Paulianity

I used to follow Gnostism. A principle part of it is to use ritualistic spiritual experiences. I know. An example would be the so-called 99th generation descendants of Jesus that came calling here a while back. They invited the people of the forum to attempt one of their 'spiritual' experiences. The truth of the matter was that they were Gnostics.

On Revelation 14:11, I don't understand what you are getting at because for the new system to come the evil of the old must be removed. That is a part of what hell is for.

But the burning of their torment is forever and ever.........the smoke from it is forever and ever. Now how can the Old system be removed as the bible states if this forever and ever is going on?

Because the new system has nothing to do with hell just the saved.

Hell is part of the Old system though, burning and torment is part of the Old system. What's it doing talked about in the New system.

There is a new heavens and a new earth, all former things have passed away. ALL

Then you apparently ascribe to the theory of utter destruction of people in hell. Something usually supported by certain scriptures in Ezekiel and something I plan on looking into more in the future.

Yes there are many denominations that subscribe to the inhalation theory, but what I am saying first that hell isn't real......The Sheol, tartarsus,..etc. just mean grave and sleeping.....As for the ETERNITY of things mentioned in the bible, it is not so, but word pictures to make a statement, I believe. Just as in Rev. and also in Jude..An also I think in Samuel. That same word is used, but does not really mean eternal. It the usage of words for that time period just like we have our usage of this period.

Originally posted by debbiejo
Jesus never taught that one would go the the imaginary hell....

* true... because Jesus never really taught hell as "imaginary"...

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
thats one really odd definition of perfection

* one way of keeping away from sin is to kill its root... there would be lesser percentage of men looking at women with lust if women wear modest apparel...

Originally posted by Gregory
peejayd, I'm not really criticizing Paul, so you don't need to defend him to me.

* very glad to hear that...

Originally posted by Gregory
Although some of his ideas seem distinctly backwards from a modern point of view ("Slaves, obey your masters."😉, and sometimes even appear self-contradictory (in one of his letters, as I recall, he explains how women should dress when they prophesize in church. He then says that women shouldn't speak in church. But people prophesized out loud, so...?) it's not like I get upset at the thought of people using the Epistles for guidance. I'm just suggesting that Christians should guide their life by the Gospels first. Presumably, after all, the disciples and other people who followed Jesus before Paul's conversion managed to be good Christians based soley on Jesus' teachings, without Paul to fall back on.

"If any man thinketh himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him take knowledge of the things which I write unto you, that they are the commandment of the Lord."
I Corinthians 14:37

* i believe that hearing out Saint Paul or any other apostle/disciple of Christ in the Bible, is tantamount of hearing Jesus as well...

Originally posted by debbiejo
Sodom and Gomorrah is still burning? That was eternal also in scripture.

These are word pictures of mental anguish.

* in the Bible, there are things mentioned literal and metaphorical... we should not conclude that the Scriptures are 100% literal or 100% metaphorical... for example:

"And if thy hand or thy foot causeth thee to stumble, cut it off, and cast it from thee: it is good for thee to enter into life maimed or halt, rather than having two hands or two feet to be cast into the eternal fire.
And if thine eye causeth thee to stumble, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: it is good for thee to enter into life with one eye, rather than having two eyes to be cast into the hell of fire."
Matthew 18:8-9

* it would be stupid to interpret this verse as literal... for the whole congregation would be thoroughly disabled...

"And when ye pray, ye shall not be as the hypocrites: for they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have received their reward.
But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thine inner chamber, and having shut thy door, pray to thy Father who is in secret, and thy Father who seeth in secret shall recompense thee."
Matthew 6:5-6

* there are also verses that should be interpreted literal like the manner of praying... 😉

Originally posted by peejayd
"If any man thinketh himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him take knowledge of the things which I write unto you, that they are the commandment of the Lord."
I Corinthians 14:37

* i believe that hearing out Saint Paul or any other apostle/disciple of Christ in the Bible, is tantamount of hearing Jesus as well...

You don't mean that. "Slaves, obey your masters" is a divine decree now? You can't excise it from the Bible, but surly you don't want to elivate it to the same level of "love thy neighbor as thyself"? Much better for Christianity to allow Paul to be mistaken now and then.

