Pope' s Speech Stirs Muslim Anger

Started by Quiero Mota13 pages

Originally posted by Alliance
I wasn't aware that I was involved in any riots 😕.

I think Jesus Christ brought nothing but war to the world. Thank God that Muhammed came to clean us of his sin.

We're tired of your Holy Crusade against Islam. Get your armies out of Islamic nations, stop assasinating our leaders and let Israel spread its reign of terror accross our lands.

The Pope's comments are a culmination of a general attitude: fear of the west. Its not just a simple crticism, it shows the underlying bigotry in the people who have been raping the Middle Wast for decades. Its time for you to leave.

😖leep:

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
I don't know why a person would use a text in a speech if they didn't agree with it unless it was to use it to make a point about what he wasn't agreeing with.

Still, and even TV stations and news etc. knows they haven't use disclaimers "The opinions etc of the following in no way reflect those of this station etc." - Because people take things personally. Crazy as it is.

The muslims have strange interpretations of things but I think the pope was talking about the difference in christian violence and islamic violence.

Pope is antichrist!!

Originally posted by Alliance
Who's dancing? I'm throwing water on the problem. You're philosophy thows naplam on it.

Calling anything evil is wrong, especially if you hav international responsibility. You agree with Bush's policy then? He likes to refer to things as evil.

Calling an evil thing evil is not wrong and condemning violence in religion is good.

Originally posted by Alliance
I don't understand.
A dhimmi is a second class citizen. in islamic countries who pay jiaya to practice their own religion. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dhimmi

Originally posted by Alliance
Ha. Don't be so naieve, there is the hole political situation surrounding this thing. If you think that is is an isolated incident...pick up a history book, preferable one on Middle Eastern History.

Again Pick up a history book and maybe try getting access to information. It happens all the time, jsut because its not the to the scale or frequency of some Islamic fundamentals doesn't mean Chirstianity is in any way is above such things.

I'm talking about that speech, and the modern christians not history .

Originally posted by markie
A dhimmi is a second class citizen. in islamic countries who pay jiaya to practice their own religion. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dhimmi

I know what it is. Your use of the word makes no sense.

Originally posted by markie
Calling an evil thing evil is not wrong and condemning violence in religion is good.

There is no "evil" its your perception, one that is NOT held by everyone.

Originally posted by markie
The muslims have strange interpretations of things but I think the pope was talking about the difference in christian violence and islamic violence.

Have you even read the speech? Don't "strange interpretation" me. Their interpretation is perfectly rational given the speech. Grow up and wisen up.

Originally posted by markie
You mean PC and dhimminess. It is not wrong to condemn islamic terrorism.

There is no such thing as "islamic terrorism." Do you condemn Islam?

Originally posted by markie
I think it was appropriate and he could have said a lot more about the violence in islam but that wasn't what he was talking about.

Id doesn't fit in the speech and was poorly written in.

Originally posted by Alliance
I wasn't aware that I was involved in any riots 😕.

I think Jesus Christ brought nothing but war to the world. Thank God that Muhammed came to clean us of his sin.

We're tired of your Holy Crusade against Islam. Get your armies out of Islamic nations, stop assasinating our leaders and let Israel spread its reign of terror accross our lands.

The Pope's comments are a culmination of a general attitude: fear of the west. Its not just a simple crticism, it shows the underlying bigotry in the people who have been raping the Middle Wast for decades. Its time for you to leave.

You first, get your people out of our countries then I'll talk to bush about it.

😆 You are a bigot.

again I'll say............GREAT FOOD!

BTW, we have no or have ever had probs. here in MI which is the largest population of that belief..........why is that??

Originally posted by Alliance
I know what it is. Your use of the word makes no sense.

There is no "evil" its your perception, one that is NOT held by everyone.

Have you even read the speech? Don't "strange interpretation" me. Their interpretation is perfectly rational given the speech. Grow up and wisen up.

There is no such thing as "islamic terrorism." Do you condemn Islam?

Id doesn't fit in the speech and was poorly written in.

OK it is good to condemn terrorism that is associated with religion. Yes I have read the speech and the only thing that could be considered anti islamic in it is that quote.
The speech is a good speech but the muslims can't see past that quote and that is unresonable.

😆 "unreasonable."

Well they may not like the pope, but at least they are not all religious bigots like yourself.

I don't much care for the pope or catholicism either I just didn't find anything particularly anti islamic in that speech. A cardinal in australia says his oppinion below.
http://www.news.com.au/sundaytelegraph/opinion/story/0,22049,20464816-5001031,00.html
The Pope's quotation was designed to make us think, but not to offend.

Non-believers who think that tolerance requires us to acknowledge that truth cannot be known with certainty have to recognise that both Christians and Muslims make claims to religious truth.

There is important overlap, but some elements of belief common to all Christians are incompatible with elements of belief common to all Muslims.

The doctrines that God isFather, Son and Spirit (Trinity) and that Jesus is also divine (Incarnation) are two examples.

Such differences are noreason why we cannot respect one another, much less any reason why we should fight or subject anyone to slavery or second-class citizenship.

Recently, Catholics have brought two new elements to discussion on Islam.

The Pope has led the call for reciprocity, for the rights we acknowledge for minorities in the West to beextended to minorities in Muslim countries.

