Darth Bane Vs Darth Vader

Originally posted by allfg
No I didn't, but the degree in which he can do it isn't comparable to Bane's.

Because you say so?

No he isn't, stop getting this twisted, I've already posted evidence from the NEGtC that explains how the benefits of the orbalisks made him much faster. A tiny bit of added weight doesn't compare to the [b]constant addition of dark side energies, adrenaline, and the strengthening of muscles.[/B]

In the DSSB, Orbalisks make people significantly slower.

By BotS, Bane is much much faster than anyone from the movies.

No... just... no.

Stop with this bullshit (this refers to everyone as well as Kadesh), "force speed" as seen in KotOR doesn't exist, there's no single power that enables a jedi to suddenly go at Superman speeds. All Jedi know how to amp up their speed with the force, but the degree to which they can do so varies on how strong in the force they are. Vader can't simply activate a power and suddenly start moving at speeds far beyond what the eyes can see.

Have you seen Episode I? Or Episode V? Check out when Qui Gon and Obi Wan run away from the blast door when destroyers show up. Or when Luke jumps out of the Carbon freezing chamber. Then get back to me.

I love how Vader fanboys love to attribute Sidious' success and power to Vader, simply because he's his student. The competence of his teacher has virtually no relation on Vader, and if anything, he was likely holding him back more than helping him.

Think of what Revan taught Bane in a short period of time. Sidious is more powerful than Revan, and he taught Vader for 20+ years.

Revan is more powerful than suited-Vader

Sure he is.

Originally posted by Riverollv
Revan is more powerful than suited-Vader

Originally posted by vader11
Isn't bane also more powerful than Vader too?

Originally posted by allfg
No I didn't, but the degree in which he can do it isn't comparable to Bane's.

Originally posted by allfg

No he isn't, stop getting this twisted, I've already posted evidence from the NEGtC that explains how the benefits of the orbalisks made him much faster. A tiny bit of added weight doesn't compare to the [b]constant addition of dark side energies, adrenaline, and the strengthening of muscles.[/B]

Originally posted by allfg

By BotS, Bane is much much faster than anyone from the movies.

Originally posted by allfg

Stop with this bullshit (this refers to everyone as well as Kadesh), "force speed" as seen in KotOR doesn't exist, there's no single power that enables a jedi to suddenly go at Superman speeds. All Jedi know how to amp up their speed with the force, but the degree to which they can do so varies on how strong in the force they are. Vader can't simply activate a power and suddenly start moving at speeds far beyond what the eyes can see.

Originally posted by allfg

I love how Vader fanboys love to attribute Sidious' success and power to Vader, simply because he's his student. The competence of his teacher has virtually no relation on Vader, and if anything, he was likely holding him back more than helping him.

Originally posted by kamhal
I am neither a vader or bane fanboy, but i think that bane has showed himself more impressive with the force and the lightsaber then vader.

Originally posted by xxXAcStylesXxx
You do the exact same thing with Kas'im and Bane.

No I don't.

Except logically the Orbalsiks can't pump constant adrenaline and dark side energy into Bane with out him dieing.

Newsflash: THIS IS STAR WARS!!
Science doesn't always apply, perhaps the force somehow negates these side effects of constant pumping up of adrenaline, who knows?

(I wan't a quote that says it actually does this)

Me and Zephiel have constantly provided you the quote, stop being difficult, and I'm pretty sure it's in BotS anyway which I know you have read.

Bane is still human force user or not the superhuman amounts of power that your claiming is being juiced into his body would put an EXTREME amount of stress on his heart and eventually it'd stop beating.

Except clearly it doesn't, and clearly you're wrong, as we know that Bane eventually left Dxun and found Zannah on Onderon and trained her as a Sith Lord.

And I'm really not seeing why you're just dismissing the fact that Bane's a force user, as that's clearly the most valid explanation as to why the adrenaline hasn't been doing the stuff you've been saying.

Now you've yet to prove exactly how much adrenaline is being given to him, and even still logically he could only last at most about a couple of minutes in a stressful real hard fight (take the one with Kas'im for example) without dieing on the spot from heart failure.

