Exar Kun and Darth Maul vs Darth Revan and Anakin Skywalker ep 3

Originally posted by Darth Sexy
OR it means Revan wasn't a full sith, and created his own sith empire to fight the "True Sith". He had no need to recreate or even find the ancient sith empire. Yes, Ragnos crowned him, wow. I guess he's more powerful than Sidious, because Sidious wasn't crowned. At that time he was the most powerful force user in the galaxy. Then Revan came along, destroyed Kun in ancient sith knowledge, to establish what needed to, and basically destroyed the republic and the Jedi, seeing as how there were less than 100 Jedi left after the JCW. Yea, Kun's ejeet. Tool.

I rofled.

Originally posted by Darth Sexy
Hey dickhead, quantify the strongest, because other than Sadow who threw a brick, there was nothing impressive about THOSE ancient sith. You're right, he could create illusions. Golly gosh, that means Aleema was a force god!!! He would have brought the republic down? Really? Not really. Yes, he used his sith ship, he's wonderful, but uber powerful? You make me laugh.

Yeah. Let's see.
Sadow came up with tangible illusions that even fooled Jedi and obviously conquered three planets for him at the same time totally f*cking up the Republic. He was able to create solar flares and rip the core of stars off. Of course...with his ship, yes. And who did built that ship ? And yes. He would have brought the Republic down as this was exactly what he was doing before Gav betrayed him and shot his meditation sphere in case you didn't notice that.

And quantify the strongest ? Going by the fact that even some remaining Ancient Sith was capable to wipe all live on Ambria out with a single Dark Side attack I wonder what you think how powerful those people really were.

Once again, Kun did this this and that, which attributes to his personal 1 on 1 combat how? The machine would have exterminated anything? Good lord Nai, the terms "bullshit assumptions" don't even begin to describe your post.

Hey, idiot. You are aware of the fact that Ulic told the Republic how to stop the Dark Reaper because he knew that every Jedi who would try to do so without his advice would die ? He does the same thing again with Anakin 4,000 years later. So where do I assume something ? It's stated that without Ulic's betrayal nobody would have been able to stop the Dark Reaper so obviously it would have crushed any opposition.

Kun is the only sith that successfully attacked Coruscant, YAY!!! Revan was the only sith that got uber close to defeating the Republic BY FORCE, if not for Malak, which was STATED to be inevitable. Looks like your argument is shit.

Yes. If we ignore Kun with his weaponary and Sadow with his illusions than Revan is the only Sith that got close to defeating the Republic by force. Looks like your argument is even worse than shit.

Gee, Kun tried to destroy the galaxy with sith magic, got close? Nope. Revan did it his intelligent way, and was within a hairsbreadth, you lose again.

Are you really that stupid ? Kun did come close to it in less than six months and only failed because Ulic did betray him twice (first time passing the information about the Dark Reaper to the Republic, second time telling them were to find Kun). As you may have noticed Ulic, just before being captured (betrayed by Aleema), was about to destroy the Republics entire fleet with a single movement. The Jedi were unable to stop the Dark Reaper and normal people weren't any thread for Kun. Who should have stopped him exactly, huh ?

No, they didn't suggest they needed them all. Perhaps you're unaware of how Revan was captured, so before making yourself look uneducated, i'm going to allow you to replay the game. And yet again, Brand said all of the jedi that came before him, from the beginning of time, would make sure Palpatine never came back. Does that mean they needed them all? No. Moot point dumbshit.

Oh they didn't suggest they would need them all ? Then why did they bring them all ? Does make much sense. Really.
And I know that Revan was capture after being hit by "friendly" fire from Malak's ship. The point is that they obviously suggested a small strike team would be enough to do the job. Something that can't be said about Kun otherwise they wouldn't have came with all Jedi in the Galaxy. And I said they wouldn't need them all. They still suggested that Kun would be powerful enough to need them all. In the same fashion Luke in JK:JA says that it might need the entire Academy to stop Ragnos. Most likely that wasn't the case even for Ragnos in flesh and bone. The point is Luke did suggest that Ragnos might be that powerful from what he knew about him.

Please, do tell oh intelligent one, who is capable of stopping Nihilus' force drain WITHOUT being a wound in the force? Oh that's right, nobody. You don't know what technique the dark reaper used, considering Nihilus' technique was unique and learned on Malachor V.

Please, oh dumb idiot. Tell me where this does have any influence on this fight. Kreia stated that Nihilus draining ability can't be learned. So he didn't learn it and Revan also didn't learn it. It's simply a part of Nihilus nature and - quite similar - to the nature of the Exile.

Read POD jackass. Revan's holocron taught Bane the force storm, thought bomb, and "various sith techniques that even sith masters feared to use".

I think you should read POD, dumbass.
"Revan had discovered many of the rituals of the ancient Sith, and as the Holocron's avatar explained their nature and purpose, Bane could barely wrap his mind around their awesome potential. Some of the rituals were so terrible-so dangerous to attempt, even for a true Sith Master-that he doubted he would ever dare to use them"

Where do you see "force storm" here, eh ? The secret of the thought bomb was stored inside the holocron, yes. So what ? That would help Revan in a one on one how exactly. Will he set up a ritual and then kill Kun with an attack that, pointing it out once again, 5-year-old Rain plain and simply resisted ? And notice how it was Bane who feared those rituals and not "any Sith master".

Says the one whose argument includes downplaying the other character.

I'm not downplaying Revan. I'm just pointing out that he had never shown us anything in terms of force use or lightsaber mastery that would put him above Exar Kun.

I am not trying to debate with you, i'm clearly winning a debate with you seeing as how you have no common sense right now, and are still focused on the antedeluvian "kun pwns" crap, that was put down a while ago. Perhaps this would be a GREAT argument to use on Janus' forum.

Wow. So you're not trying to debate while trying to debate and are also not debating while suffering from the delusion that you're winning a debate that you aren't even participating in since you aren't debating. Haha.
And that "crap" was "put down" a while ago ? By whom ? By source material ignoring idiots like yourself who can't even get a grasp on facts ? Guess who cares.

I'll stfu when you try being smarter, jackass.

Why should I try to be smarter ? A lobotomized monkey would cream you in a debate but I'll might give you a call if I'll ever have a reason to remove 90 % of my brain - you might have a chance then.

