Yup. It is.
Just is bad on defense and Enviorment plays a big part in its execution.
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Soresu
And here's another. It isen't "Official", but its facts are canon nonetheless.
http://lightsaberguide.darkjedibrotherhood.com/LightsaberGuide.pdf
Originally posted by Master_Starbuck
No, you are wrong. A few other Jedi, like Shaak Ti, who arguably died after Dooku.
The other guy was right, since Cin was a Niman Master, he knows Makashi.
😄
I disagree. Because Cin knows Niman doesnt mean he knows how to use Makashi. Niman is the diplomats form, and it uses small aspects of all the forms to create one (imo) mediocre form. Niman is NOT Makashi, in any way shape or form. And is there any proof that says Shaak Ti knows Makashi? Im not saying you are wrong but I was under the impression that the Count was the only practicioner.
Also you say that Dooku must know Shien as well, which is why he lived through Geonosis. Thats a load of bullsh*t. While Dooku was out in the open there were only jedi opposing him. Nobody with blasters were shooting at him (bar possibly Padme). He also had Jango standing there watching his back. As soon as the clones arrived Dooku fled to his secret hangar. So no, Dooku does not know Shien. If he did he would have stood a better chance against the raw power of Anakin in ROTS.
Originally posted by Rampant ox
I disagree. Because Cin knows Niman doesnt mean he knows how to use Makashi. Niman is the diplomats form, and it uses small aspects of all the forms to create one (imo) mediocre form. Niman is NOT Makashi, in any way shape or form. And is there any proof that says Shaak Ti knows Makashi? Im not saying you are wrong but I was under the impression that the Count was the only practicioner.Also you say that Dooku must know Shien as well, which is why he lived through Geonosis. Thats a load of bullsh*t. While Dooku was out in the open there were only jedi opposing him. Nobody with blasters were shooting at him (bar possibly Padme). He also had Jango standing there watching his back. As soon as the clones arrived Dooku fled to his secret hangar. So no, Dooku does not know Shien. If he did he would have stood a better chance against the raw power of Anakin in ROTS.
Niman gives you a Moderate Skill level in every form, possibly Master Level in a few, he knew Makashi, but was no Master of it. Niman isn't Mediocre, it takes the main things from each form, and turns it into a Balanced, no weakness, form. Shaak Ti doubtfully uses Makashi, all Makashi using Jedi died at the arena, but the Count definately wasn't the only Practioner, and during the Clone Wars several Jedi learned Makashi(I think) to fight the Dark Jedi, and even Dooku
Why does he need to know Shien? Who said this? Dooku didn't need Shien at all, he only knew Makashi and Ataru(I think, didn't he teach it to Qui-Gon?) as far as we know
Originally posted by Darth Kreiger
Niman gives you a Moderate Skill level in every form,
Incorrect. Niman is not a mixture of every form. It does not have ties to Form VII nor Form II.
" In practice, Form VI is a combination of Forms I, III, IV, and V."
-- Star Wars Insider, Issue 62.
As you can see it only takes from Shii-Cho, Soresu, Ataru, and Djem So.
Niman isn't Mediocre, it takes the main things from each form, and turns it into a Balanced, no weakness, form.
Incorrect. Niman isn't a "balanced" form. It has weaknesses in that it's suited for diplomats, hence "diplomat's Form". It's assessed as that because it is "less intensive in its demands than the other disciplines, allowing Jedi to spend more time developing their skills in perception, political strategy, and negotiation." As you can see, that alone is a weakness in saber combat. It allows more focus on political aspects rather than actual combat. And full masters of other forms deem Niman to be "insufficiently demanding" as well.
So, do tell, how is that not a weakness, and how is it balanced? And again, Niman only takes from four forms.
