Dimtri,Jedah VS Lord KAIN!!

Started by Violent2Dope21 pages

Originally posted by Burning thought
he has never absorbed souls, also the process of absorbsion is nowhere near as fast as the battle is going to commence, trust me, as much as you love him, the only effect pyron is possibly going to have is gravity, other than that, Jedah and Demitri are Kains concerns in this battle. Also what planet? who said anything about them being on a planet, this could be a random indestructable dimension or it could be Nosgoth
Isn't Nosgoth still a planet? Pyron is the fastest and physically strongest one here, and can bring the pain. 313

Also, Pyron's absorption process is not long at all. Pyron eats life force as well, life force and souls are the same thing.

Originally posted by Burning thought
speed and amount do not neccerily come into consideration, theres only one soul at stake here, Jedahs OR Kains, however Jedah seems to raise his hand, also wheres the proof he does it in seconds flat? the transition of events from the videos youve shown doesnt seem to say seconds, hell if you go by the video he takes a good few seconds with his hand in the air.
He raises his hand...and Kain's soul is now Jedah's.

Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Isn't Nosgoth still a planet? Pyron is the fastest and physically strongest one here, and can bring the pain. 313

Also, Pyron's absorption process is not long at all. Pyron eats life force as well, life force and souls are the same thing.

dont even put it in nosgoth, weve gone through this already the fact is, Pyron wouldnt ever take Nosgoth, and yes hes the fastest and physically strongest, problem is all of these characters except maybe Demitri are not so worried about physical damage.

Originally posted by Violent2Dope
He raises his hand...and Kain's soul is now Jedah's.

Kain Gestures and Jedahs soul is ripped as Kains replaced it...who then continues to murder the other two as Jedah Dohma

Originally posted by Burning thought
speed and amount do not neccerily come into consideration, theres only one soul at stake here,

-Jedahs OR Kains, however Jedah seems to raise his hand, also wheres the proof he does it in seconds flat? the transition of events from the videos youve shown doesnt seem to say seconds, hell if you go by the video he takes a good few seconds with his hand in the air.

-Amazing logic

-The fact that it's been stated that he can absorb souls as a specialty would be a clue and as soon as he gave the command he sucked all their souls. Furthermore, he can instantly snese and draw souls from another universe man. Kain is right their and he swill somehow be faster? Soul Sucking in LOK is slow as hell, Bt.

Originally posted by Classic NES
-Amazing logic

-The fact that it's been stated that he can absorb souls in an instant and as soon as he gave the command he sucked all their souls.

- its true, since when does him being able to take more souls than kain equel him being faster at doing it

- when has this been stated? absorbing yes. The only things ive heard is that he can Take the soul but then after taking the soul he instantly gains power from it, can you please show me where actually ripping out a soul is instant, it just seems so silly especially with video evidence that he instantly took every soul in Makai, where is he exactley when he does it? theres no secret plot device your hiding from me is there.

-what lmao...soul sucking is slow as hell, thing is kain isnt sucking, hes just ripping it out, he doesnt eat souls, his reaver does howver so Jedahs soul will be a good snack, but furthermore what says its slow?

Originally posted by Burning thought
- its true, since when does him being able to take more souls than kain equel him being faster at doing it

- when has this been stated? absorbing yes. The only things ive heard is that he can [B]Take the soul but then after taking the soul he instantly gains power from it, can you please show me where actually ripping out a soul is instant, it just seems so silly especially with video evidence that he instantly took every soul in Makai, where is he exactley when he does it? theres no secret plot device your hiding from me is there. [/B]

-Because he has more notoriety for it, When has Kain been able to suck souls from across Time/Space? Kain soul Sucking ability is faster than jedahs, I'd like to see proof. All Jedah has to do is open his chest up, hell he could absorb the reaver if he wanted.

-I edited, and once again he's Soul Sucking powers works at a much greater range. Therefore he must be able to close distances easier than Kain. I don't have solid evidence for this, but I know that soul sucking in LOK is not instantaneous.

