Parallax vs. Abraxas

abraxas was SOMEHOW in the process of ATTEMPTNG to destroy the multiverse. how would he have accomplished the feat? 😕 who knows? however, no where on panel did he actually destroy a multiverse. never happened. did he even destroy a UNIVERSE anywhere? without on-panel proof, we could as easily say his presence as the embodiment of destruction was destabilizing everything. a far cry from saying he had the outright power to blow-up the multiverse -- or even a UNIVERSE. because no clear explanation was given as to HOW he would end the multiverse, the means by which he accomplished his goal are very much open to speculation and opinion.

if wishes were fishes, the omniverse would be an ocean . . .

and juggs, i tend to agree -- it was important that the multiverse be destroyed and REMADE to correct the "fatal flaw" that had become abraxas. it was the remaking (and how it was remade) that seemed to me to be the relevent issue.

Originally posted by leonidas
abraxas was SOMEHOW in the process of ATTEMPTNG to destroy the multiverse. how would he have accomplished the feat? 😕 who knows? however, no where on panel did he actually destroy a multiverse. never happened. did he even destroy a UNIVERSE anywhere? without on-panel proof, we could as easily say his presence as the embodiment of destruction was destabilizing everything. a far cry from saying he had the outright power to blow-up the multiverse -- or even a UNIVERSE. because no clear explanation was given as to HOW he would end the multiverse, the means by which he accomplished his goal are very much open to speculation and opinion.

if wishes were fishes, the omniverse would be an ocean . . .

and juggs, i tend to agree -- it was important that the multiverse be destroyed and REMADE to correct the "fatal flaw" that had become abraxas. it was the remaking (and how it was remade) that seemed to me to be the relevent issue.

And yet MR. Master chooses to say that parrallax never made two universes on panel as a way to dismiss parrallax's power to do so. But he easily excepts abraxas' power and abraxas didn't destroy not ONE universe on panel. Oh the hippocricy. You are correct if wishes were fishes indeed.

Oh Btw What the hell is Abraxas going to do to Parallax????
It took the Spectre and many other heroes to beat him while he was creating a new Universe and the other heroes where feeding on his power. Spectre>>>>>Ultimate Nullifier
Parallax wins 10/10

Look what I have found 😱
"Parallax attempted to create new worlds and timelines as alternate realities seeped in and out of existense"

Originally posted by juggernaut66666
Look what I have found 😱
"Parallax attempted to create new worlds and timelines as alternate realities seeped in and out of existense"

Check it, he was created multiple universes and he couldnt' control them. But he certainly had the power to control and collapse them. Parrallax for the win.

going by strictly on-panel feats i don't see how anyone can say abraxas wins. he did kill alternate galactuses, but the circumstances behind those victories were never revealed. when confronted by 616 g, he was deprived of the UN forcefully (and apparently painfully) and seemed rather . . . surprised by that little stunt. while talking to galactus he says:

"As i killed your other selves throughout the multiverse. Or . . . have you forgotten the ace I still hold up my sleeve?" at this he holds up the UN. almost sounded to me as if he needed the UN to gain an advantage over 616 g. is 616 g special in someway?

absolutley. he was the FIRST galactus. the one upon which all the other 'alternate reality' ones were based. he was also the one who became a "star" at death, while the other galactuses abraxas killed became . . . corpses. perhaps 616 g was more powerful than the others? i don't know. but he WAS special. and he certainly was NOT intimidated by abraxas or did he seem in any way to be less powerful than abraxas.

beyond that, as i said, abraxas did nothing remotely close to destroying a universe, let alone the multiverse. and -- much like the absurd fallacy that abraxas killed "every galactus in the multiverse" -- i don't get where the idea of him being a 'multiversal destroyer' ever came from. reed says quite clearly that IF abraxas gets the UN he could destroy the multiverse, and abraxas himself says that "WITH the UN in his hands there is not a soul in the combined universes" that can stop him.

on top of all this, (yes, it's not 'on-panel' . . . but a lot of claims being made 'round here aren't 'on-panel' either . . .) the letter column in FF 46 refers to abraxas as a "threat of galactus-level proportions."

i suppose it's easy to say that ONLY a multiverse-destroying attack can stop him, because that's all we saw. but the goal of resetting everything was to put things back, to fix things that had become "unhinged". after all, it wasn't abraxas who "unhinged" the multiverse. in roma's own words:

"Into each reality eternity made certain there was a galactus to keep abraxas in check. until THIS reality's galactus died. And the doors of the multiverse became unhinged."

it wasn't abraxas who was responsible for the mess the multiverse was in -- it was the death of 616 galactus.

