Putting it all together...spoilers

Ok, um...Chiki, that's a good start. I guess I wasn't more clear...

I wasn't looking for Why it all happens but HOW it all happens. So for example:

1. Why do they kiss?

Will and Elizabeth kiss in the middle of the battle because as they have been fighting they are beginning to realize that they do not really belong together, but they want to be certain of their choice, so they kiss to see how they react.

2. When does Will propose and how would it end up Elizabeth does not say yes?

Will proposes right after the kiss, just to be sure that Elizabeth does not want to still marry him. He is honorable enough that he would marry her even if he no longer feels like he could love her, but he'll be relieved if she says no.

However, before she can say no, they are distracted in battle. Elizabeth gets knocked over, and even though they are no longer engaged, Will still cares about her and is distracted in the battle.

3)Will ends up stabbing the heart. How and why?

When Will is distracted by Elizabeth being knocked over, his opponents take advantage of the moment and stab him fatally in the chest. Will drops to the deck, and Jack sees this happen, as does Elizabeth.

Jack knows that the only way Will could survive such a blow is for Will to stab the heart, so he throws the chest down to Liz, who grabs it when it falls to the deck. She races over to Will and opens the chest for him, and convinces him that he needs to stab the heart in order to live, because she can't bear to lose him even if they are no longer "in love".

4. Why does Elizabeth end up alone for a while, and what is she supposed to be watching over?

Elizabeth decides she's had enough of pirating, but she knows she can no longer go back to her old life. Jack takes her and settles down with her on a deserted island. Occassionally, when the old bug bites them, they go sailing and meet up with Will to swap stories and to hang out.

Elizabeth is waiting on the beach for Will's first visit to land since he became captain of the Dutchman. He's going to meet Elizabeth and Jack's son, whom he's never met, because Gibbs watches over him when Jack and Liz go sailing.

5. What causes Jack to decide that yes, he wants Elizabeth even though she killed him and kissed Will again?

Jack understands how it is to be torn between two things that you love, and he comforts Elizabeth after she and Will have to say good-bye for the final time after the big battle.

She tries to tell Jack that she doesn't think things could work out between them, Jack gently chides her, and makes her think things over during the voyage to Tortuga. At Tortuga, Elizabeth comes to Jack and tells him that she may love him, but she doesn't know if she wants to be a pirate anymore.

Jack is quiet, then tells her that she doesn't need to be a pirate, that he knows a quiet place they can go and relax. So that's how they get to the island. 😄

So now, does anyone else want to take a crack at it? I know mine was fairly lame...

Elizabeth is such a brat at times 😛

She wanted to have adventure and become a pirate, well she got it. And she's not liking it 😄. She said so herself in DMC.

I think this movie will take a great effect on her on how life really is as a pirate and it will give herself a chance to grow up.

Originally posted by Surreal_44
Ok, um...[b]Chiki, that's a good start. I guess I wasn't more clear...

I wasn't looking for Why it all happens but HOW it all happens. So for example:

1. Why do they kiss?

Will and Elizabeth kiss in the middle of the battle because as they have been fighting they are beginning to realize that they do not really belong together, but they want to be certain of their choice, so they kiss to see how they react.

2. When does Will propose and how would it end up Elizabeth does not say yes?

Will proposes right after the kiss, just to be sure that Elizabeth does not want to still marry him. He is honorable enough that he would marry her even if he no longer feels like he could love her, but he'll be relieved if she says no.

However, before she can say no, they are distracted in battle. Elizabeth gets knocked over, and even though they are no longer engaged, Will still cares about her and is distracted in the battle.

3)Will ends up stabbing the heart. How and why?

When Will is distracted by Elizabeth being knocked over, his opponents take advantage of the moment and stab him fatally in the chest. Will drops to the deck, and Jack sees this happen, as does Elizabeth.

Jack knows that the only way Will could survive such a blow is for Will to stab the heart, so he throws the chest down to Liz, who grabs it when it falls to the deck. She races over to Will and opens the chest for him, and convinces him that he needs to stab the heart in order to live, because she can't bear to lose him even if they are no longer "in love".

4. Why does Elizabeth end up alone for a while, and what is she supposed to be watching over?

Elizabeth decides she's had enough of pirating, but she knows she can no longer go back to her old life. Jack takes her and settles down with her on a deserted island. Occassionally, when the old bug bites them, they go sailing and meet up with Will to swap stories and to hang out.

Elizabeth is waiting on the beach for Will's first visit to land since he became captain of the Dutchman. He's going to meet Elizabeth and Jack's son, whom he's never met, because Gibbs watches over him when Jack and Liz go sailing.