-

Originally posted by Classic NES
-Because he has more notoriety for it, When has Kain been able to suck souls from across Time/Space? Kain soul Sucking ability is faster than jedahs, I'd like to see proof. All Jedah has to do is open his chest up, hell he could absorb the reaver if he wanted.

-I edited, and once again he's Soul Sucking powers works at a much greater range. Therefore he must be able to close distances easier than Kain. I don't have solid evidence for this, but I know that soul sucking in LOK is not instantaneous.

-

he has never done it across time and space, ime not argueing Jedahs power rating on his soul suck, his is far superior to kains, but Kain has to gesture for his spell to work and their souls are ripped out. I can probably not find proof, the games a fast paced action rpg, you dont stand around casting spells all the spells do not have a cast time. Also how would he absorb a metal indestructable sword? hed end up piercing himself and his soul would be reaved....

-range is not equel speed, the battle is not set across time and space from eachother, in LOK the reaver instantly takes souls if you stab, its a quickly action of in and out, as shown in most canon uses of the reaver and ofcourse the gameplay when your enemies are weak, also soul sucking in LOK is instaneous depending on who is doing it, Kain doesnt suck anything, he just gestures and souls are blasted from the body quite viciously, wheras Raziels speed of soul suck as you should know depends on the range, if hes a few metres away its basically instant, if its a good 10 metres+ it will either be extremely slow or he wont even be able to reach it.

Originally posted by Burning thought
he has never done it across time and space, ime not argueing Jedahs power rating on his soul suck, his is far superior to kains, but Kain has to gesture for his spell to work and their souls are ripped out. I can probably not find proof, the games a fast paced action rpg, you dont stand around casting spells all the spells do not have a cast time. Also how would he absorb a metal indestructable sword? hed end up piercing himself and his soul would be reaved....

-range is not equel speed,

-the battle is not set across time and space from eachother, in LOK the reaver instantly takes souls if you stab, its a quickly action of in and out, as shown in most canon uses of the reaver and ofcourse the gameplay when your enemies are weak, also soul sucking in LOK is instaneous depending on who is doing it, Kain doesnt suck anything, he just gestures and souls are blasted from the body quite viciously,

- wheras Raziels speed of soul suck as you should know depends on the range, if hes a few metres away its basically instant, if its a good 10 metres+ it will either be extremely slow or he wont even be able to reach it.

-Yes, he has, He sucked souls from Majigen in is ending. Jedah also drew in Makai from the Human and Makai realm by pin pointing their souls. His Goal was to suck grab all souls from across the universe, and fuse it into the Shintai. That's a universal scale, BT.

-Wow, Range/Distance is in direct proportion to speed. That's why the formula for Speed=Distance/Time.

-They can't move out the way, but since BFR is not allowed. They go to Majigen and Jedah sucks Kain soul or Sucks it from a distance the spell will not reach. Also, it works only on one person at a time.

-Nice contradiction mate, So, which is it?

Originally posted by Classic NES
-Yes, he has, He sucked souls from Majigen in is ending. Jedah also drew in Makai from the Human and Makai realm by pin pointing their souls. His Goal was to suck grab all souls from across the universe, and fuse it into the Shintai. That's a universal scale, BT.

-Wow, Range/Distance is in direct proportion to speed. That's why the formula for Speed=Distance/Time.

-They can't move out the way, but since BFR is not allowed. They go to Majigen and Jedah sucks Kain soul or Sucks it from a distance the spell will not reach. Also, it works only on one person at a time.

-Nice contradiction mate, So, which is it?

- can you show me this please, we know he sucked souls from makai, can you show me him pinpointing the wherabouts of souls and sucking them , Kains mind powers and his invisibiliy can cloak him ime sure but still please show me jedah actually pinpointing

-range and distance means nothing in determinng how fast soul suck is going to work

-kains spell has never been shown a range, hell how are they going anywhere? can you show me where he is able to go to majikan faster than a split second cast of soul ripping, why doesnt Kain just go to Nosgoth then, also can you please prove he is not using magic in any way shape or form when taking souls from a distance? opening his chest and ripping a soul out of a being who is a dimension away is a little unbelivable without proof of him doing it before. All we see is him directing souls into the Shintai in the video, thats moving souls. This doesnt look like a vaccume chest open effect to me at all.

