Originally posted by LordofBrooklyn
[B]Show me a SINGLE instance of Thor performing ANY of the aforementioned abilities WITHOUT MJOLNIR.I'll wait.[/B]
LOL Like he needs to use teleportation or matter manipulation at any point in the fight.
Mjolnir is a tool for Thor's power. And an enchanted indestructible weapon in itself. But the vast majority of his direct combat powers as well as his Most Powerful Blast all comes from Thor, and only focused better through Mjolnir.
Get over it. Look here even with Life Force Drain:
It says that HE calls on the ancient Enchantment to do it, and HE becomes ONE with his Hammer to do it.
That's why Beta Ray Bill doesn't do that one. BRB doesn't do the godblast either for that matter. Because it's power from Thor himself, not from Stormbreaker or from Mjolnir.
Originally posted by LordofBrooklyn
You can continue to miss the point about Gladiator as well
Which point? This point:
Yeah I think everyone's got the gist of that point.
Originally posted by DARTH POWER
LOL Like he needs to use teleportation or matter manipulation at any point in the fight.Mjolnir is a tool for Thor's power. And an enchanted indestructible weapon in itself. But the vast majority of his direct combat powers as well as his Most Powerful Blast all comes from Thor, and only focused better through Mjolnir.
Get over it. Look here even with Life Force Drain:
It says that HE calls on the ancient Enchantment to do it, and HE becomes ONE with his Hammer to do it.
That's why Beta Ray Bill doesn't do that one. BRB doesn't do the godblast either for that matter. Because it's power from Thor himself, not from Stormbreaker or from Mjolnir.
Which point? This point:
Yeah I think everyone's got the gist of that point.
I don't know what was argued before, but that scan of Thor and Loki had Loki just standing there.
And the Gladiator scan? So out of context. And Gladiator had previously kicked Thor's ass in the same story.
Originally posted by pym-ftw
I get where your coming from but literally as soon as Thor stopped holding back he wrecked him.
errrr..... After Gladiator beat Thor, he fought Tarene, then had the brief scuffle with Thor before the plane, then Thor blasted Gladiator(apparently by surprise) and attacked while Gladiator was still getting up. Then Tarene attacked him with a blast compared to Odin. It wasn't quite "literally as soon as Thor stopped holding back."
Originally posted by Delta1938
I don't know what was argued before, but that scan of Thor and Loki had Loki just standing there.
Arguing about powers comic from Thor not just simply Molnir.
And Loki resists through his own magic, not by moving all over the place, so not sure what your point is there anyway.
But I'll admit if Thor was to drain Superman of Solar or Life energy it probably would have to be after some big blasts that has him stunned for a couple of seconds. It would be a finishing move. Not an opening one.
Originally posted by Delta1938
And the Gladiator scan? So out of context. And Gladiator had previously kicked Thor's ass in the same story.
😬 It's not out of context at all.
The first scan LOB posted of Glads beating Thor was the one out of context. This was how it ended. Look at the bottom right hand panel. Thor stopped holding back, and that was the result.
Originally posted by Delta1938
errrr..... After Gladiator beat Thor,
Errr, when Thor was holding back and trying to protect a civilian and comnpletely taken by surprise on Why The F*** Glads was attacking him..
Originally posted by Delta1938
he fought Tarene, then had the brief scuffle with Thor before the plane, then Thor blasted Gladiator(apparently by surprise) and attacked while Gladiator was still getting up. Then Tarene attacked him with a blast compared to Odin. It wasn't quite "literally as soon as Thor stopped holding back."
He fought her first and she finished it off.
But the majority of the fight was Thor (1 on 1) not holding back and laying into Glads and battering him.
Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Arguing about powers comic from Thor not just simply Molnir.And Loki resists through his own magic, not by moving all over the place, so not sure what your point is there anyway.
But I'll admit if Thor was to drain Superman of Solar or Life energy it probably would have to be after some big blasts that has him stunned for a couple of seconds. It would be a finishing move. Not an opening one.
My point would be Superman wouldn't stand still while Thor was prepping a move like that, but punch Thor in the face. This isn't DBZ where a character stands around for 97 episodes talking about how they have to stop the Big Bad from charging-up an attack while doing nothing to stop the charging of attack.
Do you think Superman is more likely to use his speed, or Thor more likely to try and use that life drain?
Originally posted by DARTH POWER
😬 It's not out of context at all.The first scan LOB posted of Glads beating Thor was the one out of context. This was how it ended. Look at the bottom right hand panel. Thor stopped holding back, and that was the result.
I don't know what LOB posted, but yes, what you posted was definitely out of context. And after you complained about Surfer getting cheap shotted by Darkseid when it wasn't the same thing I was arguing.