5. What causes Jack to decide that yes, he wants Elizabeth even though she killed him and kissed Will again?

Jack understands how it is to be torn between two things that you love, and he comforts Elizabeth after she and Will have to say good-bye for the final time after the big battle.

She tries to tell Jack that she doesn't think things could work out between them, Jack gently chides her, and makes her think things over during the voyage to Tortuga. At Tortuga, Elizabeth comes to Jack and tells him that she may love him, but she doesn't know if she wants to be a pirate anymore.

Jack is quiet, then tells her that she doesn't need to be a pirate, that he knows a quiet place they can go and relax. So that's how they get to the island. 😄

So now, does anyone else want to take a crack at it? I know mine was fairly lame... [/B]

Wow...Surreal...this is the first time I actually enjoyed reading one of your posts....and it's very good....

Originally posted by Chiki Mina
A rather bittersweet ending for Jack Sparrow after so many crap happening to him and then go to sail off "Me thinks I will help my Lizzie, the woman who kissed me and killed me, to raise her and Will's son!! Then me later go and plunder the fountain of youth!"

How fun is that.

I so agree with you Chiki....this is a very bittersweet ending for the money man...this just can't be how it is going to end....because....I want to know that Jack and Elizabeth love each other..and that she and will have grown apart....

That's too Pearl Harborish...why would they have the great and wonderful Jack Sparrow raise Will's son...yuck...and keep his hands off of Elizabeth for 10 years, no...i don't like that at alll...and better yet, Elizabeth keep her lips off of Jack's for 10 years, no way......they are very physically attracted to each other..that would never work out between them....

Originally posted by savvysparrow
HAHAHAHAHAHA!
Has anyone heard anything actually about the way that Norrington snuffs it? I had actually heard that he gets a reprieve, but then some people are saying that he dies, but not in the whimpy way of version 1 of the script.

It's similar but with an added crucial element...

Originally posted by lovethemtigers
I so agree with you Chiki....this is a very bittersweet ending for the money man...this just can't be how it is going to end....because....I want to know that Jack and Elizabeth love each other..and that she and will have grown apart....

That's too Pearl Harborish...why would they have the great and wonderful Jack Sparrow raise Will's son...yuck...and keep his hands off of Elizabeth for 10 years, no...i don't like that at alll...and better yet, Elizabeth keep her lips off of Jack's for 10 years, no way......they are very physically attracted to each other..that would never work out between them....

Why repeat the story of the flying dutchman..again. Would Liz will be willing to wait 10 years for Will's arrival, as well as her son?

If not then Liz can just sail of with Will for the rest of her life..problem solved. Or is it?

You think that Elizabeth would imagine herself being with Will for the rest of her life? Immortality for Lizzie or not, can she still imagine herself spending a lifetime with Will. If you want to marry someone, make sure you picture yourself for the rest of your life with this person. And seeing yourself growing old with him/her.

I think Surreal thinks that im a real dumb ass 🙂

surreal's post was....wow lmao!

but im confused because i thought she didn't like the idea of a jack/liz ending?
or am i wrong???

Well, i loved her theory anyway....very nice!! 😄

chiki, no one thinks your a dumb ass! 😄

we all love ya!!

Who says that Will and Elizabeth would repeat the story of the Flying Dutchman? The story is supposed to go that the Faithful Bride waits 10 years for the Captain to return.

However, we seem to know that for whatever reason, this didn't occur between Calypso and Davy Jones. If it had occurred, he wouldn't have ripped his heart out, and he wouldn't have become a Fish Face. We all know that Calypso was fickle and not faithful to Davy. So the story of the Flying Dutchman has technically not been sucessfully lived out to its fullest potential.

WOW, I'm gone for two hours and look at all the good stuff I've missed! I have to admit, brava Surreal. You've out done yourself.

And Chiki, you're not a dumb ass for stating what you believe and sticking to your guns. You're right, there is a reason those quotes were put into DMC. There's a reason why Will has a touch of destiny, and a reason why fate intervened. It may be that Will and Elizabeth's destiny is that they were not meant to be together. Actually, Surreal's take on the situation sounds like it could be plausible. But the fact is, we really don't know. Kick-ass ending to the writers may be something that is satisfying in terms of story, and not so much in terms of emotion, if that makes sense.

They talked a long time ago about story logic versus emotional logic of writing.

Originally posted by Ericadawn
It's similar but with an added crucial element...

