Originally posted by Mr Master
This does not in anyway prove that M-bodys come in weaker forms.Your still basing your argument on your idealism, NOT on evidence that is clearly depicted on panel as I have.
Thats the thing, it does exactly.
Its stated point blank that how well an abstract is represented can vary. It is all dependent on the abstracts wishes and their requirements.
On top of that Eternity is the totality of the universe therefore not only is the mbody not the totality of the universe as you used to argue and now have wisely quitened down on, but it conclusively cannot possess the totality of Eternitys power because he is the universe, so for him to sum up all of his power into an Mbody he would be depriving the rest of reality of energy and leave it a void. Do you see this happening on panel?
Its not idealism its rational thought. Common sense, versus unsupported fantasy made up to support an agenda. 😎
Originally posted by Mr Master
Reason, versus On Panel evidence,ok good luck on that one.
Indeed Mr M good luck. You've presented no evidence conclusively confirming that the mbodys are the abstracts in their totality. You've presented ambiguous phrases and misinterpretations I’ve had fun rectifying.
Originally posted by Mr Master
You still CAN'T prove this with a comic book, this is solely YOUR idea on the matter.I suppose we should take your word for it, instead of the MANY MANY times we've seen Eternity as the totality of the Universe on panel?
What occasions would they be? You've presented some scans which you've interpreted to be his totality, but an alternative interpretation could be made from the same scans, an alternate and just as valid interpretation. On top of that let’s not forget the many scans ive posted of Eternity himself making a distinction between his Mbody and his totality, actually stating there is a difference:
Lets not forget where Eternity describes his Mbody as just a perception:
Cant prove it? 😕 Just done it. 😱
Originally posted by Mr Master
Means nothing.
Means everything.
How can that Mbody be Eternity’s totality if it is walking around within the universe which is Eternity’s totality?
How can it possess the totality of Eternity’s power if the totality of Eternity’s power is the all power in the universe and yet the Mbody is seen walking around in an intact universe quite full of energy and life?
How can the Mbody be Eternity’s totality when it’s been destroyed whilst the universe was left intact?
How can you argue that the Mbody is Eternity’s totality when from the information you’ve presented it can be interpreted to not be his totality and you have Eternity himself stating on a few occasions that the Mbody is NOT his totality and on another that it is just a representation of the universe that is his totality?
You’re forsaking common sense and rationality for the furthering of this nonsensical interpretation which ties in with your agenda
Originally posted by Mr Master
The Fractals NEVER ever said they have authority over how much power goes into an M-body, the only permission the Fractals are given is in the PHYSICAL DESIGN of the M-body, nothing more.If you can prove this with on panel evidence please do,
but we both know you cannot.
The above is in response to this:
“It’s stated that the accuracy of the representation can vary dependent on a users requirement”
Let’s see what the comic says: 😖hifty:
The abstracts can have as much input as they want into their representations. It varies. However sometimes they have specific requirements.
The abstracts have no physical attributes, all that an Mbody is all that it is capable of is dependent on the abstract, the fractal or a combination. The Mbody isn’t just a physical representation; otherwise the Mbodys would have no power. The representation includes a representation of power. Therefore you can conclude that how powerful an Mbody is, is dependent on the abstracts requirements, what it needs to do in the physical realm.
😄
Originally posted by Mr Master
Where On Panel is this written?Or is it all in your head?
Bull shit
Its common sense and logic which you are ignoring once again to favour your agenda.How can the Eternity Mbody possess all of the universes energy within it and yet be standing within the functioning and energy filled universe. Don’t dismiss it as idealism because you can’t answer the question.
Originally posted by Mr Master
No where on panel is it stated that Eternity's M-body has ever had "varying levels of accuracy"Come on dude, let's stick to comic books.
You’re missing the point MM. Its cool, that was to be expected.
The abstracts are able to have mbodys custom built for them, for a particular purpose. The Dimension of Manifestations is filled with all of the Mbodys that have ever been built. Eternity has numerous Mbodys located there. If you have multiple Mbodys then that means they were each made for a specific purpose and are therefore different to each other. How can all of those different representations of Eternity, which you claim to be Eternity in his totality, be 100% accurate to Eternity?
