Sabretooth vs Carnage, who wins?

Started by jinzin31 pages
jinzin Senior Member

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
And all of that incoherent rambling is supposed to convince me that one of Sabretooth's itty bitty pieces of flesh completely regenerated a new fresh Sabretooth?

Let me repeat myself: BWAHHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

laughcry YOU DIDN'T DISAPPOINT ME!!!! YOU'RE THE MAN NOW DAWG!!!! laughcry laughcry laughcry laughcry

This Sabretooth grows a new body out of a tiny piece of flesh myth never gets old! kinda Here's a summary: you're projecting your butt-hurt that I've proven Wolverine can have his brain penetrated, much to your own inconvenience.


Because it's not like Wolverine's done as much on panel... IDLIIDH.

The pillar of your penetrating the brain debate...

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Carnage's malleable durability + recuperative abilities keep him in this fight, even an extended one. It's why he's able to have the fights that he has. Carnage's capacity to dish out damage like Creed can dish out isn't even a question. He's got the strength, agility, tendril control, malleable durability, recuperative abilities, perceptive abilities, vampiric touch to rip Sabretooth up as much in a toe-to-toe fight as anybody. That's who he is, a hacking/stabbing/eviscerating machine.

This ain't ego. It's comics. And your obvious zealotry and ludicrously far-reaching arguments over Wolverine-related characters doesn't negate that. Comics Code means that Venom didn't just take a slash from Carnage? lulz Sabretooth heals from an itty bitty piece of flesh? LULZGASM You're the gift that keeps on giving, from the Wolverine starvation/sleep deprivation myth to your seriously misguided attempts to deny Wolverine's brain penetrability to this thread. It's been a fun ride and you're a fine comedian.

🤨
Carnage has never HAD a fight where he had to worry about being cut to ribbons with the exception of the 1 fight he had with BONE CLAW Wolverine.... which was ironically enough a stalemate....

And his fights with Venom are no exception, as we've already seen the symbiotes negate one anothers piercing abilities on top of the fact that Venom usually tends to simply punch and pound Carnage in the face instead of clawing away at him.. funny the one time he's done it, Carnage had his face exposed, cried and got kicked accross the room.

And of course Carnage's capacity to dish out punishment isn't a question.. that's why I never questioned it... 😐

The only thing I see that's misguided here is you offering "on panel" evidence as the bulk to your arguments only when it suits you and choosing to ignore said evidence when it doesn't... It's not new and it's hardly a legit way to debate which is why it's hard to take you seriously a majority of the time... but nice bravado as always.

jinzin Senior Member
Originally posted by SamZED
Kk, sounds fair, Jin. Eitherway, was never a fan of Carnage. He does tend to fight like a complete idiot most of the time, so might as well end up having his head cut off.

cooler heads prevail! thumbsup sorry again Sam.

OneDumbG0 Find Your Own Fire

Originally posted by jinzin
Already explained this to you; couldn't get it the first time you aren't getting it now.

OMG that's been one of the main points to you ridiculing my argument, I already have you quoted as trying to strawman my argument into sabretooth winning with "one swipe" whatajoke lol.

If you dismissed the notion then why did you bring it up as a point to your argument later, and then compound on it trying to use Venom as pillar of evidence? Oh that's right because you didn't... as you already quoted YOURSELF as being wrong on that one.
And again, are you being this dense on purpose?... I just explained to you how a gutcheck isn't laced with vitals or as lethal as a throat rip. Maybe you've been so focused on English that you plumb forgot about anatomy?

You explained that when you insinuated I was afraid of your multiquotes, you were, in fact, the one that requested we summarize waaaay back on page 10? K.

No. I never relied on Carnage fighting Spidey/Venom at the same time. Feel free to quote me and prove otherwise. You brought up that fight before anyone in the thread, because you felt you had to respond to a myth that nobody was even using here. Then at some point you projected it enough on me that you literally called me "Mr. Carnage has taken Venon and Spidey at the same time many times."

Originally posted by jinzin
Riiiiiiight......
What I find funny is that you're sticking to your guns on your strawmans, easy to call me out on arguing with myself when I'm having to argue against a debate I never made. I guess in your world, your delusions are as real as anything.

IN THIS THREAD, AGAINST THIS OPPONENT, VERSUS HIS OFFENSIVE WEAPONRY.... I've clarified that many many many times in this argument and you keep clinging to "bullet proof" like it matters here.. Carnage has no "superior durability" to what Sabretooth's dishing out in this fight, he's just as likely to be cut up as the next person.

Irony.

