Luke Cage with a twist vs Abomination

Originally posted by ankur29
doc samson is stated as a class 25 aswell as luke

http://www.marveldirectory.com/individuals/d/docsamson.htm

Strength Level: Doc Samson can lift (press) approximately 70 tons under optimal conditions.

Originally posted by ankur29

however if cap took down hulk with a gut punch with less than 1 ton strength(which is some of the shitest writing ever) then cage can definately take abomination with his class 25 strength

I don think Cap can do that with a gut punch but at least you get the logic of what im saying.

Cap has breifly stunned Prof Hulk, the **** you think a guy who has class 35 strength and intense MA training with superhard skin gonna do..you get me?

The handbook that listed Doc at 25 tons corrected that error in the '89 update #1. It put Doc at 70 tons.

Originally posted by snoopdogg
The handbook that listed Doc at 25 tons corrected that error in the '89 update #1. It put Doc at 70 tons.

do you have proof of that? in comics i know its stated samson was near strong as calm hulk but another comic show where a sentinel scanned him as able to lift 25 tons?

however teh point is if cap took down hulk with a gut punch with less than 1 ton strength(which is some of the shitest writing ever) then cage can definately take abomination with his class 25 strength

Originally posted by ankur29
do you have proof of that? in comics i know its stated samson was near strong as calm hulk but another comic show where a sentinel scanned him as able to lift 25 tons?

however teh point is if cap took down hulk with a gut punch with less than 1 ton strength(which is some of the shitest writing ever) then cage can definately take abomination with his class 25 strength

Originally posted by Phantom Zone

I don think Cap can do that with a gut punch but at least you get the logic of what im saying.

Cap has breifly stunned Prof Hulk, the **** you think a guy who has class 35 strength and intense MA training with superhard skin gonna do..you get me?

Alsso Luke will probably be stronger after 1 year of training. I would put him at class 35

Hercules kayoed Abomination with a lamp post.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Alsso Luke will probably be stronger after 1 year of training. I would put him at class 35

that is quite a big increase . 10 tons? that is luke cage + classic spiderman lol (i would personally say he woudl become about 30 tons) , but if that was true would it mean that luke cage's strengthand concidently health is maintained at class 25 without training?

how strong would spidey be with a years traing ,with weights and with cap?i think about 25 tons

Originally posted by ankur29
do you have proof of that? in comics i know its stated samson was near strong as calm hulk but another comic show where a sentinel scanned him as able to lift 25 tons?

Here is the correction scan:
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c379/Doggydogg/ohmu890149.jpg

And yea I realize the Sentinel scanned Doc's strength at 25 tons but if you notice Doc has very short hair there.

Originally posted by snoopdogg
Here is the correction scan:
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c379/Doggydogg/ohmu890149.jpg

And yea I realize the Sentinel scanned Doc's strength at 25 tons but if you notice Doc has very short hair there.

that is abosolutely correct but i have learnt that samsons 'current' strength whci is no longer affected by hair growth is at 25 tons

Originally posted by ankur29
that is quite a big increase . 10 tons? that is luke cage + classic spiderman lol (i would personally say he woudl become about 30 tons) , but if that was true would it mean that luke cage's strengthand concidently health is maintained at class 25 without training?

Well I guess he does some training but this is gonna be intense. I dont see 25 to 35 is a stretch. I think 40 would be too high as they would mostly concentrate on skill and speed.

Originally posted by ankur29

how strong would spidey be with a years traing ,with weights and with cap?i think about 25 tons

15 -25 ...sounds reasonable

Originally posted by ankur29
that is abosolutely correct but i have learnt that samsons 'current' strength whci is no longer affected by hair growth is at 25 tons

Got proof? Doc does state on panel that he has Hulk level strength, im assuming baseline hulk strength.

http://img12.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=03479_Thunderbolts_117_DCP_0011_122_1008lo.jpg

Originally posted by ankur29
that is abosolutely correct but i have learnt that samsons 'current' strength whci is no longer affected by hair growth is at 25 tons

Originally posted by Phantom Zone

Got proof? Doc does state on panel that he has Hulk level strength, im assuming baseline hulk strength.

http://img12.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=03479_Thunderbolts_117_DCP_0011_122_1008lo.jpg

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
No because at class 3, hes been able to hurt WM and beat Piledriver whos punches hurt Thor and go toe-to-toe with Iron Man

Bro Cage was class 3 then, Cage Koed him when he was class 25. 😬

The same class 3 Cage that had a hard time bending a steel girder while fighting the Thing? The same class 3 Cage that wailed on the Hulk and the Hulk didnt even notice he was there? Yeah, now it makes perfect sence that he should be able to hurt WM or Piledriver. *sigh*

Well you cant prove hes more durable than the Hulk. Well Cap stunned Prof Hulk for 1 second, what do you think a class 35 martail expert is going to be capable, for startes Abom probably wont even be able to get a good hit on him.