In fact if within the Dimension of Manifestations there are multiple past Mbodys of Eternity as we saw:
(The one from Warlock and The Infinity Watch #1)
(The current 616 one)
How can you credibly argue that one of these Mbodys is the totality of the 616 universe when they are both the Mbodys of Eternity of the 616 universe?
You can’t.
Originally posted by Mr MasterEveryone knows M-bodys are representations of thier respective Concepts
Really? Just representations you say? That’s not what you were arguing ten pages back my friend
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/426282_21-thanos-with-ig-vs-white-crown-phoenix
and I thought that’s what you were disputing here? 😕
Originally posted by Mr Master
however, when Fractals become the M-body of a specific Abstract, that specific Concept places it's ENERGIES within the M-body:It NEVER said HOW MUCH Energy is transfered,
"We have a SYMBIOTIC RELATIONSHIP with the Abstract Beings, an EXCHANGE of ENERGIES that you physicals would not comprehend"
Doesn’t need to.
The representation of the abstracts is one of power as well, otherwise the Mbody would have no powers. The accuracy of the Mbody to the concept is variable as stated. It is dependent on the abstracts requirements. Not all Mbodys therefore are necessarily of the same power level, and no mbodys are the totality of their user. They cannot be without detrimental affects to reality.
Originally posted by Mr Master
Where does it say that was Infinity 616?Quasar knows Infinity 616 well, heck she employed him in the past, HOW is it Infinity did NOT recognize Quasar?
Different M-body you say, though it's still the SAME Infinity.
So an Abstract loses its memory and all recollection of it's PAST from M-body to M-body according this philosophy.
Nope that is not my philosophy. That silly statement stems from your inability to comprehend and accurately interpret on panel events. Its cool, I’m here to help.
Who’s to say THAT Infinity just didn’t want to talk to him because she had no need of him like she did previously? The abstracts aren’t humans they don’t form friendships and relationships. They act out of necessity.
Nowhere is it stated that it was Infinity from another reality. Quasar just said that it wasn’t the Mbody that he had met. The one that would have been created for the purpose of interacting with Quasar. After being ignored Quasar understood and said “What did I expect, she of all people must have an infinite number of Mbodies”
Now that sentence plus the fact that:
a) We’ve been shown multiple Mbodies of 616 Eternity existing at once in the Dimension of Manifestations
b) The abstracts are stated to be able to custom build Mbodys for specific purposes
c) This scan
(Which handles your Infinity interpretation by supporting the fact that an abstract may possess multiple Mbodys and that they can be different in this case in terms of how they act. It also shows us how an Mbody isn’t the totality of a concept by telling us how the Anomaly Mbody was previously destroyed and yet Anomaly appeared before Quasar and was fine)
All tells us that abstracts can have multiple Mbodys with different functions, forms and manner and that those Mbodys can be destroyed without disposing of the concept itself, (which can just manifest in another Mbody) In light of all that as I’ve been saying all along the Mbodys conclusively are NOT the totality of the concept in all of there appearances as you would have people believe. They are representations of the concept, representations which are shaped by the beholders views of what said concept should be like. The amount of their totality possessed by the Mbodys is determined by the abstract and dependent on what they want to do in the physical realm, however an abstract cannot put its totality into an Mbody without detrimental affects to reality.
Originally posted by Mr Master
But the FACT is:With in the ONE and ONLY Dimension of Manifestations, ALL the M-bodys of the Multi-verse/Omni-verse appear.
Which is WHY Quasar could NOT locate the M-body of Infinity that knows him:
When Gamora finds that Infinity was trapped Inside the Consciouness/Spirit of Eternity she says,
"With Eternity, that's INFINITY! ... "That's WHY Quasar COULDN'T LOCATE Her"
"COULDN'T LOCATE Her?"
But he DID LOCATE INFINITY:
In FACT, what Quasar said was:
"she's IGNORING me, GUESS THIS ISN'T the M-BODY I MET"
"What'd I expect, She of ALL people must have an INFINITE Number of M-BODIES"SO what does this mean?
