Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Ahh, the very sneaky but ultimately cowardly get-out clause.If I know, you'll blame it on that. Very often used technique. Cowardly though.
Because...I couldn't POSSIBLY know how by playing it. I DEFINITELY must've googled it.
-AC
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
All about the hypocrite train, AC is driving.
Truth be told.
Originally posted by Batman-Prime
We disagree on the kind of skill? You know what I believe even though I didn't post my definition of skill in that post? Well, well let's see.A great example of skill.I made it bold for you so you might see it better this time. So where is now my "believe" my interpretation of skill in this sentence, tell me this?
So again, just the way you are. You know son, maybe you should read, think and then post. Learn it. 😱
skill
1   /skɪl/ Show Spelled[skil] Show IPA
–noun
1.
the ability, coming from one's knowledge, practice, aptitude, etc., to do something well: Carpentry was one of his many skills.
2.
competent excellence in performance; expertness; dexterity: The dancers performed with skill.
3.
a craft, trade, or job requiring manual dexterity or special training in which a person has competence and experience: the skill of cabinetmaking.
Wherein does it state that skill is a natural ability?
It states, plently of times, that it's something you gain. A skill.
Natural skill is a misnomer. If you have to learn skill, how can it be natural? Natural UNDERSTANDING combined with LEARNED skill, is what makes say...a great artist. Natural understanding of S.F. doesn't exist because it's not the Chaos Theory. It's a FIGHTING game, ANYONE can understand it.
Please consider the definitions of words. They're nice and there for a reason.
Even the second one: competent excellence in performance. Why is Daigo competently excellent? Because of the skills he has learned. They were not gifted to him, it is 17 years of playing the game obsessively.
-AC
Originally posted by Alpha CentauriHow is that hypocrisy? Do you know the meaning of that word?
All about the hypocrite train, No End is driving.-AC
Originally posted by Alpha CentauriWhy do you keep mentionin' Daigo, he's been beaten by people who have played for less than 17 years. He's beaten people who have played for more than 17 years.Even the second one: competent excellence in performance. Why is Daigo competently excellent? Because of the skills he has learned. They were not gifted to him, it is 17 years of playing the game obsessively.
-AC
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
skill
1   /skɪl/ Show Spelled[skil] Show IPA
–noun
1.
the ability, coming from one's knowledge, practice, aptitude, etc., to do something well: Carpentry was one of his many skills.
2.
competent excellence in performance; expertness; dexterity: The dancers performed with skill.
3.
a craft, trade, or job requiring manual dexterity or special training in which a person has competence and experience: the skill of cabinetmaking.Wherein does it state that skill is a natural ability?
It states, plently of times, that it's something you gain. A skill.
Natural skill is a misnomer. If you have to learn skill, how can it be natural? Natural UNDERSTANDING combined with LEARNED skill, is what makes say...a great artist. Natural understanding of S.F. doesn't exist because it's not the Chaos Theory. It's a FIGHTING game, ANYONE can understand it.
Please consider the definitions of words. They're nice and there for a reason.
Even the second one: competent excellence in performance. Why is Daigo competently excellent? Because of the skills he has learned. They were not gifted to him, it is 17 years of playing the game obsessively.
-AC
Nice and all but what exactly has this to do anything with my interpretation of skill? I didn't gave one, I gave an example. So my boy, since this was your only excuse to start this ridiculous and meaningless rant about the meaning of the word skill, it's nothing more then a dodge because you are aware of the fact that you had nothing, just an childish wish to be annyoing.
facepalm
No need to dodge any longer. We know what skill is. We also know that my example of skill, showed what it should, skill. And since we both know this, let me ask, why did you felt the need to attack something that was only an example, something that didn't contradict anything you or i believe?
Originally posted by Alpha CentauriYou just made a ridiculously ignorant comment about the vid B-Prime posted, that's how I know you haven't played it.
Factually prove that.Beyond all doubt and deniability, factually prove I have never played it.
-AC
If you did, what color is the disc on the console you played on or did you play it on Live or PSN? Cuz if you did I would give you a pass.
Originally posted by Juk3n
thats where the natural talent and SKILL come into play.
Nah, no it's not. All you have to do is play the game for 17 years.
somethings people have a natural aptitude for.