Actually, you kept clarifying that Sabretooth has had plenty of bullet-proofish feats and miring this nugget of truth in your unwitty repartee in trying to rebut a very simple point: Carnage's durability > Sabretooth's. I never once said that Carnage's durability on its own utterly negated Sabretooth's capacity to hack and slash. I've said from the start that Carnage's malleable durability + recuperative abilities blunt it enough that this isn't a quick fight. It's a long drawn-out toe-to-toe hack/slash affair.

Originally posted by jinzin
1st scans- You see Venom screaming like a little beeotch when the tenrils strat ripping through his symbiote, to the point that Spiderman has to come in to help him even suggesting Eddies life may have been at steak. He is also commenting on the symbiotes doing damage to eachother so I'm not entirely convinced the wounds when through his arms so much as they did his symbiote, which is a meathod they've used to attack one another several times before.

HOWEVER if they are indeed going through his arms and venom healed the wounds, good for him, I never stated the symbiotes didnt' produce a healing factor, just that they don't heal at a rate fast enough to deal with the vital damages given to them in a fight with someone like Sabretooth.. is that vital damage being done? NO...

1st scan set.... FAIL.

2nd scan- Eddie takes a grazing claw swipe to his exposed ribs we don't get treated to how deep the claws went... and we don't see that part of him that was attacked thereafter. We only continue to see him from the opposite side.... And again, is this grazing swipe a vital blow that supports he can heal at a rate fast enough to matter in this fight? NO? Ok.

2nd scan..... FAIL.

3rd scan set- The only impressive scan of the bunch and what's it of? TOXIN.... okay.... not only is Toxin FAR stronger than even Carnage (to the point that it scared Venom into willingly working with Carnage.. and that should tell you something), and not only does Toxin posses powers that Carnage does not like mass manipulation over the host and strength boosting..... but we're treated to him being able to whether having his bones dislocated... WHOAZA! Something that human beings in real life without a symbiote or medical attention can survive.... so evidence of Carnage being able to tank through vital damage at a rate that matters in this fight? NO....

3rd scan... FAIL.

4rth scan- I'm not really sure WHAT you think this proves to be honest.. I mean... it kinda proves AGAIN that darts can go through the symbiote.... I'm assuming your impressed because Carnage has a healing factor able to deal with poisons to his system maybe? Either way we already addressed how symbiotes can reject poisons to the system so that's not helpful, and it CERTAINLY isn't proof of Carnage tanking a lethal blow.... soooooo... erm yeah..

4th scan.... FAIL.

1st scan... utterly proves symbiotes heal their hosts, which makes you wrong in suggesting otherwise. Brock's pain is a deflection from that. I never argued their hosts wouldn't feel pain. Also, your insinuation that the tendrils never penetrated into Brock's arm conveniently sounds like my insinuation that the plot device needle never penetrated Cletus' neck, just the symbiote. After all, Venom had to stick Cletus' exposed neck right after the symbiote fell off. And I SO knew you were going to make this insinuation which undermines your own reliance on your own scans. Predictable.

2nd scan... utterly proves symbiotes blunt/heal slashing. Arguing it's a grazing swipe when even a grazing swipe would leave some marks across Brock's body? Yeah. Not really.

3rd scan... utterly proves symbiotes blunt/heal damage done directly to their hosts, which makes you wrong in suggesting otherwise. Even the host thought it should hurt and was panicking until he realized to his shock that it didn't hurt at all and didn't inhibit him at all. Direct damage to the host body. Blunted/healed. There isn't much of a deflection to even criticize here.

4th scan... utterly proves symbiotes blunt/heal damage dealt directly to their hosts, which again makes you wrong in suggesting that symbiotes can't recuperate dehabilitive effects wrought upon the host itself. Also completely acts as the mirror opposite to your farcical reliance on Venom stabbing Carnage with a plot device needle.

So essentially you're wrong when you suggested that symbiotes can't blunt/heal damage done directly to their hosts.

OneDumbG0 Find Your Own Fire

Originally posted by jinzin
Eventually? The first attack that Sabretooth lands [/u]is[/u] going to cut right into Cletus... there you go ONCE AGAIN bringing up this issue of durability like it matters... but it doesn't... I really don't know how many times I have to tell you this for it to sink in... honestly.
It is going to cut right into Cletus? As in... it would cut into Cletus? So you are saying that the first swipe that Sabretooth lands on Carnage's throat or gut is or would tear his throat out or eviscerate him? Thought you said it can or could? Clarify for me please!
Originally posted by jinzin
And, now your argument is beginning to try and make me sound as if I ever argued that a symbiote couldn't heal a host... but that again is an argument I never made...
kinda Oh yea... could never get that impression from these statements directed at me below among multiple posts:
Originally posted by jinzin
from all appearances it can't do much to help the reactions of the hosts themselves to the pain/damage that's inflicted on them.