Originally posted by leonidas
abraxas was SOMEHOW in the process of ATTEMPTNG to destroy the multiverse.

Correct.

Originally posted by leonidas
how would he have accomplished the feat? who knows?

By continuing to collapse it.

Originally posted by leonidas
however, no where on panel did he actually destroy a multiverse. never happened. did he even destroy a UNIVERSE anywhere?

No one said he did.

Originally posted by leonidas
without on-panel proof, we could as easily say his presence as the embodiment of destruction was destabilizing everything. a far cry from saying he had the outright power to blow-up the multiverse -- or even a UNIVERSE.

Again,

I don't know who your addressing, but if it's me, review my posts carefully before replying to them indirectly.

I NEVER SAID ABRAXAS DESTROYED the MULTI-VERSE or the UNIVERSE!

Originally posted by leonidas
because no clear explanation was given as to HOW he would end the multiverse, the means by which he accomplished his goal are very much open to speculation and opinion.

No speculations or opinions are needed,

he was COLLAPSING the MULTI-VERSE, that's WHAT I SAID, that's WHAT he was DOING.

Originally posted by leonidas
if wishes were fishes, the omniverse would be an ocean . . .

dontgetit

Oh, it's sarcasm...

Originally posted by leonidas
and juggs, i tend to agree -- it was important that the multiverse be destroyed and REMADE to correct the "fatal flaw" that had become abraxas. it was the remaking (and how it was remade) that seemed to me to be the relevent issue.

As soon as you show us where it says that ON PANEL,

we'll agree with juggs and your OPINION.

Originally posted by juggernaut66666
Oh Btw What the hell is Abraxas going to do to Parallax????
It took the Spectre and many other heroes to beat him while he was creating a new Universe and the other heroes where feeding on his power. Spectre>>>>>Ultimate Nullifier
Parallax wins 10/10

Originally posted by juggernaut66666
Look what I have found 😱
"Parallax attempted to create new worlds and timelines as alternate realities seeped in and out of existense"

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
And yet MR. Master chooses to say that parrallax never made two universes on panel as a way to dismiss parrallax's power to do so.

And I'll say it AGIAN,

I have NOT seen Parallax create TWO Universes On Panel,

if anyone presents the scans, I'll gladly concede.

The scans that were posted as proof of Parallax's power, was his destroying ONE Universe and RE-CREATING that SAME Universe.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
But he easily excepts abraxas' power and abraxas didn't destroy not ONE universe on panel.

On Panel it took ERASING the MUlti-verse to stop Abraxas, period.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
Oh the hippocricy.

Oh the cluelessness.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
You are correct if wishes were fishes indeed.

Please, you claim people hold my jock strap,

don't twiddle Leon's nuts, it may be your thing but I don't think he swings that way.

Originally posted by juggernaut66666
Oh Btw What the hell is Abraxas going to do to Parallax????
It took the Spectre and many other heroes to beat him while he was creating a new Universe and the other heroes where feeding on his power. Spectre>>>>>Ultimate Nullifier
Parallax wins 10/10

And what is Parallax going to do to Abraxas?

Abraxas 10/10

Originally posted by Mr Master
And what is Parallax going to do to Abraxas?

Abraxas 10/10

Originally posted by juggernaut66666
Look what I have found 😱
"Parallax attempted to create new worlds and timelines as alternate realities seeped in and out of existense"

Yea,

that's just a side-effect of what he did, not him ACTUALLY doing it.

Wanda's Chaos Wave took on a life of it's own and it was on it's way to FOLDING the Omni-verse,

it was a BY-PRODUCT of her REMAKING the 616 Universe,

would I say that Wanda can destroy the Omni-verse because of this?

Of course not.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Yea,

that's just a side-effect of what he did, not him ACTUALLY doing it.