Not everyone can play at NBA level basketball, regardless of how much they practice.
Not everyone can drive at Formula 1 level , regardless of how much they practice.
Regardless of what the popular myth says, practice does NOT make perfect.
There are some people that will NEVER beat me at street fighter regardless of how much they practice.
Naturally skilled may not appear on that google dictionary list, but it exists and we see examples of it everyday. There are children who have had singing lessons since they were 3 years old until the age og 15, can they sing as well as michael jackson did as a child? HELL NO, why? Natural skill and talent regardless of how much they practice much?
No End, you just defeated your own argument.
You either KNOW I haven't played it...or you THINK I haven't. You have said TWICE now, that you KNOW I haven't.
If you KNOW I haven't, you could supply ME with proof. If you're just unsure, you would require me to answer questions...like now.
So, do you KNOW I haven't, or do you BELIEVE I haven't?
Secondly, I've never owned it. My friend ownsed it. I didn't look at the disc.
OH, let me save you the time. "See, you haven't played it!". Taking a leaf out of Batprime's book.
Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Nice and all but what exactly has this to do anything with my interpretation of skill? I didn't gave one, I gave an example. So my boy, since this was your only excuse to start this ridiculous and meaningless rant about the meaning of the word skill, it's nothing more then a dodge because you are aware of the fact that you had nothing, just an childish wish to be annyoing.facepalm
No need to dodge any longer. We know what skill is. We also know that my example of skill, showed what it should, skill. And since we both know this, let me ask, why did you felt the need to attack something that was only an example, something that didn't contradict anything you or i believe?
Do we agree on the kind of skill? Do we agree with the application of the word? No, we do not. If we did, the debate would not be happening. It seems a safe bet that therefore, we do not agree.
Mudslinging doesn't impress me. It might impress others, it doesn't impress me.
Dodge what? I'm not dodging anything. You posted the video, said it was "skill" in the sense of how YOU are using the word. I knew this, I disagree, so naturally I disagreed WITH you.
It's not rocket science.
Originally posted by Juk3n
somethings people have a natural aptitude for.Not everyone can play at NBA level basketball, regardless of how much they practice.
Not everyone can drive at Formula 1 level , regardless of how much they practice.
Regardless of what the popular myth says, practice does NOT make perfect.
There are some people that will NEVER beat me at street fighter regardless of how much they practice.
1. They CAN play basketball and do all the same moves/motions if they try, though.
2. Same as above.
It's not about practice making perfect. Why do you people still not get my point?
Originally posted by Juk3n
Naturally skilled may not appear on that google dictionary list, but it exists and we see examples of it everyday. There are children who have had singing lessons since they were 3 years old until the age og 15, can they sing as well as michael jackson did as a child? HELL NO, why? Natural skill and talent regardless of how much they practice much?
Why can't they sing as well?
Michael Jackson's range wasn't tremendously technical or brilliant. He had a nice voice, that's down to the voice he HAPPENED to have. What a ridiculous comparison.
-AC
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Even the second one: competent excellence in performance. Why is Daigo competently excellent? Because of the skills he has learned. They were not gifted to him, it is 17 years of playing the game obsessively.-AC
Incorrect, Daigo is as good as he is because of his skill, knowledge AND natural Talent. That's what separates Great Players from Elite Players.
Think of this very carefully, during Jeff's Interview of SFII, he openly stated why Tomo Ohira was the BEST. He said that not only was Tomo's skill level the highest, but also his reaction time (meaning gifted natural) to counter you was far higher and greater then everyone else.
This is why Tomo was able to make WW. Ryu, a Ryu who is absolute garbage, dominate in the WW Era. This is why Tomo, playing Ryu/Guile never got into the BS lockdowns of CE. Bison during the Champion Edition Era.
Tomo's natural ability to learn from a mistake on the fly is what truly separated him from the rest of the pack. Just listen to Jeff's story of Tomo beating Jeff's then Unstoppable Blanka.
Tomo got hit once with jumping fierce and figured out instantly "I can't shoot a Hadouken", he then baits Jeff instant to jump upward and throw a firece, Tomo then counters perfectly with a Inv. 1-Frame Hurricane Kick to punish Jeff in the air.