-------------------

And I'm having a hard time see how this claim is so "outrageous" given the numerous times that hosts have been wounded inside the symbiote and unable to quickly recover, or the times that blades and edges have cut right through them.

-------------------

The scratch didn't heal though. in fact the whole reason why Carnage bled enough to cover himself in his symbiote was specifically because the scratch didn't heal....
Carnage's symbiote being able to reform is not the same as his host healing damage... Not really sure how to make that more clear to you.

-------------------

Oh for god sakes... Cletus didn't have to HEAL anything other than a gash on his face... which he didn't. That's not evidence of his healing factor for a host, its evidence of the symbiotes ability to reform after it's done being attacked.. nothing we haven't already covered.

Extremely poor quaneuver. crackers
Originally posted by jinzin
As for this subway scan, there's two sides to the subway and we only see the one Venom jumps to. Did Carnage truly get run over? Maybe, maybe not, maybe he leaped out to the other side, maybe he burrowed to ground as we see him doing later, maybe he was hit and rode off on the front of the train as we've seen Venom do before. Maybe the train really did run right over Cletus, but in a number of conventional subway cars there's room enough for a man to lay between the tracks and survive... there's multiple times that this very thing has happened to people all over NYC.... even that baby in australia from last year.... The point is, what we DON'T see is Carnage being hit by multiple wheels on the track, being mangled underneath and healing from catastrophic damage that supports your case.

So while I find your continuing arrogance in this thread to be amusing that post was MADE O' FAIL. lol

Lulz. So your theory is that Carnage didn't get run over? That's how you're trying to avoid this catch-22? Your "point is, what we DON'T see" should lead you to be skeptical of the feat? 😱

And you're seriously making that argument to us after insisting that Sabretooth reformed an entire body from an itty bitty piece of flesh off-panel which "we DON'T see" ???? shocklaugh

jinzin Senior Member

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
You explained that when you insinuated I was afraid of your multiquotes, you were, in fact, the one that requested we summarize waaaay back on page 10? K.
I requested that, you didn't follow up, I took your lead, you whined away... pretty simply.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
No. I never relied on Carnage fighting Spidey/Venom at the same time. Feel free to quote me and prove otherwise. You brought up that fight before anyone in the thread, because you felt you had to respond to a myth that nobody was even using here. Then at some point you projected it enough on me that you literally called me "Mr. Carnage has taken Venon and Spidey at the same time many times." Irony.

Sigh.... k... here's you beginning to delude yourself.... >>>>>

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
[BCarnage is roughly Venom's equal. Which is partly evinced by his ability to fight both Venom and Spiderman simultaneously. [/B]
<<<<<<<<<<< and here's you commiting to the delusion>>>>>
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ So Carnage's original symbiote being spawned from Venom gives the Carnage symbiote, Venom-class strength genetically. And that disproves Carnage's roughly 30-ton raneg, how... ? Never mind the fact that he's gone toe-to-toe with Venom and Spiderman multiple times on-panel?
<<<<<<

And finally compounding on said delusion to further your agenda. >>>>

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
There are several things I claim of Carnage. And I'm wrong on these claims? So... Carnage isn't stronger, i.e., superior to Spidey+Venom's application of brute strength?
<<<<

Wow... so you still never said all that crap huh? 🙄

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Actually, you kept clarifying that Sabretooth has had plenty of bullet-proofish feats and miring this nugget of truth in your unwitty repartee in trying to rebut a very simple point: Carnage's durability > Sabretooth's. I never once said that Carnage's durability on its own utterly negated Sabretooth's capacity to hack and slash. I've said from the start that Carnage's malleable durability + recuperative abilities blunt it enough that this isn't a quick fight.
And your call to this durability is inconsequential as I've been telling you from the beginning.. anyways.. I was bringing up the bullet proof feat to disprove that Carnage has a superior TYPE of durability than Sabes?
Uh no... you missed the point entirely.. the use of Sabretooth's bullet proof feats was used to 1.) Argue that one shot powers that appear haphazardly like a vampiric touch really shouldn't be counted as a legit and likely meathod to be used in this argument. and 2.) to point out that the proofs to their durability vs. OTHER WEAPONRY is meaningless in this thread because both characters are 100% suseptible to the others offesnive capabilities. I already flat out stated that Carnage has a higher level durability to blunt damage so your flat wrong about your assumptions for my reasoning.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
1st scan... utterly proves symbiotes heal their hosts, which makes you wrong in suggesting otherwise.
Because you can clearly see the tendrils going into his arm without one ounce of doubt that Carnage was simply tearing the symbiote off of brock... Oh wait... no that room for doubt still exists.. (keeping in mind I'm not arguing that symbiotes can't heal hosts) this just isn't a clear indication of that point nevermind the argument that they can do it to the degree you're claiming.)