Oh, and as for NAi making up shit about Kun and Nadd being the strongest Sith in 21,000 years or whatever that is, B-U-L-L-S-H-I-T. Get a clue Nai.

If you will ever learn how to actually read, you might have any base to try and attack my points, idiot.

I said that Nadd called Ulic "one of the great ones" clearly talking about the force users that lived up to the day he's giving that comment and then adds "but there is one even greater than you" refering to Kun. That obviously (at least according to Nadd's oppinion who saw Sadow in action and new the powers Ragnos did wield) puts Ulic on par with the most powerful force users that lived until that day and it puts Kun above them. Not to mention that Ragnos himself did pretty much state that Kun is on his own level. The same Ragnos which command over the Dark Side the DSB labels as "frightening".

OR it means Revan wasn't a full sith, and created his own sith empire to fight the "True Sith". He had no need to recreate or even find the ancient sith empire. Yes, Ragnos crowned him, wow. I guess he's more powerful than Sidious, because Sidious wasn't crowned. At that time he was the most powerful force user in the galaxy. Then Revan came along, destroyed Kun in ancient sith knowledge, to establish what needed to, and basically destroyed the republic and the Jedi, seeing as how there were less than 100 Jedi left after the JCW. Yea, Kun's ejeet. Tool.

Oh what ? Since Revan's knowledge was only coming from the ancient Sith (see POD quote above) I guess he was in desperate need to find Ancient Sith knowledge since without that he would have been...nothing.

Now Ragnos was the most powerful Sith Lord the Ancient Sith Empire had ever seen. But you might also come up with a convincing argument (hahahaha) about how Revan would have archieved more Ancient Sith knowledge compared to the most powerful Dark Lord of the Ancient Sith Empire. The same guy who put Exar Kun on his own level. No...you can't do it.

And please. Did you ever read the DE / EE comics ? Ragnos was personally inviting Sidious to join the spirits of the Dark Lords on Korriban since he dedicated his life to the Dark Side. So, despite of your (as always) WRONG claim, Ragnos did pretty much grant Sidious the Dark Lord title.

And it's nice that you want to grant credit to Revan for the entire JCW. I guess you missed how that went on for additional 5 years after Revan was redeemed already in which Nihilus and Sion did hunt down all the Jedi, correct ? Going by the fact how Dantooine and Coruscant were still intact at the beginning of KotoR, I doubt that there were less than 100 Jedi in the entire Galaxy at that point. Which, even then, would also be pretty funny, going by the fact that Revan already had 1/3 of the Republic's / Jedi's forces under his command after the Mandalorian Wars (adding ships and droids from the SF when he started the JCW).

Originally posted by Borbarad
And I know that Revan was capture after being hit by "friendly" fire from Malak's ship. The point is that they obviously suggested a small strike team would be enough to do the job.

The Jedi Council was so desperate during the events of JCW due to the devastating onslaught of the Dark Lord Revan that they were willing to take any kind of risk to stop him and hence they even were willing to sacrifice Bastilla Shan in the process.

Now, Revan has defeated several high-profile combatants in his life and that Jedi strike team was also no match for him. Remember when Revan later on actually fought against Bastilla Shan in a single combat, he defeated her 4 times in a single duel on the Star Forge despite of the fact that Bastilla Shan was being aided by the power of the Star Forge itself. Which means that Revan was so formidable that the Sith Bastilla Shan (who stated that she is more powerful then all but few Jedi Masters) even with the support from the Star Forge was still no match for him. Now what chance did that Jedi Strike team had against Revan?

And do not forget that Darth Malak attacked Revan at that time for a good reason. He actually wanted to avoid 1 on 1 confrontation with Revan.

And also remember that only 4 Jedi went to confront Darth Sidious, who was too damn powerful as well. And what happened? Sidious decimated 3 Jedi Masters quickly and then gave Windu a fight of his life.

Originally posted by Borbarad
Something that can't be said about Kun otherwise they wouldn't have came with all Jedi in the Galaxy. And I said they wouldn't need them all. They still suggested that Kun would be powerful enough to need them all.

Originally posted by Borbarad
In the same fashion Luke in JK:JA says that it might need the entire Academy to stop Ragnos. Most likely that wasn't the case even for Ragnos in flesh and bone. The point is Luke did suggest that Ragnos might be that powerful from what he knew about him.

Originally posted by Borbarad
Please, oh dumb idiot. Tell me where this does have any influence on this fight. Kreia stated that Nihilus draining ability can't be learned. So he didn't learn it and Revan also didn't learn it. It's simply a part of Nihilus nature and - quite similar - to the nature of the Exile.

Originally posted by Borbarad
I think you should read POD, dumbass.
"Revan had discovered many of the rituals of the ancient Sith, and as the Holocron's avatar explained their nature and purpose, Bane could barely wrap his mind around their awesome potential. Some of the rituals were so terrible-so dangerous to attempt, even for a true Sith Master-that he doubted he would ever dare to use them"

Originally posted by Borbarad
And notice how it was Bane who feared those rituals and not "any Sith master".

Originally posted by Borbarad
I'm not downplaying Revan. I'm just pointing out that he had never shown us anything in terms of force use or lightsaber mastery that would put him above Exar Kun.

Revan has shown his impressive melee skills in following scenarios:

A) He single handedly killed two large Terentatek beasts (who are heavily armored and are immune to Force attacks) and that too easily with is blade.

B) He destroyed Yusanis (the most powerful Echani warrior ever known) in a single combat.

c) Revan played a major role in the destruction of an entire Sith army stationed on the Star Forge. He also killed a high profile "Sith Lord" who during the battle of Rakata Prime had become nearly unstoppable in a saber duel.

Also, Revan was acknowledged to be a Prodigy in the end of KOTOR by the most famous Jedi Master of his age due to his impressive feats in the battle of the Star Forge.

In all, Revan has fought against more deadly opponents then Kun has actually dealt with. Only Ulic Qel Droma was a true worthy opponent that Kun has faced in his entire life.

Originally posted by Borbarad
I said that Nadd called Ulic "one of the great ones" clearly talking about the force users that lived up to the day he's giving that comment and then adds "but there is one even greater than you" refering to Kun. That obviously (at least according to Nadd's oppinion who saw Sadow in action and new the powers Ragnos did wield) puts Ulic on par with the most powerful force users that lived until that day and it puts Kun above them. Not to mention that Ragnos himself did pretty much state that Kun is on his own level. The same Ragnos which command over the Dark Side the DSB labels as "frightening".