That THIS is a DIFFERENT Infinity, in FACT the MULTIPLE Reflections in the Dimension of Manifestations are from OTHER UNIVERSES! (That's what this proves)
And "Reflections" of M-bodys are from different Timelines or the Past more plainly.
Handled previously. You have no evidence to say that that Infinity was from another reality. Quasar said on panel that Infinity HIS Infinity must have multiple Mbodys and that the one that ignored him must have been one he hadn’t met. The Mbodys are created for a specific purpose, they are not all the same, they can act, look or perform differently as the comic showed us. The fact that we saw 616 Eternitys multiple Mbodys in the title tells us conclusively that the Mbodys aren’t the totality of the concept and as far as this Infinity issue, means that until we’re told differently its very possible it was just one of 616 Infinitys Mbodys, because even he realizes that she must have numerous Mbodys. The same point was stated about Eternity and it was demonstrated when we saw multiple Mbodys of his:
An entity like Eternity must have multiple Mbodys:
(I’ll have no talk of a Multi Eternity as the entity wasn’t made known to readers until many years later, so that means that in this instance they were conclusively referring to 616 Eternity)
The above depicts Eternity in a trial with the other abstracts which happened prior to events in this comic.
The current manifestation of Eternity:
Multiple Mbodys and yet you’d have us believe that each one is the totality of the universe?
Originally posted by Mr Master
You should pay close attention to your own post,How does this explanation take away from the FACT that an M-BODY is clearly being depicted Artistically accompanied by On Panel statements as the SPIRIT of the UNIVERSE!
"You mean this Corresponds to something that's going on in the UNIVERSE NOW?"
Again:
"Yeah, and this Aspect is of RIGHT VINTAGE ... So what's happening to it is GOING ON RIGHT NOW"
Where?
IN the UNIVERSE, like he clearly said.
"Since there's nothing to be done for this zoned-out MANIFESTATION of Eternity"
"Avengers are about to launch an assault on the Cosmic Muckamuck they figure DID THIS to the TEMPORAL SPIRIT of the UNIVERSE HERE"I know you know what TEMPORAL means...
This is why Quasar asked Infinity for the REAL ETERNITY, because the Comatose M-body was of "RIGHT VINTAGE", it "Corresponded to something that's going on in the UNIVERSE NOW" it was "the MOST RECENTLY Manifested Aspect of Eternity"
Which makes it, the "Spiritual Essence/Consciousness of ETERNITY, just like Quasar himself said, the "TEMPORAL SPIRIT of the UNIVERSE"
The "Spiritual Entity" you REPRESENT, happens to be an M-BODY 😱
Don’t know what the hell you’re waffling about here. Youre emphasizing words which are saying exactly what my argument needs them to say and yet I sense that youre mistakenly trying to say that they mean something completely different. But it’s all spelled out quite clearly on panel for readers. No convoluted theories to aid your fantasy which itself was fabricated to aid your agenda.
By saying this aspect is of “right vintage”, Quasar is merely saying this is the current aspect, the current Mbody. Mbodys are as we know the representations of a concept. Eternity as we know is the sentience of the universe and his totality is everything along the chronal axis. Which is why the Mbody is referred to as the temporal spirit of the universe. Because it is or at least it is its representation and so whatever happens to the universe is reflected by the Mbody.
Quasar asks to find the real Eternity not just one of his Mbodys i.e he wants the current manifestation which reflects the current state of the universe not just one of his pasts Mbodys, which reflect previous states of the universe obviously.
He finally gets to the Eternity he wants, the current manifestation of Eternity, (which is therefore reflecting the events of the totality) however he’s under the grip of Magus. With no way of talking to Eternity because his current Mbody is catatonic Quasar decides to go back to reality to see what he can do there.
Nice and simple. 😱
Originally posted by Mr MasterThe Infinity M-body did not acknowledge Quasar because it was an M-body of a different Universe, which did NOT know Quasar.
Simple, effective no?
AND,
There is ONLY ONE Dimension of Manifestation, and it is the Realm of the Living Tribunal (the Fractals just work there)
So it is quite conceivable, that Other manifestations of Eternity/Infinity, are indeed of OTHER Universes.