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Brock's pain is a deflection from that. I never argued their hosts wouldn't feel pain. Also, your insinuation that the tendrils never penetrated into Brock's arm conveniently sounds like my insinuation that the plot device needle never penetrated Cletus' neck, just the symbiote. After all, Venom had to stick Cletus' exposed neck right after the symbiote fell off. And I SO knew you were going to make this insinuation which undermines your own reliance on your own scans. Predictable.
Uh... I STILL left room for reasonable doubt because the reasonable doubt exists there... I still argued to the point that if it DOES show Brocks arm being penetrated...blah blah blah.... but lets ignore that so you can continue your arrogant little game... lol....

Anyways, the symbiote as you said is malleable and can easily slither along Brock's arm the needle isn't... the needle can't change it's shape... Makes quite a bit of difference when you want to compare the two. (*headpat*)

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
2nd scan... utterly proves symbiotes blunt/heal slashing. Arguing it's a grazing swipe when even a grazing swipe would leave some marks across Brock's body? Yeah. Not really.
Yeah they would leave marks accross the body... the right side of the body.... too bad the continuing panels only show us the left side of Brock thereafter.. so no.. it utterly proves nothing as far as your arguments are concerned.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
3rd scan... utterly proves symbiotes blunt/heal damage done directly to their hosts, which makes you wrong in suggesting otherwise. Even the host thought it should hurt and was panicking until he realized to his shock that it didn't hurt at all and didn't inhibit him at all. Direct damage to the host body. Blunted/healed. There isn't much of a deflection to even criticize here.

I NEVER suggested otherwise... so at this point I can't even call this Strawmanning... at this point you're just being insane...
lol
As it stands it STILL isn't prove of hosts taking lethal damage and it's STILL evidence of a symbiote who has powers that Carnage does not posses.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
4th scan... utterly proves symbiotes blunt/heal damage dealt directly to their hosts, which again makes you wrong in suggesting that symbiotes can't recuperate dehabilitive effects wrought upon the host itself. Also completely acts as the mirror opposite to your farcical reliance on Venom stabbing Carnage with a plot device needle.

The only "reliance" on that scan was the one to the fact that a needle can pierce Carnage's hyde thereby nullifying your testiment to his "superior durability" as if it matters in this thread.
No one ever said symbiotes can't heal hosts and certainly no one ever asserted that symbiotes can't deal with poisons.... both of those are common knowledge and have already been adressed in this thread. Again... you're being simply put: insane.
This is NOT evidence of Carnage healing lethal damage done to the host... but your equivocation that it is is amusing to say the least.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
So essentially you're wrong when you suggested that symbiotes can't blunt/heal damage done directly to their hosts.

I never said that... I've only EVER called into question that Carnage can heal vital/lethal/mortal blows done to the host, and more importantly at a rate that keep Carnage competetive in a swipe for swipe fight. Nice strawman again. 😉

jinzin Senior Member

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
It is going to cut right into Cletus? As in... it would cut into Cletus? So you are saying that the first swipe that Sabretooth lands on Carnage's throat or gut is or would tear his throat out or eviscerate him? Thought you said it can or could? Clarify for me please!

Wow... I like how you attack my understanding of English and yet you have none here.
Sabretooth IS going to cut right into Cletus with any attack he LANDS.
That does not necessitate that every he attack he DOES LAND will be LETHAL, or even deabilitating.
It also is not an argument that guarantees Sabretooth WILL LAND hits before Carnage capitalizes on his advantages in range.
It IS an argument that exposes outright how ridiculous you pulling for Carnage and his "superior durability" can be.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
kinda Oh yea... could never get that impression from these statements directed at me below among multiple posts: Extremely poor quaneuver.

Uh no... most people would probably not be left with that impression because they would have also taken into consideration the multiple times I've testified to the symbiote having a healing factor as well OR they would have drawn themselves to more reasonable conclusions on just what those quotes were referring to...
1st- statement proven by your first scan and your own assertion in your last post.
2nd- Both facts, facts that do not necessitate me into believing that a host can't recover/heal but that there's evidence where they don't do it quickly.
3rd and 4th- simple interpretations of what's happening on panel as it's presented... nothing more or less.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
crackers Lulz. So your theory is that Carnage didn't get run over? That's how you're trying to avoid this catch-22? Your "point is, what we DON'T see" should lead you to be skeptical of the feat? 😱
Yes, I'm saying that multiple wheels didn't run over Carnage.. if they did he may have been cut in half and died... you apparently feel differently? What, you think his head was still on the tracks? That he can take having his head crushed or severed in spite of dying from being ripped in half? Do you not even see the corner you're drawing YOURSELF into here?

