Martian Manhunter vs World War Hulk

Originally posted by janus77
the leaping is also proof of his speed. I don't think you can leap faster than you can run, because it's a less efficient use of your muscles, you're not constantly adding to your momentum whilst you're gliding through the air.

You're pairing the original 1D Brick with a peer of Superman who'sa swiss army knife when it comes to power set. The match just doesn't work, based on what Hulk can do versus the sheer amount of ways J'onn can avoid him, and then KO him.

Originally posted by Martian_mind
Jonn can take a win by turning microscopic,entering Hulk,then turning giant inside Hulk.

Hell,he could do a phase rip,and tear out Hulks heart(he's done it to a person before)

If Jonn wants to be cheap,he can grow giant,scoop up Hulk and toss him into space for a BFR win.

heck,Jonn could be using his telepathy on him the entire fight,and even if that doesn't give him the win,it'll keep Hulk off edge.

Its been established that attempting to phase into Hulks cells would damage MMH. Its been tried by shifters the likes of Vison for instance...and ended up harming them instead. Doing it without phasing (size changing) would do nothing but imprison Jonn.

Throwing WWH into space...rotf. WWH is not letting that happen. Jonn would increase his chances of getting KO'd like 600% trying something as stupid as that.

And in case you didn't know, WWH is highly resistant to telepathy. Thats unlikely to work whatsoever. Skrull Telepaths, the White Queen and even Charles Xavier couldn't even pull that off. 😆

Originally posted by Superboy Prime
WWH's is a lot faster than Savage Hulk because he traded blows with Sentry? There was no indication of super speed from Sentry during the fight. MMH, unlike WWH, has speed feats of his own. Like it matters anyway...Jonn becomes intangible and yawns while WWH throws a fit.

so I guess lobo and doomsday don't have super speed either and that superman never uses super speed in the majorty of his fights because it doesn't go out and say it.

Originally posted by horrorwolf
No.

Its been established that attempting to phase into Hulks cells would damage MMH. Its been tried by shifters the likes of Vison for instance...and ended up harming them instead. Doing it without phasing (size changing) would do nothing but imprison Jonn.

Throwing WWH into space...rotf. WWH is not letting that happen. Jonn would increase his chances of getting KO'd like 600% trying something as stupid as that.

And in case you didn't know, WWH is highly resistant to telepathy. Thats unlikely to work whatsoever. Skrull Telepaths, the White Queen and even Charles Xavier couldn't even pull that off. 😆

And no, if you think a super strong, size changing, shape shifting Martian inside Hulk's head wouldn't do enough damage for a KO, you need to take a step back to reevaluate your opinions.

As for Hulk KO'ing a skyscraper-sized J'onn... Lulz. He still has super speed. He'll be able to catch Hulk. And I still don't see how Hulk's going to be able to KO a being faster than him, who's equipped with invisibility, intangibility, flight, long range attacks, shape shifting and telepathy.

In case you didn't know, the Martian Manhunter is a superior telepath to anybody that was named there. Not to mention, telepathy has worked on him in the past, so it seems logical that J'onn could simply constantly keep Hulk off his game by attacking Hulk's mind and body simultaneously. Jonn's done it to others in the past.

Originally posted by CaptainStoic
Yea I read the ones that showed Despero putting the big hurt on him, yet Lobo was completely unaffected by Despero. I believe it took place in one of the JL Europe books.

WWHulk at his strongest would rip Jonns arms off. Oh and he doesn't tire, while Jonn does. The writers are in error, because Jonn always had an endurance problem.

Doomsday Rex told him that he was powerful but compared to Superman he was nothing, as has nearly pulled a WWHulk vs Colossus on him.

So before you go giving me the "have you ever read this or that speech" you should take the Hulks feats into consideration.

WWh has almost no chance. Please note that I used a small "h", because hulk is just a little sissy.

And, WWH does not ha ve any kind of superspeed. Let's get that out tof the way right now.
In the battles with Sentry, I have seen people saying that Hulk was as fast, because Sentry must have been using superspeed.
This did NOT happen.
If those strikes were happening at superspeed, on panel, that would mean that they were also speaking at superspeed. 😉

Originally posted by Horrificus
He looked pretty tired when he was on his knees.

