Originally posted by srankmissingninwolverines mind control wasnt really shown to hinder him at all during the arc though
It was in the story... it was explicitly stated in the narrative of that very issue as well as by Captian America and Nicky Fury in the same story arch. That's why admist killing superheroes, he stopped to save a woman from rappists. Have you read the story?
Originally posted by DestinyGuy678Key words.
yeah but he was fighitng it plenty of times such as when he fought the fantastic four, it didnt really seem to effect his performance
We don't know how badly it effected him. Point being is that it shouldn't be admissible due to the circumstance of him not being in his right mind.
Originally posted by Creshoskwell they actually showed his inner conflict when he was fighting the mond control, so if it didnt have one of those then he shouldve een in control at the time
Key words.We don't know how badly it effected him. Point being is that it shouldn't be admissible due to the circumstance of him not being in his right mind.
Originally posted by Daredevil1
Agreed he outsmarted Torch and put down the Thing. Showing he was still very dangerous. And he also put down Namor in New Invaders 6 which ties into "Enemy of State".
Thats the level of Wolverine that Daredevil had to face and add to the fact that Logan had assistants from the hand well then you got one formidable foe. As DD held his own rather nicely.
Originally posted by Never
Daredevil has a SIGNIFICANT advantage over Wolverine in H2H. Period.Wolverine was trained by who? DD was trained by Stick. There's no comparison. Sabretooth tried that crap with DD. The fight was slightly in Sabretooth's favor because DD was protecting that child in the Fall of the Mutants story arc. Once the child was safe, DD just. Trashed. Sabretooth. Destroyed him. Sabretooth ran. Sabretooth was created to be, quote, "bigger. stronger. faster" than Wolvie. DD is QUICKER, far more AGILE, and has BETTER senses.
End of story.
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Wolverine was trained by Ogun A man so skilled that by nature of that skill alone developed a mastery over the human body that made him immortal and practically impervious to pain. He survived for hundreds of years with out aging a day, could be run through by a sword with out any ill effect and could kill a water Buffalo with a casual open hand slap. He could read minds and transfer bodies. He developed a training method that aloud him to impart years of knowledge to his students in days if not hours. Ogun was the very reason that Stick sent Elektra to retrain Wolverine after he lost his humanity.
Ogun > Stick
I think you should read 238 again. There was never a point when the "child" (who was a lady by the way) was safe and Daredevil "thrashed" Sabretooth. Sabretooth slit the girl's throat and DD got mad, tackled him from behind and hit Vic twice. Matt asked Creed why he did it, Creed basically said he could help himself and then left of his own volition... and Matt was too injured to go after him. When the fight ended DD was trashed, his costume was torn to shred and he was too injured to continue fighting, while Sabretooth on the other hand was fine; and that was three upgrades ago and before any of his back story was developed.
Daredevil is slower than Wolverine. Not more agile enough to matter. By his own admission has sense inferior to Wolverine.
EDIT: Sense of smell anyway.
Originally posted by DestinyGuy678
wolverines mind control wasnt really shown to hinder him at all during the arc though
He was depicted as still being dangerous. Well of course he was, he is a dangerous man. However, being dangerous doesn't preclude him from suffering under the influences of mind control. It just goes to show that if a Wolverine suffering under the affects of missing part of his soul and mind control is dangerous then he is even MORE dangerous when he is at peak efficiency.
He was depicted over the course of the story as arguing with the two other voices in his head (white and green narration boxes), he stated himself he was actively fighting against the mind control, Fury and Captain America surmised the same thing. It was in the story, arguing otherwise is pointless... all of this of course doesn't even begin to touch on the fact that Wolverine was MISSING PART OF HIS SOUL THAT GREATLY DIMINISHED HIS FIGHT CAPABILITIES. These are the reasons why DD ended up in a full nelson in three panels in MCP and fought off Wolverine for several pages in EotS.
Originally posted by srankmissingnin
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Wolverine was trained by Ogun A man so skilled that by nature of that skill alone developed a mastery over the human body that made him immortal and practically impervious to pain. He survived for hundreds of years with out aging a day, could be run through by a sword with out any ill effect and could kill a water Buffalo with a casual open hand slap. He could read minds and transfer bodies. He developed a training method that aloud him to impart years of knowledge to his students in days if not hours. Ogun was the very reason that Stick sent Elektra to retrain Wolverine after he lost his humanity.
Ogun > Stick
I think you should read 238 again. There was never a point when the "child" (who was a lady by the way) was safe and Daredevil "thrashed" Sabretooth. Sabretooth slit the girl's throat and DD got mad, tackled him from behind and hit Vic twice. Matt asked Creed why he did it, Creed basically said he could help himself and then left of his own volition... and Matt was too injured to go after him. When the fight ended DD was trashed, his costume was torn to shred and he was too injured to continue fighting, while Sabretooth on the other hand was fine; and that was three upgrades ago and before any of his back story was developed.
Daredevil is slower than Wolverine. Not more agile enough to matter. By his own admission has sense inferior to Wolverine.