What? Oh no, so he gets snuffed by Bootstrap?! I thought they said he was going to die in a less wimpy way. Hopefully he actually puts up a fight this time.

lovethemtigers: Well, thank you...I think. 😉

Chiki: If I thought ye were a dumb ass, I woulda told you already. 😄 You're not a dumb ass; I didn't explain what I wanted in my post well enough, that's all. 😄

T.Maria: I ship Norribeth, but I realize that it is (sadly) more fanon than canon, so I defend Willabeth, but when the occassion calls for it, I can write Sparrabeth. Multi-talented, I am. 😛

Savvy: Thank you for thinking it sounds plausible. I tried to work out my theory based on the trailer and how Ted and Terry think. I know it's still rough around the edges, but I could probably refine it better later.

As for Norrington, to be fair, in the original script he was not just fighting Bootstrap, who seemed nearly possessed, but eventually he had to fight several members of the crew. When he was distracted by them, Bootstrap stabbed him.

I wouldn't call it wimpy, just really sucky luck to be fighting people who can't die and who seriously want to kill you. But there is one element that has been added to his death (if it's at all true) that you will probably like. I hope it's as good as people have said it is, because nothing will satisfy me on Norrington's death unless it's meaningful and well-thought out. 😄

Ah the faithful bride! I remember that was the name of the drinking place at tortuga right?

Didnt know/remember that it had anything to do with the Calypso/Davy story..

Originally posted by Surreal_44
[b]lovethemtigers: Well, thank you...I think. 😉

Chiki: If I thought ye were a dumb ass, I woulda told you already. 😄 You're not a dumb ass; I didn't explain what I wanted in my post well enough, that's all. 😄

T.Maria: I ship Norribeth, but I realize that it is (sadly) more fanon than canon, so I defend Willabeth, but when the occassion calls for it, I can write Sparrabeth. Multi-talented, I am. 😛

Savvy: Thank you for thinking it sounds plausible. I tried to work out my theory based on the trailer and how Ted and Terry think. I know it's still rough around the edges, but I could probably refine it better later.

As for Norrington, to be fair, in the original script he was not just fighting Bootstrap, who seemed nearly possessed, but eventually he had to fight several members of the crew. When he was distracted by them, Bootstrap stabbed him.

I wouldn't call it wimpy, just really sucky luck to be fighting people who can't die and who seriously want to kill you. But there is one element that has been added to his death (if it's at all true) that you will probably like. I hope it's as good as people have said it is, because nothing will satisfy me on Norrington's death unless it's meaningful and well-thought out. 😄 [/B]

WAIT---what is it? Do you know what the element is that satisfying?

Originally posted by IheartPocky
Ah the faithful bride! I remember that was the name of the drinking place at tortuga right?

Didnt know/remember that it had anything to do with the Calypso/Davy story..

It doesn't, as far as I know. But who knows, maybe the name of the tavern is significant for that reason.

It doesn't really, although it could be looked at as a pun. 😉

The tavern the "faithful bride" is chained up on the sign, I think, which I find kind of funny. 😄

But for the legend of the Dutchman, it fits because the bride must be faithful to the Captain. We don't know all the ins and outs of the legend so far (at least in TnT's world), so I don't know exactly what would have happened if Calypso had been faithful to Davy Jones.

I'm wondering if it means at the end of 10 years if he can give up captaining or continue on for another 10 years, or if having her faithful means he automatically is no longer captain and a new one is chosen.

Or it might be none of those things. Who knows? Well, except TnT and the directors. 😛 At this point I wonder if even the actors know how it would all play out. 😄

Actually that's true. They didn't talk much about Davy's curse or the story behind the Dutchman. Which means however it turns out, it holds huge significance to the story of Jack, Liz and Will.

We do know that Davy's sailing the seven seas for ten years is completely different from the fish face curse. Supposedly the fish face curse is something that Jones brought on himself when he removed his heart.

The land/every ten years story has to do with the curse of the Dutchman. I haven't heard anything about the girl's end of the bargain actually. I know in the Opera he's looking for a woman who can be faithful and go sailing with him.

What was all that business about Fiddler's Green being important?

Yeah, keep in mind that Bootstrap has the final stab but Norrington is actually fighting, probably 3-5 or more actual crew members, but yes, it's what's after the stabbing that's kickass and is so very James!

Fiddler's Green features in an old Irish legend, to the effect that a sailor can find the paradisiacal village by walking inland with an oar over his shoulder until he finds a place where people ask him what he's carrying.[citation needed] This legend may have some of its origin in Tiresias' prophecy in Homer's Odyssey, in which he tells Odysseus that the only way to appease the sea god Poseidon and find happiness is to take an oar and walk until he finds a land where he is asked what he is carrying, and there make his sacrifice.

