Thanos vs Orion - Fisticuffs

Originally posted by quanchi112
What does that have to do with the thread in question? Thanos wins this thread regardless of my opinion in any other thread.

Aha! Your argument is: "Thanos lands and the fight ends shortly after". A very one sided scenario you've drawn up there. Obviously forgetting that Thanos isn't some speedster, and his striking power? What makes you think he levels Orion in short order? And don't give me that top tier cop out statement you're always like making. Give me some logic. Orion isn't exactly a featherweight in the physical department.

thanos durabality is to much for orion,thanos 1shots him

Originally posted by Allankles
Aha! Your argument is: "Thanos lands and the fight ends shortly after". A very one sided scenario you've drawn up there. Obviously forgetting that Thanos isn't some speedster, and his striking power? What makes you think he levels Orion in short order? And don't give me that top tier cop out statement you're always like making. Give me some logic. Orion isn't exactly a featherweight in the physical department.

Seriously,this isnt close at all.

Originally posted by quanchi112
He doesnt have to be. You havent even shown me anything proving that someone with Orion's speed coul defeat Thanos. Nothing. Thanos has grabbed the Hulk and bashed his head together with Hercules if I recall correctly quite easily. He is just in another league. He has beaten the Surfer down.....easily. The Surfer could take Orion imo and he isnt shit to Thanos.

Seriously,this isnt close at all.

Originally posted by Red Hulk
Hey Quan, do you have HDNet?

Originally posted by quanchi112
No. Do you have aim or msn instant messenger?

Originally posted by Red Hulk
Web MSN count?

Originally posted by Red Hulk
Web MSN count?

Originally posted by Cavalier
We have Quan on MSN.

Originally posted by Red Hulk
...

Originally posted by Cavalier
He PMed you.

Originally posted by Cavalier
Faster? In terms of art? I'm not going to analyze who has more motion lines drawn for them.

But Gamora manages much more staggering feats with far worse physical stats than Orion.

Now hold on a second.

You're discounting the Darkseid vs Orion fight based on the staging of that fight - that Orion apparently only got in a 'few kicks' or whatever (untrue). That having speed lines and throwing each other around doesn't really constitute any real showing of skill.

This is the criteria established by the poster I am replying to.

So I'm asking you, where is a battle with Gamora that, visually, blows this one out of the water? That makes it MORE clear that she is moving faster, that she is using more skill.

I ask, because this is one of the most superbly staged fights that I have ever seen. As far as I can remember, no western characters have gotten into this kind of brawl, with an artist depicting with such care the kinds of moves we see here.

Originally posted by ultimatethor
Really if the entire fight was filled with such speedlines then someone shud post those scenes and not the absolutely irrelevant one. Orion flying at a guy in no way proves his case. What actually im looking for is Orion showing actual hand to hand super battle speed. Not him flying from afar to hit someone. 🙄

Firstly, that wasn't Orion flying at Darkseid but running. Without his Astro Harness, he doesn't have the ability to fly. That was him RUNNING at Darkseid really fast (and vice versa, presumably).

Secondly, I believe scans of most of that fight WERE posted just a few posts below the one you responded to.

The next one shows orion flying and hitting some four guys in what looks to be a straight line. No hand to hand superspeed or skill of ANY KIND. It is completely irrelevant.

He was moving so fast that you couldn't SEE what he was doing. You have no evidence that all he did was bum rushed them - if that was all he did, than it would be the dogs that were damaged, rather than faces exploding and all that.

The one with him beating the New God of so and so is better but getting in three blows in what seemed like a normal manner( no great speed was indicated) in NO WAY PROVES the case that thanos will be unable to hit orion.

Given that he was unable to hit Gamora who also had no great speed lines indicated, I don't see why it wouldn't factor into that. Especially since Valkyra was essentially a Gamora analogue.

Also THAT is the precise reason I used Thor and Champion as examples. Both are described as great warriors but really dont have any of the feats to show that they are unhittable by thanos like characters. Orion is in the same vein and these examples have done little to disprove that.