- this is Raziel sucking souls, not ripping one out, altho this may be true for Jedah but not for kain who doesnt drain

sorry for double post but i just realised that i was describing the time and speed it takes for Raziels soul to actually get to him, what were debating or i am at least is the time and speed it takes for attacks to go into effect, the speed of the soul, the soul doesnt seem to go instantly to jedah after he plucks it from its source.

Are Makai all immortal btw?

Originally posted by Burning thought
- can you show me this please, we know he sucked souls from makai, can you show me him pinpointing the wherabouts of souls and sucking them , Kains mind powers and his invisibiliy can cloak him ime sure but still please show me jedah actually pinpointing

-range and distance means nothing in determinng how fast soul suck is going to work

-kains spell has never been shown a range, hell how are they going anywhere? can you show me where he is able to go to majikan faster than a split second cast of soul ripping, why doesnt Kain just go to Nosgoth then, also can you please prove he is not using magic in any way shape or form when taking souls from a distance? opening his chest and ripping a soul out of a being who is a dimension away is a little unbelivable without proof of him doing it before. All we see is him directing souls into the Shintai in the video, thats moving souls. This doesnt look like a vaccume chest open effect to me at all.

- this is Raziel sucking souls, not ripping one out, altho this may be true for Jedah but not for kain who doesnt drain

- Makai sucked into Majigen from earth:

Her dark heart was dark enough that Jedah considered
her a darkstalker and pulled her into the Majigen
When Hannya and Kien moved out, they were sucked into the
Majigen.
Taro the dog in Bishamon's bg was considered a worthy soul and transported to the Majigen.
As Demitri prepared himself to challenge Morrigan, he and his castle were sucked into the Majigen by Jedah.
Jedah sensed this power and deemed them as worthy souls. The two dreamed again on the night their powers awoke. It was a nightmare which was caused by Jedah's summoning. Their souls were instantly transferred to Majigen.

From Makai:

But when Jedah created the Majigen, she and her castle is
pulled into Jedah's dimension.

Let's of course ignore that Jedah was sucking many souls into Majigen acroos the universe:

When Jedah was revived and created the Majigen, she notices the vast amount of souls in the new dimension. She heads towards the Majigen to gather souls to satisfyher Soul Bee's hunger and to satisfy her own hunger as well.
Victor believes that if he collects many souls, he can revive
Emily. So he heads out to the Majigen to collect souls.

Now Let's looks at Jedah's goal:

Jedah had already madeup his mind. His complete revival and the cleansing of all souls. For this, a new stage was necessary. A new dimension, the Majigen.

And most importantly of all:

edah, the lord of the Dohma clan, awoke from his century long sleep. He believes that he is the one that needs to recreate life by fusing all souls into one life form, "the Shintai". To do this, he creates the Majigen
and summons those with worthy souls into his realm.

No, Makai are not immortal, for example, Gallon died of old age after like 32,000 years.

Originally posted by Burning thought

-kains spell has never been shown a range, hell how are they going anywhere?

- can you show me where he is able to go to majikan faster than a split second cast of soul ripping,

-why doesnt Kain just go to Nosgoth then,

-also can you please prove he is not using magic in any way shape or form when taking souls from a distance?

-opening his chest and ripping a soul out of a being who is a dimension away is a little unbelivable without proof of him doing it before. All we see is him directing souls into the Shintai in the video, thats moving souls. This doesnt look like a vaccume chest open effect to me at all.

-So, it encompasses everything? 😬

-They can all teleport instantly, why do thry have to go to Majigen to escape said spell? When they can just teleport out of it's range?

-Go ahead.

-Can't prove a negative, it hasn't been stated to be magic. It's implied to be a natural ability, besides it's been shown that Makai can interact with souls. Jedah is just skilled at that craft.

-I'm sure there many other ways to interact with souls, Bt. Are you gonna ignore how many other Makai have various ways as well.