Except the adrenaline is always being pumped into him. It doesn't increase in stressful situations, it remains constant always, whether Bane's fighting or not.

And as I've said in the past if this is a "constant" affect which your claiming he'd be suffering from a number of psychological problems such as hypertension, insomnia which in turn would lead to hallucinations, sever rage, irritability coupled with the fact he has the dark side which can destroy minds, he'd be a mental wreak.

Again, the fact that Bane was able to leave Dxun, find his apprentice on Onderon, and train her as a sith lord before dying while having adrenaline pumped into him constantly for all that time proves you wrong. You're relying on science when it quite frankly means jack in SW.

Now I just want to put emphasis on a couple of points, so you don't come back with the same excuses.

1. The science you're using is clearly wrong, as we know that Bane left Dxun, found Zannah on Onderon and trained her as a sith lord, all while being constantly pumped with adrenaline, and all of that wouldn't have been possible if the stuff that you've been mentioning actually happened. So please, stop bringing the same science bs up, as you're clearly wrong.

2. Whether Bane's in a stressful situation, or not, the adrenaline being pumped into him remains the same, so stop with this bs. Bane can last way more than a minute in any fight (not that he'd need to in this one anyway), stress has no effect.

Originally posted by Kadesh
you ARE a fanboy of bane, especially kotor characters, And sorry kamhal but i can list everything that vader did which is more impressive than bane. And please if you do that prepare to get omgwtfffs pwned by JJ's list as well

You and JollyJim are known as huge fanboys of Vader. AcStyles and Sexy are known as huge antifanboys of Bane. Kamhal, as far as I can tell, is completely neutral, and I'd imagine that Vader1 would actually be more of a Vader fan, yet he still thinks Bane is more powerful. What does that tell you? And JJ's joke of a list hardly compares to mine, don't be silly.

Kopekz thought he might just be the sith'ari aka the ultimate sith and perfect being after only just one conversation with Bane, so he clearly sensed that the force within Bane was on the next level.

Githany believed his power was beyond the level of pretty much any jedi or sith master when he had only received a few months worth of training. The jedi and sith during those times were pretty uber, this speaks for quite a lot.

Kaan, the leader of the BoD was scared shitless of him before he had even met him; this was based purely on descriptions of his power.

When he was 18, he was able to instinctively choke his father to death, which greatly speaks for how prodigious he was, and how strong in the force he was.

He once lost his temper, and was able to instinctively project his fury on an entire room full of people; that speaks for truly how strong he was in the darkside.

He pretty much mastered force lightning after just 1 hour of having learnt the technique, and was even able to create a miniature storm. By BotS, after having grown much more powerful, he would likely be able to replicate this to much greater effect.

He was able to release a wave of energy that was able to collapse the entire 20 story Rakatan Temple, and the temple wasn't even hit by the entire attack (it wasn't hit by the portion that hit Kas'im).

He was able to choke Quordis to death like he was a child, and Quordis was one of the top sith in the BoD, the head of the academy in fact.

He was able to control the power of over 20 sith lords combined with his own to destroy an entire world. This speaks quite a lot for his mastery and control by that point

He was able to pull a moon out of orbit, and pretty casually too given he did it while riding on top of a flying beast.

He knew every move and sequence of the saber staff perfectly (and those are the moves and sequences for all 7 forms, and not just the regular forms, but Kas'im's perfected forms), and thus would be able to wield one to the same effect as Kas'im.

Sirak, the top apprentice at the BoD Academy was damn powerful; he was able to move in blurs, had mastered multiple forms..and Bane was able to completely outclass him in saber combat; his shatterpoint ability was so great that he was able to sense weaknesses in Sirak's style seconds after the duel began, and constantly throughout the battle, but held back because he wanted to humiliate Sirak, and tire him down first, and towards the end, was able to tool him with one masterful manoeuvre; his movements were faster than the eyes of everyone present could see, so fast that it seemed like time had stopped for them.