Wanda's Chaos Wave took on a life of it's own and it was on it's way to FOLDING the Omni-verse,

it was a BY-PRODUCT of her REMAKING the 616 Universe,

would I say that Wanda can destroy the Omni-verse because of this?

Of course not.

Going by feats Parallax takes this
Otherwise it is a stalemate or Parallax wins by causing another Entropy rift which side effects will do the job.

actually it wasn't just you i was replying to, hence the reason i didn't quote you. it wasn't because i'm shy . . .

however, since you did quote me . . .

Originally posted by Mr Master
By continuing to collapse it.

the collapse had already begun and he had nothing to do with its beginning. where exactly in the arc did it say that abraxas was going to 'continue collapsing it'?

No one said he did.

you're correct in assuming you did not (at least i don't believe you did . . .) say that. that was addressed to someone else from a different thread. if i could remember where i would find it and quote it . . .

I NEVER SAID ABRAXAS DESTROYED the MULTI-VERSE or the UNIVERSE!

paranoia? 😕 if i was accusing you, don't you know by now that i would be directing it AT you?

No speculations or opinions are needed,

he was COLLAPSING the MULTI-VERSE, that's WHAT I SAID, that's WHAT he was DOING.

where does it say that anywhere in the arc?

As soon as you show us where it says that ON PANEL,

we'll agree with juggs and your OPINION.

reed himself hinted at it in your own oft-quoted line: "In order to realign all that is, we needed to end all that was."

imo, killing abraxas would not have been enough to stop the catastrophe happening to the multiverse. after all, abraxas didn't start the mess, why would killing him alone end it? there is also the part he plays in eternity, his role to account for. the only real solution to what was happening was realignment, and the only way to do that was to reset things. resetting also obviously ensured that abraxas was locked up because all the galactuses were brought back.

abraxas did NOT cause the collapse of the multiverse, 616's galactus's death did, nor (that i saw in the arc) did he even aid the collpase as you said -- though if you can show me a scan to prove your opinion is true, i'll be more than happy to agree. re-reading the arc in fact, i found myself wondering just what the hell abraxas WAS doing?

juggs and i may not have conclusive proof that our OPINIONS are correct, but what i do have i feel all right with. again, it's pretty easy to say it took a multiversal level blast to . . . lock him back up because that's the only thing we've seen happen. the damage that was done though (and its cause) went beyond abraxas, and so a solution that addressed everything was required.

Originally posted by leonidas
going by strictly on-panel feats i don't see how anyone can say abraxas wins.

Simply,

if you can't erase a Multi-verse, then ...you can't defeat him.

Originally posted by leonidas
he did kill alternate galactuses, but the circumstances behind those victories were never revealed.

No need, we know Abraxas does NOT use weapons or power sources, so he did it under his own power.

Originally posted by leonidas
when confronted by 616 g, he was deprived of the UN forcefully (and apparently painfully)

Painfully?

😂

Not forcefully AT ALL, Galactus WILLED out of Abraxas's hands, because the UN is an Apsect or PART of Galactus:

Originally posted by leonidas
and seemed rather . . . surprised by that little stunt.

Now you got the story straight.

Originally posted by leonidas
while talking to galactus he says:

"As i killed your other selves throughout the multiverse. Or . . . have you forgotten the ace I still hold up my sleeve?" at this he holds up the UN. almost sounded to me as if he needed the UN to gain an advantage over 616 g.

Unsurprising SPECULATION,

NEVER in that issue is it even hinted, that Abraxas NEEDED ANYTHING to defeat 616 G,

I can't believe you said that.

He held up the UN to show Big G, if I killed your other selves with my bare POWER, imagine now that I have the UN.

Originally posted by leonidas
is 616 g special in someway?
absolutley. he was the FIRST galactus. the one upon which all the other 'alternate reality' ones were based. he was also the one who became a "star" at death, while the other galactuses abraxas killed became . . . corpses.

This is meaningless.

Originally posted by leonidas
perhaps 616 g was more powerful than the others?

More SPECULATION.

Originally posted by leonidas
i don't know.

I do.

Originally posted by leonidas
but he WAS special.

I agree.

