Originally posted by Accelthey do if they want to get past wolverine's defense.. sorry, but while a strength-withdrawn punch can certainly knock wolverine back, the punch won't do anything if it isn't packing a lot of power behind it, what I mean is, sure wolverine will fly, but if it doesn't really effect him what good will it do? bleh.. again.. the wonderman feat is a problem because it WAS a sneak attack, and wolverine's claws WEREN'T out, it changes things dramatically... what's worse is that punching wolverine farther away will only give wolverine more time to heal.
The thing is, a Class 100 character doesn’t really need to a full-power haymaker to knock Wolverine back and then proceed to beat on him mercilessly.
Originally posted by Accelit's possible.. honestly I don't know.. it occured during the incident at the vault.. so, whenever that was...
Was the laser incident back when he had problems with his abilities and no self-esteem (which basically hinders his strength)?
Originally posted by Accelgranted, but it is certainly consistant.. even IN CANON wolverine's cut herc with bone claws for god sakes.
And Wolverine only stabbed the Surfer in a ‘What If?’ meaning non-canonical.
Originally posted by Accelwait.. wait wait.... you think having the IG made thanos weaker? 🤨
Thanos could have been due to his having the IG and the fact that he always felt he didn’t deserve such power (same reason every one, including people like She-Hulk, managed to land effective blows on him).
Originally posted by Acceldoes he have instantaneously healing feats? sincerely I haven't seen him do that before.. 😬
As for Wonderman, I’m not sure if claw wounds would really affect someone whose body is composed of ions. Logically, any wounds should just reform instantly.
Originally posted by Zahitwrecker didn't knock wolverine 2 blocks away he threw him two blocks away.. big diff.
a deer knocked wolverine back a ways...
yet wolverine barely moved when namor punched him.
shouldn't namor be able to knock him a few blocks away?
the wrecker did in new avengers not long ago.
namor is a lot stronger than wrecker.if marvel refuses to apply any logic to wolverine,
then what's the point of even debating anything
regarding wolverine anymore?
Originally posted by jinzin
they do if they want to get past wolverine's defense.. sorry, but while a strength-withdrawn punch can certainly knock wolverine back, the punch won't do anything if it isn't packing a lot of power behind it, what I mean is, sure wolverine will fly, but if it doesn't really effect him what good will it do? bleh.. again.. the wonderman feat is a problem because it WAS a sneak attack, and wolverine's claws WEREN'T out, it changes things dramatically... what's worse is that punching wolverine farther away will only give wolverine more time to heal.
While the incident was a sneak attack, it does show that Wolverine is pretty much helpless if a Class 100 continues to pummel his without pause.
Originally posted by jinzin
granted, but it is certainly consistant.. even IN CANON wolverine's cut herc with bone claws for god sakes.
is wonderman really more durable than hulk, thanos, and herc?
Surfer flies through black holes without trouble. Wolverine’s claws shouldn’t even compare to that.
Thanos manages to shrug off attacks from Sky-Fathers without any noticeable damage. Again, Wolverine’s claws shouldn’t even be noticed.
Hulk has resisted adamantium-crushing force from a Dog of War (something which had to have been stronger than Wolverine). He’s also shown to be impervious to those claws in Wolverine’s first appearance (this wasn’t necessarily retconned since the Hulk Wolverine fought when he said he just healed quickly was the Grey Hulk, the weakest version).
And as for the Herc incident, wasn't that in CoC? The same story where Black Widow beat Wonderman?
Originally posted by jinzin
wait.. wait wait.... you think having the IG made thanos weaker? 🤨
Originally posted by jinzin
does he have instantaneously healing feats? sincerely I haven't seen him do that before.. 😬
I personally wouldn’t find stabbing at a collection of ions very useful.
Originally posted by brainchild81
Namor's KOed him before. Namor could also use his speed to grab Wolvies arms and then fly somewhere where there's water, dive in and keep going deeper underwater.
Wolverine's healing factor can steal speed somewhat like the speed force, leaving Namor like a statue.
That's how he beat Quicksilver, speed demon and the gay canadian.
Originally posted by jinzin
"in his area"? what's that? the I'm gonna smash you with a submarine area?plain and simple logan's better in hand to hand, that's not even up for debate really. and yes they will apply for shit here.. funny you bring up kciks and grappling but ignore fist striking, which is going to be effective with 6 admantium blades that are easily capible of making minced meat out the guy.
In brawling...
And fist striking doesn't really help him that much either. Namor is better in that one, and is capable of brushing off his blows (claws or not) or dodging them.
Originally posted by jinzin
sure he does, giests armor, and feats he's pulled off against the danger room level 120. 😐 we've already danced this dance dc.
Geists armor = roughly 10-20 movements.
Namor sculpting entire statue with lot of details = 100+ movements.
Danger Room? What, it took him .03 seconds to cross about one meter? That's like...60 mph? 🤨
Originally posted by jinzin
sure he has, once in their first hand to hand (he was astonished he missed cap) and again while brainwashed (twice during that fight, both from behind) cap was still able to react.
In their first fight, he was 18 and thought he was hitting an normal human...and are you saying that brainwashed people fight as fast and good as normal? 🤨
Originally posted by jinzin
you implied it, when riceroost claimed namor would have to fight flawless if he were to go hand to hand, you didn't really argue that point with him..