Also, I just remembered Magus making M-bodys.
You do realize that Magus was NOT in 616 at this point right?
What does that tell you, that again, indeed beings of OTHER/DIFFERENT Universes can dwell within the Dimension of Manifestation simultaneously.
Its possible that it was an alternate universe Infinity, but as its established that 616 Infinity and Eternity can have multiple Mbodys and its actually depicted on panel that Eternity of 616 actually HAS multiple Mbodys then its just as possible that it was 616 Infinity. Either way ive won on the point that the abstracts can have multiple Mbodys the point you were trying to dismiss with your claim that it was an alternate universe Infinity, despite the fact that it wasnt stated on panel as being so, but instead just another Mbody of 616 Infinitys.
Originally posted by Mr Master
So when and where On Panel has it ever been stated that Eternity is not the totality of the Universe?
You seem to be confused as to what im arguing and what youre arguing yourself as ive highlighted in my rebuttal. Please take a time out and recapture your lost senses before even considering to reply. 🙂
Eternity is the totality of the universe, im not disputing that. What im disputing is that Eternitys Mbodys are the totality of the universe. They are clearly not. Most of your evidence stems from occassions where an Eternity Mbody has said its the totality and youre quite foolishly trying to argue that thats evidence that said Mbodys are the totality, whilst forgetting to acknowledge that said Mbodys are the voices of the totality. So it saying its all that is, doesnt mean that humanoid figure is literally all that is, the voice which it is a medium for is all that it is.
Its flat out on panel stated by Eternity that there is a difference between his totality and his Mbodys. With that in mind you have no case whatsoever for trying to tell any of us otherwise. Its been stated on many occassions as ive highlighted throughout this thread,
Give it a rest. shutup
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Its possible that it was an alternate universe Infinity, but as its established that 616 Infinity and Eternity can have multiple Mbodys and its actually depicted on panel that Eternity of 616 actually HAS multiple Mbodys then its just as possible that it was 616 Infinity. Either way ive won on the point that the abstracts can have multiple Mbodys the point you were trying to dismiss with your claim that it was an alternate universe Infinity, despite the fact that it wasnt stated on panel as being so, but instead just another Mbody of 616 Infinitys.
Why would Eternity and Infinity send multiple M-Bodies to The Dimension of Manifestations ?
It makes a lot more sense that those are M-Bodies from different universes.
You are trying to argue that it is possible that those are just replicas of ONE universe, but you can't truly back that up, can you?
Again, you are ignoring the obvious...the IG has multiversal influence. Give it up already GS....
the infinity m-body ignored quasar BECAUSE the infinity sentience was IMPRISONED along with the ETERNITY sentience by magus.
a clear distinction has been shown to exist between the m-body and the sentience. m-body catatonic, sentience still fully functional and battling. we have seen multiple m-bodies existing of eternity and multiple m-bodies existing of death. to say these are 'other-multiversal' manifestations is pure speculation as other multiverses are NEVER MENTIONED in any relevent book dealing with m-bodies.
for more on m-bodies here's a thread where i posted loads of scans.
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/431793_1-marvel-universe-the-end-discussion-thread
it turned out to be quite lengthy, but quite enlightening imo. 🙂
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Why would Eternity and Infinity send multiple M-Bodies to The Dimension of Manifestations ?It makes a lot more sense that those are M-Bodies from different universes.
You are trying to argue that it is [b]possible
that those are just replicas of ONE universe, but you can't truly back that up, can you?Again, you are ignoring the obvious...the IG has multiversal influence. Give it up already GS.... [/B]
What do you mean why would they send them there? Read the comic so you understand because you obviously dont take the time out to read and analyse posts properly.
As stated in the scans ive shown the abstracts have Mbodys constructed to suit specific purposes, therefore they can vary, in form function or sometimes manner.All the Mbodys constructed exist in the ir place of origin the dimension of manifestations.
As stated both Eternity and Infinity of 616 have multiple Mbodys. I have posted the scans where this is stated and i have posted the scans where this is verified scans which show multiple Mbodies of 616 Eternity thereby conclusively dismissing the notion that an Mbody is the totality of the universe.