WWh has almost no chance.

And, WWH does not ha ve any kind of superspeed. Let's get that out tof the way right now.
In the battles with Sentry, I have seen people saying that Hulk was as fast, because Sentry must have been using superspeed.
This did NOT happen.
If those strikes were happening at superspeed, on panel, that would mean that they were also speaking at superspeed. 😉

Once again selective use of comic physics. It's comics dude; Captain Marvel can say "shazam" in the middle of fighting with superspeed opponents, tons of superspeed characters talk while battling. To selectively apply it to Hulk only is ridiculous.

If what you say was true, then any character cannot be moving past mach 1 if they are speaking, since they would be moving faster than sound. Guess what - a comic with no dialogue would be boring.

Originally posted by Kutulu
Once again selective use of comic physics. It's comics dude; Captain Marvel can say "shazam" in the middle of fighting with superspeed opponents, tons of superspeed characters talk while battling. To selectively apply it to Hulk only is ridiculous.

If what you say was true, then any character cannot be moving past mach 1 if they are speaking, since they would be moving faster than sound. Guess what - a comic with no dialogue would be boring.

Come on, put your credibility on the line Kutulu. 😄
Are you sure you want to go on record as saying WWH had superspeed?

Originally posted by Horrificus
He looked pretty tired when he was on his knees.

WWh has almost no chance. Please note that I used a small "h", because hulk is just a little sissy.

And, WWH does not ha ve any kind of superspeed. Let's get that out tof the way right now.
In the battles with Sentry, I have seen people saying that Hulk was as fast, because Sentry must have been using superspeed.
This did NOT happen.
If those strikes were happening at superspeed, on panel, that would mean that they were also speaking at superspeed. 😉

for you last point that happens in nearly every superspeed fight ever.

oh yeah and it was stated several times that the sentry was going all out. So i guess using all your power and going insane doesn't mean that you are using 1 hundreth of your power. Man the hulk hating is bad on this forum.

Originally posted by Horrificus
So, do we agree that WWHulk does NOT have superspeed?
Or are you REALLY going to say he does have superspeed, and he was matching Sentry?
Because, if WWH had superspeed, it leaves a lot of questions to be answered about all the other fights in the series.

Come on, put your credibility on the line Kutulu. 😄
Are you sure you want to go on record as saying WWH had superspeed?

yeah a lot of questions about the other fights like how he beat the crap out of black bolt who also has super speed or blits other characters. yeah and because MM uses his Super speed 100 percent of the time as well. bias

Originally posted by StylishSmurph
Supposition. The leaping is not proof of anything.Hulk's always possessed incredible leaping ability, and yet is said to top out while running around 300 mph... which is nothing on J'onn.

You're pairing the original 1D Brick with a peer of Superman who'sa swiss army knife when it comes to power set. The match just doesn't work, based on what Hulk can do versus the sheer amount of ways J'onn can avoid him, and then KO him.

anyway, as I showed, he has demonstrated the ability to tangle with superspeed people and Jack of Hearts has commented that he moves impossibly fast - fast enough to capture a herald like character.

if you're still going by the whole "one dimensional brick" argument, it's pretty pointless pursuing this conversation as you don't even have an appreciation of what Hulk's powers are.

he's basically beyond the abilities of MM to kill and he's more than capable of one shotting MM should the opportunity arise.

if he was purely a "one dimensional brick" Hulk would long ago have grown boring and repetitive, instead his powers and the nature of his abilities are a lot subtler than that.

Originally posted by Horrificus
So, do we agree that WWHulk does NOT have superspeed?
Or are you REALLY going to say he does have superspeed, and he was matching Sentry?
Because, if WWH had superspeed, it leaves a lot of questions to be answered about all the other fights in the series.

Come on, put your credibility on the line Kutulu. 😄
Are you sure you want to go on record as saying WWH had superspeed?

First off, in regards to speaking while fighting: If you used this, you must use it for all fights, both Marvel and DC. Let me bring up some examples for you.

http://i233.photobucket.com/albums/ee305/Wally_Respect3/blinkout.jpg
http://i233.photobucket.com/albums/ee305/Wally_Respect3/blinkout2.jpg

These are Flash-level speedsters fighting and yet they can speak.