The Ancients:

- Ajunta Pall (DLOTS)

And other Ancients have never met Revan, so they never knew about his true power.

KOTOR Age:

- Darth Traya (DLOTS)
- Yuthura Ban
- Darth Malak (he recognizes Revan's true power in the end)

Furture:

- Darth Bane (DLOTS)

Think before you say something.

Originally posted by Borbarad
Oh what ? Since Revan's knowledge was only coming from the ancient Sith (see POD quote above) I guess he was in desperate need to find Ancient Sith knowledge since without that he would have been...nothing.

NOTE: True Sith are not the same Ancients that we know about.

And where did Kun got his knowledge from? I guess that he too was very desperate for Ancient knowledge because without that, he too would have been... you know... nothing! 🙄

Originally posted by Borbarad
Now Ragnos was the most powerful Sith Lord the Ancient Sith Empire had ever seen. But you might also come up with a convincing argument (hahahaha) about how Revan would have archieved more Ancient Sith knowledge compared to the most powerful Dark Lord of the Ancient Sith Empire. The same guy who put Exar Kun on his own level. No...you can't do it.

The so called most powerful Ancient Sith Lord did not had the balls to invade the Republic in his age! 🙄

Talk about impressive display of power and knowledge! idiots!

Originally posted by Borbarad
And please. Did you ever read the DE / EE comics ? Ragnos was personally inviting Sidious to join the spirits of the Dark Lords on Korriban since he dedicated his life to the Dark Side. So, despite of your (as always) WRONG claim, Ragnos did pretty much grant Sidious the Dark Lord title.

Originally posted by Borbarad
And it's nice that you want to grant credit to Revan for the entire JCW. I guess you missed how that went on for additional 5 years after Revan was redeemed already in which Nihilus and Sion did hunt down all the Jedi, correct ? Going by the fact how Dantooine and Coruscant were still intact at the beginning of KotoR, I doubt that there were less than 100 Jedi in the entire Galaxy at that point. Which, even then, would also be pretty funny, going by the fact that Revan already had 1/3 of the Republic's / Jedi's forces under his command after the Mandalorian Wars (adding ships and droids from the SF when he started the JCW). [/B]

And it's nice that you want to grant credit to Revan for the entire JCW. I guess you missed how that went on for additional 5 years after Revan was redeemed already in which Nihilus and Sion did hunt down all the Jedi, correct ? Going by the fact how Dantooine and Coruscant were still intact at the beginning of KotoR, I doubt that there were less than 100 Jedi in the entire Galaxy at that point. Which, even then, would also be pretty funny, going by the fact that Revan already had 1/3 of the Republic's / Jedi's forces under his command after the Mandalorian Wars (adding ships and droids from the SF when he started the JCW).

If you try to fight a conventional war with ships,troopers,etc. then of course it will take longer time to conquer it so you have complete control. When Sidious was killed on the second death star war which was the battle of endor. The battle of Endor was already 4 years after the battle of Yavin. So here we see the most powerful sith lord having trouble keep his galactic empire which was THE government of the galaxy at that time.Now if Sidious were to conquer the galaxy the convential way it would take a years to accomplish.During the Great Sith War Kun aswell as Ulic were in the galaxy already in the galaxy Ulic and the Krath were on the planet Empress Teta and Kun Yavin 4. So they would obviously have an easier time to get to Coruscant and forced the senate to surrender. Revan and Malak were out of the galaxy. You also have to recognize that Revan wanted complete control of the galaxy so it can be strong enough to defend against the true sith.

Originally posted by Borbarad
Yeah. Let's see.
Sadow came up with tangible illusions that even fooled Jedi and obviously conquered three planets for him at the same time totally f*cking up the Republic. He was able to create solar flares and rip the core of stars off. Of course...with his ship, yes. And who did built that ship ? And yes. He would have brought the Republic down as this was exactly what he was doing before Gav betrayed him and shot his meditation sphere in case you didn't notice that.

And quantify the strongest ? Going by the fact that even some remaining Ancient Sith was capable to wipe all live on Ambria out with a single Dark Side attack I wonder what you think how powerful those people really were.

Hey, idiot. You are aware of the fact that Ulic told the Republic how to stop the Dark Reaper because he knew that every Jedi who would try to do so without his advice would die ? He does the same thing again with Anakin 4,000 years later. So where do I assume something ? It's stated that without Ulic's betrayal nobody would have been able to stop the Dark Reaper so obviously it would have crushed any opposition.

Yes. If we ignore Kun with his weaponary and Sadow with his illusions than Revan is the only Sith that got close to defeating the Republic by force. Looks like your argument is even worse than shit.

Are you really that stupid ? Kun did come close to it in less than six months and only failed because Ulic did betray him twice (first time passing the information about the Dark Reaper to the Republic, second time telling them were to find Kun). As you may have noticed Ulic, just before being captured (betrayed by Aleema), was about to destroy the Republics entire fleet with a single movement. The Jedi were unable to stop the Dark Reaper and normal people weren't any thread for Kun. Who should have stopped him exactly, huh ?

Oh they didn't suggest they would need them all ? Then why did they bring them all ? Does make much sense. Really.
And I know that Revan was capture after being hit by "friendly" fire from Malak's ship. The point is that they obviously suggested a small strike team would be enough to do the job. Something that can't be said about Kun otherwise they wouldn't have came with all Jedi in the Galaxy. And I said they wouldn't need them all. They still suggested that Kun would be powerful enough to need them all. In the same fashion Luke in JK:JA says that it might need the entire Academy to stop Ragnos. Most likely that wasn't the case even for Ragnos in flesh and bone. The point is Luke did suggest that Ragnos might be that powerful from what he knew about him.

Please, oh dumb idiot. Tell me where this does have any influence on this fight. Kreia stated that Nihilus draining ability can't be learned. So he didn't learn it and Revan also didn't learn it. It's simply a part of Nihilus nature and - quite similar - to the nature of the Exile.