Originally posted by Quinlan_Vos
Yeah, but Jedi don't neccesarily feel the meaning of tiredness as we do. Dooku is better than Maul, but the way he was toying with Anakin and Obi-Wan, Maul should be able to fight against that. And I don't think AOTC Obi-Wan is greater than Maul, probably equal to. And like Exanda said, the fights are for the audience's enjoyment. If there wasn't the pit I honestly don't know what would have happened. If there wasn't the ledge, Obi-Wan would have died.Anyway, I believe Maul wins this. He has massacred Black Sun thugs, Jedi Masters including Anoon Bondara, resisted Force Lightning and killed his victim, slew Qui-Gon even though Qui-Gon revitalized himself.
Darth Maul wins.
I think they do. Dooku got really tired when Anakin started bashing his lightsaber against him, according to the ROTS Novelization. At first, it's true, Dooku was toying with them, but then he realized how much a threat they were, so decided to end the fight as quickly as possibly. AOTC Obi-Wan is, without a doubt, much better than TPM Kenobi. 10 extra years of experiance? That's very true, without the pit, Obi-Wan would have died.
Taking out the Black Sun is no small accomplishment, but his skills with the Force and his martial arts prowess helped him remove them. However, these things are far more effective against multiple opponents rather than a single opponent, such as, say that Anoon Bondara. He was, like Cin, a great lightsaber duelist, but who of the two was truly better? Qui-Gon was also powerful, but that "revitalization" counted for nothing when the lack of space restricted his use of Ataru.
Taking out the Black Sun is no small accomplishment, but his skills with the Force and his martial arts prowess helped him remove them. However, these things are far more effective against multiple opponents rather than a single opponent, such as, say that Anoon Bondara. He was, like Cin, a great lightsaber duelist, but who of the two was truly better? Qui-Gon was also powerful, but that "revitalization" counted for nothing when the lack of space restricted his use of Ataru.
Well Qui-Gon had the chance to jump to the other side of the hole and around the room if he was an Ataru user. But Maul's Juyo just weared him down and he was too tired to perform such moves.
Maul has infiltrated Black Sun and killed their leader Alexi Garyn, was incredibly acrobatic and a master of Teras Kasi (martial arts), slew Anoon Bondara, killed the Nightsister Mighella [and resisted Force Lightning], slew maverick Jedi Qui-Gon Jinn and defeated Obi-Wan Kenobi.
Cin Drallig was the battlemaster of the Jedi order, skilled in several forms, was known as the Troll, said to be capable to kill Grievous (via through Soresu), and was slain by Anakin one-handed.
I think Maul seems to have a better track record. I don't see any proof why Drallig can beat Maul. Because like I said before ten times, I don't think Cin Drallig can beat Qui-Gon Jinn and Obi-Wan Kenobi.
Originally posted by Quinlan_Vos
Well Qui-Gon had the chance to jump to the other side of the hole and around the room if he was an Ataru user. But Maul's Juyo just weared him down and he was too tired to perform such moves.Maul has infiltrated Black Sun and killed their leader Alexi Garyn, was incredibly acrobatic and a master of Teras Kasi (martial arts), slew Anoon Bondara, killed the Nightsister Mighella [and resisted Force Lightning], slew maverick Jedi Qui-Gon Jinn and defeated Obi-Wan Kenobi.
Cin Drallig was the battlemaster of the Jedi order, skilled in several forms, was known as the Troll, said to be capable to kill Grievous (via through Soresu), and was slain by Anakin one-handed.
I think Maul seems to have a better track record. I don't see any proof why Drallig can beat Maul. Because like I said before ten times, I don't think Cin Drallig can beat Qui-Gon Jinn and Obi-Wan Kenobi.
Very impressive. The Nightsister, however, was skilled in the dark side of the Force. However, she was not a Sith lord, which is like the type of person who can access the Dark Side's power to the highest degree (e.g. Dark Jedi cannot). As I stated before, Maul's martial arts prowess will probably not help him as much in a fight against a SINGLE enemy with a lightsaber as opposed to many/a single opponent without a lightsaber. True, he killed a Jedi Master and nearly beat his apprentice, but do you think he would have done was well with only one side of his lightsaber? Give Drallig a double sided saber and he could take them on.