All of the above was done on the FLY, Tomo hadn't even played Jeff's Blanka up until that point, and was able to figure out how punish Jeff accordingly where as everyone else for the past 2+ months were getting ocved by his HF. Blanka.
Yes, that is Natural Talent right there, along with the highest of Skill Level, you simply "can't" be as good as Daigo by just simply playing the game 24/7, even with the Best. You also have to have that natural edge that gives you an advantage along with your skill that puts you too that level.
Just watch Alex Valle vs John Choi back in SF:A2, nobody could do what those guys were doing, and they were all playing the same amount of time, and putting in the same effort. It's just that Valle and Choi in their prime were naturally better then everyone else, plus they played the game just as much as everyone there.
You simply cannot expect "experience and dedication" will get you there, natural talent plays a part.
Why do you think nobody to this day has played to the level of Jang Iksu in the world of Tekken...Nobody, no, not even Nin, for as good as he is. Jang Iksu was doing things with Mishima's that only Jang Iksu could do, much like how Tomo was doing things with Ryu and Guile that only Tomo could do.
Hard Work+Dedication+Practice+Best Competition Around+Natural Talent plays a part into why certain fighting game players are simply the Best.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Do we agree on the kind of skill? Do we agree with the application of the word? No, we do not. If we did, the debate would not be happening. It seems a safe bet that therefore, we do not agree.Mudslinging doesn't impress me. It might impress others, it doesn't impress me.
Dodge what? I'm not dodging anything. You posted the video, said it was "skill" in the sense of how YOU are using the word. I knew this, I disagree, so naturally I disagreed WITH you.
It's not rocket science.
-AC
Do we agree? How could you know, you don't know after all how my definition of skill is.
This "debate" is happening not because of the meaning of skill, i never gave one, it happens because of you ridiculously childish need to compensate something. It's a debate about me not giving any interpretation of skill. facepalm
You do it all the time, that's why it isn#'t impressive, though you can't even tell the difference it seems.
No. Wrong. I never said that this is an example of natural skillz, you are born with nor did i say this is an example of skills you learn over time. 😬
You know nothing, you have your opinion and you desire to be annoying, quit it, it's pathetic.
I pity you AC, i really do.
Originally posted by FWahMaN
Hit boxes and frame data I'm not too familiar with
Hit Boxes are super important in SF because of the placing of knowing where you know you can hit your opponent and when they can hit you. This is vital in a game such as SF is simply because of things like footsies. If you play Ryu and you know the exact distance in which you can stuff out your opponents best pokes from maximum range, then it gives you a significant advantage, not only that, but even knowing where to hit on the hit box of a character is really important too, because depending upon whether you want to land it higher, mid, or super deep is incredibly important depending upon the situation, there's alot more, but that's just off the top of my head.
Alot of variables with it, and frame data, I feel is important for both SF and in this case, Tekken a well. Due to Tekken's +Frame and - Frame advantage, knowing frame data is super essential, as by example, if someone throws a -14 frame attack and you block it, and your Jin, you have them at a -14 frame advantage, meaning Jin can land an Ewgf because it takes 13 frames to animate, meaning you'll hit the opponent before they can recover because they are at -14 frame disadvantage.
It works in similar ways in SF as well, but slightly differently however the same rules apply as well, because their are some blocks to where you the player will be at an advantage, however somethings you do may put you at a disadvantage and room for punishment.
Originally posted by JustFrame
Incorrect, Daigo is as good as he is because of his skill, knowledge AND natural Talent. That's what separates Great Players from Elite Players.Think of this very carefully, during Jeff's Interview of SFII, he openly stated why Tomo Ohira was the BEST. He said that not only was Tomo's skill level the highest, but also his reaction time (meaning gifted natural) to counter you was far higher and greater then everyone else.
That's not natural talent, that's a learned skill. Go on.
Originally posted by JustFrame
This is why Tomo was able to make WW. Ryu, a Ryu who is absolute garbage, dominate in the WW Era. This is why Tomo, playing Ryu/Guile never got into the BS lockdowns of CE. Bison during the Champion Edition Era.
Because of a learned and honed skill?
Yes, that's my point. Bring on a counter any time now.
Originally posted by JustFrame
Tomo's natural ability to learn from a mistake on the fly is what truly separated him from the rest of the pack. Just listen to Jeff's story of Tomo beating Jeff's then Unstoppable Blanka.
