Thor vs Superman

Originally posted by Jack Daniels
okay this is old old recollection here probably like 15 years ago.....we had an official book for battles etc...hulk and thor unearthly strength....thats the way hulk starts out...he gets mad he reaches class 1000 and beyond...thors hammer is class 1000 not thor nor did it increase his physical strength to class 1000 just a blow by the hammer....k now use that with comic knowledge the hammer didnt knock hulk out with one blow...yeah he was a bit scared of it cause it hurt but class 1000 blow didnt knock him out....supes can knock hulk out with one punch..he has done it in comic.....why wouldnt supes just do the same to thor......now the thread that has thor as captain universe versus superman prime is worth debating this thread should die...I like thor second to thing(Iknow hes less in strength bigtime sept when he was spiked out) but neither of them come close to superman...lets move this to the capt uni thor versus prime thread...thats a possible debate there! Who better to be captain universe than THOR!!!!!!! oh yeah! (we just need to know can a captain universe die?)

the battle of supes and hulk was fan voted. any crossover battle is always doubtful and shouldn't be used as points for debate.

but i believe that superman is both stronger and faster than thor, but just as tough. I still put my vote on thor though, because he's got magic. superman is vulnerable to magic, and he wouldn't be able to knock thor out before has been able to use the magic against him.
thor is also a much greater fighter, and since superman doesn't really overpower him that much, i still see the fight going thor's way.

<<The reason I brought up Twilight was, if you're going to bring up the Earth Stealer's, (which is pre-crisis, as well as out-of-continuity,) why shouldn't I be able to bring up Thor lifting Twilight? You insisted that Superman is stronger by gauging his feats, which is quite hypocritical.>>

hypocritical? how so? i admitted that i didn't know that was a pre-crisis supes (knew the book was post-crisis, not sure why supes in it is pre-crisis. where'd you hear that?) i also said the list may not actually convince anybody. AND you've complied a list of feats for THOR! how am I being hypocritical? long ago, i made the claim x-overs are the only true measuring stick, (even if most don't like them) because 'feats' across comics can rarely be compared. then i come to find your greatest feat of strength for thor was an assumption you made! cube, we've had our differences, but come on . . .

and i'd sort of thought we'd already established that the sword COULDN'T be 'true' white dwarf matter - you even admitted something to the effect - it would imply thor is capable of lifting AND THROWING a weight several thousands (maybe millions) of times the mass of the earth. clearly he is not, so, either it isn't 'true' white dwarf matter, OR the magic in the sword renders it liftable, hence wieldable. but these are old points we've both long since past, and, if one thing is PAST clear, it is that neither one of us will be moved from our stance. oh well . . . the vote, however is creeping ever closer. maybe others are listening?

So Leo reaches my position on this thread, that nothing can move it on and all things that can be said have been said 🙂 good to have you aboard the merry go round. 😄

supes is one tough mutha.... but I believe that Thor would win this fight...
don't get me wrong it won't be easy but he will come through. he is after all the god of thunder. And with his belt of strength and mjolnir at his side he is arguably the most powerful hero on earth. Christ he is one of the few who can go toe to toe with hulk and live to tell the tale.
IMO Thor is supes equal in everything except speed, but his magic compensates for that.

heheh, thanks whirly! i have one final card to play, however . . .

what if, during their battle, superman used his strange but viable 'Torquasm-Vo' ability? it is a kryptonian warrior technique that i'd COMPLETELY forgotten about! basically, it goes along with the idea that supes is a telepath (that's why jonnz can't find him at times - supes shuts him out with his mental powers, it's also why he can lift objects and not have them shatter, and why is is so resistant to mental attacks in general - much MUCH moreso than most on this forum think he is)

basically, with the technique, supes drags someone onto his mental plane where he is the master. while it's true he has not mastered the ability, the ability DOES exist, and he has used it. if he brought thor into his mental world, it would be over. thor's magic would be non-existent in supe's world. the perfection of the technique it is said, is what possibly allowed superman to evolve into superman prime.

i'd not have brought it up most likely, but since this 'bloodlust' format says they will battle to their fullest . . . (shrugs)

just one more reason to think supes could certainly win this fight. 🙂

ps-thor wouldn't have his belt for this fight.

well if your gonna discuss about that telepathy, thor also has teleportation. just banish supes to a sunless galaxy and lets see what happens. anyway, just wanted to counteract the telepathy thingy.

Originally posted by Avalonofthewind

Here he is vibrating effortlessly through DD's attacks and flame breath. You can cut and paste thor into DD's place fairly easily.

Your right Avalon some people just dont understand 😉 Just replace DD with Thor and DDs firebreathe for the Godforce blast and there you have it. Goodnight Thor.

Or maybe they dont want to.

<<well if your gonna discuss about that telepathy, thor also has teleportation. just banish supes to a sunless galaxy and lets see what happens. anyway, just wanted to counteract the telepathy thingy.>>

2 problems with this: (1) thor wouldn't know supes gets his power from the sun. (2) supes has reserves that would last a long time without a sun. thor technically might be able to teleport him away then leave him, like he did juggs, but that would certainly not be the way thor would try to win this fight. if supes could use his own mental powers against thor, it would likely be a definitive win. especially given the fact that thor is hardly the most stable of individuals to begin with, and his past history with being controlled.