Another example:
http://i233.photobucket.com/albums/ee305/Wally_Respect3/barkeep.jpg
http://i233.photobucket.com/albums/ee305/Wally_Respect3/barkeep2.jpg

Flash is clearly faster than sound. So how can he speak? It's comic book physics.

There are a few things in comic books that just cannot make sense no matter which way you try to apply physics to them: Clothing and talking.

I can illustrate enough examples to fill 100 pages of characters that can move faster than the speed of sound talking while they are fighting. Heck, all one has to do is visit the Superman respect thread to see more examples than you can count.

Same thing goes for clothing. Any attack strong enough to shatter a building would instantly shred all clothing a character has on. Surviving a nuclear bomb? Buck naked. Surviving an IMP from Flash? Buck naked. Surviving a sundip? Buck naked. You get the point. Comics have to A) Tell a story and B) be written with restrictions to an audience of the appropriate age group.

For example: Darkseid got blasted by Galactus in the crossover, yet only his torso's shirt was ripped. This is the same Galactus that can generate a multiple solar system destroying blast, and eats planets like candy. You think Darkseid's clothing would survive?

To sum up: Clothing and talking are exempt from comic book rules and physics. I rest my case.

Originally posted by janus77
😂
umm, I'm afraid the leaping is proof of his speed, as it is application of his leg muscles to propel himself. if he's running obviously he's going to continue to increase his momentum, instead of merely being propelled by his initial leap.

anyway, as I showed, he has demonstrated the ability to tangle with superspeed people and Jack of Hearts has commented that he moves impossibly fast - fast enough to capture a herald like character.

if you're still going by the whole "one dimensional brick" argument, it's pretty pointless pursuing this conversation as you don't even have an appreciation of what Hulk's powers are.

he's basically beyond the abilities of MM to kill and he's more than capable of one shotting MM should the opportunity arise.

if he was purely a "one dimensional brick" Hulk would long ago have grown boring and repetitive, instead his powers and the nature of his abilities are a lot subtler than that.

Originally posted by Horrificus
So, do we agree that WWHulk does NOT have superspeed?
Or are you REALLY going to say he does have superspeed, and he was matching Sentry?
Because, if WWH had superspeed, it leaves a lot of questions to be answered about all the other fights in the series.

Come on, put your credibility on the line Kutulu. 😄
Are you sure you want to go on record as saying WWH had superspeed?

Hulk doesn't have superspeed in the conventional sense, e.g. Flash. He does, however, have an extremely fast reaction and attack times. Numerous times heroes and villains alike have remarked that they were shocked that Hulk attacked so fast. He just can't fly, or run around super fast, but if he leaps at someone in a straight line, or grabs at someone, or throws his fist, those are very fast attacks.

Example: Jack of Hearts says "Impossible! Nothing alive can move that fast!"

Another example, Wonder Man surprised at his speed:

Someone else explains his speed, in a non-angry state:

Originally posted by Accel
I found this scan of a nice speed feat on comicboards a while ago (credit goes to Zeeder btw). I had never seen it before and I found it pretty interesting:

http://img323.imageshack.us/img323/6548/hulksuperspeedbj7.jpg

I’ll quote the source of the scan also, since Zeeder actually does the calculations of how fast Hulk’s speed is here:

"The Hulk has banner's brain due to Modoks attacks. Modok has a virus. In order to make the antidote, the vials must be placed in a centrifuge for 40 hours at 40,000 rpm's.

You can buy a centrifuge online that does 6000 rpm and produces 6000 g's. The comic centrifuge would be doing about 12000 g's easily.

The Hulk does in 8 minutes, what the centrifuge would do in 40 hours. He would be producing 6 million 500 thousand(6,500,000) g's. His hands would have to vibrate at 1/9 the speed of light.

He does it with strength. He isn't even mad."

