The fact that id refuses to switch to First Age, when according to the discussion 3rd Age has the same power set minus restrictions on energy, speaks volumes about possible usage. If you turn off the CIS and start blowing up cities or something, we'll know and call shenanigans. Forewarned, id. Not trying to be a jerk, just letting you know this so that you can gauge accordingly. People are expected to push the limits....that's commendable. But the rest of us are also expected to watch those limits like a hawk for our opponents.
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Well if they're being brought up for discussion, it certainly speaks to their power level. Though, granted, I can't really name many people Trick hasn't questioned since drafts started, so it's not like I'm in elite company.But my earlier point(s) stands. Right now, my only concern is demystifying the Spawn mess and figuring out if he should be allowed or not. Otherwise, people have been surprisingly trustworthy with not trying to sneak picks in (though my objection to Judomaster at 10 pts. remains 😛 ).
Originally posted by illadelph12
The matter manipulation rule (like the no mind control rule for telepaths and the speed cap) prohibits the use of matter manipulation on your opponent. Characters that possess these abilities (matter manipulators/transmuters, telepaths, speedsters) are still allowed. Those methods of attack/ability are simply not available.
If one team alters their own armour/whetever with those powers, can another team alter them back to standard the same way?
Like, only use matter manipulation against pre-matter manipulated materials/people?
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Trick, you're going to have to remember that the limit is High Meta. Not Iron Man, which it is normally associated with. Prove to me that MM (current, btw) or Sinister belong in Low Herald and I'll happily concede the point. They don't. They'd get thrashed by nearly anyone at that level, or would put up a good fight but lose....the same that is often said of IM vs. Low Heralds. Hell, Tony has hung with High Heralds for a while, even in normal armor. Being at the top of, say, middle school math students, does not mean you'd beat high school math students on tests. Same thing.I drafted some strong, badass picks. No obvious fancy meshes, but they are as good as nearly anyone that will be drafted. But it doesn't make them illegal. I find it weird that everyone I drafted is in the tiers thread, which ahs been up for years, and no one's ever even mentioned those two as belonging elsewhere. There's a reason for that.
I'm a little disappointed in you for not drafting more indy characters.
🙁
Originally posted by Scoobless
If one team alters their own armour/whetever with those powers, can another team alter them back to standard the same way?Like, only use matter manipulation against pre-matter manipulated materials/people?
I've asked Ill. The only thing you can use matter manip on in combat is your surrounding. In prep you can matter manip your resourses\armout\tech, but you can't matter manip those of opposition.
I have other plans for you, though, so don't worry- and I've asked about its legality yesterday. In fact, so far your team looks the scariest in entire roster.
Originally posted by Charlotte DeBel
I've asked Ill. The only thing you can use matter manip on in combat is your surrounding. In prep you can matter manip your resourses\armout\tech, but you can't matter manip those of opposition.
I have another plans for you, though, so don't worry- and I've asked about its legality yesterday.
S'awrigh' ... you've aint gonna beat Leo 'n me ... no way no how.
😎
Originally posted by DigiMark007
The fact that id refuses to switch to First Age, when according to the discussion 3rd Age has the same power set minus restrictions on energy, speaks volumes about possible usage. If you turn off the CIS and start blowing up cities or something, we'll know and call shenanigans. Forewarned, id. Not trying to be a jerk, just letting you know this so that you can gauge accordingly. People are expected to push the limits....that's commendable. But the rest of us are also expected to watch those limits like a hawk for our opponents.
Ah well you need to excuse me, but I am going to attempt to protect my investment. I find it odd, that members are targeting the energy issue. To me it would not be such a big problem, other then the fact that if he was drained of said energy he dies. Not tire, or weaken, but die. let me look around a bit. I found an interesting comment I don’t want to take any credit for it.