I think you should read POD, dumbass.
"Revan had discovered many of the rituals of the ancient Sith, and as the Holocron's avatar explained their nature and purpose, Bane could barely wrap his mind around their awesome potential. Some of the rituals were so terrible-so dangerous to attempt, even for a true Sith Master-that he doubted he would ever dare to use them"

[quote]Where do you see "force storm" here, eh ? The secret of the thought bomb was stored inside the holocron, yes. So what ? That would help Revan in a one on one how exactly. Will he set up a ritual and then kill Kun with an attack that, pointing it out once again, 5-year-old Rain plain and simply resisted ? And notice how it was Bane who feared those rituals and not "any Sith master".

I'm not downplaying Revan. I'm just pointing out that he had never shown us anything in terms of force use or lightsaber mastery that would put him above Exar Kun.

Wow. So you're not trying to debate while trying to debate and are also not debating while suffering from the delusion that you're winning a debate that you aren't even participating in since you aren't debating. Haha.
And that "crap" was "put down" a while ago ? By whom ? By source material ignoring idiots like yourself who can't even get a grasp on facts ? Guess who cares.

continued..

Why should I try to be smarter ? A lobotomized monkey would cream you in a debate but I'll might give you a call if I'll ever have a reason to remove 90 % of my brain - you might have a chance then.

If you will ever learn how to actually read, you might have any base to try and attack my points, idiot.

I said that Nadd called Ulic "one of the great ones" clearly talking about the force users that lived up to the day he's giving that comment and then adds "but there is one even greater than you" refering to Kun. That obviously (at least according to Nadd's oppinion who saw Sadow in action and new the powers Ragnos did wield) puts Ulic on par with the most powerful force users that lived until that day and it puts Kun above them. Not to mention that Ragnos himself did pretty much state that Kun is on his own level. The same Ragnos which command over the Dark Side the DSB labels as "frightening".

Oh what ? Since Revan's knowledge was only coming from the ancient Sith (see POD quote above) I guess he was in desperate need to find Ancient Sith knowledge since without that he would have been...nothing.

Now Ragnos was the most powerful Sith Lord the Ancient Sith Empire had ever seen. But you might also come up with a convincing argument (hahahaha) about how Revan would have archieved more Ancient Sith knowledge compared to the most powerful Dark Lord of the Ancient Sith Empire. The same guy who put Exar Kun on his own level. No...you can't do it.

And please. Did you ever read the DE / EE comics ? Ragnos was personally inviting Sidious to join the spirits of the Dark Lords on Korriban since he dedicated his life to the Dark Side. So, despite of your (as always) WRONG claim, Ragnos did pretty much grant Sidious the Dark Lord title.

And it's nice that you want to grant credit to Revan for the entire JCW. I guess you missed how that went on for additional 5 years after Revan was redeemed already in which Nihilus and Sion did hunt down all the Jedi, correct ? Going by the fact how Dantooine and Coruscant were still intact at the beginning of KotoR, I doubt that there were less than 100 Jedi in the entire Galaxy at that point. Which, even then, would also be pretty funny, going by the fact that Revan already had 1/3 of the Republic's / Jedi's forces under his command after the Mandalorian Wars (adding ships and droids from the SF when he started the JCW). [/B]

Lets see, another quote to debunk your pathetic argument.
"After the Jedi Civil War, barely a hundred jedi remained". Yep, your pathetic attempts to discredit Revan with more bullshit, are pretty sad. I'm glad Nihilus and Sion killed a few jedi, maybe you can give them a high five in your wet dreams. I don't care what you "DOUBT", it's what was stated. Shut up, you lose tool.

1. If I'm dumb, that implies i'm an idiot. Unless you're calling me a dumb genius. Either way, stop being redundant, twit.

shut it you gay ******

dude, thats all you could reply to his two posts?

IOU is yet another moron who can't debate for shit. Of course the kid's going to reply with utter stupidity. Gay ******.. LOL... As opposed to a straight ******? I rest my case.

Well, as least he's consistent..."dumb idiot"..."gay f@ggot"...at least he's sticking with the double negatives, lol.

I'm still waiting for Neb to come back...(not really)

"Have you come to take Lord Vader's place"? Oh right, after he said Vader was dead, they said "stay here". I guess your incessant fact distorting argument is shot down again. Not to mention you don't even know if that was Ragnos.

Sexy is right here you don't know if it was Ragnos who said it because there were many sith spirits at the tomb Sidious visited.

http://www.swtimeline.ru/?comics=126&page=175
then on http://www.swtimeline.ru/?comics=126&page=176

There is one quote that sounds like it could be Ragnos speaking here. "How can one who has ruled for a few decades command those who held domion for centuries?" but since there is no picture of the spirits and all the statues look the same you can't say for sure it was Ragnos.

So, despite of your (as always) WRONG claim, Ragnos did pretty much grant Sidious the Dark Lord title.

Originally posted by Darth Sexy
Hey guess what Nai. Sadow fought a total of.... 4 Jedi? Golly gee, he's superman! Nor do you know who built that ship, nor do you know if he would have brought the republic down, which is one of the dumbest assumptions you've ever made, but hey you're on a roll. He caught the Republic by surprise but he didn't have nearly enough forces to win, and when the rebels started to fight for the republic, it was over... Regardless of what Gav did. He didn't come close to defeating the republic, that's your assumption. Revan was the only one who came close.

Excuse me, genious.
Did you even read the comics ?

http://www.swtimeline.ru/?comics=2&page=077
"Coruscant...a world under attack...a city about to fall to overwhelming Sith forces" You were saying ? This is before the illusions vanish.

http://www.swtimeline.ru/?comics=2&page=085
Doesn't look as if Odan was too confident about winning on Kirrek either. And this is after the illusions have already vanished. Battle Meditation has no effect on the Sith Warriors

Did she vie for power in the ancient sith community? DO you know ANYTHING about the sorceress? No you don't. All you know is Sadow's biggest "force" feat is throwing a brick at Ludo. Those two didn't show a damn thing except Ludo shaking a mountain with his anger. I'm sure they both were powerful, but as powerful as you're making them out to be, nor is there any proof that they're uber powerful.