Originally posted by leonidas
and he certainly was NOT intimidated by abraxas or did he seem in any way to be less powerful than abraxas.

Of course he wasn't intimated, the UN was right infront of him, the ONE and ONLY thing that was able to banish Abraxas, Galactus KNEW it, just like Galactus KNEW he could WILL it out of Abraxas's hands like nothing, since it's a PART OF HIM.

Originally posted by leonidas
beyond that, as i said, abraxas did nothing remotely close to destroying a universe, let alone the multiverse.

Again?

Originally posted by leonidas
and -- much like the absurd fallacy that abraxas killed "every galactus in the multiverse" --

Your still hanging on to that statement that was made like half a year ago?

Jeez, your agenda is rising,

I gave you the credit many months ago on bringing that to light, let's proceed forward already.

Originally posted by leonidas
i don't get where the idea of him being a 'multiversal destroyer' ever came from.

Uhh,

from several Fantastic Four issues, namely the Abraxas ARC...

Originally posted by leonidas
reed says quite clearly that IF abraxas gets the UN he could destroy the multiverse, and abraxas himself says that "WITH the UN in his hands there is not a soul in the combined universes" that can stop him.

And?

Originally posted by leonidas
on top of all this, (yes, it's not 'on-panel' . . . but a lot of claims being made 'round here aren't 'on-panel' either . . .)

Like WHAT?

Originally posted by leonidas
the letter column in FF 46 refers to abraxas as a "threat of galactus-level proportions."

That's NO letter column,

nice try.

That's a bulletin on the BACK of the issue, WHO knows who wrote that RUBBISH.

"threat of galactus-level proportions."

And yet:

MULTI-ETERNITY himself is quaking in FEAR of Abraxas:

"What was revealed to me through the Cosmic Entity known as ETERNITY"

"Was a Being like NO OTHER I have EVER encountered, his name is ABRAXAS, and to say HE (MULTI-ETERNITY) had nothing to FEAR in our discovery is an UNDERSTATEMENT"

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

Originally posted by leonidas
i suppose it's easy to say that ONLY a multiverse-destroying attack can stop him, because that's all we saw. but the goal of resetting everything was to put things back, to fix things that had become "unhinged". after all, it wasn't abraxas who "unhinged" the multiverse. in roma's own words:

"Into each reality eternity made certain there was a galactus to keep abraxas in check. until THIS reality's galactus died. And the doors of the multiverse became unhinged."

it wasn't abraxas who was responsible for the mess the multiverse was in -- it was the death of 616 galactus.

WRONG!!!

Galactus's death unhinged the doors to the Multi-verse releasing the MUTLIVERSAL DESTROYER known as ABRAXAS the Embodiment of MULTIVERSAL DESTRUCTION!

Originally posted by juggernaut66666
Going by feats Parallax takes this
Otherwise it is a stalemate or Parallax wins by causing another Entropy rift which side effects will do the job.

But the Entropy rift didn't take out the Multi-verse, it doesn't say exactly how many Timelines when berzerk.

Actually,

I was leaning towards a stalemate my self, cause I figured, perhaps netiher of them can hurt each other.

You need to wipe out the Multi-verse to stop Abraxas.

But Parallax destroyed a Universe, clearly Abraxas didn't do that.

So I say it's a stalemate.

Originally posted by Mr Master
No need, we know Abraxas does NOT use weapons or power sources, so he did it under his own power.

really? he had a part of the watcher's talisman, at least. i have no idea why. you're the cosmic guy. why DID he take it?

Painfully?

😂

i'm afraid the only thing funny is your creative cropping abilities. again . . .

sure g willed it from his hand. and as the scan shows, abraxas clearly enjoyed the moment . . .

😆

Now you got the story straight.

whew . . .

Unsurprising SPECULATION,

this from the guy who says that when an eternity m-body leaves a universe, it takes ALL of the universe with it because it IS the 'whole' universe, that warlock confronted multi-eternity and that thanos clearly destroyed the multiverse. 🙄

1. where exactly in the end does it say that thanos destroyed the multiverse again?

2. where does it say multi-eternity in that warlock issue?

ohhh, you're speculating, you say? using outside the book resources and trying to draw inferences? so . . . it's all right if you do it, but what, no one else can . . .?