He as good as defeated Kas'im in a duel; Kas'im was basically The master of the lightsaber; he mastered every from, every primary art of the saber, and then furthered and perfected each form and constantly refined his skills, and Kas'im was only able to defeat him when he used a style that was alien to Bane.

While he was choking Quordis to death, Quordis begged him to stop and let them fight with sabers so that he could die with honour, and Bane said that he would be able to just as easily defeat him with a saber, and Quordis agreed. This implies that Bane would have been able to defeat him in seconds with a saber, and Quordis was one of the top sith of a pretty impressive order.

Bane possesses the orbalisk armour, which constantly pumps dark side energies and adrenaline into his body, and strengthens his muscles. It's also completely immune to the cutting power of even a lightsaber, and covers his entire body, except for his head (the only area where he can be physically affected), and a few joints where the gaps are too small for a lightsaber to pass through anyway.

His knowledge base was also pretty considerable too;

1. He pretty much knew the entire BoD archives inside out.

2. He had received most of the teachings that the then current Masters could offer via Githany.

3. He had gained most of the knowledge found inside Darth Revan's holocron.

4. He was able to access a jedi holocron.

5. He was able to plunder the tomb of Nadd's holocron, and gain access to his holocron.

Bane >>>>> Vader.

Originally posted by Kadesh
And please if you do that prepare to get omgwtfffs pwned by JJ's list as well

Jim's 'list' really isn't that impressive, nor does it prove much of anything considering it's mere feat wars for the most part.

No I don't.

Yeah, simply cause Kas'im taught him lightsaber forms he's now a master 🙄

Newsflash: THIS IS STAR WARS!!
Science doesn't always apply, perhaps the force somehow negates these side effects of constant pumping up of adrenaline, who knows?

For a science fiction series that its (Human) chracters despite being aided by a field of energy, still behave in the way real world humans do that is: getting tiered, fatigue, stress, adrenaline, ect ect. Now simply "LAWLZ tis is teh sStawrs!" is a cop out excuse for:

"I have no counter argument."

As said since he is a dark side force user and the dark side is all he knows, it works against all the knowledge that we have of the dark side of the force that it would in affect "calm" him and slow his heart rate down and keep it from assploading.

What is the typical dark side user fighting like? Rage and hate filled using it to fuel their power, Bane especially does this, now to think that he could use this same side of the force to in affect calm him is absolutely ridicules.

Me and Zephiel have constantly provided you the quote, stop being difficult

So what, I don't remember it. And I seem to have to reiterate myself EVERY TIME I argue with the either of you so you do the same.

and I'm pretty sure it's in BotS anyway which I know you have read.

the parasites were also pumping him with adrenaline and strength. This was a symbiotic relationship based on dark side energies, and now - - after he had absorbed the knowledge within the Sith holocron - - Darth Bane knew there would be enough dark side power for them all.

Thats all it says, there's no constant, he has to feed then for them to even be more then a plate of armor. Now, as I've said logically their not constantly pumping adrenaline, unless Bane can pump Dark Side energy in his sleep(and many other mundane, useless situations) then its not happening.

Except clearly it doesn't, and clearly you're wrong, as we know that Bane eventually left Dxun and found Zannah on Onderon and trained her as a Sith Lord.

Great and tell me Nebaris, how long did those training sessions last? And seriously, how much energy does he have to exert to spar with a 8 year old girl? Oh and how many of those sessions was actually lightsaber training, why couldn't it have been the majority force knowledge? You have NO answer for any of these questions because simply: You don't know.

So, for you to sit here and say: "Well he trained Zannah, so your argument is wrong." reeks of bullshit.

And I'm really not seeing why you're just dismissing the fact that Bane's a force user, as that's clearly the most valid explanation as to why the adrenaline hasn't been doing the stuff you've been saying.

Except in my argument I even put "force user or not" and I'm dismissing the force because mostly all sentient life in the Star Wars galaxy has a heart, and all humans behave in the same biological fashion as we do.

Now, if we go by your original argument which is: Bane gets super humans strength and speed due to the orbalisks pumping constant adrenaline, then Bane would be suffering from the many psychological conditions that has been laid out and in any real hard stressful activity he'd probably die withing minutes.