It is also the subject of numerous songs, including this about a fisherman who is dying at the dockside

As I walked by the dockside one evening so fair
To view the still waters and take the salt air,
I heard an old fisherman singing this song,
Won't you take me away boys, my time isn't long.
Chorus:
Wrap me up in my old oilskins and jumpers,
No more on the docks I'll be seen,
Just tell me old shipmates I'm taking a trip, mates,
And I'll see you someday in Fiddler's Green.
On Fiddler's Green is a place I've heard tell
Where fishermen go if they don't go to hell,
Where the weather is fair and the dolphins do play,
And the cold coast of Greenland is far, far away. (Chorus)
Where The sky's always clear and there's never a gate
Where the fish jump onboard with a swish of their tails,
Where you lie at your leisure, there's no work to do;
And teh skipper's below making tea for the crew. (Chorus)
When you get back in dock and the long trip is through
There's pubs and there's clubs and there's lassies there too,
Where the girls are all pretty and the beer is all free,
And there's bottles of rum growing on every tree (Chorus)
Now I don't want a harp nor a halo, not me
Just give me a breeze an da good rolling sea,
And I'll play me old squeeze-box as we sail along,
With the wind in the rigging to sing me this song. (Chorus)
Just tell me old shipmates I'm taking a trip, mates,
I'll see you some day in Fiddler's Green.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiddler's_Green

I'll take a whack at it, Surreal... though would it be okay if i threw out the "think like the writers" rule and went full out outrageous fanfiction? I'm in a wild mood. 🙂

1. Why do they kiss?

Will and Elizabeth kiss to demonstrate their new pacifist political stance. They have just been chanting "make love not war!" and now decide to demonstrate to their enemies just what that looks like.

2. When does Will propose and how would it end up Elizabeth does not say yes?

The oncoming enemies are skeptical that Will and Elizabeth are serious about spreading peace and love instead of war. They ask for more graphic proof. Will, who has had a lot of experience on a recent visit to Tortuga, doesn't want to make Elizabeth uncomfortable by asking for anything other than a kiss. So he proposes as an alternate method of displaying the "make love not war" theory. Elizabeth pretends to say yes, but says no later in private.

3)Will ends up stabbing the heart. How and why?

The oncoming baddies take time to assert that "make love not war" is a beautiful idea, but completely impractical in today's modern society. They continue to battle. Will gets frustrated, and, thinking back to hunger strikes and peaceful protests in the past, decides to do a metaphorical action to show the baddies what their violence is doing. He seizes the heart and gives a stirring speech about how violence doesn't just kill bodies, it kills hearts and souls. He stabs the heart as the final whammy on his amazing speech. Everyone is shocked. Davy Jones declares that he is glad to die for such a noble cause, and knights Will before dying. Will takes up Captainage of the Flying Dutchman, renaming the ship the "Loving Englishman" because he is English and not Dutch. He vows to spread love and peace across the seven seas.

4. Why does Elizabeth end up alone for a while, and what is she supposed to be watching over?

Elizabeth works for a while among the old baddies, who have been reformed by Will's speech and his new role as Captain. She works extremely hard disbanding the EITC, who have all become hippies. However, after many legal struggles with Beckett, she takes up alcohol, and Will isn't around to make sure she stops when she's had enough. She gets burned out from trying to do too much, and her rep tells her she should enter rehab for her alcohol problem. She calls up Jack to ask him where he usually does rehab, and he suggests he go with her. She says this is good, since she still has his compass and needs to return it to him.

5. What causes Jack to decide that yes, he wants Elizabeth even though she killed him and kissed Will again?

Well, they hang out at the rehab place for a while, before deciding its too confining. Elizabeth concocts a brilliant plan of escape, and they end up back at the Pearl, where they rent all the movies the other has been in. After seeing him in Chocolat, Elizabeth decides she cant resist him anymore and attempts to seduce him. Seeing her cute and somewhat pathetic attempts at seduction, Jack is totally disarmed. He makes a pot of strong coffee and they spend the whole night talking, discussing every nuance of their much-debated relationship and finally spelling out in detail exactly what they feel for each other. Elizabeth confesses her original plan of chaining him to the mast and staying with him, hoping the kraken would follow the longboat and take out her fiance and the crew, so that her and Jack could enjoy some alone time on the Pearl.
After re-watching COTBP and DMC, Jack and Elizabeth conclude the only logical way to end things is with a passionate sex scene and then a shot of them both sailing into the horizon.