Yeah right. You may explain the following scenes to me, genious:
http://www.swtimeline.ru/?comics=2&page=103
As you see the systems of Sadow's ship are failing and the weapons are also empty. Technically he just has some empty hull there. And now explain to me how this happened:
http://www.swtimeline.ru/?comics=2&page=109

Can it be that the powerless Dark Lord of the Sith did actually manage to come up with quite spectacular explosions himself, going by the fact that the weapons of his ship were actually disabled when he produced that kind of destruction ?

And if they left the dark reaper alone? What would have happened? Oh right, nothing. Please show me where it's stated that without Ulic's betrayal, the jedi would have been wiped out..

Leave the Dark Reaper alone ? How should that have happened as long as Ulic and Kun controlled it ? And please...
"If Dooku restores the Reaper, it will mean the end of the Republic." (Mace Windu on the weapon). Do you need anything else ?

Uh no there's nothing to ignore. What you're saying is "I like Sadow and Kun more so lets ignore Revan even if he DID achieve more". Revan's tactics+force>Kun's weaponry and Sadow's illusions. Sadow attacked the Republic like an ignorant fool, hoping to wipe them out with illusions. Kun thought 20 jedi converts and Mandalorians would wipe out the republic. Revan converted his fellow jedi soldiers to the sith side, then brought the war to the republic, and was within a hairsbreadth of conquering it. Unlike your bullshit, what I said is quoted by the omniscient author. Sorry, looks like YOUR argument worse than shit, if you call this babbling nonsense an argument.

You mean like the omniscient writer I quoted about how Coruscant was about to fall to the overwhelming Sith forces of Sadow before the illusions were shot down. Hmm...

And Kun who had the Dark Reaper which Mace Windu thought to be powerful enough to bring the end of a later Republic with more powerful Jedi and more powerful conventional military ?

What were you trying to argue ?

No dumbass, it's your ASSUMPTION that Kun came close and ONLY failed because Ulic betrayed him. "OMGZ Kun is going to destroy the REpublic with 20 dark jedi converts and some Mandalorians LOL".
Sorry Nai, no. Ulic was about to destroy the Republic's entire fleet? My my Nai I didn't think you were the type to twist facts. Where is there ANY evidence Ulic was about to destroy the ENTIRE Republic fleet? There was no ENTIRE Republic fleet there, and what remained ON Coruscant, was caught by surprise. As soon as the Jedi arrived, it was over.

I'm really getting bored by having to slap you with the actual sources again and again.

a) Kun's Dark Reaper alone was enough to bring the end of the Republic (Jedi included) unless you have more to say on that issue than Mace Windu.

b) Kun's "olololol 20 Dark Jedi" did kill all considerable powerful Jedi Masters in their time. The only one of the Masters still alive and able to move around (considering Ood also survived) seems to be Thon or did I miss somebody ?

c) For Ulic:
http://www.swtimeline.ru/?comics=5&page=046
As the guy who's being force choked by Ulic mentions, the execution of Ulic's command would lead to the destruction of the entire Republic fleet. You were saying ?

As you may notice now without the betrayal of Aleema our dear Ulic would have destroyed the Republic's entire fleet. And as you might notice Kun had designed a superweapon powerful enough to take down the Republic (according to Mace Windu). Anything else to say, Darth Simplemind ?

Same reason why Brand suggested he was going to use every Jedi who ever lived before him to make sure Palpatine never comes back. Does that mean he NEEDED everyone, or better safe than sorry. You don't really understand the details about capturing Revan, considering it was doing a space battle, so if thats your argument go back to the drawing board. And they DIDNT suggest they needed all the Jedi, you're only assuming Kun was that powerful.

I wonder why I should reply to you as you refuse to simply read things I've posted. The point is that the Jedi could have sent all they had against Revan - yet they did send a freaking Padawan and some strike team which didn't include somebody particulary powerful with the exception of Bastila herself.

What's Kun going to do against, hell 20 jedi? Twirl his little baton like a cheerleader and take him out? Sorry he's not that good. You don't see Luke Skywalker taking on 20 Jedi. And now you're bringing in the JA example, which has been debunked so many times. So sad, so sad. I wouldn't even consider Kun to be equal to Ragnos anyways, nor Luke knowing ANYTHING about him.

Urm. Since Kun's freaking spirit force choked the entirety of Luke's students all at once with ease...what would 20 Jedi do against him ? And no. I don't see Luke Skywalker taking 20 Jedi. What I did see were Kyle Katarn and Jaden Korr who did both kill more than 20 Dark Jedi individually. Big deal.

1. If I'm dumb, that implies i'm an idiot. Unless you're calling me a dumb genius. Either way, stop being redundant, twit.

Did you ever have some lessons in linguistics ? You might be aware of the fact that there are so called "figures of speech". You might also be aware of the fact that one of them is called "tautology". You might also be aware of the possible rhetoric use. But to spare you the thinking (as you are quite inable to do that yourself): I just wanted to emphasize how dumb you are, idiot. Got it now ?
And if you want somebody to stop being redundant: You can decide yourself when it's time to keep your mouth close as everything you produce seems to be redundant.

Nihilus' ability can't be learned, except that Nihilus learned it on Malachor V, as a result of what happened, and THAT technique was directly stated to derive from the ancient sith. No, he couldn't teach it to anyone, but he learned it.

Kreia stated that it can be learned by experiencing it in case you manage to survive it. I still don't see any relevance to this debate as Revan didn't experience it hence he can't have learned it.

Hey dumbass, the force storm was a creation by the ancient sith. I love how you throw in a passage, and purposely leave 2 out. Well let me clear it up since you seem to be on the losing side of yet another argument. Hmmm I wonder what Bane did when he gathered on mountain and destroyed the forest. IT was stated that he learned the technique in Revan's holocron, and it was stated that the technique was called a....Force storm? Ooops you lose douchebag. 5 year old Rain resisted it? By god you're a dumbass. Rain was far away from the blast, as were a bunch of jedi. I LOVE how you twist facts around because your argument is pure shit.

So Rain was far away from the blast ?

http://www.swtimeline.ru/?comics=8&page=089

WHAT THE HELL ?
So she was far away from the blast which is why she stands in the damn middle of destruction right on that picture, correct. Did that trees around her went away ? Did the ground spontaneously burst into flames and hence appears burned ? Oh no. Wait. She simply resisted that blast.

Want to throw any more lies in here or are you finished now ? Rain resisted the attack. And there goes you "argument". Retard.

