Big Boss vs Solidus Snake

1. I would have to find the bullshit. Pyron Knight posted it.

2. Said he wanted to make him suffer. How is he gonna suffer if he is dead? Sokolov...Is a skinny wimpy scientist.

He was LITERALLY pulling his punches.

When he punched he pulled back so it wouldn't have full impact. He wasn't pulling them in the torture scene, true. But said torture scene ended with Snake being bloodied, fvcked up, half dead, and missing an eye. He doesn't have to dump all his electricity in every punch.

...I'm bisexual

3. Ummm...Yeah, he actually WAS.

~Sado

The tanking rockets comes from the fight with the shagohad because when you finish that fight is shows Snake holding a rpg but for all we know it might not have been a direct hits just the explosion's that might have hurt him

Actually there was also a scene which shows Snake firing a rocket at him.

I'll respond when I find the proof Sado.

Originally posted by Sado22
and how's he gonna make him suffer by pulling his punches too?

How are you going to make someone suffer by killing them in one blow? 😐

Back to the topic,

All of Big Boss's experience didn't stop him from getting his ass kicked twice by Solid Snake. Are some of you here saying Solid is more skilled than Liquid and Solidus?

Given Solidus's accelerated old age, isn't he the eldest of the three clones?

Yeah he is.

He also struck me as the most powerful.

I was bored and have the flu... so yesterday morning I decided to play through MGS3 and I beat it this morning. 🙂

Relevance? Not sure... however Volgin was holding back his punches, and he was torturing Snake for a reason. He wanted information. There's like a ten minute interrogation scene where Volgin's just beating the shit out of him and questioning him until Boss states that he isn't going to break...

However that's not damage soak, and it's not a feat in favor of Snake's durability. After the first couple of punches from Volgin Snake was essentially down for the count. At that point Volgin just started pounding him until he shit himself... I suppose that you can count it as a feat due to Snake not dying, but he was unable to fight back, or even muster up a defense at all; so it's unrealistic for Snake to magically be able to defeat Volgin in a fight, especially considering the man has an EM force field like Magneto's that's strong enough to repel RPG rounds, enough strength to punch through reinforced steel walls, and was only killed when he was struck by lightning and pulpified by hundreds of rounds of his own bullets strapped to his chest going off.

There really should be no way for either Big Boss or The Boss to have punked Volgin.

Exactly.

And don;t forget, the dude had excellent control over his powers.

By wrapping his arms with Shagohod's wires, he could completely control it.

Volgin's shield can tank RPGs, but he can as well.

When punching Snake, like I and Blax said, he was pulling back his punches before they could make full impact, and even then, after the first few, Snake was fvcked up and could not fight back.

Volgin is a character that is so powerful it would be ridiculous for the likes of even Batman to beat him in H2H, yet alone Snake.

And it isn't like Volgin is some big dumb guy either. He was a skilled champion boxer before he joined GRU, he knows how to fight.

^but thats the thing, in terms of pure strength, gray fox was even MORE powerful than volgine, and snake took him in hand to hand combat. its not about what he SHUD have been capable of doing, the only hting relevant is what he DID do, makinbg up rationalisation like{they werent going all out} is stupid. big boss also defeated gene who was physically PLAYING with null. maybe we shud stop thinking of the snakes as HUMANS. that wud bring things into perspective. {oh btw, volgin PUNCJED straight through the armour of the shagohod which the RPG with a heat warhead cudnt even SCRATCH, let alone dent. and he was defeated by a lightening strike created by the SORROW, probably no ordinary lightening strike}

Originally posted by leonheartmm
its not about what he SHUD have been capable of doing, the only hting relevant is what he DID do,

You have no idea what PIS is do you?

By your logic, which sucks btw no offense, Spiderman > beings that can move faster then light, since he did beat Firelord.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
Solidus killed MEtal Gear Rays and did so easily.

He has a gun that shreds right through their armor.

He blocked their turret fire with his swords.

He has a suit that enhances his strength, speed, and durability.

He has Doc Ock tentacles that also shoot missiles.

And as for defeating Volgin in H2H combat, that fight reeked of PIS.

Solidus wins.

raiden destroyed metal gears and he did so with reletive ease

he has a gun called the p-90 which every other tengu has{and we have too in mgs4} the gun is less penetrating than even the m-4, its only that solidus knew the weak points of the UNMANNED rays and had the suit to get him to that height{u can do sumthing similar with the metal gears in mgs4}

both raiden{human form} and grayfox cud block machine gun fire with a single sword.

big boss has a cqc enhancing suit as well, but that doesnt matter, since he regularly beats foes with hand to hand TECHNIQUE

the missiles shot can be shot or cut down, and the tentacle were easily avoided by raiden.

it wasnt PIS, it cud only be PIS if it was completely inconsistant with everythin else big boss and humas in MGS series did. we cant compare it with the same standards as marvel or dc, it HAPPENED.accept it.

solidus loses. only solid or possibly liquid cud have beat big boss.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
You have no idea what PIS is do you?