EDIT: Sense of smell anyway.
Owned with 'da knowledge'.
Originally posted by Daredevil1
Let him think what he wants. I done responding to him. But anyhow who do you give the majority too in this scenario???
Daredevil. His feats are far more impressive and he can take him down with presure point. Was going to go into more detail why he wins but im too tired.
edit: If wolverine gets used to not having his healing factor I actually might give the majority to Wolverine.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Daredevil. His feats are far more impressive and he can take him down with presure point. Was going to go into more detail why he wins but im too tired.
Wolverine has shanked Thanos with the Infinity Gauntlet. He's become a Cosmic/Abstract at least once. He's beaten an ancient divine being whose sole purpose is to kick-ass. He's even got a few wins against Magneto...
Let's not compare feats, shall we? twisted1
Even without the healing factor, Wolverine still has superior physical stats in every category, and has that Adamantium skeleton, which protects him that much more in addition to putting more force behind his strikes.
Originally posted by Eternal Idol
Wolverine has shanked Thanos with the Infinity Gauntlet. He's become a Cosmic/Abstract at least once. He's beaten an ancient divine being whose sole purpose is to kick-ass. He's even got a few wins against Magneto...Let's not compare feats, shall we? twisted1
Is this supposed to be some sort of joke or are you for real? You're using that as your criteria? 😬
Originally posted by Eternal Idol
Even without the healing factor, Wolverine still has superior physical stats in every category, and has that Adamantium skeleton, which protects him that much more in addition to putting more force behind his strikes.
I have a feeling that the thread starter meant no adamantuim but I can't be sure. Anyway if that is the case the main factor here is that he gets used not having a HF.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Is this supposed to be some sort of joke or are you for real?I have a feeling that the thread starter meant no adamantuim but I can't be sure. Anyway if that is the case the main factor here is that he gets used not having a HF.
The feat thing was a joke, but even with no adamantium or healing factor, he'd still have the physical edge on Daredevil. The only thing Murdock would have on Logan would be reach, assuming the claws won't be used because of the missing healing factor.
Originally posted by Eternal Idol
The feat thing was a joke,
I was about to say.....Lol come to think of it I think Cap did better against Thanos than Wolverine did. 😂
Originally posted by Eternal Idol
but even with no adamantium or healing factor, he'd still have the physical edge on Daredevil. The only thing Murdock would have on Logan would be reach, assuming the claws won't be used because of the missing healing factor.
What are you basing that opinion on?
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
I was about to say.....Lol come to think of it I think Cap did better against Thanos than Wolverine did. 😂What are you basing that opinion on?
Cap got the pimp-hand from Thanos...
I'm basing it off that FACT that Wolverine has (and has shown on-panel) enhanced/superhuman physical abilities. Strength, speed, reflexes, durability, etc. The healing factor improves his stamina and strength, and the adamantium allows him to support heavy lifting, but he's still amped without them. His speed without the adamantium only gets better.
Oh, and the reach theory speaks for itself.
Originally posted by Eternal Idol
Cap got the pimp-hand from Thanos...
Anyway lets forget it everybody got owned by Thanos anyway.
Originally posted by Eternal Idol
I'm basing it off that FACT that Wolverine has (and has shown on-panel) enhanced/superhuman physical abilities. Strength, speed, reflexes, durability, etc. The healing factor improves his stamina and strength, and the adamantium allows him to support heavy lifting, but he's still amped without them. His speed without the adamantium only gets better.Oh, and the reach theory speaks for itself.
Hes shown enhanced skills without his HF and adamantuim....how do you know?
Were not sure if he has it or not. If he still amped without them the alck of adamantuim does not weigh enough to make a difference to somebody with enhanced strength.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Anyway lets forget it everybody got owned by Thanos anyway.
Yeah, but Thanos backhanded Cap unconscious during one of his patronizing speeches. That's a feat in a league of its own. smoke
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Hes shown enhanced skills without his HF and adamantuim....how do you know?Were not sure if he has it or not. If he still amped without them the alck of adamantuim does not weigh enough to make a difference to somebody with enhanced strength.
I never said he was the friggin' Hulk's equal or anything of the sort. He definitely ain't on human level though. That adamantium, being as tough and dense as it is, has to weigh a freakin' ton. No, not literally, Zone. I don't buy it when Marvel's stats bill Wolverine at 300lbs with the adamantium-- it just sounds like a thrown out number. It's not like he's being anchored down by it, but it does weigh him down. Try running around with a backpack full of books. Sure, you can do it just fine, but you're not gonna be nearly as fast.
All this time, Wolverine's shown some impressive displays of strength WHILE having to lug around the extra weight from his skeleton (the elevator feat comes to mind). That should say a lot about his strength.
I'm pretty sure Jinzin's got a few examples of each in his Wolverine Respect thread... (No charge for the plug, Jinzin.) Remember, Logan's been without both for a while after Magneto ripped the adamantium out of him, Alf.
Let's say you're right, though....
*pause for uproar of laughter*
... Wolverine is still more skilled than Daredevil, and would still likely get a speed increase.