And why would he have to fight flawless? He can take cuts with ease, pain has NEVER bothered him (except against Wolverine in Invaders, badly written as it was). Or is every attack Wolverine lands automatically going to hit Namor's weakest place and there is nothing he can do about it? 😂
Originally posted by jinzin
you hope he has... but wolverine has been in enough fights to be able to land those shots, or adapt to something else.. even so, wolverin can aim for legs, arms, neck, face, chest... he doesn't have to aim at the stomach.. which he doesn't have issues hitting anyway...
If he aims for legs, arms, face or chest, he isn't doing much damage. Lots of bones there.
Originally posted by jinzin
no he hasn't.. he's had plenty of chances to dodge hits from the likes of daredevil, cap, wolverine, black panther, thing, tiger shark, spidey.. all of these guys have landed blows.. wolverine will land blows... it's that simple.
Yet, he never goes all out or seriously against those guys...when he does, they are one-shotted or he simply dodges their blows. Etc. why Spider-Man had to rely with sneak attacks against him, why Hulk doesn't land a single hit when he goes seriously against him,
And Wolverine will land blows. But again, they won't really do much, unless he hits him in stomach or neck. And Namor has been trained in swordfighting, he knows that protecting neck and stomach are important...
And again, Namor only needs to land one blow and continue.
Originally posted by jinzin
so now your argument is that he let wolvie do it? either that or he was helpless to react.. like when cap slugs him in the face or kicks him in the gut... etc etc...
Except that only time Cap has landed an fair hit on him is when he was mindcontrolled or young.
Originally posted by jinzin
funny coming from a guy who conviently forgets about crucial aspects of the anti-wolverine feats he posts... ie wonderman's sneak attack. ei wendigo's healing factor. ie injured/or pre-beaten up logan. ie logan not fighting back... etc etc etc... hypocrite. pffft..
Crucial aspects that apply to entirely different points then what I was discussing. Wolverine was still helpless against those Class 100 blows whether he was fighting them or not, weakened or not, surprised or not...he simply isn't able to attack an Class 100 unless they stop hitting him for reason or another. Forum fights are not written for selling good fights, so Namor would not be punching him only once or twice...
Originally posted by jinzin
and there are also quite a few where he fails to pull them off as well.. the point remains his strength is a deminishing factor out of water..period.
Diminishing factor, but not when he has his suit on, or if he is straight out of water...which he won't be.
Whoops, I forgot. Namor needs to be weakened in order to Wolverine to do anything...
Originally posted by jinzin
I'm not ignoring them, I just don't think they're anywhere near as impressive as you wish they were. still it's hard to take your feats at face value.. i mean you're trying to uphold that namor/cap's shield incident as if that's the standard and it's not.. in every hand to hand fight cap's been in with namor he's landed hits... when namor wasn't holding back because he was on a mission to kill he was using his abilities and strength better than he usually does, cap still landed blows... when sinestro made the N2 clone which was again using namor's ablities better than namor usually uses them cap landed blows, when controller took namor's powers for himself and tried to fight cap, cap landed blows, when cap was disguised and namor attacked him thinking he was a true enemy, cap landed hits, he reacted to namor's attacks.. same thing when namor was super pissed at cap and attacked him full out.
Erm...when was Namor on mission to kill? Was the mission to kill Captain America?
And in the disguise fight...Cap landed ONE blow on Namor when he was behind him...Namor landed three blows, which one was on head to head collision, and Namor was faster on that...
N2 clone wasn't Namor, neither it had the same abilities and it was not using Namor's powers better. It was knocked out by three blows from Cap, therefore it was also weaker...
Controller doesn't fight like Namor, doesn't really apply there either...
And which one of the fights was when Namor was super pissed at Captain America?
Originally posted by jinzin
the lava men were all over namor, he wasn't outspeeding them whatsoever, cap showed he was faster by comparison in hand to hand, same thing with the stone men...
hell even in his fight with hercules. herc admitted namor was faster and herc STILL got his mits on the guy...
About the Lava men...ehh what? Namor clearly outspeeded them underwater and they snuck up on him...
About Cap, even when Namor was cocky and young, he STILL landed more blows on Cap then vice versa...when he was adult Cap landed zero blows...
About Hercules which fight are you referring? The fight on the beach? Or the fight on the island where Namor was dehydrating? Or the fight underwater where Namor easily won? Or the one where Namor was sent by Zeus to hit Hercules.
Originally posted by jinzin
show me this untouchable namor.. show me where he's easily been able to avoid blows from an adversary not only as fast as wolverine but as skilled... show me that this has been something that has happened repeatedly.. show me that this is something that's consistent with his character... show me this untouchable, class 7 fighting god that you think he is... I haven't seen it.. plain and simple.
I'm not saying he is untouchable. But most attacks Wolverine would do would be ineffective against Namor who is taking the fight seriously and not fighting like an idiot. He IS Supreme Commander of a entire army. Only places he would be able to do any damage that would slow down Namor would be either stomach or neck.
And again, you are forgetting that he can fly.
I'm fine agreeing to disagree too. But if you post stuff, I logically assume that you want to debate... 😉