But, if we go by my explanation (the logical one) that is supported by BOTS, meaning he has to literally feed them energy for them to give him anything in return. (a basic symbiotic relationship) This means its not a constant factor and Bane himself can control the affects of the parasites, also he can when he chooses "stop" them from giving the extra adrenaline before it kills him.

Now all this boils down to is Bane gets a little streghtn and speed advantage to compensate for the weight of the Orbalisks. Big whoop, thats nothing that truly sets him apart from the rest of the SW power house who can use the force to augment their strength to match and surpass Bane's a factor which the DSSB does not take into account.

BTW can anyone post Banes stats?

Except the adrenaline is always being pumped into him. It doesn't increase in stressful situations, it remains constant always, whether Bane's fighting or not.

Again, the fact that Bane was able to leave Dxun, find his apprentice on Onderon, and train her as a sith lord before dying while having adrenaline pumped into him constantly for all that time proves you wrong. You're relying on science when it quite frankly means jack in SW.

Again wrong.

1. The science you're using is clearly wrong, as we know that Bane left Dxun, found Zannah on Onderon and trained her as a sith lord, all while being constantly pumped with adrenaline, and all of that wouldn't have been possible if the stuff that you've been mentioning actually happened. So please, stop bringing the same science bs up, as you're clearly wrong.

Wrong, wrong wrong, wrong, Wrong, wrong wrong, wrong. Dr. Cox

2. Whether Bane's in a stressful situation, or not, the adrenaline being pumped into him remains the same, so stop with this bs. Bane can last way more than a minute in any fight (not that he'd need to in this one anyway), stress has no effect.

Well other then the fact that its wrong, you know this how? Have you seen Bane fight with the Orbalisks on? No. So where does this genius explanation come from? Fact? Pfft yeah right. Nebaris's fanboy mind? Yup, that sounds about right.

AcStyles and Sexy are known as huge antifanboys of Bane. Kamhal, as far as I can tell, is completely neutral,

Not really, I actually liked his PoD portrayal, its the others that give him ridicules powers that annoy me, but that can be blamed on KJA, I don't like any of KJA's characters because other then the fact that their lame, one dimensional and lack any depth what so ever, their horribly overpowered from Exar Kun who went from nobody padwan to "Teh strongest evar!" In about 6 months to Kyp Durron some n00b who can almost match Luke, and yes Banes portrayal in BOTS where Bane becomes in the beginning an idiotic coward who can't use the DS for shit, then by the end of the story he becomes a god. 🙄

and I'd imagine that Vader1 would actually be more of a Vader fan, yet he still thinks Bane is more powerful. What does that tell you?

Um who?

Nebaris I'll respond to that laundry list when I get home from work tonight but most of that has already been beaten.

owned owned owned, all hail Sir acstyles

Not really, I'm just waiting until I can get that quote. Then the ownage will continue.

Originally posted by Apollo Cloud
Not really, I'm just waiting until I can get that quote. Then the ownage will continue.

Originally posted by Apollo Cloud
Not really, I'm just waiting until I can get that quote. Then the ownage will continue.

Your imaginary quote? Either way you lose, I have an argument for each situation whether its constant(if its this it defies the damn basis of a symbiotic relationship) or not.

Dude, stop talking rubbish, I can actually guarantee quote or no quote, your main argument is working under a serious flaw, and will crumble as soon as I choose to point it out. Here's a hint: ''As said since he is a dark side force user and the dark side is all he knows."

Originally posted by Apollo Cloud
Dude, stop talking rubbish, I can actually guarantee quote or no quote, your main argument is working under a serious flaw, and will crumble as soon as I choose to point it out. Here's a hint: ''As said since he is a dark side force user and the dark side is all he knows."

Obviously you can't, since you said it was in BOTS and that was wrong, its probably not in the DSSB either else someone would have corrected me by now, and as for your flaw that Dark Side is all he knows and all he was ever taught, if your going to imply that Revan taught him some magical power to slow his heart rate (Bullshit) then you'd better have proof (which of course you don't) every time Bane gets going in a fight he gets worked into a frenzy using the Dark Side to fuel is power through his hate and rage, again to think that that can calm him is idiotic.