I'm pretty sure that Grievous would be more than a match for Maul, though Maul would put up one hell of a fight. I'm sure that Cin put up a good fight before going down to Anakin. The Maul with the metallic legs didn't do so well against Obi-Wan, who fought hard to beat Anakin. That would show you who is the better of the two. Now, we're sure that Cin fought well against Anakin, so (it may be difficult to see the logic) Cin would probably be a better duelist than Maul.
Is there any proof that Maul can beat Cin? Is there any proof that he cannot beat the two of them?
(is it kind of confusing me switching from Cin to Drallig and stuff? Because if it is, then I'll stop. You can just tell me which one you'd rather me stick to)
I'm sure that Cin put up a good fight before going down to Anakin.
Unfortunately we do not know that. We know Anakin beat Cin with one-hand, which I highly reckon Maul can stand against for a while.
The Maul with the metallic legs didn't do so well against Obi-Wan, who fought hard to beat Anakin.
Those are Infinities and are not established as canon, so we really can't use it.
Anyway, I am just going to say Darth Maul because he is quite an impressive duelist. But nevertheless the match would be kinda close.
Originally posted by Quinlan_Vos
Unfortunately we do not know that. We know Anakin beat Cin with one-hand, which I highly reckon Maul can stand against for a while.Those are Infinities and are not established as canon, so we really can't use it.
Anyway, I am just going to say Darth Maul because he is quite an impressive duelist. But nevertheless the match would be kinda close.
Hold off against an angry Anakin? I highly doubt it. Not many could stand against him. Kenobi could barely, and he beat the mechanical Maul with some ease.
Is the Black Sun thing and Infinitiy? Because if it is, then both can be discounted.
Agreed. The Match would be close, but while you support Maul, I support Cin.g
Damn it, I typed out a response and then accidentally closed it so now I'm typing it back. 🙁
Cin Drallig was the battlemaster of the Jedi order, skilled in several forms, was known as the Troll, said to be capable to kill Grievous (via through Soresu)
I don't think Cin Drallig can beat Qui-Gon Jinn and Obi-Wan Kenobi.
Unfortunately we do not know that. We know Anakin beat Cin with one-hand, which I highly reckon Maul can stand against for a while.
Those are Infinities and are not established as canon, so we really can't use it.
Is the Black Sun thing and Infinitiy? Because if it is, then both can be discounted.
Wow...
Originally posted by Rampant ox
I disagree. Because Cin knows Niman doesnt mean he knows how to use Makashi. Niman is the diplomats form, and it uses small aspects of all the forms to create one (imo) mediocre form. Niman is NOT Makashi, in any way shape or form. And is there any proof that says Shaak Ti knows Makashi? Im not saying you are wrong but I was under the impression that the Count was the only practicioner.Also you say that Dooku must know Shien as well, which is why he lived through Geonosis. Thats a load of bullsh*t. While Dooku was out in the open there were only jedi opposing him. Nobody with blasters were shooting at him (bar possibly Padme). He also had Jango standing there watching his back. As soon as the clones arrived Dooku fled to his secret hangar. So no, Dooku does not know Shien. If he did he would have stood a better chance against the raw power of Anakin in ROTS.
First off, your the dumb@$$.
You obviously know nothing about Niman. Yeah, it is the Diplomat's form, but it DOES use Makashi. It uses sections from every form counting one through seven.(Duh?) This means Drallig did know Makashi, although he may not have mastered it to the point that Dooku did.
And if you need proof that Shaak Ti knows Makashi, here:
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Talk:Form_II:_Makashi#Users
Look in there, some genious managed to shed some light on wether she knows Makashi or not. Lol.
"Also you say that Dooku must know Shien as well, which is why he lived through Geonosis."
You friggin Idiot, when the hell did I ever say he knew Shien?
Did you mean Shii-Cho? Of course he knew Form I!
And just for the record, since you probally never saw Episode II from the sound of it, no, Padme did not shoot at Count Dooku.