Originally posted by Kutulu
Hulk doesn't have superspeed in the conventional sense, e.g. Flash. He does, however, have an extremely fast reaction and attack times. Numerous times heroes and villains alike have remarked that they were shocked that Hulk attacked so fast. He just can't fly, or run around super fast, but if he leaps at someone in a straight line, or grabs at someone, or throws his fist, those are very fast attacks.

Example: Jack of Hearts says "Impossible! Nothing alive can move that fast!"

Precisely.

Originally posted by janus77
😂
umm, I'm afraid the leaping is proof of his speed, as it is application of his leg muscles to propel himself. if he's running obviously he's going to continue to increase his momentum, instead of merely being propelled by his initial leap.

anyway, as I showed, he has demonstrated the ability to tangle with superspeed people and Jack of Hearts has commented that he moves impossibly fast - fast enough to capture a herald like character.

if you're still going by the whole "one dimensional brick" argument, it's pretty pointless pursuing this conversation as you don't even have an appreciation of what Hulk's powers are.

he's basically beyond the abilities of MM to kill and he's more than capable of one shotting MM should the opportunity arise.

if he was purely a "one dimensional brick" Hulk would long ago have grown boring and repetitive, instead his powers and the nature of his abilities are a lot subtler than that.

As for the rest of it- Hulk has a one dimensional power set, there isn't much else to it. His popularity and personality don't change that, and there is certainly nothing subtle about it. It's not my lack of appreciation speaking, it's the pretty obvious truth.

A big "lol" at the idea of Hulk tagging J'onn, much less one-shotting him. And J'onn certainly can kill Hulk. If you think he can't- "it's pretty pointless pursuing this conversation as you don't even have an appreciation of what Martian Manhunter's powers are."

Originally posted by StylishSmurph

As for the rest of it- Hulk has a one dimensional power set, there isn't much else to it. His popularity and personality don't change that, and there is certainly nothing subtle about it. It's not my lack of appreciation speaking, it's the pretty obvious truth.

True. so lets look at WWH's power set.

Base power is known to be beyond standard Hulk levels....and classified as unlimited.

Speed...well Hulk's reaction times to speedsters is incalculable...as he was able to pwn Quicksilver pretty easily.

Durabilty...I'd place just below Supermans but with a healing factor faster and stronger than Wolverine's.

Has shown resistance to Telepathy, Phasing, Disentegration.

Is a much better fighter than Jonn. So there really isnt much else that needs to "be" to it. WWH takes teams to stop.

Also, WWH could end this instantly with a Thunderclap.

Originally posted by horrorwolf
True. so lets look at WWH's power set.

Base power is known to be beyond standard Hulk levels....and classified as unlimited.

Speed...well Hulk's reaction times to speedsters is incalculable...as he was able to pwn Quicksilver pretty easily.

Durabilty...I'd place just below Supermans but with a healing factor faster and stronger than Wolverine's.

Has shown resistance to Telepathy, Phasing, Disentegration.

Is a much better fighter than Jonn. So there really isnt much else that needs to "be" to it. WWH takes teams to stop.

Also, WWH could end this instantly with a Thunderclap.

He's never, afaik, battles someone with telepathy of J'onn's caliber, or phasing that works like a Martian's does. Also, resistance =/= immunity.

Now let's look at J'onn-

Power- Pulled circa a third of the weight of the earth, and can grow exponentially based on morphing and taking the Earth's mass in.
Speed- Iirc, he's got > lightspeed feats.
Durability- Not far below Supes, and has an amazing healing factor as well.
Phasing- His whole body leaves the dimension
Telepathy- Superior to Prof. X
Martian Vision- Makes canyons out of even ground
Heat Vision
Invisibility
Morphing- grows extra limbs as strong as his original ones, Mr. Fantastic level elasticity
Flight
Growth
Shrinking
Can take in the mass of the earth
Super senses
Telescopic Vision

And even more. But what I named is easily enough to take Hulk out.

Oh, and the idea of taking J'onn out with a thunderclap from Hulk is idiocy.

Originally posted by StylishSmurph
Oh, and the idea of taking J'onn out with a thunderclap from Hulk is idiocy.

Originally posted by StylishSmurph
Oh, and the idea of taking J'onn out with a thunderclap from Hulk is idiocy.

Someone said that?

lulz.