Originally posted by Classic NES
And most importantly of all:

most of those are BFR, not simply soul removal, its been said so many times morrigan was transported but could not escape, Morrigan is not killed in canon afaik

what do you mean across the universe? when did this happen, you said it was just from one dimension to another, thats not a unvierse

Originally posted by Classic NES
-So, it encompasses everything?

-They can all teleport instantly, why do thry have to go to Majigen to escape said spell? When they can just teleport out of it's range?

-Go ahead.

-Can't prove a negative, it hasn't been stated to be magic. It's implied to be a natural ability, besides it's been shown that Makai can interact with souls. Jedah is just skilled at that craft.

-I'm sure there many other ways to interact with souls, Bt. Are you gonna ignore how many other Makai have various ways as well.

-anywhere kain can know of would be a sensible answer to that, its shown no range at all, its not a projectile this soul wrack, all his doing is ripping a soul from a being and replacing it with his own, more sensible answer would be in his sight range, but since his mind powers are incredible and he would know where they are, he could either follow or rip them back out of the dimension

- teleport instantly, it takes a thought wave to teleport, it takes a thought wave, possibly a small gesture to rip or replace a soul, then you have to take into account can Jedah teleport this fast, ive not seen him teleport quickly, Pyron yes, Demitri i belive he can, but Jedah?

-go ahead? what do you mean?

-...cannot prove it hmm? typical, you cannot prove whether or not it is magic he is using, from what ive read most of the Makai seem to use forms of magic.

-no that depends on many factors, ime not just going to concede this point when something as outrageous as saying he can open his chest and take through vaccume kains soul from a dimenson, possibly two dimensions away...(if kain is in nosgoth, altho in Nosgoth it would not neccerily effect him) not to menstion he has incredible power of his own soul and life and death, his own capabilities i belive (albiet without concrete proof) could protect himself from soul deaths since he wields the reaver emblem of spirit, giving him control over said forces.

can he or can he not use vacume and if so can you show me it, to take a soul? if hes using magic to take the souls from far away or BFR then that is invalid.

Originally posted by Burning thought
most of those are BFR, not simply soul removal, its been said so many times morrigan was transported but could not escape, Morrigan is not killed in canon afaik

what do you mean across the universe? when did this happen, you said it was just from one dimension to another, thats not a unvierse

-Of course they are, that's what I was trying to justify man. He can pinpoint souls from anywhere across the Cosmos and bring them into Majigen. He did not extract everyones souls, except for in his ending where he took souls from Makai and Gave it to "The Shintai".

-Dimension is another term for universe. 😬

Originally posted by Burning thought

-anywhere kain can know of would be a sensible answer to that, its shown no range at all,

-its not a projectile this soul wrack, all his doing is ripping a soul from a being and replacing it with his own, more sensible answer would be in his sight range, but since his mind powers are incredible and he would know where they are, he could either follow or rip them back out of the dimension

-So, you give it unlimited range, because it hasn't been shown to have a range in-game. 😬

-But, what's the range, man? I already showed you that Jedah's rage for BFR and Soul extracting is universal. What's Kains range, homey?

Originally posted by Burning thought

- teleport instantly, it takes a thought wave to teleport, it takes a thought wave, possibly a small gesture to rip or replace a soul, then you have to take into account can Jedah teleport this fast, ive not seen him teleport quickly, Pyron yes, Demitri i belive he can, but Jedah?

-go ahead? what do you mean?

-...cannot prove it hmm? typical, you cannot prove whether or not it is magic he is using, from what ive read most of the Makai seem to use forms of magic.

-Doesn't have too since he's working with Pyron, who can Teleport Jedah along with himself. Like they did in the OVA against Demitri. Also, Jedah could just phase into the ground easily too escape.

-Go ahead as in that will not help him

-And, special abilities as well, it's up in the air as to what it is. And, you cannot prove a negative, that's impossible. Research logic one day, my friend.

