Originally posted by chithappens
Everything Leo has said was debunked here.Let us just bask in the excellence that is Leo, for he is never wrong.
in the post in question, i see lots of personal oppinions, no categoric rebuttals, and oddly, many MANY claims with NO evidence{as it seems to be so dear to every1 opposing me} to back them up.
Originally posted by Robtard
What is your point then, that there are porn people out there that are being exploited? Sure, I am sure there are, just as in any industry.What's that have to do with the blanket generalizations Leo has been making?
I don't think because something is small scale in an industry makes it any more acceptable.
Originally posted by leonheartmm
in the post in question, i see lots of personal oppinions, no categoric rebuttals, and oddly, many MANY claims with NO evidence{as it seems to be so dear to every1 opposing me} to back them up.
Everything you've posted has been opinion.
Originally posted by Grand_Moff_Gav
I don't think because something is small scale in an industry makes it any more acceptable.
Right, but what's your point? Are you arguing that all industry should be abolished, then? Because God help us, we couldn't have some poor porn stars, factory workers, checkout operators, copy boys or cab drivers being abused, could we?
Originally posted by Robtard
Confucius?Trying not to shit ever again is "having no choice".
Killing or not killing yourself is a choice.
He may have said something about that, seems down his street...I know Seneca did.
Depends on your mental capacities though doesn't it...least, thats how the law sees it.
Originally posted by Grand_Moff_Gav
I don't think because something is small scale in an industry makes it any more acceptable.
So we should shut down every industry because somewhere, someone is/might be being exploited?
Or in the very least, we should show utter contempt and disdain to the clothing industry (eg) as a whole, besides some children in India making socks are working 16 hour days under dangerous conditions? Seriously?
Originally posted by chillmeistergen
Right, but what's your point? Are you arguing that all industry should be abolished, then? Because God help us, we couldn't have some poor porn stars, factory workers, checkout operators, copy boys or cab drivers being abused, could we?
I never said that...I was simply adding a perspective on the topic...
Originally posted by Grand_Moff_Gav
He may have said something about that, seems down his street...I know Seneca did.Depends on your mental capacities though doesn't it...least, thats how the law sees it.
There factually is a choice, you cannot deny or ignore that. Nothing excludes that choice existing, whether it's a case of mental illness or whatever, the choice is still there, always will be.
^ wrong, and most psychologist would disagree too. infact go ask any psychological researcher who is instrumental in making questionaries annd conducting sociological surveys etc, and they will tell you that FORCED CHOICE is a well known phenomenon in these matter and should be avoided as far as possible{eg. yes or no question, how many people other than your father has your mother slept with, 5 - 12 - above 35, and you HAVE to choose between one of them} , the entire psychological community agrees that FREE choice is the only thing being worthy of called choice while FORCED choice is no choice at all, as choice also implies personal inclination or desire to chooce one path} inevitably all choices at SOME point will be forced as there arent an infinite number of options to choose from, but they become less and less forced when people's personal desires exist as soem paths or as the number of paths increases. please do not context with with your ignorance robtard. suicide for a significant part, is NOT a choice. to say so is insulting to people who suffer and commit suicide.
Originally posted by chillmeistergen
There factually is a choice, you cannot deny or ignore that. Nothing excludes that choice existing, whether it's a case of mental illness or whatever, the choice is still there, always will be.
I think the element of choice may be there, but I think thats irrelevant. What is important is whether or not the person who has to make the "choice" has A) the mental capability and B) is in the conditions to make a rational choice
Originally posted by Grand_Moff_Gav
He may have said something about that, seems down his street...I know Seneca did.Depends on your mental capacities though doesn't it...least, thats how the law sees it.
I doubt that Roman was making that tidbit as to pretain to everything.
Crazy or not, it is still a choice in its very essense. If something could or could not be done, the choice is there.
Stop naming extremes of stuff.
This is not "Invisible Children." You can't say the majority are forced into making porn. You can say that plenty of kids are forced WITH NO CHOICE to fight wars, dig for diamonds, and so on with adequate everyday necessities.
There is a such thing as "forced choice" but why the hell are you making the exception to the rule your basis for argument?
Says a lot about the porn you watched.
^choice, as seen in your black and white world requires full RESPONSIBILITY for the reprecussions of the choice made. i guess you shud hold suicidals in full blame for the pain they might cause loved ones, or hold a father fully responsible for the murder of a person even if it was in an attempt to save his family from death as the person was a burglar etc etc etc. ofcourse, it is ridiculous to assume such things. but that is the result of rob's translation of choice.
There is still a choice though. How can you be this stupid? Even if they have a voice in their head telling them to do it incessantly and feel forced, it's a choice. Obviously there's a choice, as there's a point where they decide to do whatever it may be, whether someone or something is influencing them in that choice is of no importance.
In the case of pornography, they've got a fair few contracts to sign before shooting. If they're being leaned on to sign them, then it's up to them to inform the appropriate authorities, just like in any other industry.
Originally posted by chillmeistergen
There is still a choice though. How can you be this stupid? Even if they have a voice in their head telling them to do it incessantly and feel forced, it's a choice. Obviously there's a choice, as there's a point where they decide to do whatever it may be, whether someone or something is influencing them in that choice is of no importance.
Noone is denying the existence of a choice. Its whether or not a person is able to actually make that choice. In some instances women are in pron or prostitution or indeed any job because they have to be- even if it causes them pain and/or anguish.
For example, a pimp might force a woman to be a prostitute- she has the choice to stop but that will likely lead in her being beaten and possibly killed...is that a free choice she is making? No.
Your trying to steer this debate into whether or not a choice exists, ofcourse the choice does exist. However, Leo and I are trying to show that often the choice is nulified by the conditions surronding it.
^you didnt read what i wrote, a CHOICE isnt just the presence of multiple paths to choose from, that is a mere decision. a CHOICE is what the PERSON wants and desire and THEN if there is, among the many pathsm provided, a path which almost perfectly coincides with that personal desire and then if the person chooses that path. then and only THEN is it a real choice.
agin choice implies responsibility, should i then hold all americans responsible for the entire band of actions of their leader????!!!!!! NO! current democracy is also a forced choice and hence citizens can not be held fully responsible for the choices of the elected leaders.