I disagree. His skill is regularly referred to in his battles with Kalibak. His battle with Darkseid was singularly impressive for any character, in terms of depiction, and the OBVIOUS intention is for those characters to be moving at super speed. No inference is necessary to see the skill of the moves therein. Its quaint for various posters to try to discredit it by saying "ZOMG flips" or "All he did was punch and kick", but of course these are the basic actions of any hand to hand combat battle, and such tactics are desperate at best.

Someone like Champion ONLY gets lip service. He's never had an impressive hand to hand showing in his ENTIRE history. He's been one shotted by dumb Drax (while he was powered up, no less!), defeated by the Silver Surfer, and defeated by She Hulk.

In point of fact, his battle against Thanos was his highest showing to date.

That said, I should mention that I'm not arguing that Orion is going to take this. Simply that if someone like Gamora can go as long as she did with him, someone like Orion - with significantly higher stats and about equal skills and speed - is going to do that much better.

He still gets defeated. Any top tier does.

Originally posted by quanchi112
He doesnt have to be. You havent even shown me anything proving that someone with Orion's speed coul defeat Thanos. Nothing. Thanos has grabbed the Hulk and bashed his head together with Hercules if I recall correctly quite easily. He is just in another league. He has beaten the Surfer down.....easily. The Surfer could take Orion imo and he isnt shit to Thanos.

Seriously,this isnt close at all.

Aha, so bashing two characters head constitutes what exactly? Does it show a similar degree of MA skill as Darkseid and Orion demonstrated? Not at all. So in short I showed Orion's MA, he is not Hulk or Hercules of the early 90'S or whenever that story was printed.

Originally posted by Allankles
Aha, so bashing two characters head constitutes what exactly? Does it show a similar degree of MA skill as Darkseid and Orion demonstrated? Not at all. So in short I showed Orion's MA, he is not Hulk or Hercules of the early 90'S or whenever that story was printed.

It doesn't take any great MA, or even any level of strength greater than your opponent, to bash their heads together.

Moe used to do it to Larry and Curly all the time.

Supergirl did it to two alternate Supergirls in comics.

It means nothing.

Originally posted by Desaad
Firstly, that wasn't Orion flying at Darkseid but running. Without his Astro Harness, he doesn't have the ability to fly. That was him RUNNING at Darkseid really fast (and vice versa, presumably).

Secondly, I believe scans of most of that fight WERE posted just a few posts below the one you responded to.

He was moving so fast that you couldn't SEE what he was doing. You have no evidence that all he did was bum rushed them - if that was all he did, than it would be the dogs that were damaged, rather than faces exploding and all that.

Given that he was unable to hit Gamora who also had no great speed lines indicated, I don't see why it wouldn't factor into that. Especially since Valkyra was essentially a Gamora analogue.

I disagree. His skill is regularly referred to in his battles with Kalibak. His battle with Darkseid was singularly impressive for any character, in terms of depiction, and the OBVIOUS intention is for those characters to be moving at super speed. No inference is necessary to see the skill of the moves therein. Its quaint for various posters to try to discredit it by saying "ZOMG flips" or "All he did was punch and kick", but of course these are the basic actions of any hand to hand combat battle, and such tactics are desperate at best.

Someone like Champion ONLY gets lip service. He's never had an impressive hand to hand showing in his ENTIRE history. He's been one shotted by dumb Drax (while he was powered up, no less!), defeated by the Silver Surfer, and defeated by She Hulk.

In point of fact, his battle against Thanos was his highest showing to date.

That said, I should mention that I'm not arguing that Orion is going to take this. Simply that if someone like Gamora can go as long as she did with him, someone like Orion - with significantly higher stats and about equal skills and speed - is going to do that much better.

He still gets defeated. Any top tier does.

Whether he was running or flying because him that scan alone is still irrelevant in this case though when i was responding i hadnt checked the scans put up by Allankles.

What people are basing gamoras speed and skill off arre feats where she takes on multiple people superior to her physically and durability who can easily put her down but is able to defeat all of them because of her skill alone.