NEVER in that issue is it even hinted, that Abraxas NEEDED ANYTHING to defeat 616 G,

really? then why does he have to tell g that he has an ACE up his sleeve?

He held up the UN to show Big G, if I killed your other selves with my bare POWER, imagine now that I have the UN.

Unsurprising SPECULATION,

or did i miss where that was actually said in the arc . . .? i did see the part where g told abraxas he was nothing. i know, i know, galactus was using hyperbole . . . of course he was . . .

Of course he wasn't intimated, the UN was right infront of him, the ONE and ONLY thing that was able to banish Abraxas, Galactus KNEW it, just like Galactus KNEW he could WILL it out of Abraxas's hands like nothing, since it's a PART OF HIM.

Unsurprising SPECULATION,

galactus had no intention of using the UN. why not, exactly? you have repeatedly said that he has the ultimate control -- he could certainly have used it to focus on abraxas, no? or he could himself have used it to wipe out everything. why not on just abraxas? imo because that would have done nothing. abraxas was a symptom, NOT the problem. the multiverse was unhinged by g's death. because of thatdeath, abraxas was freed.

Your still hanging on to that statement that was made like half a year ago?

😆 that was you?? you won't believe me, but i actually didn't know/remember it was you who started that . . .

Like WHAT?

sticking to the topic at hand let's start with this:

he was COLLAPSING the MULTI-VERSE, that's WHAT I SAID, that's WHAT he was DOING.

care to show anyone WHERE this was shown OR been stated to have happened in the arc . . .?

That's NO letter column,

nice try.

That's a bulletin on the BACK of the issue, WHO knows who wrote that RUBBISH.

🤨

first, it was in the letter col. yeah, it's a bulletin, so . . .? . . . just who do you THINK wrote it? it's an editor's bulletin. what the hell, you think they just let some guy off the street walk up and write a summary of the story and they stuck it in the letter col?

Like WHAT?

let's add this one to the list:

MULTI-ETERNITY himself is quaking in FEAR of Abraxas

could you show all of us the part where multi-eternity is quaking in fear? or a part that tells us he is afraid at all . . .?

"What was revealed to me through the Cosmic Entity known as ETERNITY"

nice scan showing reed talked to abraxas. and . . . 😕

"Was a Being like NO OTHER I have EVER encountered, his name is ABRAXAS, and to say HE (MULTI-ETERNITY) had nothing to FEAR in our discovery is an UNDERSTATEMENT"

🤨

"HE" referred to abraxas. reed had found out about him, and was saying it didn't matter. abraxas thought he knew the knowledge wouldn't help them.

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

it is sorta funny that you constantly deride others for not showing on-panel feats and exaggerating or lying then you tell us multi-eternity is 'quaking' in fear (and show a SCAN as it it somehow proves your point!) then you tell everyone abraxas is collapsing the multiverse (something else never shown or stated to have happened) and then say g didn't even manage to hurt him at all and show a cropped scan that by-passes the panel that has him screaming!

the hell am i saying -- in retrospect it IS damn funny!!

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

mm, i seriously can't believe you posted that last scan. the same one i quoted, then said:

WRONG!!!

Galactus's death unhinged the doors to the Multi-verse releasing the MUTLIVERSAL DESTROYER known as ABRAXAS the Embodiment of MULTIVERSAL DESTRUCTION!

now in your scan, it says:

"Until this reality's galactus died. And the doors to the multiverse became unhinged."

in your own QUOTE with your own SCAN you said exactly what i said (well . . . except for the part where you added your own text to the scene, something you would crucify someone for) -- GALACTUS'S DEATH UNHINGED THE DOORS TO THE MULTIVERSE!

was abraxas released? of course. but the multiverse was ALREADY unhinged, set out of whack by galactus's death. how much more clearly does a being with omniversal knowledge have to state things??

please, somewhere, SHOW me -- show all of us -- where it says abraxas is a multiversal destroyer!! reed says that if abraxas gets the UN he could destroy the multiverse, abraxas HIMSELF says once he HAS the UN no soul in the universes could stop him. what does that imply? it implies someone could PREVIOUSLY have had the power to stop him. or shall you dismiss it has 'crappy writing' once again?

do you or do you not have on-panel evidence (that does NOT rely on your interpretation of the story or your OWN speculation) that says abraxas is a mutliversal destroyer??

