Originally posted by Soleran
Everyone deserves a chance or two by you , me and the gov't. The folks that sit down and don't change don't deserve the help over and over again.
again: unskilled laborers are NEEDED. its not a problem or an unfortunate condition which they should change. they are NECESSARY. wtf is your malfunction?
Originally posted by SoleranA nation's children are its future.
Even if I don't assume overtime so far your total assumption is that everyone for some reason deserves the right to a 40 hour work week with a level of pay that should give them a level of comfort you feel is fair (which you never said what level of comfort is fair.) That if someone wants to have kids or should they have kids then all of a sudden everyone around them should reconfigure what is "fair" since now they have another mouth to feed, etc. etc. etc. You have a great idea of what you feel is fair and right and good and an overzealous attitiude that belies your message.
Originally posted by PVS
again: unskilled laborers are NEEDED. its not a problem or an unfortunate condition which they should change. they are NECESSARY. wtf is your malfunction?
I keep asking myself what's your problem. You came up with a number a value of 17k-20k now I'm assuming thats in net take home pay since you don't like to figure out gross incomes(seeing as thats how EVERY employer figures pay, you're onto something here, huh.)
So you quantified the minimum pay.....................so I'm also assuming if this pay is met then govt subsidizing stops altogether.
What is the quality of life that this income now gives them, obviously you have some idea if you can come up with a figure. Is it Cable TV, Car, 3 bedroom home, etc etc what makes up the value for your dollar amount?
Originally posted by Soleran
I keep asking myself what's your problem. You came up with a number a value of 17k-20k now I'm assuming thats in net take home pay since you don't like to figure out gross incomes(seeing as thats how EVERY employer figures pay, you're onto something here, huh.)So you quantified the minimum pay.....................so I'm also assuming if this pay is met then govt subsidizing stops altogether.
WTF??? you asked me for my opinion on a fair figure, so i gave you one....now you want to manipulate the debate, switch topics when you're cornered, and go on to suggest that this arbitrary figure is the basis of my argument. :edit: not worth it
Originally posted by Soleran
What is the quality of life that this income now gives them, obviously you have some idea if you can come up with a figure. Is it Cable TV, Car, 3 bedroom home, etc etc what makes up the value for your dollar amount?
housing, food, clothing, medical insurance, transportation, basic essentials.
people who have to worry about how to meet these demands, unlike your lawn mowing friend, often times have to settle for minimum wage. you want me to break it all down with the hope that we can run off on a tangent and divert attention from the fact that you have an eletist mentality and feel that unskilled laborers should be penalized for being who they are, and should want to change as if they are burdens on our economy when in fact they are necessary to it.
Originally posted by PVS
WTF??? you asked me for my opinion on a fair figure, so i gave you one....now you want to manipulate the debate, switch topics when you're cornered, and go on to suggest that this arbitrary figure is the basis of my argument. :edit: not worth it
I realize once again you're having a hard time with this PVS but I'll do this again for you. You gave me a number of 17-20k as a minimum income to live with net. I produced some numbers awhile back and you pounced on me for showing gross income rather then net (like I can really figure everyone's tax deductions obviously you can though.) So now I am asking for you to qualify what that means more specific to the numbers you threw up there, see this would happen if you sat down with someone and had to justify that income.
I do see some merit to raising the income to that level if gov't intervention is switched off, I see absolutely little to no value if that income is achieved and govt funding/taxing didn't change.
Are you following me now, this isn't a bait and switch its having you explain/justify what you are telling me should be right.
housing (own or rent?), food(home made or packaged/order out?), clothing(pretty simple here), medical insurance(sure the poor already get insurance that work minimum wage but lets up wages and give them back to the individuals), transportation(pretty simple), basic essentials(wtf is this, I thought the things listed above were basic essentials!?).
people who have to worry about how to meet these demands, unlike your lawn mowing friend, often times have to settle for minimum wage.
Lets get one thing clear though, sometimes you cannot choose what life gives you but it's very clear you can choose on how you handle it and what you do to change it. Which is why I am for a mix of capitalism and some socialism.
you want me to break it all down with the hope that we can run off on a tangent and divert attention from the fact that you have an eletist mentality and feel that unskilled laborers should be penalized for being who they are, and should want to change as if they are burdens on our economy when in fact they are necessary to it.
No, as a matter of fact I am not attempting to divert any focus from your real conversation here. What I am saying is that you show me some accountability for what you say by backing up your numbers with something other then because, yeah, uh huh, you elitist, following me?
Originally posted by Soleran
I realize once again you're having a hard time with this PVS but I'll do this again for you. You gave me a number of 17-20k as a minimum income to live with net. I produced some numbers awhile back and you pounced on me for showing gross income rather then net (like I can really figure everyone's tax deductions obviously you can though.) So now I am asking for you to qualify what that means more specific to the numbers you threw up there, see this would happen if you sat down with someone and had to justify that income.I do see some merit to raising the income to that level if gov't intervention is switched off, I see absolutely little to no value if that income is achieved and govt funding/taxing didn't change.
Are you following me now, this isn't a bait and switch its having you explain/justify what you are telling me should be right..
you asked for a figure, i gave you one off the top of my head. now you want to run with it to distract from the point. this is a sad tactic and if it were not such an obvious reference i would post it in another thread regarding idiotic tactics....so i wont. no, i will NOT break down figures with you, and factor in bus fare and rent along with the kid's summer wardrobe for the next 50 pages, just so youu dont have to look like an elitist freak. sorry, not playing along.
Originally posted by Soleran
Lets get one thing clear though, sometimes you cannot choose what life gives you but it's very clear you can choose on how you handle it and what you do to change it.
way to ignore the point. watch this: THEY DONT HAVE TO "CHANGE IT"> THEY'RE WORK IS IMPERITAVE FOR THE SURVIVAL OF OUR ECONOMY.
and in your next post, in which you will predictably and pathetically ignore this point, question just what you are trying to accomplish here.
Originally posted by Soleran
No, as a matter of fact I am not attempting to divert any focus from your real conversation here.
😂 im sorry....i normally dont reply with smilies...but what comedy!
ok, let me try: im not attempting to insult you, idiot.
Originally posted by Soleran
What I am saying is that you show me some accountability for what you say by backing up your numbers with something other then because, yeah, uh huh, you elitist, following me?
ok kids, in the future of discussing minimum wage, you may be called out on your own implication that unskilled workers do not deserve a living on the grounds that they are a burden to society, and should desire to be 'better', when in fact their work is a necessity for our society and our economy.
when it is pointed out that you are dead wrong, to win the thread, ask your opponent for a general figure of what they think would be fair. when the opponent throws out a quick number, turn that into the topic and ignore how you painted yourself in a corner. when confronted with your obvious tactic, just say your not doing it in the same post in which you do it. your opponent will then fall over laughing and hopefully become concussed and unable to retort.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
I thought Jesus said to watch over every sheep, not just a select few....
I'm not going to bother replying to the rest of that mish-mash of crap you wrote.
(By the way, Bush wants to lower taxes and is ANTI-JESUS: "Give to Caesar what is Caesar's," Jesus says. Therefore, lowering taxes is evil.)
Originally posted by PVS
i see.....yeah, you're right......i guess i took ran with a thought and made the response inapropriate to your own post.........well lets just paint over it with another topic and look away. do you enjoy baseball bardock?
I think i would if I'd look into it, it seems enjoyable, besides it's US Americaness. Funnily enough, I am at the moment watching a Cold Case episode about a Black Baseball Player that was killed in the 60s (or something) after a game...seems to be a good episode. The racism history of your country is despicable, by the way.