Anyway, I was making to a referance to some of Dooku's earlier battles, with the Mandalorians, etc. In those fights you can clearly see him demonstrate his use of Shii-Cho, during the firefights.
Rampant ox, beleive me, Im as abig a Christpopher Lee fan as you, he's awsome, loved his movies, he's a pimp.
But you don't need to keep making Dumb@$$ posts like this and embarrasing his good name. XD
First off, your the dumb@$$.
You obviously know nothing about Niman. Yeah, it is the Diplomat's form, but it DOES use Makashi. It uses sections from every form counting one through seven.(Duh?) This means Drallig did know Makashi, although he may not have mastered it to the point that Dooku did.
And if you need proof that Shaak Ti knows Makashi, here:
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Talk...:_Makashi#Users
Look in there, some genious managed to shed some light on wether she knows Makashi or not. Lol.
"Also you say that Dooku must know Shien as well, which is why he lived through Geonosis."
You friggin Idiot, when the hell did I ever say he knew Shien?
Did you mean Shii-Cho? Of course he knew Form I!
And just for the record, since you probally never saw Episode II from the sound of it, no, Padme did not shoot at Count Dooku.
Anyway, I was making to a referance to some of Dooku's earlier battles, with the Mandalorians, etc. In those fights you can clearly see him demonstrate his use of Shii-Cho, during the firefights.
Rampant ox, beleive me, Im as abig a Christpopher Lee fan as you, he's awsome, loved his movies, he's a pimp.
But you don't need to keep making Dumb@$$ posts like this and embarrasing his good name. XD
Wow, speak for yourself. You are a dumb@ass!!!
From Wookiepedia:
"Form VI utilizes techniques from Form I, Form III, Form IV, and Form V."
There's no mention of Makashi. And for that reason, we don't know if Cin Drallig used Makashi or not. The only people I know that use Makashi during PT time are Count Dooku, Tholme, and Shaak Ti.
And Dooku knew all the forms. He was battlemaster for the Jedi order and he taught all the forms to Grievous and the MagnaGuards.
And how do you see Dooku using Shii-Cho in a comic? The only time we have ever seen Shii-Cho is in the Clone Wars series where Kit Fisto uses it underwater. Don't tell me you can tell he was using Shii-Cho.
Re: Wow...
Originally posted by Master_Starbuck
First off, your the dumb@$$.
You obviously know nothing about Niman. Yeah, it is the Diplomat's form, but it DOES use Makashi. It uses sections from every form counting one through seven.(Duh?) This means Drallig did know Makashi, although he may not have mastered it to the point that Dooku did.
And if you need proof that Shaak Ti knows Makashi, here:
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Talk:Form_II:_Makashi#Users
Look in there, some genious managed to shed some light on wether she knows Makashi or not. Lol."Also you say that Dooku must know Shien as well, which is why he lived through Geonosis."
You friggin Idiot, when the hell did I ever say he knew Shien?
Did you mean Shii-Cho? Of course he knew Form I!
And just for the record, since you probally never saw Episode II from the sound of it, no, Padme did not shoot at Count Dooku.Anyway, I was making to a referance to some of Dooku's earlier battles, with the Mandalorians, etc. In those fights you can clearly see him demonstrate his use of Shii-Cho, during the firefights.
Rampant ox, beleive me, Im as abig a Christpopher Lee fan as you, he's awsome, loved his movies, he's a pimp.
But you don't need to keep making Dumb@$$ posts like this and embarrasing his good name. XD
Excuse me, but could we please not use such language. Both of you. Save it for the Andeteluvians, or however that banned group of jerks spelt their names. Well, namely Sorgo was bad. Janus and Traya weren't that bad, I guess. Anyway, http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Form_VI:_Niman That's some stuff on Niman. It shows that Makashi is not part of it. The link that you posted was what people were speculating. Not as concrete as this.
Excuse me, but could we please not use such language. Both of you. Save it for the Andeteluvians, or however that banned group of jerks spelt their names. Well, namely Sorgo was bad. Janus and Traya weren't that bad, I guess. Anyway, http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Form_VI:_Niman That's some stuff on Niman. It shows that Makashi is not part of it. The link that you posted was what people were speculating. Not as concrete as this.
