Originally posted by Melnorme
I just wanted to post this image here, courtesy of DarkCrawler, to illustrate how I think Namor would most likely use a truck, tree, or bus to slam Wolverine. It makes sense, using the logic of Bloodlust, because it is extremely efficient, while leaving little to no room for a counterattack (as Jinzin suggested Namor would necessarily do for some reason, standing next to Wolverine with a truck in his upstretched arms).In any case, here it is...ownage! Thanks again, DarkCrawler! 🙂
wansn't something I said WOULD happen.. just called into question that it COULD, or may.. the same way you implied wolverine would be standing there waiting for it..
Originally posted by Melnorme
Yes, but my point is that if he can get knocked out by gunshots and elk and Daredevil (up to three examples now)
it's not so much that the're automatically dispissed... what's really dismissed is the circumstances leading up to them...
the gunshot KO had MULTIPLE circumstances going for it to work...
wolverine was delusional
his healing factor wasn't working right due dehydration lack of food and other fluids...
mentally he was going crazy seeing people that weren't there and even forgot he WAS wolverine by that point...
the dd incident WASN'T a KO....
so that leaves the elk incident as the only viable piece of evidence you have.. which was contradicted in the comic EXACTLY before it when wolvie took a beating from sasquatch and wasn't KOed... nor even slowed down for his next fight....
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
"The speed of a nerve impulse varies with the type of nerve impulse the nervous system is sending. Some signals such as those for muscle position, travel at speeds up to 119m/s. Nerve impulses such as pain signals travel slower at 0.61m/s. Touch signals travel at speeds of 76.2m/s. If you are reading this at this moment and thinking at the same time, which some people may have trouble with, thought signals are traveling at speeds ranging between 20 and 30 meters per second."Thought is not near instantanious.
over a given distance.. but because the distance for nerve sparks to relaps in your brain is so minuscule it is....
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
If you were travelling with thought speed through space, you would not get pretty far in a short time.
as I said over a given distance... the distance for the relaps for your brain is not quite NEAR the same... 😕
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
But you see, Namor thinks faster then normal humans...
namor being quick witted? yeah.. intelligent? yeah... since when have his electrical relapses been shorter than that of a humans? 🤨
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
It is, if he hasn't never displayed such speeds in the comics...
wolverine strikes an ogun possessed viper.. he bolts an nearly exits the stratosphere in a flash... he's displayed it...
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Thus, he is never hitting him with full power on their encounters...
wrong... namor goes for plot devices to hit wolverine in both encounters.. pretty clear indication he isn't holding back...
would you grab a baseball bat to hit an opponent with if you were holding back? 🤨
Originally posted by DarkCrawlerspeedforce, and two guys who have fighting speeds equivolent to running speeds.. not the same as namor...
Ah yes. Flash can run fast, but he is real slowpoke in fights...same with Northstar...and Quicksilver...
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
namor's more comparible to rhino or thing.. both can run down full speed cars.. both don't outspeed peak human's in fights....Namor is too fast for Wolverine. He is just never written correctly...
never? now you're arguing for how you think the characters SHOULD be and not for how they're presented.. not a solid argument ❌
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
On the first fight, Wolverine did minor damage. On the second fight, Namor was fighting like an retard.
wolverine did damage namor didn't... namor resorted for a plot device.. wolverine did not....
second fight: all speculation on your behalf...
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
He goes easy on Wolverine...it's pretty simple.
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Kind of a stupid way to refer at someone's arguments....
I'm reffering to your arguments because they are flawed.. and how they are flawed kinda stupid that you can't catch on....
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Not really maybe...Namor actually dodging Wolverine, instead of standing in one place would make it lot harder to Wolverine....
hasn't before.. 😕
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
So...they both have moved faster, but only the low-end feats apply?
not at all.. do you see me calling out pis every time you post a namor feat? or attempting to discredit it as soon as you r bring one up?
no.. that's not my style... for every feat you post I post a similar one for wolverine...
they both have a wide range of high end and low end feats.. but many of their more impressive feats put them at a comparible level in the fight which is why I keep reminding you of the two direct comparison's that he have to use as evidence here...