Originally posted by DARTH POWERErrr, when Thor was holding back and trying to protect a civilian and comnpletely taken by surprise on Why The F*** Glads was attacking him..
He fought her first and she finished it off.
But the majority of the fight was Thor (1 on 1) not holding back and laying into Glads and battering him.
How was Thor "holding back?" He wasn't angry? Wasn't using the full range of powers? What? And Thor was taken by surprise? The part where Thor got the first two attacks in? Or the part where Gladiator threw a building at Thor then charge in and beat him down? Wouldn't that be Thor's fault for not being good enough? And that's not the same as Thor and Gladiator saving the plane full of passengers, then apparently cheap shot blasting Gladiator. That was the fight being interrupted and Thor cheap shotting after.
Originally posted by Delta1938
I don't know what was argued before, but that scan of Thor and Loki had Loki just standing there.And the Gladiator scan? So out of context. And Gladiator had previously kicked Thor's ass in the same story.
Originally posted by Delta1938
errrr..... After Gladiator beat Thor, he fought Tarene, then had the brief scuffle with Thor before the plane, then Thor blasted Gladiator(apparently by surprise) and attacked while Gladiator was still getting up. Then Tarene attacked him with a blast compared to Odin. It wasn't quite "literally as soon as Thor stopped holding back."
Let's not forget Gladz kicked the hammer from him before he punched him in the air. That Thor still had the burden of turning back to Olsen. Maybe things could have been a little different without those 2 factors.
And the Tarene scene was brief. Gladz made short work of her before his next tangle with Thor.
Also how was him attacking Gladiator after the plane scene a surprise? Thor basically let him know that some ass kicking was about to ensue. Gladz was also not just getting up. He had his wits about him, but just didn't realize what a non-holding back Thor could do.
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsGladiator10.jpg
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsGladiator11.jpg
Also notice he was already knocked the phukk out before Tarene ever blasted him. Thor was already not holding back before her attack.
In fact Gladiator flat out admitted to Zarrko Thor was too strong and that he failed. Keep in mind Gladz was out to kill.
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
You sure you're talking about the same fight? You talk of context yet you failed to bring up the part where Thor was fighting Gladiator while trying to prevent the girl(Mandy) he was with from getting hurt. Not really fair don't you think?
http://s388.photobucket.com/user/OneDumbG0/media/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsGladiator05.jpg.html
Seems she left the scene when Gladiator threw a building at Thor. And yes I'm talking the same fight.
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Let's not forget Gladz kicked the hammer from him before he punched him in the air. That Thor still had the burden of turning back to Olsen. Maybe things could have been a little different without those 2 factors.
Since Thor can call back Mjolnir, wouldn't that mean Gladiator KTFOed him long enough for him to revert to Jake? Des having Mjolnir mean Thor is more face-punch resistant?
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
And the Tarene scene was brief. Gladz made short work of her before his next tangle with Thor.
The comic makes it pretty clear to me there was off-panel fighting.
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Also how was him attacking Gladiator after the plane scene a surprise. Thor basically let him know that some ass kicking was about to ensue.
You mean the part where we don't see Gladiator before Thor blasts him?
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Gladz was also not just getting up. He had his wits about him, but just didn't realize what a non-holding back Thor could do.
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsGladiator10.jpg
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsGladiator11.jpgAlso notice he was already knocked the phukk out before Tarene ever blasted him. Thor was already not holding back before her attack.
In fact Gladiator flat out admitted to Zarrko Thor was too strong and that he failed. Keep in mind Gladz was out to kill.
So tell me what "not holding back" is? Angry?
He may have been unconscious, may have just been incapacitated. Doesn't change what I pointed-out already.
And the funny thing is Thor was lucky Mandy, what you argue to justify Thor getting KTFOed, was there in the first place.
Originally posted by Delta1938
Seems she left the scene when Gladiator threw a building at Thor. And yes I'm talking the same fight.
Nope she was lying there when the building came crashing hence Thor was distracted by smashing up all the building debris to stop any of it hitting her.
Then Gladiator used that distraction to Blitz Thor.
The odds were clearly against Thor in that fight who was still protecting people and holding back.
Once Thor stopped holding back we saw what happened:
So stop the twisting the facts. And face facts, Thor was solidly more powerful than that particular Gladiator at least.
Originally posted by Delta1938
Seems she left the scene when Gladiator threw a building at Thor. And yes I'm talking the same fight.
Originally posted by Delta1938
Since Thor can call back Mjolnir, wouldn't that mean Gladiator KTFOed him long enough for him to revert to Jake? Des having Mjolnir mean Thor is more face-punch resistant?
Originally posted by Delta1938
The comic makes it pretty clear to me there was off-panel fighting.