<<Actually, Surtur was depicted forging Twilight from a white dwarf.>>

damn, i forgot to ask you this earlier - where did you get this info from? what issue of thor says it is white dwarf material? twilight was forged in the heart of a destroyed galaxy. it is said in the famous thor 337 to have been made of 'molten star stuff' which is obviously (since it is liquid) NOT white dwarf matter which would be dense beyond comprehension. so . . . where did you get that it was made of 'white dwarf matter'? PLEASE don't say that was another 'assumption' you made . . .

Originally posted by leonidas
<<Actually, Surtur was depicted forging Twilight from a white dwarf.>>

damn, i forgot to ask you this earlier - where did you get this info from? what issue of thor says it is white dwarf material? twilight was forged in the heart of a destroyed galaxy. it is said in the famous thor 337 to have been made of 'molten star stuff' which is obviously (since it is liquid) NOT white dwarf matter which would be dense beyond comprehension. so . . . where did you get that it was made of 'white dwarf matter'? PLEASE don't say that was another 'assumption' you made . . .

I was reading Superman #175 ‘Doomsday Rex’ (the book Avalon’s scan is from.) That’s just two issues following the conclusion of the Imperiex War. Kismet had given Superman the majority of her power to defeat Imperiex. It is very possible that her energy could have amplified Superman’s power, allowing him to perform such a feat. If anyone can make any clarifications feel free.

Superman isn’t usually at planet pushing strength levels. In the past, Thor has lifted millions of tons with not too much strain. Where does everyone get the idea that Superman is stronger?

Thor is more powerful than many are giving him credit for.

stars are unlikely to be liquid due to the pressure at a stars centre. 😄 Nope lets stick to fusing atomic nuclei 😄

Originally posted by whirlysplat
stars are unlikely to be liquid due to the pressure at a stars centre. 😄 Nope lets stick to fusing atomic nuclei 😄

Exactly. White dwarfs occur when the star can no longer maintain it's volume, and it becomes an immensely dense 'super-solid' of tightly packed subatomic particles.

Fusion has long since ceased when a star becomes a dwarf.

Originally posted by leonidas
i found this list of feats somewhere on the forum, and thought it was interesting. not sure it will convince anyone that supes really IS stronger, but they are impressive nonetheless:

<<Credit to RedWolf:

JLA: World War Three story-line: Superman was chained to the endless millwheels of the Mageddon machinery. His strength was used to move the gears of a weapon whose size dwarfed the entire Earth/Moon system. Once again it dwarfed the entire Earth/Moon System.
/\
Wrong.
Superman entrapped while Mageddon was still moving to planet Earth.
His powers where only an addiction to enhance some more Mageddon's power, it wasn't his strenght that was used but his energy resources.

In Superman: The Earth Stealers, Superman propelled a massive space station, cylindrical in shape and stated to be 600 miles in diameter (the length of the cylinder, judging by the depiction, had to have been about 2500 miles ) by pushing against it. The weight was inestimable- it was constructed from all the natural resources gleaned from an entire solar system. A hyperspace portal was opened and Superman not only pushed it, he propelled it for 20 minutes through hyperspace (it was stated that they reached the halfway point at 10 minutes). He had to exert the power to move it at the same time that he had to deal with the stresses of hyperspace unprotected.

JLA #77: Superman contains a black hole in the palm of his hand for an undisclosed amount of time. Later, he produces static electricity sufficient to be "corralled" by Green Lantern John Stewart into containing the black hole. Superman then launches the black hole into a neighboring wormhole.

Luthor 2000 special: Superman split one of Saturn's moons with a single strike.>>

others have mentioned some astounding feats as well.

Originally posted by Cosmic Cube
Deception.

A microscopic black hole, with no gravitaitional pull. All it did was make the JLA forget how to use their powers. Flash forgot how to slow down, Batman forgot how to talk, etc.

Earth Stealers = Pre-Crisis Superman. John Byrne said himself that Earth Stealers was one of the last showings of pre-crisis Superman's power. It was published shortly after the Crisis on Infinite Earths, in January of '88. Post-crisis Superman is nowhere near that level of power.

When was it established that the Mageddon warhead was that large? That occured in JLA #40, but it sounds like quite an exaggeration.

The only feat I questioned. Thank you K3VIL.

Earth-Stealers = Pre-crisis Superman. It isn't even in continuity.

The Black Hole in JLA #77 was inert. It was in a device that stole the JLA's memories. Batman was able to hold the very same microscopic black hole. Superman threw it into a boom tube.

Never read Luthor 2000.

Thor has split moon-sized asteroids with Mjolnir on more than one occasion.

Thor isn't out of this fight. He has a plethora of powers that I haven't even mentioned.

Originally posted by K3VIL
Yes Mageddon was various time bigger than the Earth.

He moved the entire Mageddon device?

Originally posted by Cosmic Cube
He moved the entire Mageddon device?

Originally posted by Cosmic Cube
The only feat I questioned. Thank you K3VIL.

Earth-Stealers = Pre-crisis Superman. It isn't even in continuity.

The Black Hole in JLA #77 was inert. It was in a device that stole the JLA's memories. Batman was able to hold the very same microscopic black hole. Superman threw it into a boom tube.

Never read Luthor 2000.

Thor has split moon-sized asteroids with Mjolnir on more than one occasion.

Thor isn't out of this fight. He has a plethora of powers that I haven't even mentioned.

CC stop being naughty you know size has nothing to do with the weight of a singularity. 😄 bad Cosmic Cube 😄

Originally posted by whirlysplat
CC stop being naughty you know size has nothing to do with the weight of a singularity. 😄 bad Cosmic Cube 😄

🙄

Anyway, it was big.

I bet it was 😄