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Namor has dodged LOT faster things then Wolverine...should be quite clear that he can dodge Wolverine.
those things that are faster than wolverine.. are not wolverine and do not have the same factors, abilities, presicion, experience, skill, etc etc that wolverine possesses..
wolverine has dodged things that move too fast for the human eye to register.. he should be able to dodge namor right? wrong.. it's not that simple..
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Upgraded in strength...that doesn't decrease.
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Do they break it multiple times?
actually many rifles do break it at least several times...
some up to ten... the short burst rifles used in weapon x were probably breaking it about 5 (that's a low estimate considering weapon x tech) and wolverine described the bullets as if they were in slow motion...
DC, those speeds you reference from what I can tell are only a comparison of the conduction speed of action potentials in different nerve fibres, which depends on their myelination and diameter. They don't really give an accurate representation of the time it takes for thought.
Jinzin I think you mean synapse rather than relapse - a relapse is something a recovering alcoholic has. And at synapses neurons transduce electrical signals into chemical signals which cross the synaptic cleft and are transduced back into electrical signals. These transductions do create latency. Also most thought processes require multiple synaptic activation over different regions of the brain.
The fact that Namor can fly and swim at high Mach speeds while still maintaining the ability to process the information they are receiving while moving at these speeds dictates his thought process are more adept than people who cannot move at Mach speeds.
Originally posted by xmarksthespot✅
DC, those speeds you reference from what I can tell are only a comparison of the conduction speed of action potentials in different nerve fibres, which depends on their myelination and diameter. They don't really give an accurate representation of the time it takes for thought.Jinzin I think you mean synapse rather than relapse - a relapse is something a recovering alcoholic has. And at synapses neurons transduce electrical signals into chemical signals which cross the synaptic cleft and are transduced back into electrical signals. These transductions do create latency. Also most thought processes require multiple synaptic activation over different regions of the brain.
The fact that Namor can fly and swim at high Mach speeds while still maintaining the ability to process the information they are receiving while moving at these speeds dictates his thought process are more adept than people who cannot move at Mach speeds.
I think Xmarksthespot alrady said something about the nerve impulse speed.
Originally posted by jinzin
wolverine strikes an ogun possessed viper.. he bolts an nearly exits the stratosphere in a flash... he's displayed it...
Ok...when did he fight at those speeds?
Originally posted by jinzin
wrong... namor goes for plot devices to hit wolverine in both encounters.. pretty clear indication he isn't holding back...
would you grab a baseball bat to hit an opponent with if you were holding back? 🤨
Again.
Full power punch topples a multi-thousand ship:
http://img352.imageshack.us/img352/6122/namorfeat966tw.gif
When Namor punches Wolverine (300 pounds), he hardly goes back meter.
I think it's QUITE CLEAR that he doesn't fight close to full power on their encounters.
That, or he is weakened about a hundredfold on their fights.
Originally posted by jinzin
speedforce, and two guys who have fighting speeds equivolent to running speeds.. not the same as namor...
Umm...hitting dozen times in less then a moment...when pressure is hindering him.
Originally posted by jinzin
never? now you're arguing for how you think the characters SHOULD be and not for how they're presented.. not a solid argument ❌
If a guy can move his hands fast enough to catch missiles, swim at Mach speeds, jump from meteor to meteor, how come his hands suddenly move slower at the fight?
Originally posted by jinzin
wolverine did damage namor didn't... namor resorted for a plot device.. wolverine did not....
Namor was clearly weakened...I mean, he can topple ships with one punch, but Wolverine hardly goes back a meter. 😆
Originally posted by jinzin
second fight: all speculation on your behalf...
Bad writing. Namor didn't dodge, even though he has shown speed and skill enough to dodge things that are faster then that. Oh yeah, and he was just standing in one place.
Which he isn't going to do that in here.
Originally posted by jinzin
his need to resort for grabbing a plot device dictates otherwise...
Hey, maybe he wanted to make the fight more different? I post it again.
Full power punch topples a multi-thousand ship:
When Namor punches Wolverine (300 pounds), he hardly goes back meter.
I think it's QUITE CLEAR that he doesn't fight close to full power on their encounters.
Originally posted by jinzin
I'm reffering to your arguments because they are flawed.. and how they are flawed kinda stupid that you can't catch on....