And NO he was moving in a straight line. It is plainly obivous from his outstrecthed body position and the lines that are depicted. If he had changed position at any point then the shape of the lines would have changed. What we see though is a horizontal line that is in line with orions outstretched body position passing across the people in that scan. Which is an obvious indication of a bull rush.

As for the Darkseid fight i highly doubt it was at superspeed. Fights going on at superspeed are usually more clearly depicted than that. They usually involve multiple attacks in quick succession. Fights such as flash vs zoom are undisputable example of such fights. To a lower degree, MAs like Iron fist and Cap also display such in their fights showing enhanced speed. Something lacking in the orion fight.

So while orion may be considerably greater than someone like champion skillwise, he is similar in the way that he does not have the feats to show that his skill level can give him the victory here.

And skill wise Gamora is still considerably above orion.

[QUOTE=11092445]Originally posted by Allankles
[B]Orion may well be more intense than Thor since his aggression overwhelms him completely making him berserk, it is a trait he inherited from Darkseid it even alters his appearance making him look more demonic like Darkseid and the other Apokoliptans, he keeps it in check with his motherbox.

i have all the new gods comics and the orion series and know orion has inherited his rage from darkseid becasuse jack kirby stated it but darkseid never really seem to lose his rage. i always see him as a cool headed schemer

Originally posted by ultimatethor
Whether he was running or flying because him that scan alone is still irrelevant in this case though when i was responding i hadnt checked the scans put up by Allankles.

What people are basing gamoras speed and skill off arre feats where she takes on multiple people superior to her physically and durability who can easily put her down but is able to defeat all of them because of her skill alone.

And NO he was moving in a straight line. It is plainly obivous from his outstrecthed body position and the lines that are depicted. If he had changed position at any point then the shape of the lines would have changed. What we see though is a horizontal line that is in line with orions outstretched body position passing across the people in that scan. Which is an obvious indication of a bull rush.

As for the Darkseid fight i highly doubt it was at superspeed. Fights going on at superspeed are usually more clearly depicted than that. They usually involve multiple attacks in quick succession. Fights such as flash vs zoom are undisputable example of such fights. To a lower degree, MAs like Iron fist and Cap also display such in their fights showing enhanced speed. Something lacking in the orion fight.

So while orion may be considerably greater than someone like champion skillwise, he is similar in the way that he does not have the feats to show that his skill level can give him the victory here.

And skill wise Gamora is still considerably above orion.

Gamora fighting skills is not on orion level she look more skilled because she is a highy skilled gymnast orion relies on pure martial arts skills when he fight.
orion#5,orion#16,orion#17, new gods vol.2 #6,7,8,9,jack kirby foruth world#7

Originally posted by Cavalier
That's "Gamora like"?

crylaugh

The only thing that even represents skill there is him throwing a couple kicks.

lolz.

that scan was from orion#5 he did not show all of the scans if you by the comic or go to orion respect thread you will see him using a close quarter combat technique by brutely smashing his face on the ground.

😄

Originally posted by beast1234
that scan was from orion#5 he did not show all of the scans if you by the comic or go to orion respect thread you will see him using a close quarter combat technique by brutely smashing his face on the ground.

😄

Doesnt matter what you show, it will all be considered just"random punching/kicking with speedlines". Anyhow from the early onset of this thread I have always remained with the opinion that Thanos will eventually win, however what I strongly disagreed with was the line of reasoning behind the victory.

Orion is a top tier in every respect, what really propels his character is his awesome MA skill. It is in my strong opinion that he will be able to press forward with a solid offense agaisnt Thanos whilst skillfully fending off attacks as well. I believe this will continue for a considerable duration, however due to Thanos incredible level of durability I can see him whistanding the attacks even if it means him being ragdolled.

Orions superior combat speed and MA level will allow him to avoid Thanos but at the sametime mounting and effective offense. Thanos will only be successful with his attacks after Orion has been worn down after expending most of his strength. At this point I can't see him effortlessly countering/avoiding Thanos anymore and it as this time Thanos will pick up the win.