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
And you're seriously making that argument to us after insisting that Sabretooth reformed an entire body from an itty bitty piece of flesh off-panel which "we DON'T see" ???? shocklaugh
Because.. unlike Carnage, Sabretooth has evidence to back this claim, unlike Carnage this claim is in line with perviously aforementioned feats.
Unlike Carnage, Sabretooth has another party stating what happened to him as fact.

So where do you stand? You think Carnage can take having a subway train crush or severe his head?

chomperx9 Restricted

if this is sabretooth with adamantium skeleton he has a shot for sure

jinzin Senior Member

Originally posted by chomperx9
if this is sabretooth with adamantium skeleton he has a shot for sure
just a question: why do you think the Skeleton matters?

chomperx9 Restricted

Originally posted by jinzin
just a question: why do you think the Skeleton matters?
indestructible skeleton always matters

Starscream M Senior Member

Originally posted by jinzin
just a question: why do you think the Skeleton matters?
uh...are you serious?

do you know how big of a difference having an adamantium skeleton makes?

it makes your brain virtually unpenetrable,

it makes it impossible for somenoe to cut off your head or limbs

do you not realize how valuable that is??!

chomperx9 Restricted

Originally posted by Starscream M
uh...are you serious?

do you know how big of a difference having an adamantium skeleton makes?

it makes your brain virtually unpenetrable,

it makes it impossible for somenoe to cut off your head or limbs

do you not realize how valuable that is??!

for real

jinzin Senior Member

Originally posted by Starscream M
uh...are you serious?

do you know how big of a difference having an adamantium skeleton makes?

it makes your brain virtually unpenetrable,

it makes it impossible for somenoe to cut off your head or limbs

do you not realize how valuable that is??!

I get how valuable that it is from being ripped apart or having limbs severed. But for most fights that's not happening. His bones already give him the durability to tank class 60-100 shots. They're super durable as is... I'm just saying it doesn't offer him a massive advantage in this fight.

chomperx9 Restricted

Originally posted by jinzin
I get how valuable that it is from being ripped apart or having limbs severed. But for most fights that's not happening. His bones already give him the durability to tank class 60-100 shots. They're super durable as is... I'm just saying it doesn't offer him a massive advantage in this fight.
his skeleton can still be damaged. adamantium skeleton cannot unless its some god like force or a hit from superman prime or something but this carnage. with an adamantium skeleton he would win

captainman Restricted
Originally posted by chomperx9
his skeleton can still be damaged. adamantium skeleton cannot unless its some god like force or a hit from superman prime or something but this carnage. with an adamantium skeleton he would win

spider-man never needed adamantium skeleton in order to kick his ass so sabretooth who is the better fighter, more durable then spider-man, got a healing factor and got the claws to hurt carnage wont be needing it as well

chomperx9 Restricted

Originally posted by captainman
spider-man never needed adamantium skeleton in order to kick his ass so sabretooth who is the better fighter, more durable then spider-man, got a healing factor and got the claws to hurt carnage wont be needing it as well
spidey is quicker and more agile than sabretooth. but i see your point

captainman Restricted

more agile ? yes ... faster? no , in combat sabretooth is faster then spider-man , wolverine is able to go toe 2 toe with spider-man and sabretooth is superiour to wolverine in that department

captainman Restricted

but seriously?

chomperx9 Restricted

Originally posted by captainman
more agile ? yes ... faster? no , in combat sabretooth is faster then spider-man , wolverine is able to go toe 2 toe with spider-man and sabretooth is superiour to wolverine in that department
spider-man has his spidey sense he is faster for sure at dodging and blocking more than creed. and spidey has webbed up wolverine before. yeah i know they have both taken eachother down at different points.

captainman Restricted
Originally posted by chomperx9
spider-man has his spidey sense he is faster for sure at dodging and blocking more than creed. and spidey has webbed up wolverine before. yeah i know they have both taken eachother down at different points.

so thats why spider-man gets his ass beat up by fighters like daredevil and captain america all the time? skills and fighting speed is what spider-man lacks and thats why people like sabretooth will always be faster then him in a fight

and dont bring him web ing wolverine from behind while wolverine wasnt even fighting him please

captainman Restricted

and of course this