Flawed in which way?
Originally posted by jinzin
hasn't before.. 😕
Even though he has speed and skill enough to do that...bad writing.
The fact that he was weakened on the first fight (and he dodged Wolverine few times there - didn't you see how his claw swipes did no damage at all) and on the second fight Namor was seemingly lost all the memory of the earlier fight and forgotten how to dodge, it's not valid at all...😕
Originally posted by jinzin
not at all.. do you see me calling out pis every time you post a namor feat? or attempting to discredit it as soon as you r bring one up?
Alright.
Originally posted by jinzin
no.. that's not my style... for every feat you post I post a similar one for wolverine...they both have a wide range of high end and low end feats.. but many of their more impressive feats put them at a comparible level in the fight which is why I keep reminding you of the two direct comparison's that he have to use as evidence here...
Namor is underwritten on each fight. First fight - he is barely strong enough to make Wolverine fly with each punch/he is going easy on him, second fight - he doesn't dodge Wolverine, even though he is cabable of that. He just stands there like an idiot. So, every time he fights Wolverine, we should just assume that he losts all his fighting skills, his strength is reduced by 90%, his speed by 70% and Wolverine will have all his full powers, strength and speed? 🤨
Originally posted by jinzin
those things that are faster than wolverine.. are not wolverine and do not have the same factors, abilities, presicion, experience, skill, etc etc that wolverine possesses..
It doesn't really matter...skilled or not, his fist moves maybe with top speed of half a Mach...which is childs play to Namor. Bruce Lee is skilled, but do you think he would have a prayer to hit Quicksilver?
Originally posted by jinzin
wolverine has dodged things that move too fast for the human eye to register.. he should be able to dodge namor right? wrong.. it's not that simple..
Because Namor can move his fists and legs on faster speeds then humans, so no...😕
Originally posted by jinzin
did I say it did decrease in water? 🤨
aquaman is not namor.. do you see me using sabretooth to prove a claim here? I mean damn at least sabes is in the same universe.. 🙄
Try put a hundred pound weights on your hands and legs. Move them. Now move without them.
Did you move faster? Yes...😕
Doesn't the same apply to Namor?
Originally posted by jinzin
actually many rifles do break it at least several times...some up to ten... the short burst rifles used in weapon x were probably breaking it about 5 (that's a low estimate considering weapon x tech) and wolverine described the bullets as if they were in slow motion...
I think the highest speed of rifle bullets is Mach 5...
Namor's broken it more.
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Full power punch topples a multi-thousand ship:
http://img352.imageshack.us/img352/6122/namorfeat966tw.gif
fresh from water toppling boat in water.. not quite as impressive as the claim makes out.. icebergs do that too.. 😕
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
When Namor punches Wolverine (300 pounds), he hardly goes back meter.I think it's QUITE CLEAR that he doesn't fight close to full power on their encounters.
That, or he is weakened about a hundredfold on their fights.
it's not clear when he grabs a plot device to hit wolverine with.. 😕
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Umm...hitting dozen times in less then a moment...when pressure is hindering him.
no clear indication of how long a moment is..
no clear indication that the upgrade in water is reciprocal..
wolverine's had similar feats during training sessions, fights, etc...
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
If a guy can move his hands fast enough to catch missiles, swim at Mach speeds, jump from meteor to meteor, how come his hands suddenly move slower at the fight?
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Namor was clearly weakened...I mean, he can topple ships with one punch, but Wolverine hardly goes back a meter. 😆
then it's speculation.
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Bad writing. Namor didn't dodge, even though he has shown speed and skill enough to dodge things that are faster then that. Oh yeah, and he was just standing in one place.Which he isn't going to do that in here.
actually... I've heard this again and again and again.. namor didn't dodge, namor didn't dodge...
you act as if he didn't try.. but evidence suggests otherwise.. in both fights namor suffers glancing blows that cut his skin but don't gut him.. we KNOW wolverine can gut namor, and things of equal or greater durability... so his durability wasn't deflecting the blades or reducing the cut.. thus it must have been namor getting partially out of the way.. thus he WAS trying to avoid the claws strikes... it just didn't help much when in brawl mode with wolverine...