Originally posted by Delta1938
You mean the part where we don't see Gladiator before Thor blasts him?
Originally posted by Delta1938
So tell me what "not holding back" is? Angry?
Originally posted by Delta1938
He may have been unconscious, may have just been incapacitated. Doesn't change what I pointed-out already.And the funny thing is Thor was lucky Mandy, what you argue to justify Thor getting KTFOed, was there in the first place.
Err... Thor was at a disadvantage. Not sure why you still refuse to acknowledge that fact.
Also you keep seeing past what was stated on panel.
One, Thor was holding back until right before he unleashed hell on Gladiator.
Second, Gladiator flat out admitted defeat due to Thor being stronger. Can't get anymore smoking gun than that.
Anything remotely denying those two facts is lowballing.
Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Nope she was lying there when the building came crashing hence Thor was distracted by smashing up all the building debris to stop any of it hitting her.Then Gladiator used that distraction to Blitz Thor.
The odds were clearly against Thor in that fight who was still protecting people and holding back.
Once Thor stopped holding back we saw what happened:
So stop the twisting the facts. And face facts, Thor was solidly more powerful than that particular Gladiator at least.
She was on the ground when Gladiator picked-up the building. We don't see her on-panel again for essentially two pages, after Gladiator KOs Thor, then we see Thor land one-panel later. Looks to me like she got a fair distance away.
You keep saying "holding back" without answering my question.
I'm not twisting anything. You're ignoring facts. Gladiator one-shot Thor(unless you think knocking Mjolnir out of his hands hit him in the face). Face that fact.
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Lol what are you even trying to tell me here?
He was fighting with a handicap. Pretty clear for everyone to see. If you don't have a proper response just say so.
We don't see Mandy after Gladiator picked up the building, then the next time we see her she's a fair distance away. I don't think she was around when Gladiator KTFOed Thor.
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
That could be the case. Again he was fighting with a handicap.
The part where Mandy was probably away, or the part where Thor didn't have Mjolnir? Does Mjolnir make Thor more face-punch resistant? Yes or no?
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
It was a brief tussle do to Gladz encasing her in ice and not wanting to fight her in the first place.
It's obvious there was off-panel fighting. Unless you think a building teleported to where the truck Jake landed around was?
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
I mean the part where he clearly warns him before some ass kicking. Again pretty clear.
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsGladiator10.jpg
So the part where we don't see if Gladiator is aware he's going to be blasted or not. Concessions accepted.
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Pretty clear he was ktfo'd. And what point was that?
I wasn't aware it was impossible for you to be conscious but your eyes closed. If we saw him on the ground with his eyes closed for more than one panel, you'd have a point.
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Err... Thor was at a disadvantage. Not sure why you still refuse to acknowledge that fact.
I pointed-out it looks like Mandy was gone before Gladiator THREW the building, since she got a pretty good distance away. I'm arguing when Glads actually HIT Thor, not the part before.
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Also you keep seeing past what was stated on panel.
One, Thor was holding back until right before he unleashed hell on Gladiator.Second, Gladiator flat out admitted defeat due to Thor being stronger. Can't get anymore smoking gun than that.
Anything remotely denying those two facts is lowballing.
You do realize that Mandy put the fire out that Jake got caught with, right? Or that Tarene came and stopped Gladiator. And Mandy is the reason Jake even got back into contact with Mjolnir.
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Lol what are you even trying to tell me here?
He was fighting with a handicap. Pretty clear for everyone to see. If you don't have a proper response just say so.That could be the case. Again he was fighting with a handicap.
It was a brief tussle do to Gladz encasing her in ice and not wanting to fight her in the first place.
I mean the part where he clearly warns him before some ass kicking. Again pretty clear.
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsGladiator10.jpgPretty clear he was ktfo'd. And what point was that?
Err... Thor was at a disadvantage. Not sure why you still refuse to acknowledge that fact.
Also you keep seeing past what was stated on panel.
One, Thor was holding back until right before he unleashed hell on Gladiator.Second, Gladiator flat out admitted defeat due to Thor being stronger. Can't get anymore smoking gun than that.
Anything remotely denying those two facts is lowballing.
Guess what Superman would do, who is a fair bit stronger than Thor?
I can see the House Of El have got truly desperate now. Using Gladiator (a Gladiator of unknown strength, speed and power mind you) beating Thor when Thor has clearly stated he was holding back.
I think you all need another reminder of what happened when Thor stopped holding back:
Looks like Twisting and Lowballing is all The House of El has at this point.
Originally posted by DARTH POWER
LOL Like he needs to use teleportation or matter manipulation at any point in the fight.Mjolnir is a tool for Thor's power. And an enchanted indestructible weapon in itself. But the vast majority of his direct combat powers as well as his Most Powerful Blast all comes from Thor, and only focused better through Mjolnir.