Well I only called him a dumb*** because he was calling rampant that even though he has no clue what Niman is. That's just stupid.
Anyway, unless there's a source, I don't believe Cin Drallig uses Makashi.
Because you don't want to. EU grievous could beat those 2 without alot of trouble and Cin > Grievous. And lets just say for a minute that Cin can only take out Grievous because of Soresu. He said earlier that you thought Cin's Soresu was probably about as good as AOTC Obi-Wan's but that can't be true because AOTC Obi-Wan would get pwnd badly by EU Grievous. To beat EU Grievous with Soresu Cin's Soresu would have to be close to ROTS Obi-Wan's. And if his Soresu is almost as good as ROTS Obi-Wan's then he has I'd say about a 50/50 chance of beating Maul while using Soresu and we don't even know if Soresu is his best form!
Well Obi-Wan improved a great deal from AOTC to ROTS. I would say that perhaps somewhere between is where Drallig because I doubt his Soresu is equal to Kenobi's. But I still think Maul's quickness and prowess in Juyo will penetrate whatever form Drallig uses.
No, we know that Anakin walked into the room, killed Whie (Padawan, 13-14 years old) instantly cause he caught him by surprise and Whie didn't know that Anakin was a bad guy, then he starts to fight Bene, after a second he grabs her neck with his mechanical hand, then, using his other hand, duels Cin. For all we know, while dueling with one hand Cin manages to hit Anakin's arm and then some Clones come and shoot Bene so Anakin can convert to using two hands and even after that Cin puts up a hell of a fight against him. As you see, we can play guessing games all day long but we really don't know how good of a fight Cin put against Anakin before going down.
But Cin was killed with one arm! That means while crushing Bene he slashed Drallig's shoulder and watched the Jedi Master die.
Originally posted by Quinlan_Vos
Well I only called him a dumb*** because he was calling rampant that even though he has no clue what Niman is. That's just stupid.Anyway, unless there's a source, I don't believe Cin Drallig uses Makashi.
Oh that's absolutely lovely! I was ultra bored because no one was on, so I read about Cin, and here! (from Wookiepedia)
He instructed many Jedi in the art of lightsaber combat, such as Obi-Wan Kenobi, though he trained Serra Keto as a personal apprentice. He specialized only in Forms one through six. Drallig made his home deep within the Jedi Temple and gave himself over completely to the will of the Living Force.
Forms one through six 🙂
Sorry, I wasnt referring to you calling him a dumb what. I was referring to Rampant Ox. However, I can see your point of view.
Oh lol. Anyway, all right then, wookiepedia is not 100% factual but it's right most of the time.
Makashi would be a good form for Cin to use. However, how good is Cin's Makashi? It's definately not as good as Dooku's. And the way the Toying Dooku fought in AOTC, I would say Maul can match up to that. Now I am assuming that Cin's Makashi would be slightly lesser than Toying Dooku's Makashi. But I may be wrong.
I like Cin Drallig, but I just don't think he can match up to Maul.
Originally posted by Quinlan_Vos
Oh lol. Anyway, all right then, wookiepedia is not 100% factual but it's right most of the time.Makashi would be a good form for Cin to use. However, how good is Cin's Makashi? It's definately not as good as Dooku's. And the way the Toying Dooku fought in AOTC, I would say Maul can match up to that. Now I am assuming that Cin's Makashi would be slightly lesser than Toying Dooku's Makashi. But I may be wrong.
I like Cin Drallig, but I just don't think he can match up to Maul.
Yah, I know. How can he be Niman and still know Makashi at the same time, eh? Yes, often right, because it's written by the fans who know practically more than Lucas himself.
Yes, no one has mastered Makashi to the degree of Dooku. But nevertheless, Makashi specializes in blade-to-blade combat. I have no idea what my point is 😖
Very well, we all have our opinions. Can't change your mind 😉