NATURAL ability to learn from a mistake? Do you NOT understand how ridiculous you are being?
That's not natural ability. That's making a mistake and not making it again. It's LEARNING.
Originally posted by JustFrame
Tomo got hit once with jumping fierce and figured out instantly "I can't shoot a Hadouken", he then baits Jeff instant to jump upward and throw a firece, Tomo then counters perfectly with a Inv. 1-Frame Hurricane Kick to punish Jeff in the air.All of the above was done on the FLY, Tomo hadn't even played Jeff's Blanka up until that point, and was able to figure out how punish Jeff accordingly where as everyone else for the past 2+ months were getting ocved by his HF. Blanka.
Yes, so it's experience. None of this points to natural skill.
Originally posted by JustFrame
Yes, that is Natural Talent right there, along with the highest of Skill Level, you simply "can't" be as good as Daigo by just simply playing the game 24/7, even with the Best. You also have to have that natural edge that gives you an advantage along with your skill that puts you too that level.
You don't have the "natural edge". His "natural edge" is his LEARNED skill. He just learned it to a level beyond others. Well, apparantly not, he loses matches.
Originally posted by JustFrame
Just watch Alex Valle vs John Choi back in SF:A2, nobody could do what those guys were doing, and they were all playing the same amount of time, and putting in the same effort. It's just that Valle and Choi in their prime were naturally better then everyone else, plus they played the game just as much as everyone there.
That is PLAYER understanding, not SKILL. Everyone can pick up a brush and paint, right? Not everyone can paint the Mona Lisa, despite having the same hands and tools. The reason is because one person has a different perception.
You cannot do the same in Street Fighter. People play the game differently because people THINK differently. There's a limit to the learning on Street Fighter, fact. This proves that once you learn everything, the only thing to do is gain experience and work on doing what you've learned faster than your opponent.
Originally posted by JustFrame
You simply cannot expect "experience and dedication" will get you there, natural talent plays a part.
It doesn't.
Originally posted by JustFrame
Why do you think nobody to this day has played to the level of Jang Iksu in the world of Tekken...Nobody, no, not even Nin, for as good as he is. Jang Iksu was doing things with Mishima's that only Jang Iksu could do, much like how Tomo was doing things with Ryu and Guile that only Tomo could do.
Oh my goodness.
"That only Jang Iksu could do.". The MOVES and techniques are ALL thre for a player to use. He didn't invent them, they were programmed into the game on the basis that ANYONE could do it.
That's unreal of you to suggest.
Originally posted by JustFrame
Hard Work+Dedication+Practice+Best Competition Around+Natural Talent plays a part into why certain fighting game players are simply the Best.
It doesn't.
You're being oblivious.
Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Do we agree? How could you know, you don't know after all how my definition of skill is.
This "debate" is happening not because of the meaning of skill, i never gave one, it happens because of you ridiculously childish need to compensate somthing. It's a debate about me not giving any interpretation of skill. facepalm
Then stop weaselling and dodging, give me your definition of skill.
Not that it matters. I pasted the definitions of skill just above. If it doesn't coincide with one of those, it's made-up and false.
Originally posted by Batman-Prime
You do it all the time, that's why it isn#'t impressive, though you can't even tell the difference it seems.No. Wrong. I never said that this is an example of natural skillz, you are born with nor did i say this is an example of skills you learn over time. 😬
You know nothing, you have your opinion and you desire to be annoying, quit it, it's pathetic.I pity you AC, i really do.
Boring. Drop the evaluation and just make with the info, you're putting me to sleep.
What's your interpretation of skill?
-AC
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Saying that there's no natural talent involved with actual top level play
Learning from a move isn't anything if you don't have the ability to counter it on call. I know people who can see things happening, however due to their reaction time, they simply can't do it to the same degree, this is what separates players.
I'll basically stop trying to say this to you, because it's obvious now, you are not a competitive player, nor have you ever played at a remotely solid level to realize what it takes to BE THAT GOOD. Natural Talent to punish someone faster and react faster is something that isn't "learned", it is something that gives them a natural advantage over others.