Lightsaber mastery, no, force knowledge, ancient sith knowledge, etc, superior to Kun's. Nobody stated that Revan knew sith magic and sith alchemy.

Oh really ? You want to use POD as source and then consequently ignore it ? "And there was far more than just the ancient practices of dark side sorcerers stored inside the Holocron." WTF ? Dark Side sorcerers whose techniques were stored in Revan's holocron. I'm glad that he didn't use Sith magic which would be what Sith sorcerers actually do.

And before you actually come up with anything on this:
http://www.swtimeline.ru/?comics=7&page=010
"...for Sith Sorcerer Naga Sadow..."

Ups ? OWNED. Anything else you want to tell me ?
And there was more than that in the holocron, yes. Something that is just called "understanding of the Dark Side". I wonder what that should be especially since that "most terrible" stuff that Bane wouldn't use was the stuff those Ancient Sith Sorcereres (*hint* Sadow ! *hint*) left behind.

This is coming from the dumbass that has to completely twist facts around in order to tell himself he knows what he's talking about and he's winning a debate. Good job urkel, you're mediocre.

Yay...let's see. As the source material completely owns you, you might be better off keeping your mouth shut when wanting to accuse people of "twisting facts". I'm mediocre ? Excuse me, Darth Sexy. Are you still suffering from the illusions that you can debate or have the slightest bit of knowledge about the things you want to discuss ? In reality it seems so that this isn't the case.
But of course I'm mediocre compared to you. You are far ahead of me. Of course that's only the case because I'm already about to outstrip you on the debate race track.

Well lets see, I'm creaming you in a debate, you're starting to make shit up and alter facts, so what does that say about your intelligence when compared to a "lobotomized monkey"? Go back to the drawing board urkel, you're killing yourself here.

Yes. Everybody can see the proof for somebody "altering facts" and "making shit up" here. Seems to be you. Or how can it be that I litter the place with sources why you, so far, came up with...urm...nothing to substantiate your claims, not to mention that the source material did proof that you were telling lies here ? Damn. I have to change the comparison. A pile of shit from said monkey would be smarter than you.

No, I think I did a good job attacking your factual points(very rare in your argument), and your distorted ones(99% of the other crap).

No. You just tried to argue the source material and failed.

Wtf does "One of the greatest ones" means? Oh wait it's Nadd's wonderful opinion who lived for a total of... 50 years? So CLEARLY you don't KNOW what he's talking about, and CLEARLY it has nothing to do with the 21,000 years of Jedi history. Shut up. Nor did Nadd know the powers that Ragnos had, seeing as how Ragnos was >>>>>>>>>>>>to Sadow. Ragnos stated Kun was on his own level? Gee, from now on i'm going to count how much bullshit you can add in a"Debate", if you even call what you wrote that.

Right. Double-standarts again. The Revan Fanboy connection is handing in the opinion of all kind of force using dickheads that gave testament to Revan's power. That is the uber proof for Revans force skills.

The opinion of somebody who did experience one ancient Sith, had contact to another Ancient Sith at least (seen on Korriban where one of them tells Nadd that Kun is ready now) and has been around in actual form and spirit form for more than 400 years of course doesn't matter.

Really. The complete dialogue from the comic goes like that:

Nadd: Greetings, Jedi.
Ulic: Freedon Nadd!
Nadd: I am here to warn you... you must not interfere with the work of the Dark Side. The Sith are destined to rise again. Nothing can prevent that.
Ulic: You talk big for a spirit. I thought Arca drove you away.
Nadd: Arca cannot interfere with the dead... Nor can he help you, poor Jedi, to avoid your destiny.
Ulic: What are you talking about?
Nadd: You will be one of the great ones-- and there is another even greater than you.

What do you think is "one of the great ones" refering to as Nadd is speaking about the power of the Dark Side and the new rise of the Sith ? Of course he's calling Ulic one of the great ones (refering to the Sith up to that point) just to call Exar Kun "even greater" in the very same sentence.

And Ragnos ?
"You are the chosen..."
"You may bring to pass the great destiny foretold..."
"You have rightly earned the title Dark Lord of the Sith..."
"We now secure the future when the Sith take their revenge..."

Yadda, yadda, yadda. By the comment that Kun has "rightly earned" the title Dark Lord of the Sith, Ragnos puts him on his own level.

And back to square one with the imbecile..
Kun's knowledge comes from Sadow and ONLY Sadow
Revan's knowledge came from Korriban, AND Malachor V, where Nihilus and Traya learned their drain.
Revan>Kun in knowledge. Sorry big boy.

Indeed. You're back to square one, imbecile.
Kun's knowledge consisted of: Things Vodo told him, things Nadd told him (who was in possession of the most precious source of Ancient Sith knowledge - Adas holocron), everything Sadow left behind (another Ancient Sith), things he found on Ossus (he came to that planet twice), the scrolls he found in Nadd's tomb (ok...also Sadow's work most likely).

And are you once again sighting the f*cking planet-size graveyard and that nice Sith school where Kreia and Revan (supposed) learned that uber force drain that Kun used multiple times ?

Sorry, kid. The size of the knowledge source doesn't influence the amount of knowledge and the value of the knowledge stored there. You again just came up with that graveyard planet where we never saw any "knowledge" being found and Malachor V were the knowledge is limited to basical Sith teachings + the force drain. WTF ?

Awww if I ever took logical reasoning class and if I was a boring pseudointellectual like you morons on that other forum, I'd be inclined to get a woodie by pointing out your various fallacies. Tell me urkel, where did I EVER imply that Revan was on the level of Ragnos? Where did I EVER imply that Revan would have achieved more sith knowledge? Sorry, I never said that, learn to read dumbshit. Palpatine is the ONLY one with more sith knowledge, everybody knows this. And again, Ragnos never put Kun on his level..

You are aware of the funny fact that you can put "Sadow" here instead of "Ragnos" and the result would still be the same ? Namely that Kreia, who had her ass on Malachor for several years, still considered herself a child compared to the Ancient Sith Lords. This talking about people including Sadow ? Even if Kun only got Sadow's entire knowledge that "only", as it seems, puts him above Kreia and Revan already.

And thanks. I'm aware that "logical reasoning" is a totally foreign field for you. You don't have to point that out.