Originally posted by Gregory
You don't mean that. "Slaves, obey your masters" is a divine decree now? You can't excise it from the Bible, but surly you don't want to elivate it to the same level of "love thy neighbor as thyself"? Much better for Christianity to allow Paul to be mistaken now and then.

Originally posted by Gregory
You don't mean that. "Slaves, obey your masters" is a divine decree now? You can't excise it from the Bible, but surly you don't want to elivate it to the same level of "love thy neighbor as thyself"? Much better for Christianity to allow Paul to be mistaken now and then.

* i never said anything like that... i meant to prove Jesus and Saint Paul's teachings do not conflict and go hand in hand... 😉

* true... because Jesus never really taught hell as "imaginary"...

* in the Bible, there are things mentioned literal and metaphorical..

Originally posted by peejayd

one way of keeping away from sin is to kill its root... there would be lesser percentage of men looking at women with lust if women wear modest apparel...

you have a very good point from a St Augustine view

but answer me this
without lust how am I to judge the worth of a woman? 😈

Originally posted by debbiejo
How do you know he taught it the way you thought it to be?

* the 4 Gospels... all 4 never tells that hell is imaginary...

Originally posted by debbiejo
Mr, Paul worshipper?

* i do not worship Saint Paul... i obey Jesus' words, he who hears Jesus' apostles also hears Jesus (Luke 10:16) and he who receives Jesus' apostles also receives Jesus (Matthew 10:40)...

* and even if, by mental disorder, i worship Saint Paul, he does not accept worship and blatantly rejects worship (Acts 14:11-15)...

Originally posted by debbiejo
Who gets to pick which is metaphorical and what is not.

* the true preacher sent by God in the endtimes (Daniel 12:9-10, Revelation 1:3)...

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
you have a very good point from a St Augustine view

* we have similar views? Augustine was a Catholic... i'm sorry but majority of Catholic women do not follow I Timothy 2:9...

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
but answer me this
without lust how am I to judge the worth of a woman? 😈

* i appreciate your frankness... 😛

"As a face is reflected in water, so the heart reflects the person."
Proverbs 27:19

Augustine was really into sin and the defintion thereof he also had a lot of interest in the struggle against lust

Augustine wrote a lot of things I respect. One mistake I think many Protestants make is that they disregard Catholic, Mormons, JWs etc. simply by their affiliation. If we what they say is in line with scriptures we must accept it. Only when it is not must we draw a line.

Originally posted by Nellinator
Augustine wrote a lot of things I respect. One mistake I think many Protestants make is that they disregard Catholic, Mormons, JWs etc. simply by their affiliation. If we what they say is in line with scriptures we must accept it. Only when it is not must we draw a line.

I don't disregard Catholics, Jew, Mormons etc. teachings

In fact I don't disregard the teachings of any religion (Philisophically speaking I do not believe in the concept of 1)

How do you know he taught it the way you thought it to be? Mr, Paul worshipper?

You hold a fringe belief that very few people--including religious scholars*--hold. You're entitled to, but must you be rude about it?

Regarding more recent posts, I believe that even Martin Luther recommended the apocrypha as enlightening. Although since even Catholics rarely seem to read it, it's probably hopelessly optimistic to assume Protestants will.

*Don't even think of throwing up a link and claiming it refutes this. If you know anything about religious scholarship, you'll know better then to do that, but I'll preempt it just in case.

Originally posted by Gregory
No Markianity?

I don't understand the point of this thread; when I saw the title, I assumed it was debbijo, and I would have known what she was talking about, but you...?

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
I don't disregard Catholics, Jew, Mormons etc. teachings

In fact I don't disregard the teachings of any religion (Philisophically speaking I do not believe in the concept of 1)

Originally posted by Nellinator
Well, Mark was Peter's scribe so really Markianity is just a sect of Petertology.

P.S. This thread might be taking a shot at the stupid antics of debbiejo, but I'm not going to say for sure.

Actually, I worked that out, the answer is:

Spoiler:
He lost at grab ass.