It's just ridiculous how much you try to coincide to think that everything can be learned with just "time" however you can watch this video, from the #2 Best Street Fighter II : Hyper Fighting player of the Golden Era and he'll even tell you flat out, as to how he was not physically as good as Tomo which is why he's #2.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAFC0H5hVqs&feature=related
So yeah...if the BEST Players are stating Natural Talent gives you an advantage then obviously they hold far more credibility then an random guy on a thread who claims to "know all the chinks" to what makes a fighting game work competitively, even though he has never himself played at a solid enough level to comprehend such a thing.
Man, I wished I was still playing competitively, just so I could teach kids like you how your interpretation of a good player is so flawed.
I'll be back to read up anymore "I Know what I'm talking about" from you again later, I need to out w/ friends for dinner now, laters.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Then stop weaselling and dodging, give me your definition of skill.Not that it matters. I pasted the definitions of skill just above. If it doesn't coincide with one of those, it's made-up and false.
Boring. Drop the evaluation and just make with the info, you're putting me to sleep.
What's your interpretation of skill?
-AC [/B]
I would answer you question but honestly you aren't worth it. Nothing productive will come from you, that's what you showed me in our "debate". You lost, now that we both know it, there is no point in discussing this anymore.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
All about the hypocrite train, AC is driving.
It doesn't work like that, Batprime.
If you can't counter me, then that's fine. I still think you have your head screwed on better than a lot of others. It's just a very poor technique to leave and then fire shots off at me as you do.
Either duck out or don't. Don't run away while shouting shit back over your shoulder. That's just cowardly.
I won, and with that, you'll reply.
Originally posted by JustFrame
Learning from a move isn't anything if you don't have the ability to counter it on call. I know people who can see things happening, however due to their reaction time, they simply can't do it to the same degree, this is what separates players.
Exactly. That's what I've been saying all along.
Reaction time/speed. Why are you trying to counter me if you agree?
Originally posted by JustFrame
I'll basically stop trying to say this to you, because it's obvious now, you are not a competitive player, nor have you ever played at a remotely solid level to realize what it takes to BE THAT GOOD. Natural Talent to punish someone faster and react faster is something that isn't "learned", it is something that gives them a natural advantage over others.
Haha, why are you doing this? Why do you tell me I'm wrong and then proceed to go and cite the exact point I'm making?
My whole point was that it's just about reacting faster. That's absolutely learned. You don't just GET gifted with speed.
You can't learn a skill and claim it's a natural advantage, man. You're not understanding anything. Swimmers with large feet and long reach, THAT is a NATURAL advantage. They did not train to get bigger feet. If they don't train to actually swim properly, though, they won't be any good. You can't have a natural advantage unless you're equal in all other ways first.
If someone with big feet and long reach just jumped in a pool, they couldn't beat a champion swimmer. If they became as good, then their NATURAL advantage combined with LEARNED skill would give them the edge.
Compared to Street Fighter, you learn the moves and the set techniques. That is it. You learn them. There is no NATURAL advantage there. Getting faster or reacting faster is not something that you JUST HAVE. You LEARN IT. It's two people with a controller, knowing the same moves. What separates them is how fast they've learned to play. It's not natural, it's not gifted, it's learned.
Fact. Science.
Training to become faster is not a natural advantage, it's a learned one.
Originally posted by JustFrame
It's just ridiculous how much you try to coincide to think that everything can be learned with just "time" however you can watch this video, from the #2 Best Street Fighter II : Hyper Fighting player of the Golden Era and he'll even tell you flat out, as to how he was not physically as good as Tomo which is why he's #2.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAFC0H5hVqs&feature=related
So yeah...if the BEST Players are stating Natural Talent gives you an advantage then obviously they hold far more credibility then an random guy on a thread who claims to "know all the chinks" to what makes a fighting game work competitively, even though he has never himself played at a solid enough level to comprehend such a thing.
Man, I wished I was still playing competitively, just so I could teach kids like you how your interpretation of a good player is so flawed.
I'll be back to read up anymore "I Know what I'm talking about" from you again later, I need to out w/ friends for dinner now, laters.
I don't particularly care who YOU choose to believe. Obviously you'll side with them, but it doesn't erase my argument, nor does it counter it.
Them saying "It's natural talent." doesn't win you the argument. Because I need to be successfully countered for you to win the argument.