Hasent Karnak hit the Hulk before and stated that the Hulk has no weak points? I would say CA hurting the Hulk is PIS, but i'm sure you'll disagree.

Abomination has thunderclaps and ground strikes that would neutralize any speed difference that Cage may have.

As I stated, Luke will probably be able to dodge most of those punches and if he hit vital areas he can KO Abom.😬 Hell he was class 3 and hurt class 95 WM....do the math.

1+1=3 is your type of math here. Your the only person in the thread that is arguing on Cages bahalf and its crazy. For some reason, you have it in your mind that Cage is going to come out of this training being able to fight as well as Captain America. Sorry, but the student isnt going to equal the teacher here. Even it did happen that way, Cage still loses. Theres just to much difference to make up.

Originally posted by snoopdogg
Actually that scan you posted Doc says he's Hulk level and he has short hair. Doc does have a buzz haircut nowadays.

Yeah well my point is that hes not class 25. 😐

Originally posted by Phantom Zone

1. I think you're wrong there because all the WC have the same durability and they can take shots from Thor.

2. Well bios say different things about strength levels, but even at Spiderman level strength he is still alot weaker than

1. Wonder Man
2. Iron man.
3. Rhino.
etc

3. Well he has ears, eyes, nose and a mouth why wouldnt he have testes, and besides there other weak points.

4. Yes but since he doesnt always thunderclap we cant assume he will. CIS is allowed.

5. Yes I know, your not getting the point. Black Tarantular is a MA expert who has class 25 strength, hes not as good as Cap in MA but I can bet his punches are going to be alot more effective than Caps.

1. Pile driver has been pierced by a standard hawkeye arrow. Not all that durable

2. My point was that Cage strength is inconsitently written. You state that he was one shotted by hulk when class 3 I don't believe his stength was ever properly categorised and am questioning whether he really has had an "upgrade" but is just being written more consistently at the high end of his power. Stopping a train is easily a class 25 feat and yet he did this while supposedly class 3. So was he ever really class 3 or has his strength never really changed.

3. Abomination he may have testes but they aren't visible. I have seen him depicted without his usual trunks there is nothing there dude - (poor Emil probably why he is so bitter) His ears, nose may or may not be weak points, this has not been established you are assuming here. The guys is not a normal human, he is a green scaly beast that can survive tank shells re-entry heat etc.

4. He's gonna use it if Cage is too dodgy to hit

5. Martial arts will give cage the ability to hit Emil better and avoid his hits. But often martial arts works by exploiting weak points and as I have said you cannot establish if Emil even has any

Also, your reference to Cage fighting Iron Man, Ironclad, Piledriver, Rhino, and Black Goliath is weak too.

I dont have the comic, but Cage beating Iron Man or even having a decent showing is rediculous. Do you actually think Cage should be able to hang with Iron Man? Ever? For once, be honest with yourself.

Ironclad is Luke Cage only to another degree. Losing to Cage is garbage writing at best.

Piledriver should never lose either, but he's a villian that was created to lose regardless. Low showing for him.

Rhino,,,,,,he's never won a fight in the Marvel Universe. Nuff Said!

Black Goliath? A c-lister thats not going to win against one of Marvels premier minority heros. Regardless, I dont think he had enough for Cage anyways. He wasnt much and dying to a cheap imitation of Thor proved that.

All this, and we're arguing that a 30 tonner at best is going to beat a character that has already beaten the Hulk before. Unreal.

Originally posted by tkitna
The same class 3 Cage that had a hard time bending a steel girder while fighting the Thing?

I never stated that a class 3 Cage can beat Thing. I stated that class 3 Cage has beaten much stronger opponents. Just becaue he cant bend a steel girder doesnt mean he cant hurt much stronger opponents because he can do it time and time again. Cap or DD cant bend steel girders but they can hurt bricks is that PIS to?

Originally posted by tkitna

The same class 3 Cage that wailed on the Hulk and the Hulk didnt even notice he was there? Yeah, now it makes perfect sence that he should be able to hurt WM or Piledriver. *sigh*

Did he hit Hulk in the nuts? Is Piledriver as tough as The Hulk? Why do you think it takes 4 of them to fight Thor? Terrible logic.

Originally posted by tkitna

Hasent Karnak hit the Hulk before and stated that the Hulk has no weak points? I would say CA hurting the Hulk is PIS, but i'm sure you'll disagree.