"Have you come to take Lord Vader's place"? Oh right, after he said Vader was dead, they said "stay here". I guess your incessant fact distorting argument is shot down again. Not to mention you don't even know if that was Ragnos.

http://www.swtimeline.ru/?comics=126&page=175
I guess you're not capable of reading properly. Much less capable of actually using common sense. They have a placed reserved for Vader ? How can that be if they didn't at least grant Vader the title Dark Lord of the Sith ? Ups. Aside of that "How can one who has ruled only a few decades can command those who held dominion for centuries" ? Notice that the only Sith Lord known to have ruled for over a century was...Ragnos. Talked yourself into the next dead end, eh ?

Lets see, another quote to debunk your pathetic argument.
"After the Jedi Civil War, barely a hundred jedi remained". Yep, your pathetic attempts to discredit Revan with more bullshit, are pretty sad. I'm glad Nihilus and Sion killed a few jedi, maybe you can give them a high five in your wet dreams. I don't care what you "DOUBT", it's what was stated. Shut up, you lose tool.

Uh. Yes. I was descrediting Revan. Once again: Do I doubt that Revan is powerful ? No. Do I doubt that he's a military genious ? No. Do I doubt that he's capable of taking "the darkest power in the Galaxy" in a one on one situation ? Yes.
We can keep arguing about Revan's archievements again and again. Did he personally, with his own power, take all that Jedi down ? Nope. Does it matter then ? Nope. Did Revan with his own power and nothing else conquer the Republic. Nope. Does it matter then ? Nope.

Got it now ? Anything that can not be attributed to Revan's lightsaber skills or force knowledge directly is worthless for this debate. Unless you assume he's going to kill Kun by floating him with droids and ships from the Star Forge or he takes some HK droid out of his packet to assassinate Kun.

And if you want to go by archievements. Six months after taking the path down to the Dark Side Kun and Ulic almost had the complete Republic's fleet destroyed, and had a superweapon capable of bringing the end of the Republic - designed by Kun. I wonder what they would have without being betrayed and adding another 1.5 years of kicking the living shit out of the Republic and "spreading death on a genocidal level". Hmm...

Originally posted by Borbarad
Excuse me, genious.
Did you even read the comics ?

http://www.swtimeline.ru/?comics=2&page=077
"Coruscant...a world under attack...a city about to fall to overwhelming Sith forces" You were saying ? This is before the illusions vanish.

http://www.swtimeline.ru/?comics=2&page=085
Doesn't look as if Odan was too confident about winning on Kirrek either. And this is after the illusions have already vanished. Battle Meditation has no effect on the Sith Warriors

Can it be that the powerless Dark Lord of the Sith did actually manage to come up with quite spectacular explosions himself, going by the fact that the weapons of his ship were actually disabled when he produced that kind of destruction ?

Leave the Dark Reaper alone ? How should that have happened as long as Ulic and Kun controlled it ? And please...
"If Dooku restores the Reaper, it will mean the end of the Republic." (Mace Windu on the weapon). Do you need anything else ?

a) Kun's Dark Reaper alone was enough to bring the end of the Republic (Jedi included) unless you have more to say on that issue than Mace Windu.

b) Kun's "olololol 20 Dark Jedi" did kill all considerable powerful Jedi Masters in their time. The only one of the Masters still alive and able to move around (considering Ood also survived) seems to be Thon or did I miss somebody ?

c) For Ulic:
http://www.swtimeline.ru/?comics=5&page=046
As the guy who's being force choked by Ulic mentions, the execution of Ulic's command would lead to the destruction of the entire Republic fleet. You were saying ?

As you may notice now without the betrayal of Aleema our dear Ulic would have destroyed the Republic's entire fleet. And as you might notice Kun had designed a superweapon powerful enough to take down the Republic (according to Mace Windu). Anything else to say, Darth Simplemind ?

I wonder why I should reply to you as you refuse to simply read things I've posted. The point is that the Jedi could have sent all they had against Revan - yet they did send a freaking Padawan and some strike team which didn't include somebody particulary powerful with the exception of Bastila herself.

Urm. Since Kun's freaking spirit force choked the entirety of Luke's students all at once with ease...what would 20 Jedi do against him ? And no. I don't see Luke Skywalker taking 20 Jedi. What I did see were Kyle Katarn and Jaden Korr who did both kill more than 20 Dark Jedi individually. Big deal.

Did you ever have some lessons in linguistics ? You might be aware of the fact that there are so called "figures of speech". You might also be aware of the fact that one of them is called "tautology". You might also be aware of the possible rhetoric use. But to spare you the thinking (as you are quite inable to do that yourself): I just wanted to emphasize how dumb you are, idiot. Got it now ?
And if you want somebody to stop being redundant: You can decide yourself when it's time to keep your mouth close as everything you produce seems to be redundant.

Everything I produce seems to be redundant? Please, enlighten me pseudointellectual, since you can't throw any intelligence into this debate.

Kreia stated that it can be learned by experiencing it in case you manage to survive it. I still don't see any relevance to this debate as Revan didn't experience it hence he can't have learned it.

So Rain was far away from the blast ?

http://www.swtimeline.ru/?comics=8&page=089

WHAT THE HELL ?
So she was far away from the blast which is why she stands in the damn middle of destruction right on that picture, correct. Did that trees around her went away ? Did the ground spontaneously burst into flames and hence appears burned ? Oh no. Wait. She simply resisted that blast.

Want to throw any more lies in here or are you finished now ? Rain resisted the attack. And there goes you "argument". Retard. [/B]

Awwww soooo Sorry Nai, POD has retconned Jedi vs. Sith. Rain was nowhere near the blast, you lose again.

Originally posted by Borbarad
Oh really ? You want to use POD as source and then consequently ignore it ? "And there was far more than just the ancient practices of dark side sorcerers stored inside the Holocron." WTF ? Dark Side sorcerers whose techniques were stored in Revan's holocron. I'm glad that he didn't use Sith magic which would be what Sith sorcerers actually do.

Ups ? OWNED. Anything else you want to tell me ?
And there was more than that in the holocron, yes. Something that is just called "understanding of the Dark Side". I wonder what that should be especially since that "most terrible" stuff that Bane wouldn't use was the stuff those Ancient Sith Sorcereres (*hint* Sadow ! *hint*) left behind.