-AC
Obviously, having put so much time and dedication into a game, it's not unlikely they'll make exaggerative claims deifying the game. So what if they say it takes natural talent? Why would they say otherwise and make SF seem ungodly? It's pretty much their god/religion, after all.
Yes, those high-end players may be able to do things almost no one else can do. However, that doesn't mean people cannot train up to that level. Yes, it may take more time learning it then others due to setbacks, so you can say there is some natural ability involved. Someone having the natural ability to react at a certain speed without as much training as another person, is very possible. Those who CAN'T reach a level like Daigo's are what I would call physically and/or mentally deficient (or, something else) since Daigo & friends are not gods. After thinking long and hard about it, no one is fully incorrect or right. Comparing SF to something like music and art however, is dumb, but no one really did that. Those two categories are infinite, SF isn't. Tekken also is more complex with what you can do. No, I'm not saying there's a lot of ways to win in Tekken. Someone should learn to differentiate.
I've played one person on SCIV online who seemed as if he was on cocaine. He escaped every grab and countered everything, even with the character's special counter (Apprentice). Obviously, there are people who cannot reach that level no matter how hard they tried, but those are the unfortunate ones who are simply born special or had been affected during their lives at one point. Seeing as he isn't gifted beyond the norm, though, an equally capable person just needs to train, dedicated, and be awake during the match. I could be wrong about Daigo, though. He could just be...special.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
No End, you just defeated your own argument.You either KNOW I haven't played it...or you THINK I haven't. You have said TWICE now, that you KNOW I haven't.
If you KNOW I haven't, you could supply ME with proof. If you're just unsure, you would require me to answer questions...like now.
So, do you KNOW I haven't, or do you BELIEVE I haven't?
Secondly, I've never owned it. My friend ownsed it. I didn't look at the disc.
OH, let me save you the time. "See, you haven't played it!". Taking a leaf out of Batprime's book.
No I didn't. My argument is that you can not possibly know what your talkin' about in this case about the level of skill required and the abilities you need to have because you have never played the game.
My point is, YOU HAVE NOT PLAYED IT. You say you have but your posts say otherwise.
What console did you play it on?
Originally posted by FWahMaN
Obviously, having put so much time and dedication into a game, it's not unlikely they'll make exaggerative claims deifying the game. So what if they say it takes natural talent? Why would they say otherwise and make SF seem ungodly? It's pretty much their god/religion, after all.
That has nothin' to do with it, they use it to make money. It has become a job (that they may love to do). Everyone who works at Target doesn't make Target sound Godly. He says what he knows and how he feels because he lives it and does it for livin'.
Originally posted by FWahMaN
Yes, those high-end players may be able to do things almost no one else can do. However, that doesn't mean people cannot train up to that level.
Who ever said that? The point is, you can get to a high skill level but what decides the match if both people are equally skilled and playin' wit the same character? Natural Abilities. It doesn't even have to be to play SF or VGs, you can apply a natuaral skill you've gained or discovered from your day job to help you play better.
Originally posted by FWahMaN
Yes, it may take more time learning it then others due to setbacks, so you can say there is some natural ability involved.
Some people JUST CAN'T DO IT. That's the point...
Originally posted by FWahMaN
Someone having the natural ability to react at a certain speed without as much training as another person, is very possible. Those who CAN'T reach a level like Daigo's are what I would call physically and/or mentally deficient (or, something else) since Daigo & friends are not gods.
You don't have to be a God to have a natural affinity towards VGs. And you don't have to be "mentally deficient" to just suck at playin' VGs. That's crazy, that's like saying that every average person could be as intelligent as Stephen Hawking if they just study hard. And if they can't they are mentally retarded. The truth is, everything you do in life there will be someone better, not because they work harder but because they are just "Special".
Originally posted by FWahMaN
Comparing SF to something like music and art however, is dumb, but no one really did that.
Comparing VGs period to something like music and art is dumb, includin' Tekken.
Originally posted by FWahMaN
Tekken also is more complex with what you can do.
And SF is more complex in what you have to know. KOF, GG and the rest fall into the exact same categories. Because those games are 2D, you literally have to know more about the game in order to play it. Not just the characters and moves. You have to know the limits of engine the game runs on, if you want to be good.