Christians have been suffering violence and death for years, from Nigeria, through Sudan toIndonesia. The recent murder of an Italian nun in Somalia was not isolated.

These evils are not totally one-sided, but years of silence have only seen them worsen. Now we need to speak such truths - prudently, in charity, but regularly. This is why the topic of violence is central.

Is violence inconsistent with genuine Islam, or is it justifiable because, for Muslims, God's will is beyond such human categories as rationality and justice?

Originally posted by Alliance

There is no such thing as "islamic terrorism." Do you condemn Islam?

I most certainly do.

As Robert Spencer said ''There are moderate and peaceful muslims, but there is certainly no moderate and peaceful Islam''

Moderate and peaceful muslims are not practicing true Islam. They are either ignorant of its teachings or have conciencly rejected it.

Yeah right, millions of muslims are not practicing true Islam and they all are ignorant of its teaching and Islam is violant because there are terrorists that happened to be muslims. It's like saying that Christianity is violant because a lot of criminals happened to be christians. This "logic" works with ANY religion. Want to judge about Islam, read Qur'an from beginning to the end and not misinterpreted and mistranslated quotes from some sites that were originally created to present islam as a violant religion.

Also the Qur'an is supposed to be read in a certain context, I know that sounds like bullshit to those who are biased already, I used to be like that too. Since people are just going to label me as a Muslim and give me no crediblity, I should let you know that I am not Muslim.

Originally posted by crazy
Also the Qur'an is supposed to be read in a certain context, I know that sounds like bullshit to those who are biased already, I used to be like that too. Since people are just going to label me as a Muslim and give me no crediblity, I should let you know that I am not Muslim.
You are atheist?

Please people, READ what I write next, and pay CLOSE attention. Short lecture on history of Islam -

What a lot of westerners do not understand is that the Qur'an, does not have an equal in the western civilisation. The way Qur'an is seen by Muslims, nothing in the west has its parallel. Bible is WAY off.

Qur'an is believed by Muslims and Islamic theologies, to have been dictated WORD for WORD by Alah himself, through Angel Gabriel to Muhammad.

The problem is that now, every word of the Qur'an, every single one, unless it is canceled by another section (which would mean, there are no contradictions in the Qur'an) is valid for all time and it cannot be questioned, reformed or changed.

This means that moderate muslims, if they are sincere, they have to reject entirely Qur'anic literalism, BUT to do this, it puts them outside of the sphere of orthodox, or TRUE Islam throughout history.

Because to do so, it is to reject the very basic core of Islam, that this is a book dictated by God, the perfect copy of a perfect book, the Umm al-kitab (The mother of the book) that has existed forever with Allah in Heaven. Forever.
Every word of this book is the word of the God.

Thus, going back to my many Qur'anic quotes about violence and killing of the Infidels, would mean that those are the exact, untranslatable, words of god, which are to be carried out.

NOW PAY ATTENTION -

Therefore, people who are killing in the name of Allah, infidels and Jews, are practicing the true Islam. The Islam which Prophet Muhammad practiced himself.

Muhammad beheaded between 600 and 800 men, himself, personally. That is not counting tribes he sacked and expelled and the killings he ordered to be done.

Now, Muhammad is considered the al-insan al-kamil, which means ''The Perfect Man''.
He is the model, to be imitated.
He is the person, the more Muslim is like him, the better off he is.
He is revealed as the example to be followed by all Muslims.

Therefore, taking all this BACK to the Pope comment - what the Emperor in Pope's quote said was TRUE.

Anything which is peaceful in the Quran is not NEW. Muhammad lived with Jewish and Christian tribes, and thus while he has, the verses in the Quran are identical to those in the Bible.
What Muhammad brought that was new are the sword spread religion, and religious dominance through government.

Technically thus, the Byzantine emperor was absolutely correct.

Furthermore, if you would like to check what I have said, please read the Qur'an, the Haidths (because you cannot understand Qur'an without reading the Hadiths), Islamic tradition, Islamic theology and Islamic history.

I promise you, you will be all that wiser.

Now please, do me a favoure and point at controdictions in Qur'an, and also tell me where did you get exact numbers of "beheaded" people and try reading hystory books yourself. I don't want to break your "many Qur'anic quotes about violence and killing" theory but in all quotes where mentioned "killing" or "violance" it said about "fighting back" and killing if someone tries to kill you or your relatives. Bah, what's the point of talking to someone who believes that She is is the only person that understands Qur'an correctly and millions of people misinterpreted it "peaceful muslims are not practicing true Islam", "praising Hitler"🙄 All this speaks for itself, i don't know who made you a religion forum mod but it clearly was a mistake, try learning more about Islam and read Qur'an and not Wikipedia this time, please.

And you have never ever read the Hadiths, have you?

Anyway, here is a HISTORIC account of what happened (since noone seem to have read that either)

Authoratative Islamic History
Life og Muhammad (Sirat Rasul Allah)

by Muhammad bin Ishaq, written in 773AD

The life of Muhammad, page 464-

''Then they sourendered and the Prophet confined them in Medina...Then the apostle went out to the market of Medina and dug trenches in it.
The he sent for them and struck off their heads in those trenches as they were brought out to him in batches...
There were 600 or 700 though some put figure as high as 800 or 900''

This was written by an early Muslims, the apostole of Muhammad.

Don't embarress yourself. Read the history of the one you claim is al-insan al-kamili.