. No, when you argue with facts, I state a fact too. It makes you look foolish.

B. Nobody says any war was the bloodiest ever except the Vong invasion, quit putting words into my mouth. It left the republic in shambles, the jedi were all but extinct. Show me another war that did the exact same thing to both the Jedi and the republic. Oh wait, you can't.

C. No lightsnake, because you will look to constantly contradict facts and ask for specific proof from a specific person, because your argument is defeated, is why I call you an idiot.

Originally posted by Advent
What? What do you mean double blades don't require a different form? If I'm understanding what you said correctly (probably not), say you were to use Djem So with a double blade - you'd have to incorporate the moves, and fit them into the blade's movements itself, so basically you are using a unique form because you are changing the moves, and incorporating them so they can work in conjunction with the double blade.

Omg is common sense in here? Sweet

Hardly. It's just the same manner of fighting, but a different weapon...it's confirmed Maul was a Juyo user, and he used a DBL. Every DBL would be using a unique style if that was the case...kinda takes away from the uniqueness

Originally posted by Lightsnake
Hardly. It's just the same manner of fighting, but a different weapon...it's confirmed Maul was a Juyo user, and he used a DBL. Every DBL would be using a unique style if that was the case...kinda takes away from the uniqueness

No, every DBL user would not be using a unique style, they would be using a unique style of a single saber form, that's all. Kun didn't have the same saber that everyone else did, it died with him. He created it, he made the power of the crystals travel to both sides of the hilts and all, his saber was shorter than all the others, he could wield it with 1 hand, his technique was unique and lost.

Once again, by this logic, everyone from Yoda to Dooku is using a different style because of hilt style and size..
And no, nothing shows what style he used. Nothing says his weapon was unique, just that he was the earliest known user. And earliest known user implies there were others.
And we see him wield it with one hand once. Twice more we see him use two when he strikes-when he kills Vodo and when he attacks Ood...when he injures Vodo, he uses one hand and when he twirls it, he uses one hand.

The size of a blade's hilt should make no different to what form someone uses. Dooku uses a 'unique' saber one handed...Shaak ti uses two hands with a standard size...and she's a Makashi user too

Originally posted by Lightsnake
Once again, by this logic, everyone from Yoda to Dooku is using a different style because of hilt style and size..
And no, nothing shows what style he used. Nothing says his weapon was unique, just that he was the earliest known user. And earliest known user implies there were others.
And we see him wield it with one hand once. Twice more we see him use two when he strikes-when he kills Vodo and when he attacks Ood...when he injures Vodo, he uses one hand and when he twirls it, he uses one hand.

The size of a blade's hilt should make no different to what form someone uses. Dooku uses a 'unique' saber one handed...Shaak ti uses two hands with a standard size...and she's a Makashi user too

No lightsnake, that is YOUR logic, nobody else's. There are 7 forms of lightsaber combat, and those forms were designed long before double lightsabers came about, so when one is used, it becomes a unique form in its own. And yes, everything shows his weapon was unique, and his style was unique. And no, it is stated that he created the weapon, and was the FIRST to use it, so your arguing against Nai, me, and facts.
And his hilt was small, so that would make all the difference in the world considering its a lot easier for him to wield it with 1 hand, while the rest of the double bladed sabers are wielded with 2 hands. So no, you're wrong again.

Or it simply means the form is incoporated into the new weapon, that simple.

And once again, we see Kun use two hands on his weapon several times, do you keep ignoring that? Where does it say he created the saber? It said earliest known. Nothing has ever said definitively he created the weapon himself.
And Dooku's hilt was curved and he used it one handed. Unique weapon, unique way of wielding it, big deal

Originally posted by Lightsnake
Or it simply means the form is incoporated into the new weapon, that simple.

And once again, we see Kun use two hands on his weapon several times, do you keep ignoring that? Where does it say he created the saber? It said earliest known. Nothing has ever said definitively he created the weapon himself.
And Dooku's hilt was curved and he used it one handed. Unique weapon, unique way of wielding it, big deal

Lightsnake it's cute how you switch your arguments from "prove it was his weapon" to "well prove he used a different form in his unique weapon". Really, your debating skills make me giggle.