Originally posted by Mr Master
So I say it's a stalemate.

now THAT i can live with. that's a FAR cry from 10/10 abraxas. we can end this right here if you like.

Originally posted by leonidas
really? he had a part of the watcher's talisman, at least. i have no idea why. you're the cosmic guy. why DID he take it?

i'm afraid the only thing funny is your creative cropping abilities. again . . .

sure g willed it from his hand. and as the scan shows, abraxas clearly enjoyed the moment . . .

😆

whew . . .

this from the guy who says that when an eternity m-body leaves a universe, it takes ALL of the universe with it because it IS the 'whole' universe, that warlock confronted multi-eternity and that thanos clearly destroyed the multiverse. 🙄

1. where exactly in the end does it say that thanos destroyed the multiverse again?

2. where does it say multi-eternity in that warlock issue?

ohhh, you're speculating, you say? using outside the book resources and trying to draw inferences? so . . . it's all right if you do it, but what, no one else can . . .?

really? then why does he have to tell g that he has an ACE up his sleeve?

or did i miss where that was actually said in the arc . . .? i did see the part where g told abraxas he was nothing. i know, i know, galactus was using hyperbole . . . of course he was . . .

galactus had no intention of using the UN. why not, exactly? you have repeatedly said that he has the ultimate control -- he could certainly have used it to focus on abraxas, no? or he could himself have used it to wipe out everything. why not on just abraxas? imo because that would have done nothing. abraxas was a symptom, NOT the problem. the multiverse was unhinged by g's death. because of thatdeath, abraxas was freed.

😆 that was you?? you won't believe me, but i actually didn't know/remember it was you who started that . . .

sticking to the topic at hand let's start with this:

care to show anyone WHERE this was shown OR been stated to have happened in the arc . . .?

🤨

first, it was in the letter col. yeah, it's a bulletin, so . . .? . . . just who do you THINK wrote it? it's an editor's bulletin. what the hell, you think they just let some guy off the street walk up and write a summary of the story and they stuck it in the letter col?

let's add this one to the list:

could you show all of us the part where multi-eternity is quaking in fear? or a part that tells us he is afraid at all . . .?

nice scan showing reed talked to abraxas. and . . . 😕

🤨

"HE" referred to abraxas. reed had found out about him, and was saying it didn't matter. abraxas thought he knew the knowledge wouldn't help them.

it is sorta funny that you constantly deride others for not showing on-panel feats and exaggerating or lying then you tell us multi-eternity is 'quaking' in fear (and show a SCAN as it it somehow proves your point!) then you tell everyone abraxas is collapsing the multiverse (something else never shown or stated to have happened) and then say g didn't even manage to hurt him at all and show a cropped scan that by-passes the panel that has him screaming!

the hell am i saying -- in retrospect it IS damn funny!!

mm, i seriously can't believe you posted that last scan. the same one i quoted, then said:

now in your scan, it says:

[b]"Until this reality's galactus died. And the doors to the multiverse became unhinged."

in your own QUOTE with your own SCAN you said exactly what i said (well . . . except for the part where you added your own text to the scene, something you would crucify someone for) -- GALACTUS'S DEATH UNHINGED THE DOORS TO THE MULTIVERSE!

was abraxas released? of course. but the multiverse was ALREADY unhinged, set out of whack by galactus's death. how much more clearly does a being with omniversal knowledge have to state things??

please, somewhere, SHOW me -- show all of us -- where it says abraxas is a multiversal destroyer!! reed says that if abraxas gets the UN he could destroy the multiverse, abraxas HIMSELF says once he HAS the UN no soul in the universes could stop him. what does that imply? it implies someone could PREVIOUSLY have had the power to stop him. or shall you dismiss it has 'crappy writing' once again?

do you or do you not have on-panel evidence (that does NOT rely on your interpretation of the story or your OWN speculation) that says abraxas is a mutliversal destroyer?? [/B]

Wow I love you. You pointed out what I been saying all along. He's a sham. You got OWNED Mr. Master.