Yes i'll disagree because there are lots of feats that can prove that Cap should be able to do it. I could list them out but i'll wait for your response.

Originally posted by tkitna

Abomination has thunderclaps and ground strikes that would neutralize any speed difference that Cage may have.

He doesnt do that all the time. CIS is allowed pay attention

Originally posted by tkitna

1+1=3 is your type of math here. Your the only person in the thread that is arguing on Cages bahalf and its crazy.

Yes the math adds up, all you are doing is giving me some events which you think contradict Cage being able to hurt people much stronger than him. I countered them.

Originally posted by tkitna

For some reason, you have it in your mind that Cage is going to come out of this training being able to fight as well as Captain America. Sorry, but the student isnt going to equal the teacher here. Even it did happen that way, Cage still loses. Theres just to much difference to make up.

See below get it?

Originally posted by Phantom Zone

Yes I know, your not getting the point. Black Tarantular is a MA expert who has class 25 strength, hes not as good as Cap in MA but I can bet his punches are going to be alot more effective than Caps.

Originally posted by severance
1. Pile driver has been pierced by a standard hawkeye arrow. Not all that durable

Right so the fcat this happened means he cant take shots from Thor? No it doesnt.

Originally posted by severance

2. My point was that Cage strength is inconsitently written. You state that he was one shotted by hulk when class 3 I don't believe his stength was ever properly categorised and am questioning whether he really has had an "upgrade" but is just being written more consistently at the high end of his power. Stopping a train is easily a class 25 feat and yet he did this while supposedly class 3. So was he ever really class 3 or has his strength never really changed.

To be quite honest most of strength feats are around 10. Spiderman has feats in class70 sometimes that dont make him class70 because most of his feats are class 10.

Originally posted by severance

3. Abomination he may have testes but they aren't visible. I have seen him depicted without his usual trunks there is nothing there dude - (poor Emil probably why he is so bitter) His ears, nose may or may not be weak points, this has not been established you are assuming here. The guys is not a normal human, he is a green scaly beast that can survive tank shells re-entry heat etc.

He does cos Cap has been able to hurt him, also he looks similar to a human so he probably

Originally posted by severance

4. He's gonna use it if Cage is too dodgy to hit

I think its possible he could dodge a few, if he knows it coming. As I was saying the impression I get from shockwaves is that they are considerably less powerful if you get behind them. Even if hes too dodgey to hit he most likley wont use it straight away. Spiderman was fighting Hulk and Hulk didnt use it till much later.

Originally posted by severance

5. Martial arts will give cage the ability to hit Emil better and avoid his hits. But often martial arts works by exploiting weak points and as I have said you cannot establish if Emil even has any

He does cos Cap has been able to hurt him, also he looks similar to a human so he probably

Originally posted by tkitna
Eveytime I see a feat that doesnt support my argument im gonna just say its PIS. I think more people should use this debating tactic, if in doubt just say PIS.

He can't take shots from thor. He may have taken them but this is either Thor holding back (most likelY) or PIS. If thor unleashes a true hit pile driver turns into red mist. Spidey (who does not have super hard skin) took out almost the whole wrecking crew are we saying he hits as hard as thor?

Did cap hurt him with his unbreakable shield or with his fists?

Ultron looks similar to a human do you think he has weak spots?

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
I never stated that a class 3 Cage can beat Thing. I stated that class 3 Cage has beaten much stronger opponents.

Than Thing or himself?

Cap or DD cant bend steel girders but they can hurt bricks is that PIS to?

Alot of the times,,,,yes. This also depends on the bricks we're talking about. No, I dont feel they should be able to hurt the Hulk, Thing, or Abomination for that matter.

Did he hit Hulk in the nuts? Is Piledriver as tough as The Hulk? Why do you think it takes 4 of them to fight Thor? Terrible logic.

Are the nuts the only pressure point your concentrating on here? It takes 4 of them because Thor is in the Hulks and Abominations class. See the logic and how futile it is for Cage now?

Yes i'll disagree because there are lots of feats that can prove that Cap should be able to do it. I could list them out but i'll wait for your response.

Your disagreeing because an Inhuman who's sole power is to find weak spots in objects and characters stated there was NO weak spots? Brilliant. Cap gets away with it because he's a flagship character in Marvel. No other reason. I'll wait for your response.

Yes the math adds up, all you are doing is giving me some events which you think contradict Cage being able to hurt people much stronger than him. I countered them.

Crap writing and low showings for superior characters is your counter?

Piledriver being impaled by Hawkeye's arrow was PIS, as Piledriver has shown multiple times to be bulletproof.

Severance your greatly underestimating the crew, I suggest you read this:

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f98/t453738.html