Beyonder vs The Presence, Yahweh, TOAA.

Originally posted by Juntai
True in a sense, however, the real universe, at least in DC, is part of the DCOmniverse[while existing outside of the Multiverse/Universe norm].

Mr Mxyzptlk has popped into the 'real world' even so recently as a handful of issues before Crisis [the real world being depicted by actual pictures of the associates at the office] and Mxy complained to the editor that they weren't doing a great job with the comic, and the Editor promptly had it fixed. Oh- and it appeared Mxy also had his full range of powers in the real world, as his teleportations and flying among other powers still worked. 🙂

Even though Mr. Mxyzptlk have shown some great non-canon feats.
Classic Molecule man and classic Beyonder have made greater statements and feats.
Molecule man recreated the Multi-verse with a finger...
And while doing that he talked to the Beyonder...
No strugle there at all.

When someone says: God; in a comicbook forum, you should connect it to Thanos w/ THOTU or TGEB. -- Because that is what God is in Marvel and DC. -- At least powerwise.

Originally posted by Juntai
But its been made quite clear in this thread the others before that by TOAA, we were talking about Marvel's Supreme Being. We use "TOAA" because it's the most generally accepted.

Or do you mean that there is a being out there that (in the comics) that all of Marvel, all of the writers give their power, that they serve some being in the comics?

Thats just wierd..

Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
Yes, but your missing the point.
Writer's arent a fictional, even they sometimes try to be one.
They not really a part of the story.

Even though Mr. Mxyzptlk have shown some great non-canon feats.
Classic Molecule man and classic Beyonder have made greater statements and feats.
Molecule man recreated the Multi-verse with a finger...
And while doing that he talked to the Beyonder...
No strugle there at all.

When someone says: God; in a comicbook forum, you should connect it to Thanos w/ THOTU or TGEB. -- Because that is what God is in Marvel and DC. -- At least powerwise.

Originally posted by Juntai
That's your interpretation. You're welcome to it, however wrong it may be.

The beyonder CANNOT defeat DC's the Presence. All this other stuff is speculation and philosophical Dialogue, best left to another forum. The Minute the Beyonder enters the DC mega verse, The Presence tells Mxy that some new imp is trying to mess with his play ground and it's on. And after Mxy gets thru wearing the beyonder out, The ALE comes and takes his turn a whooping THe beyonder's ass. Then The Spectre fully powered by the Presence kicks the beyonder out of the DC main universe into the wildstorm universe where he is demoted to a member of the wildcats as voodoo's understudy.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
The beyonder CANNOT defeat DC's the Presence. All this other stuff is speculation and philosophical Dialogue, best left to another forum. The Minute the Beyonder enters the DC mega verse, The Presence tells Mxy that some new imp is trying to mess with his play ground and it's on. And after Mxy gets thru wearing the beyonder out, The ALE comes and takes his turn a whooping THe beyonder's ass. Then The Spectre fully powered by the Presence kicks the beyonder out of the DC main universe into the wildstorm universe where he is demoted to a member of the wildcats as voodoo's understudy.

Very true he can not defeat Yahweh/The Presence. The Beyonder didn't know everything. The Presence does know everything. The Beyonder had to trick MU Death into killing herself something The Presence wouldn't need to trick the DC Death into doing he could just blink her out of existance. Marvels God would also win.

Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
Your "editor in chef" does not have the power to create.

Funny how he's created the character Catiana and Joe Quesada has been centrally involved in the creation of three successful imprints:

Marvel Knights, aimed at older readers (this was before his tenure as editor-in-chief)
MAX, aimed at adult readers, with Brian Michael Bendis
Ultimate, aimed at new readers, with Brian Michael Bendis, and Mark Millar

Anyway this fight has been done. Pre-retcon Beyonder versus TOAA results in the retconned Beyonder.

So is TOAA a fictional character or a writer?
-- I seriously start to wonder who's sichzo here...