Originally posted by Burning thought

-no that depends on many factors, ime not just going to concede this point when something as outrageous as saying he can open his chest and take through vaccume kains soul from a dimenson, possibly two dimensions away...(if kain is in nosgoth, altho in Nosgoth it would not neccerily effect him) not to menstion he has incredible power of his own soul and life and death, his own capabilities i belive (albiet without concrete proof) could protect himself from soul deaths since he wields the reaver emblem of spirit, giving him control over said forces.

can he or can he not use vacume and if so can you show me it, to take a soul? if hes using magic to take the souls from far away or BFR then that is invalid.

We don't know how he does, but the point is he can by shown by the ending. The specifics regarding if he can open his chest are irrelevant since it does not change the fact that he can still do it.

Originally posted by Classic NES
-Of course they are, that's what I was trying to justify man. He can pinpoint souls from anywhere across the Cosmos and bring them into Majigen. He did not extract everyones souls, except for in his ending where he took souls from Makai and Gave it to "The Shintai".

-Dimension is another term for universe. 😬

-So, you give it unlimited range, because it hasn't been shown to have a range in-game. 😬

-But, what's the range, man? I already showed you that Jedah's rage for BFR and Soul extracting is universal. What's Kains range, homey?

-Doesn't have too since he's working with Pyron, who can Teleport Jedah along with himself. Like they did in the OVA against Demitri. Also, Jedah could just phase into the ground easily too escape.

-Go ahead as in that will not help him

-And, special abilities as well, it's up in the air as to what it is. And, you cannot prove a negative, that's impossible. Research logic one day, my friend.

We don't know how he does, but the point is he can by shown by the ending. The specifics regarding if he can open his chest are irrelevant since it does not change the fact that he can still do it.

1. dimensions are diffrent realities connected to other dimensions, the unvierse is what people consider everything in our universe as far as ime concerned anyway, you may confuse people, they may actually think hes across the unvierse when doing this when all hes doing is plucking them through dimensional portals, sort of like what kain can do with the dimenson reaver

2. it has not shown in-game or out of game, so the only way to debate it, is to delete the range equation giving it unlimited range, also now that i think of it, Kain has taken souls from other dimensions also so perhaps we do have a solid range for him, which equels Jedahs, so not even he can escape:

Dark Chronicle-Soul reaver 1 background story
Dipping into the underworld, Kain snared six souls and thus birthed his lieutenants of which I, Raziel, was one. We, in turn prowled the twilight of purgatory building six legions of vampires to pillage Nosgoth.

the underworld is a seperate dimension to the plane Kain is on, at the same time it could also be a completly seperate reality since it has diffrent rules also, wheras Jedah takes soul from another dimension which of similiar physical reality, infact theres already a dimensional breach between Earth and Makai, kain makes his own breach to take souls

3. haha excellent, so were working with Pyrons teleport, that teleport i know, and hes slow, when he puts down the shield the time is far longer than it takes for kain to gesture, ill dig up the video showing it, the time it takes is over a second also Pyron has never entered another dimension, teleport does not equel dimension porting, its not like any being with teleport can go through dimensions, its a seperate ability.

4. wont help him? hell be untouchable in Nosgoth, Jedah wont be able to do anything, Kain on the other hand.....owns them all without them knowing at the same time as comondering Jedah, hell maybe kain will destroy the whole DS universe with Jedahs powers and filter all the souls into Nosgoth for his Reaver, instead of Shintai which will starve how wonderful.

5. cannot prove a negative doesnt mean anything, its still unproven, up in the air as you say, the only thing is he doesnt use vaccume to control the souls for the shintai does he otherwise it would go into him, so hes using a diffrent form, which if its magic will not work on kain

6. it is relevent, if he cannot use his vaccume chest manouvre to claim kains soul, then hes sunk because kain will have his anti physical and magic shell, infact, a Vaccume is of Physical nature....

Lolz, how is this thread still alive?

Kain mostly due to his time manipulation.

Originally posted by Sado-sama
Lolz, how is this thread still alive?

Kain mostly due to his time manipulation.

i dont know, i think kain won several pages back but the DSers are still grabbing hold

Hang in there my pals! We can beat him!

Originally posted by Sado-sama
Hang in there my pals! We can beat him!

😂