Get over it. Look here even with Life Force Drain:
It says that HE calls on the ancient Enchantment to do it, and HE becomes ONE with his Hammer to do it.
That's why Beta Ray Bill doesn't do that one. BRB doesn't do the godblast either for that matter. Because it's power from Thor himself, not from Stormbreaker or from Mjolnir.
Which point? This point:
Yeah I think everyone's got the gist of that point.
1) Thor's abilities without Mjolnir- You've failed to answer my challenge. The point is conceded.
You are trying to obfuscate bringing up the "GODBLAST" and Mjolnir. I clearly acknowledged that the Godblast as the essence of Thor's power comes directly from him.
Bringing up as akin to the other abilities I mentioned, without showing proof is not going to work.
You can't show proof because NONE of Thor's canon supports your assertion.
NEXT.
2) Gladiator- Here is the point for YOU, Carver, the lowly Thanosi, and your other cheerleader.
a) An inferior Superman analogue- Gladiator is a poor man's Superman and yet he was able to perform well against Thor. You dismiss EVERY aspect of the fight as being a function of Thor "HOLDING BACK".
SO, Thor despite his comprable Superman level combat speed, ALLOWED Gladiator to separate Mjolnir from him.{/B]
If we take your assertion at face value it still does NOTHING to dimiss my point which is AGAIN the following.
[B]SUPERMAN OUTPACES HIS MARVEL ANALOGUES AND AS A CONSEQUENCE WILL REPLICATE THEIR PERFORMANCES AT A HIGHER LEVEL!
I brought up The Count Nefaria fight and you, ONCE AGAIN, acknowledge the events as Thor "HOLDING BACK". Even though Nefaria was clearly intent on MURDERING all of the Avengers.
The Nefaria fight is much more indicative of what would actually happen. But, ironically enough, as a concession to YOUR scenario I used Gladiator to show a more even matchup involving a Superman.
Feel free to actually ANSWER my arguments at any time.
P.S. Post the scan some more it is all you've got at this point! 😎
Originally posted by abhilegendSuperman can barely on occasion best Thor until he quits holding back then it is a wrap.
You are trying to tell us that Gladiator, who was weaker than Thor KTFOed Thor after blitzing him? Because Thor was pretty much KTFO when he landed after that Gladiator punch.Guess what Superman would do, who is a fair bit stronger than Thor?
Originally posted by Delta1938facepalm
We don't see Mandy after Gladiator picked up the building, then the next time we see her she's a fair distance away. I don't think she was around when Gladiator KTFOed Thor.
Originally posted by Delta1938
The part where Mandy was probably away, or the part where Thor didn't have Mjolnir? Does Mjolnir make Thor more face-punch resistant? Yes or no?
Originally posted by Delta1938
And the Gladiator scan? So out of context. And Gladiator had previously kicked Thor's ass in the same story.
Originally posted by Delta1938Again you're making claims which have no legs to stand on. Even if there were off-panel shenanigans, it still doesn't change the fact that it was a brief encounter. Nothing of significance happened. Nowhere in that book was it indicated that Gladz was weakened or weakening. Because let's face it that's where you're going with this.
It's obvious there was off-panel fighting. Unless you think a building teleported to where the truck Jake landed around was?So the part where we don't see if Gladiator is aware he's going to be blasted or not. Concessions accepted.
Originally posted by Delta1938Wow! Should I even dignify this response? This is just pathetic. He ate multiple Mjolnir sandwiches. If someone has to point out to you he was KO'd in that scene then you need help.
I wasn't aware it was impossible for you to be conscious but your eyes closed. If we saw him on the ground with his eyes closed for more than one panel, you'd have a point.
Originally posted by Delta1938Dude quit it with the red herrings. That doesn't matter. The fight began with Thor being protective while Gladiator was out to kill. Gladz even endangered the girl's life and Thor was forced to save her. Thor was at a disadvantage. Period.
I pointed-out it looks like Mandy was gone before Gladiator THREW the building, since she got a pretty good distance away. I'm arguing when Glads actually HIT Thor, not the part before.
Originally posted by Delta1938
So, how was it Thor was holding back? Because he wasn't mad?
Originally posted by Delta1938More red herrings.
You do realize that Mandy put the fire out that Jake got caught with, right? Or that Tarene came and stopped Gladiator. And Mandy is the reason Jake even got back into contact with Mjolnir.
I sense desperation here because none of my main points were not properly addressed.
Again the comic outright states Thor was holding back. When he stopped, he stomped.
The comic also flat out has Gladiator admitting defeat and stating that Thor is too strong.
Now anything brought up about the fight that can't clearly lessen those two facts is flat out lowballing.