Originally posted by kevdude
Very true he can not defeat Yahweh/The Presence. The Beyonder didn't know everything. The Presence does know everything. The Beyonder had to trick MU Death into killing herself something The Presence wouldn't need to trick the DC Death into doing he could just blink her out of existance. Marvels God would also win.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
The beyonder CANNOT defeat DC's the Presence. All this other stuff is speculation and philosophical Dialogue, best left to another forum. The Minute the Beyonder enters the DC mega verse, The Presence tells Mxy that some new imp is trying to mess with his play ground and it's on. And after Mxy gets thru wearing the beyonder out, The ALE comes and takes his turn a whooping THe beyonder's ass. Then The Spectre fully powered by the Presence kicks the beyonder out of the DC main universe into the wildstorm universe where he is demoted to a member of the wildcats as voodoo's understudy.

Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
So is TOAA a fictional character or a writer?
-- I seriously start to wonder who's sichzo here...

But until you stop trying to impose a double standard I can't answer.

And besides its my beleif that since TOAA has never shown up in the comics, TOAA refers to whoever controls what goes on in the Marvel universe. And if we're talking aobut one person it's gotta be the person who calls the shots within the company.

This doesn't change the fact that Beyonder has already lost this fight, and that's why retconned beyonder even exists and as you said before the pre-retconned doesn't exist anymore.

Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
Yeah... well this isnt the place for speculation...

Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
Besides Mr. Mxyzptlk
(and please spell his name correct, you just look ignorant if you type Myx, the least you could do is spell the tree first letters right: Mxy)
Anyhow mr. mxyzptlk would have no chanse in hell of beating the Beyonder not even at his non canon max - from the world funniest.
Anti-Life Equalation superior to the Beyonder, you underastimate this guy. and I think you know it. -- just to proud to admit it.

Originally posted by Creshosk
As soon as you make up your mind I'll let you know.

But until you stop trying to impose a double standard I can't answer.

And besides its my beleif that since TOAA has never shown up in the comics, TOAA refers to whoever controls what goes on in the Marvel universe. And if we're talking aobut one person it's gotta be the person who calls the shots within the company.

This doesn't change the fact that Beyonder has already lost this fight, and that's why retconned beyonder even exists and as you said before the pre-retconned doesn't exist anymore.

As the previous example: the writers of Marvel can retcon TOAA.
This quote is all that needs: The one above all wasent really a being superior to the Living Tribunal.
-- Writers in our world can do that. - not impossible

Originally posted by Creshosk
Yes it is. Thjat's exactly what this place is for.

And you over estimate him... Funny that.

-edit-

Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
Knowdelge is overestiamted... When it comes to a fight the only matter is power.
Knowledge keeps you away from battles you cannot win.
And the feats of the Great Evil Beast have been kinda lame, I wouldent state him over the Living Tribunal...

Yes but when your debating on being's such as these, their level of omniscience is an indication of their omnipotence.

If we go by feats to determine the outcome of this battle, the Beyonders biggest feat is destroying Multi-Death. Thanos with the power of TOAA, was able to destroy The Living Tribunal, who pulls rank on Multi-Death, and is a bigger feat. And before you say that all the abstracts including The Living Tribunal were afraid of the Beyonder, there exist no proof that the Tribunal was afraid of him. He doesn't say a word, Eternity pleads, but not the Tribunal. The only time he speaks is after Multi-Death is gone and he says "Thus passeth the old way!". Now the Tribunal is undoubtedly more powerful than Eternity, and if he were that set against the passing of Multi-Death, he would have been the speaker, because his word carries the most weight among the abstracts. It's more likely that he was just there as an observer because of the scope of the event. Now, everyone acts like The Beyonder was more powerful than Thanos with TOAA's power because no one tried to fight with the Beyonder, while everybody attacked Thanos. In my mind that means that Thanos was more powerful, because everybody risked oblivion to wrest the power from Thanos. You see, they didn't like the thought of Multi-Deaths passing, but the thought of Thanos with that much power had to be stopped at any cost, even if EVERYTHING was destroyed in the process.

One last thing, on the last panel of the issue where the Beyonder destroy's Death, the Beyonder says "For a guy who's still basically omnipotent, I'm exhausted!". Well exhaustion is not a factor with an endless energy supply. Even a person with the power gem never suffers from exhaustion. So he obviously didn't have an Infinite amount of energy. As I stated before, Infinity is a constant. It can not be subtracted from, added to, multiplied, or divided, because the answer is ALWAYS the same.

Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
Maybe I do overestimate him... Or maybe it's you who overestimate the fictional character named as The one above all.