In any case working under the ridicules assumption that it can if fact calm Bane down( the dark side that is) then he takes precious time out of the duel to slow down and calm himself in which Vader (Im using pre suit) will capitalize on and kill Bane, not that he can't anyways.

Obviously you can't, since you said it was in BOTS and that was wrong, its probably not in the DSSB either else someone would have corrected me by now

I never said it was definitely in BotS, all I said was that I was pretty sure it was in it, however I know for a fact that it's in one of those sourcebooks or reference guides.

and as for your flaw that Dark Side is all he knows and all he was ever taught,

Point is, you made a 'ridicules' statement. You're ignoring:

1. The universal powers he learnt at the BoD.
2. The universal and lightside powers he learnt from Revan.
3. The stuff he learnt from the Jedi holocron he came across.

Man up to coming out with sh1t as whack as you did.

if your going to imply that Revan taught him some magical power to slow his heart rate (Bullshit) then you'd better have proof (which of course you don't) every time Bane gets going in a fight he gets worked into a frenzy using the Dark Side to fuel is power through his hate and rage, again to think that that can calm him is idiotic.

You're acting as if Bane is some sort of madman that loses control whenever he fights. He's actually one of the few sith who has actually displayed the mindframe to act pretty passively in a duel. And really, given such obscure techniques as Morichro, it's not hard to believe that Bane would know how to slow down his heart rate. And again, you're working under the assumption that the adrenaline input increases during stressful situations, when it clearly doesn't. As soon as I have the quote, you're getting proven wrong.

In any case working under the ridicules assumption that it can if fact calm Bane down( the dark side that is) then he takes precious time out of the duel to slow down and calm himself in which Vader (Im using pre suit) will capitalize on and kill Bane, not that he can't anyways.

More likely that Bane will end the fight in seconds with his superior skill and technique. And it's funny how you automatically assume that Bane can't multitask.

I never said it was definitely in BotS, all I said was that I was pretty sure it was in it, however I know for a fact that it's in one of those sourcebooks or reference guides.

I'm waiting...

1. The universal powers he learnt at the BoD.

LOL when? Name me one "universal power" aside from TK (in any form)

2. The universal and lightside powers he learnt from Revan.

Name me ONE "universal power he learned from Revan, of and BTW that little poison control used the Dark Side.

3. The stuff he learnt from the Jedi holocron he came across.

When? I've never read ANYTHING about a Jedi Holocron, not only that but why the hell would a Jedi holocron open to Bane?

Man up to coming out with sh1t as whack as you did.

When you stop lying Nebaris.

You're acting as if Bane is some sort of madman that loses control whenever he fights. He's actually one of the few sith who has actually displayed the mindframe to act pretty passively in a duel.

And where the f*ck does that power come from? Oh yeah the dark side, and how do you mainly use the Dark Side? Oh yeah by using your emotions such as hate, rage, and fear.

And really, given such obscure techniques as Morichro,

Um when does he do this? He simply starves himself in the cave on Dxun, then when he emerges he's physically exhausted.

it's not hard to believe that Bane would know how to slow down his heart rate.

Yes, it is since he doesn't know Morichro to begin with

And again, you're working under the assumption that the adrenaline input increases during stressful situations, when it clearly doesn't. As soon as I have the quote, you're getting proven wrong.

Obviously you don't get how it works, Bane keeps juicing them with Dark Side energy then pump him with more adrenaline, it doesn't matter even if it did remain a steady flow where do you think the old burst of adrenaline go? He doesn't just fart them out, since he's as your arguing "constantly" being pumped theres no time for the old bursts to where off and dissipate.

More likely that Bane will end the fight in seconds with his superior skill and technique .

LOL!

And it's funny how you automatically assume that Bane can't multitask.

Yeah he can't because as he himself said if he decided to multitask in the Kas'im duel he'd have been ass raped.