Originally posted by FWahMaN
I've played one person on SCIV online who seemed as if he was on cocaine. He escaped every grab and countered everything, even with the character's special counter (Apprentice). Obviously, there are people who cannot reach that level no matter how hard they tried, but those are the unfortunate ones who are simply born special or had been affected during their lives at one point. Seeing as he isn't gifted beyond the norm, though, an equally capable person just needs to train, dedicated, and be awake during the match. I could be wrong about Daigo, though. He could just be...special.
Some people are gifted beyond the norm at playing video games. People are born gifted at things that don't even exist yet. Some NORMAL people will just suck no matter what at video games.
It's genuinely hilarious that, even now, people are still saying things like:
"Natural skill you've gained from your job.", and failing miserably to see why that immediately stops it being a natural skill.
So ridiculous.
Originally posted by No End N Site
No I didn't. My argument is that you can not possibly know what your talkin' about in this case about the level of skill required and the abilities you need to have because you have never played the game.My point is, YOU HAVE NOT PLAYED IT. You say you have but your posts say otherwise.
I've NEVER played the game? That's a fact is it?
Hmm, I haven't played it, you're SO sure of that. You're claiming it's a fact I haven't played it. Yet...
Originally posted by No End N Site
What console did you play it on?
Why are you asking, if it's a fact I didn't play it? Hmm?
Come on, you're smarter than this, aren't you?
If it's a fact I didn't play it, then I played it on...no console, because I've never played it. Right?
If you're asking me that question, it means you clearly don't know if I have or have not played it. You are looking to find out. Thus, stop sitting there making stupid claims like "You haven't ever played it.". You don't know if I have or have not, you're making what you believe to be a well-educated guess. It's not a fact, you can't prove that.
A fact is an undeniable truth with insurmountable and inarguable proof. Do you have insurmountable and inarguable proof that proves, beyond all doubt and deniability, that I have not played this game? Can you prove, as sure as water is wet and the sun is hot, that I have never played Street Fighter 3? No.
When you realise why you're wrong, when you stop making such silly claims as "You have never played the game.", I'll answer any questions you have. Until then, you're done.
What you SHOULD be saying is: "I do not believe you have ever played the game.". You don't believe I have, you don't KNOW.
No, before you reply with "I do.". You don't. You're just really sure. Until you accept this, I'm answering no questions of yours. Until you learn to seriously differentiate between fact and opinion, you and I cannot be buddies and have ice cream, I'm afraid.
Learn the difference, word your proposals properly, THEN I will indulge you son.
-AC
Don't waste your time No End, it's pointless, I don't deny you ever playing it Alpha, what I deny is the fact that you don't really know about the fighting game you are disputing against and rooting for. Your logic of easy, to strategy and diversity is flawed, as shown by your worship of "Move List ='s Diversity" notion. Ever notice that the only person who agrees with you and your thoughts is someone who also has not played against solid competition? Coincidence?
If you go to srk.com, and read a note about Jeff, he stated about how back when he was very young, that he took a reaction speed test.
"My reaction time used to be among the fastest, at well under .16 seconds from brain to hand. I remember I took a reaction time test when I was younger and the guy said I was extraordinarily rare and that I was higher than a lot of professional baseball players and boxers he tested." - Quote from Jeff at srk.com
Jeff even stated that because of this, he then applied it into the game of Street Fighter. So in short, it wasn't a "learned" thing that he learned from playing the game of SF to "improve" his speed. Basically put this was NOT learned while playing Street Fighter, this was just him being naturally inherited with this. Yes, he only improved on it, which made him become one of the best during the Early Era. Really now? So a guy who was already naturally gifted at being fast in reaction, decides to play SF, and only improves on, made him even more monstrous and was one of the catalyst that puts him near the Top.
This is why Jeff's Statement in the video I showed you pertaining about Tomo would make absolute and perfect sense, because as good as Jeff was naturally, Tomo was Better.
I agree, reaction time "can" be improved through playing fighting games, however to deny that it isn't also naturally inherent with certain people as well is simply ridiculous. Heck, even the study of Reaction Speed, they clearly state that it's also naturally inherent.
http://www.coreperformance.com/knowledge/training/reaction-time.html
Ps: It's also noted that some people do suck at fighting games, regardless of how hard they try, because they can't react nor execute with any relative consistency, if it can go that way, it can surely go the other.