Yay...let's see. As the source material completely owns you, you might be better off keeping your mouth shut when wanting to accuse people of "twisting facts". I'm mediocre ? Excuse me, Darth Sexy. Are you still suffering from the illusions that you can debate or have the slightest bit of knowledge about the things you want to discuss ? In reality it seems so that this isn't the case.

But of course I'm mediocre compared to you. You are far ahead of me. Of course that's only the case because I'm already about to outstrip you on the debate race track.

Yes. Everybody can see the proof for somebody "altering facts" and "making shit up" here. Seems to be you. Or how can it be that I litter the place with sources why you, so far, came up with...urm...nothing to substantiate your claims, not to mention that the source material did proof that you were telling lies here ? Damn. I have to change the comparison. A pile of shit from said monkey would be smarter than you.

No. You just tried to argue the source material and failed.

Right. Double-standarts again. The Revan Fanboy connection is handing in the opinion of all kind of force using dickheads that gave testament to Revan's power. That is the uber proof for Revans force skills.

The opinion of somebody who did experience one ancient Sith, had contact to another Ancient Sith at least (seen on Korriban where one of them tells Nadd that Kun is ready now) and has been around in actual form and spirit form for more than 400 years of course doesn't matter.

Nadd: Greetings, Jedi.
Ulic: Freedon Nadd!
Nadd: I am here to warn you... you must not interfere with the work of the Dark Side. The Sith are destined to rise again. Nothing can prevent that.
Ulic: You talk big for a spirit. I thought Arca drove you away.
Nadd: Arca cannot interfere with the dead... Nor can he help you, poor Jedi, to avoid your destiny.
Ulic: What are you talking about?
Nadd: You will be one of the great ones-- and there is another even greater than you.

And Ragnos ?
"You are the chosen..."
"You may bring to pass the great destiny foretold..."
"You have rightly earned the title Dark Lord of the Sith..."
"We now secure the future when the Sith take their revenge..."

Yadda, yadda, yadda. By the comment that Kun has "rightly earned" the title Dark Lord of the Sith, Ragnos puts him on his own level.

Indeed. You're back to square one, imbecile.
Kun's knowledge consisted of: Things Vodo told him, things Nadd told him (who was in possession of the most precious source of Ancient Sith knowledge - Adas holocron), everything Sadow left behind (another Ancient Sith), things he found on Ossus (he came to that planet twice), the scrolls he found in Nadd's tomb (ok...also Sadow's work most likely).

And are you once again sighting the f*cking planet-size graveyard and that nice Sith school where Kreia and Revan (supposed) learned that uber force drain that Kun used multiple times ?

Sorry, kid. The size of the knowledge source doesn't influence the amount of knowledge and the value of the knowledge stored there. You again just came up with that graveyard planet where we never saw any "knowledge" being found and Malachor V were the knowledge is limited to basical Sith teachings + the force drain. WTF ?

You are aware of the funny fact that you can put "Sadow" here instead of "Ragnos" and the result would still be the same ? Namely that Kreia, who had her ass on Malachor for several years, still considered herself a child compared to the Ancient Sith Lords. This talking about people including Sadow ? Even if Kun only got Sadow's entire knowledge that "only", as it seems, puts him above Kreia and Revan already.

And thanks. I'm aware that "logical reasoning" is a totally foreign field for you. You don't have to point that out.

http://www.swtimeline.ru/?comics=126&page=175
I guess you're not capable of reading properly. Much less capable of actually using common sense. They have a placed reserved for Vader ? How can that be if they didn't at least grant Vader the title Dark Lord of the Sith ? Ups. Aside of that "How can one who has ruled only a few decades can command those who held dominion for centuries" ? Notice that the only Sith Lord known to have ruled for over a century was...Ragnos. Talked yourself into the next dead end, eh ?

We can keep arguing about Revan's archievements again and again. Did he personally, with his own power, take all that Jedi down ? Nope. Does it matter then ? Nope. Did Revan with his own power and nothing else conquer the Republic. Nope. Does it matter then ? Nope.

Got it now ? Anything that can not be attributed to Revan's lightsaber skills or force knowledge directly is worthless for this debate. Unless you assume he's going to kill Kun by floating him with droids and ships from the Star Forge or he takes some HK droid out of his packet to assassinate Kun.

And if you want to go by archievements. Six months after taking the path down to the Dark Side Kun and Ulic almost had the complete Republic's fleet destroyed, and had a superweapon capable of bringing the end of the Republic - designed by Kun. I wonder what they would have without being betrayed and adding another 1.5 years of kicking the living shit out of the Republic and "spreading death on a genocidal level". Hmm... [/B]

Originally posted by Borbarad
http://www.swtimeline.ru/?comics=126&page=175
I guess you're not capable of reading properly. Much less capable of actually using common sense. They have a placed reserved for Vader ? How can that be if they didn't at least grant Vader the title Dark Lord of the Sith ? Ups. Aside of that "How can one who has ruled only a few decades can command those who held dominion for centuries" ? Notice that the only Sith Lord known to have ruled for over a century was...Ragnos. Talked yourself into the next dead end, eh ?

Why would he say Those than? Why not say "than one who has held dominion for centuries?" Looks like those is plural there. Also note even if it was Ragnos talking it proves nothing other than he was one of a few sith spirits there. Since when did the sith spirits need to grant you the title of DLOTS to be one? Vader has been a sith lord since ROTS. If you try to look at the quote with an open mind (which you can't since you have been debating about Ragnos,kun,etc. for a while ) you would realize it could mean how can Sidious who has been DLOTS for decades order previous sith lords now living as a spirits for centuries. But there is no definite proof to prove Ragnos was there since you see anything that proves it was Ragnos. So saying that it was definitely was is wrong since you have a very vague quote which you can interpret many ways. And you never see Ragnos or no mention to his name. The only picture of a spirit doesn't even look like him.

Nai apparently forgot about the BOD, and Bane's Lineage, where EVERYONE is a dark lord.

http://www.swtimeline.ru/?comics=2&page=079

Hmm, what is this 😆?

What about it?

By the way, i wanted to add something:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HETt3T3Zr2s&mode=related&search=

So, it seems Exar Kun himself finds Revan as a powerful guy...

Also http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xgVEIMNKNr8&mode=related&search=

and

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_xDOyeam1s&mode=related&search=