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Hey, maybe he wanted to make the fight more different?
that's it? that's the best you got? 😂
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Flawed in which way
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Even though he has speed and skill enough to do that...bad writing.
no.. he's proved he has the speed/skill to do that with things that are not wolverine.. but he has yet to prove such concerning wolverine himself...
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
The fact that he was weakened on the first fight (and he dodged Wolverine few times there - didn't you see how his claw swipes did no damage at all) and on the second fight Namor was seemingly lost all the memory of the earlier fight and forgotten how to dodge, it's not valid at all...😕
again.. via my observation.. we was trying to dodge..
again... dd caught the saem swipe he was okay.. he must be as durable as namor or something 😱
ooooor maybe it's that namor only caught a glancing blow as the action would certainly suggest...
wolverine incidently dodged namor just as many times...
and how weak was he and from what?
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
It doesn't really matter...skilled or not, his fist moves maybe with top speed of half a Mach...which is childs play to Namor. Bruce Lee is skilled, but do you think he would have a prayer to hit Quicksilver?
actually he might... cyber, gambit, and wolverine have all done the same...
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Because Namor can move his fists and legs on faster speeds then humans, so no...😕
you didn't get the point of what I said did you?
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Try put a hundred pound weights on your hands and legs. Move them. Now move without them.Did you move faster? Yes...😕
Doesn't the same apply to Namor?
it's contingent on how fast he gets weaker being out of water..
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
I think the highest speed of rifle bullets is Mach 5...Namor's broken it more.
and this is well documented?
Originally posted by jinzin
fresh from water toppling boat in water.. not quite as impressive as the claim makes out.. icebergs do that too.. 😕
This was done on land:
http://img488.imageshack.us/img488/1989/funfact24pe.gif
You never really explained to me how the same would not apply to Wolverine.
Originally posted by jinzin
it's not clear when he grabs a plot device to hit wolverine with.. 😕
Full power Namor hit:
http://img488.imageshack.us/img488/1989/funfact24pe.gif
And when Namor hit Wolverine, he was not chucked away, even though he weighs three times less then Hulk.
Pretty clear that he was not hitting him with same force that he hit Hulk...😕
Or do you claim that gravity doesn't apply to Wolverine?
Originally posted by jinzin
no clear indication of how long a moment is..no clear indication that the upgrade in water is reciprocal..
wolverine's had similar feats during training sessions, fights, etc...
Namor is not faster in water in anything else then swimming speed...
I know it, I have read quite a lot comics with Namor on them.
Originally posted by jinzin
slower than his moving speed... there's no reason why not.. in that same notion, hulk can catch missiles.. can hulk catch wolverine? not often...
But can sometimes.
A question. If there would be a forum fight with Captain Cold VS Flash, would you say that Cpt. Cold wins? Because he has hit flash before...
Originally posted by jinzin
in spite of lack of any real evidence that states it? 😕
then it's speculation.
"Full power Namor hit:
http://img488.imageshack.us/img488/1989/funfact24pe.gif
And when Namor hit Wolverine, he was not chucked away, even though he weighs three times less then Hulk.
Pretty clear that he was not hitting him with same force that he hit Hulk...😕
Or do you claim that gravity doesn't apply to Wolverine?"
Not speculation. Full power hit from Namor sends Hulk flying,
Hulk's weight >> Wolverine's weight
Wolverine is not sent flying by the force of punch,
Conclusion: Namor was not hitting him with near to full power.
It's strange that you can't grasp simple concepts like these...
Originally posted by jinzin
actually... I've heard this again and again and again.. namor didn't dodge, namor didn't dodge...you act as if he didn't try.. but evidence suggests otherwise.. in both fights namor suffers glancing blows that cut his skin but don't gut him.. we KNOW wolverine can gut namor, and things of equal or greater durability... so his durability wasn't deflecting the blades or reducing the cut.. thus it must have been namor getting partially out of the way.. thus he WAS trying to avoid the claws strikes... it just didn't help much when in brawl mode with wolverine...
http://img107.imageshack.us/img107/6735/namornotdodging6ks.gif
If that looks like a man trying to dodge, you need to check your eyes.