(I say that its not a name that was ever given to the entity that you refer to, inthe comics and merely a description. and later the name was given to him by fans)

Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
It never said to have any connections to God at all.

Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
Jack Kirby called himself God, not The one above all.

Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
The one above all is a fictional character above the Living Tribunal and gods. -- Let's call the writer's the writers.

Sijnce you know, they'ed be the ones to decide what does and does not happen in Marvel.

Originally posted by Thanos_THOTU
Well so TOAA is not a fictional character, it isnt really a being that exists in the comics. It exist in our world. -- right?

As the previous example: the writers of Marvel can retcon TOAA.
This quote is all that needs: The one above all wasent really a being superior to the Living Tribunal.
-- Writers in our world can do that. - not impossible

Words and phrases you need to look up:
Easter Egg
Avatar

Originally posted by darthgoober
Yes but when your debating on being's such as these, their level of omniscience is an indication of their omnipotence.

If we go by feats to determine the outcome of this battle, the Beyonders biggest feat is destroying Multi-Death. Thanos with the power of TOAA, was able to destroy The Living Tribunal, who pulls rank on Multi-Death, and is a bigger feat. And before you say that all the abstracts including The Living Tribunal were afraid of the Beyonder, there exist no proof that the Tribunal was afraid of him. He doesn't say a word, Eternity pleads, but not the Tribunal. The only time he speaks is after Multi-Death is gone and he says "Thus passeth the old way!". Now the Tribunal is undoubtedly more powerful than Eternity, and if he were that set against the passing of Multi-Death, he would have been the speaker, because his word carries the most weight among the abstracts. It's more likely that he was just there as an observer because of the scope of the event. Now, everyone acts like The Beyonder was more powerful than Thanos with TOAA's power because no one tried to fight with the Beyonder, while everybody attacked Thanos. In my mind that means that Thanos was more powerful, because everybody risked oblivion to wrest the power from Thanos. You see, they didn't like the thought of Multi-Deaths passing, but the thought of Thanos with that much power had to be stopped at any cost, even if EVERYTHING was destroyed in the process.

One last thing, on the last panel of the issue where the Beyonder destroy's Death, the Beyonder says "For a guy who's still basically omnipotent, I'm exhausted!". Well exhaustion is not a factor with an endless energy supply. Even a person with the power gem never suffers from exhaustion. So he obviously didn't have an Infinite amount of energy. As I stated before, Infinity is a constant. It can not be subtracted from, added to, multiplied, or divided, because the answer is ALWAYS the same.

Calling yourself omnipotent does not mean that its true. I could call myself the queen mother... and appearently be just as accurate as the Beyonder was...

Originally posted by darthgoober
Yes but when your debating on being's such as these, their level of omniscience is an indication of their omnipotence.

If we go by feats to determine the outcome of this battle, the Beyonders biggest feat is destroying Multi-Death. Thanos with the power of TOAA, was able to destroy The Living Tribunal, who pulls rank on Multi-Death, and is a bigger feat. And before you say that all the abstracts including The Living Tribunal were afraid of the Beyonder, there exist no proof that the Tribunal was afraid of him. He doesn't say a word, Eternity pleads, but not the Tribunal. The only time he speaks is after Multi-Death is gone and he says "Thus passeth the old way!". Now the Tribunal is undoubtedly more powerful than Eternity, and if he were that set against the passing of Multi-Death, he would have been the speaker, because his word carries the most weight among the abstracts. It's more likely that he was just there as an observer because of the scope of the event. Now, everyone acts like The Beyonder was more powerful than Thanos with TOAA's power because no one tried to fight with the Beyonder, while everybody attacked Thanos. In my mind that means that Thanos was more powerful, because everybody risked oblivion to wrest the power from Thanos. You see, they didn't like the thought of Multi-Deaths passing, but the thought of Thanos with that much power had to be stopped at any cost, even if EVERYTHING was destroyed in the process.

One last thing, on the last panel of the issue where the Beyonder destroy's Death, the Beyonder says "For a guy who's still basically omnipotent, I'm exhausted!". Well exhaustion is not a factor with an endless energy supply. Even a person with the power gem never suffers from exhaustion. So he obviously didn't have an Infinite amount of energy. As I stated before, Infinity is a constant. It can not be subtracted from, added to, multiplied, or divided, because the answer is ALWAYS the same.