Members you're going to have to remember that the limit is High Meta. Not Iron Man, which it is normally associated with. Prove to me that Spawn (3rd, btw) belong in Low Herald and I'll happily concede the point. He doesn’t. He'd get thrashed by nearly anyone at that level, or would put up a good fight but lose....the same that is often said of 1st/3rd age Spawn vs. Low Heralds. Hell, Al has hung with High Heralds for a while, even in on its initial age. Being at the top of, say, middle school math students, does not mean you'd beat high school math students on tests. Same thing.
Other then Spawn and Cable do we have other issues to resolve?
Originally posted by id369
Ah well you need to excuse me, but I am going to attempt to protect my investment. I find it odd, that members are targeting the energy issue. To me it would not be such a big problem, other then the fact that if he was drained of said energy he dies. Not tire, or weaken, but die. let me look around a bit. I found an interesting comment I don’t want to take any credit for it.Members you're going to have to remember that the limit is High Meta. Not Iron Man, which it is normally associated with. Prove to me that Spawn (3rd, btw) belong in Low Herald and I'll happily concede the point. He doesn’t. He'd get thrashed by nearly anyone at that level, or would put up a good fight but lose....the same that is often said of 1st/3rd age Spawn vs. Low Heralds. Hell, Al has hung with High Heralds for a while, even in on its initial age. Being at the top of, say, middle school math students, does not mean you'd beat high school math students on tests. Same thing.
Other then Spawn and Cable do we have other issues to resolve?
OK.. keep them for all intents and purposes. I don't want to start a flamewar over those...
id, I'm not trying to be argumentative with you. I can only go off of comments from other members who know things about Spawn. So yes, my comments concerning my own picks are still valid, and apply to everyone else as well. If the insertion you use in your last post is as valid as it was for me, then I'm happy to allow him in.
If he indeed has no low herald potential, then great. For what it's worth, I believe you, and never actually doubted you, but wanted to clarify the bind we're in. I only had to say what I did regarding Spawn because so few are familiar with him, so I wanted to let you know that we'll be monitoring him, both for the sake of the tourney's integrity as well as for our own plans. That will still happen. The responsibility isn't just on us to prove whether or not a pick is legal...it's also on participants to pick those that aren't above the caps, and to inform others of the limitations of unknown characters so that confusion is minimized and things are kept respectable.
So thank you for your input. The sarcasm isn't needed, but I understand your situation and trust that Spawn is ok.
Though I'll say this again, just for discussion: Takion knows Spawn as well as anyone. This from the Apoc vs. Spawn thread:
Originally posted by Takion
616 Apoc beats...Third Age (Before he learned what he can do)
*emphasis added
Not a giant red flag, but to act like we don't have legit concerns is a bit silly.
Originally posted by Scoobless
I'm a little disappointed in you for not drafting more indy characters.🙁
I always want to, then it comes down to it and Marvel characters are the best for the job.
Well look at this way, time and time again Violator, Redeemer, and Overkitkill are giving him trouble (in just about every encounter). Neither are on the Herald class, I have to question exactly what members are afraid of besides character hype. Other then that, maybe after this tournament, it will create some interest to read up on Spawn.
Originally posted by id369
Well look at this way, time and time again Violator, Redeemer, and Overkitkill are giving him trouble (in just about every encounter). Neither are on the Herald class
Violator is being discussed for High Herald in the tiers thread. 2 votes against to 1 for, but the discussion itself raises eyebrows. I would hope that a probably-mid-herald would give a supposedly High Meta trouble. So that's not exactly a ringing endorsement of your point.
Like I said, I personally believe you. I'll be watching, but I trust that it's mostly just fear based in a lack of knowledge. But things like this do tend to raise alarms, so we're not going solely on speculation.
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Violator is being discussed for High Herald in the tiers thread. 2 votes against to 1 for, but the discussion itself raises eyebrows. I would hope that a probably-mid-herald would give a supposedly High Meta trouble. So that's not exactly a ringing endorsement of your point.Like I said, I personally believe you. I'll be watching, but I trust that it's mostly just fear based in a lack of knowledge. But things like this do tend to raise alarms, so we're not going solely on speculation.
The only character that is in meta tier from named here is Overkill. Redeemer- high end high meta, Violator- low herald.