This is Namor dodging:
http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/9575/namorspeedfeat311ch.gif
This is not:
http://img107.imageshack.us/img107/6735/namornotdodging6ks.gif
Funny...for some reason Namor felt like he could take a full stab from Wolverine's claws...even though he has faced him before...
What were the words again...oh yea, bad writing.
Originally posted by jinzin
that's it? that's the best you got? 😂
"It's not stated anywhere it's not there".
Hey, that grass is green!
"Sorry, captions don't state it, it's not there."
"Hey, Namor has black jacket!"
"Sorry, captions don't state it, it's not there."
"Hey, Wolverine is not flying back from that punch, even though Namor's punches have sen Hulk fly back easily! He must not be hitting Wolverine with full power!"
"Sorry, captions don't state it, it's not there."
Originally posted by jinzin
doh
you... aren't familiar with debate are you?
Been here a year longer then you...yes, yes I am....
Originally posted by jinzin
no.. he's proved he has the speed/skill to do that with things that are not wolverine.. but he has yet to prove such concerning wolverine himself...
http://img117.imageshack.us/img117/1018/namordodgingwolv0hq.gif
Originally posted by jinzin
again.. via my observation.. we was trying to dodge..
Your observation is not correct...
This is a Namor dodging:
http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/9575/namorspeedfeat311ch.gif
This is not:
http://img107.imageshack.us/img107/6735/namornotdodging6ks.gif
Originally posted by jinzin
again... dd caught the saem swipe he was okay.. he must be as durable as namor or something 😱
ooooor maybe it's that namor only caught a glancing blow as the action would certainly suggest...
wolverine incidently dodged namor just as many times...
and how weak was he and from what?
Just came back fighting Hylth'ri and saving Iron Fist...plus was suffering from anti-mutant virus that robbed him of his wings among other things...
Originally posted by jinzin
actually he might... cyber, gambit, and wolverine have all done the same...
And had their skill to do anything with it?
Was it classic (175 mph) or upgraded Quicksilver?
Originally posted by jinzin
you didn't get the point of what I said did you?
Alright, Namor can move his fists/legs faster then human eye can register...
Or can it register Mach speeds?
Originally posted by jinzin
it's contingent on how fast he gets weaker being out of water..
Maybe six-ten hours...
Originally posted by jinzin
and this is well documented?
The rifle bullet speed, or Namor's hand/leg moving speed?
Is the Weapon X rifle bullet speed documented?
Originally posted by jinzin
it's not so much that the're automatically dispissed... what's really dismissed is the circumstances leading up to them...the gunshot KO had MULTIPLE circumstances going for it to work...
wolverine was delusional
his healing factor wasn't working right due dehydration lack of food and other fluids...
mentally he was going crazy seeing people that weren't there and even forgot he WAS wolverine by that point...
Originally posted by jinzin
the dd incident WASN'T a KO....
Originally posted by jinzin
so that leaves the elk incident as the only viable piece of evidence you have.. which was contradicted in the comic EXACTLY before it when wolvie took a beating from sasquatch and wasn't KOed... nor even slowed down for his next fight....
Regardless, your hand-waving doesn't simply undo what you have already conceded is a viable piece of evidence. Therefore, we can only conclude that Wolverine has been knocked out by less powerful blows than Namor's, and therefore can be knocked out by Namor.
Originally posted by jinzin
never? now you're arguing for how you think the characters SHOULD be and not for how they're presented.. not a solid argument ❌
I also fail to see how this is not a solid argument. We have a defined "rules of engagement" for these forums that is necessarily different from what we see in comics. We examine applicable feats, compare strengths and weaknesses, and omit plot elements that story writers love to put in. It is in this last part that we necessarily diverge from what is seen in comics. In the comics, Storm can beat Wonder Woman, Spider-Man can beat Superboy, and Wolverine can beat Lobo. On these forums, that would all be laughed at as utter nonsense, because we recognize authorial fiat when we see it.
Can you recognize how your position is the one which is not solid, now?
Originally posted by jinzin
you act as if he didn't try.. but evidence suggests otherwise.. in both fights namor suffers glancing blows that cut his skin but don't gut him.. we KNOW wolverine can gut namor, and things of equal or greater durability...