And once again, Kun used both 2 hands and 1 hand because the hilt was short. The other double bladed saber holders all used 2 hands because the hilt was 2 sabers combined, and the beams were larger than they were, so you're wrong yet again.. And yes, he created the weapon, so quiet.

but a different weapon...it's confirmed Maul was a Juyo user,[/b]

It's also confirmed Maul's style is unique, he uses Teräs Käsi in his moves. And if you'll notice, Maul can't do the same attacks, he doesn't move the same way, he doesn't even dodge the same way when his blade is broken in half by Obi-Wan, and when he attacks Qui-Gon on Tatooine.

It said earliest known. Nothing has ever said definitively he created the weapon himself.

Where do you think he got it? Digging for buried treasure? Seriously, we know Exar Kun is not a pirate, he created the weapon.

"Do you like the modifications I made to my lightsaber, master?"

Exar's own testimony, and common sense say he created it himself. The "new modification" was the other blade.

Thank you Sama, perhaps you should take over, I get tired of arguing with ignorance.

It says he modified his saber, so? Of course he modified it himself, I'm questioning if he was the first to do so, even if he's the earliest known. A modification is not a new invention.

maul's style is Juyo, it's never said to be unique. By this logic, Dooku's style is unique...hell, considering how diverse sabers are, all styles are unique.

Take over? Hell no! It's Saturday night, baby! Ms. Advent needs to go clubbing.

This is too easy and I'm nursing a hangover, so somebody needs to argue with stupidity.

Intimidation is a sure sign of immaturity. So's boasting and Ad hominem.

I'm asking him to prove something, Sama...perhaps you can? I want a single source, that's it

Originally posted by Lightsnake
Intimidation is a sure sign of immaturity. So's boasting and Ad hominem.

I'm asking him to prove something, Sama...perhaps you can? I want a single source, that's it

I'm not boasting, I'm shocked at how ridiculous you are. You've been on this forum for god knows how long and yet anytime you have no argument, you tend to try and play stupid, and fail.

You keep saying that and never back up your own argument definitively.

I'm sick of you putting people down when you argue against them. It's tiresome.

Originally posted by Lightsnake
It says he modified his saber, so? Of course he modified it himself, I'm questioning if he was the first to do so, even if he's the earliest known. A modification is not a new invention.

The modification he made was the new invention. There's absolutely zilch to support that there was another double-bladed user. You would have to prove your assertion, what evidence to you have to suggest that there was another?

maul's style is Juyo, it's never said to be unique.

Actually it is, sorry. Maul uses Teräs Käsi in his moves, do all Juyo users practice TK? No, they don't. And even so, he uses a double blade. So, if he integrates Teräs Käsi into his lightsaber form, it's unique given that Teräs Käsi is a completely different form itself, though a melee form.

This was confirmed by the movie firstly, and I believe in Sabotuer (maybe Shadow Hunter).

By this logic, Dooku's style is unique...hell, considering how diverse sabers are, all styles are unique.

No, we're not talking about the saber itself. Dooku's style isn't affecting by his curved hilt, how does he need to incorporate Makashi's moves to use it? He doesn't, he uses the same strikes as any other user would, therefore not unique. Unique hilt, not unique style.

And the difference between Exar Kun and the example you have (Dooku), is that Exar Kun had to first actually integrate lightsaber moves, so he didn't get himself killed. If you use an overhand strike with Djem So using a single saber, it will not be the same as using an overhand strike with Djem So using a double blade, because of the other factors (the second blade, the length, etc.).

When using a double blade you have to take into consideration the other blade, notice how Darth Maul doesn't carry his blade the same way, doesn't dodge the same way, and cannot attack the same way when his saber is broken.

And anyways, can we all be a *bit* more civil, the constant "idiot", "this guy's a joke", "f*ck off", etc. is out of line, and let's just. . . uh, all be friendly or at least civilized.

I would try being nice if lightsnake made a conscious effort at being smarter, or at least offer logical arguments.

How do we know that, Sama? Does anything say he invented the DBL? A modification isn't an invention and despite that he's the first to be seen using it...

Maul's form is still Juyo, it doesn't make it unique. Where's it stated his form is unique? We know he's a Tera Kasi user...And Shadow Hunter didn't mention his saber form. Like I said, by this logic, everything is unique. Obi-wan's style, Kit Fisto's, Palpatine's, Dooku's..unique hilts and weapons.

It doesn't matter what weapon you use, every saber is unique to a degree. Yoda had to integrate a lot just to fight and as Qui-Gon proved, Ataru need not always involve flips and twirls