By your logic, which sucks btw no offense, Spiderman > beings that can move faster then light, since he did beat Firelord.

^i do know what PIS is, but i see manga in which humans unaided can destroy buildings etc with no special powers etc etc. you have to look at the CONTEXT things are used in. would u say that chad using that pole to battle hollows in his human form {before he got any spirit power} is PIS, seeing as he was human then and not capable of a feat like that?! or would you say that kenshin's battles are PIS, because hes only HUMAN{which he is along with every1 else in the series, and it is explicitly stated that there is nuthign SUPERNATURAL about his techniques} . ofcourse not! this isnt the dc or marvel verse. you can only judge PIS by looking at OTHER actions of the characters inside the same MEDIA, and then seeing if the feats are completely inconcistant. if snake was in marvel AND taking on foes like volgin, then itd be PIS, however, when he is inside MGS verse, it isnt PIS. just like kenshin and saitou arent PIS.

Originally posted by leonheartmm
[B]would u say that chad using that pole to battle hollows in his human form {before he got any spirit power} is PIS, seeing as he was human then and not capable of a feat like that?!

Considering Chad been shown before hand to possess superhuman durability and strength, no. Hitting a hollow with a pole would not be PIS.

or would you say that kenshin's battles are PIS, because hes only HUMAN{which he is along with every1 else in the series, and it is explicitly stated that there is nuthign SUPERNATURAL about his techniques} .

"Regular human" is subjective in a non-fictional universe. Regular human in the Kenshin-verse may not be as weak as regular humans are in our own reality.

this isnt the dc or marvel verse. you can only judge PIS by looking at OTHER actions of the characters inside the same MEDIA, and then seeing if the feats are completely inconcistant.

No, you judge PIS by looking at their feats and their abilities. If Snake has not shown any abilities or has any feats that say he could even stand a chance against Volgin, then it's PIS if he does. Snake was incapacitated by Volgin by only a couple of punches. He then lost an eye. How chould a man who has been trained using two eyes his entire life and had gotten the ever living shit beaten out of him, manage to beat Volgin not even three days later when his depth perception is half as good as he's been used to his entire life, and he's shown zero feats and abilities that put him on Volgin's level aside from getting his ass handed to him on a platter by the Boss and Volgin on multiple occasions?

The answer is simple, because Snake needed to win in order for the plot to continue.

You don't think it should work that way. Too bad. That's how KMC battle rules work.

Originally posted by leonheartmm
raiden destroyed metal gears and he did so with reletive ease

he has a gun called the p-90 which every other tengu has{and we have too in mgs4} the gun is less penetrating than even the m-4, its only that solidus knew the weak points of the UNMANNED rays and had the suit to get him to that height{u can do sumthing similar with the metal gears in mgs4}

both raiden{human form} and grayfox cud block machine gun fire with a single sword.

big boss has a cqc enhancing suit as well, but that doesnt matter, since he regularly beats foes with hand to hand TECHNIQUE

the missiles shot can be shot or cut down, and the tentacle were easily avoided by raiden.

it wasnt PIS, it cud only be PIS if it was completely inconsistant with everythin else big boss and humas in MGS series did. we cant compare it with the same standards as marvel or dc, it HAPPENED.accept it.

solidus loses. only solid or possibly liquid cud have beat big boss.

2. Kay...And that feat is far above Big Boss'.

3. I can't believe I actually have to tell you this, but Ray's turrets are>>>standard machine guns.

4. Kay...Solidus' feats are still better.

5. Who is not Big Boss. And Raiden even as a human was agile and quick.

6. ...It IS inconsistant with everything Big Boss has done.

Originally posted by leonheartmm

both raiden{human form} and grayfox cud block machine gun fire with a single sword.

Raiden, in human form, can block a few bullets not multiple gunfire like Grayfox. His reflexes are not in the league of Cyborg Grayfox.

solidus loses. only solid or possibly liquid cud have beat big boss.

What? How can you say only Liquid and Solid could have beat Big Boss? Do you have proof that they're above Solidus? Solidus is the first and only perfect clone of Big Boss. He has both dominant and recessive genes. His potential is the same as the Big Boss.

What are you even saying?!?!?!?

Originally posted by leonheartmm
^but thats the thing, in terms of pure strength, gray fox was even MORE powerful than volgine, and snake took him in hand to hand combat. its not about what he SHUD have been capable of doing, the only hting relevant is what he DID do, makinbg up rationalisation like{they werent going all out} is stupid. big boss also defeated gene who was physically PLAYING with null. maybe we shud stop thinking of the snakes as HUMANS. that wud bring things into perspective. {oh btw, volgin PUNCJED straight through the armour of the shagohod which the RPG with a heat warhead cudnt even SCRATCH, let alone dent. and he was defeated by a lightening strike created by the SORROW, probably no ordinary lightening strike}

He won cause the plot required it. By feats, Big Boss should NEVER beat Volgin.

The Snakes are humans who can take a decent amount of damage.

Dude, Volgin while pulling his punches had Snake dazed and beat in two blows, how in the FVCK does he beat Volgin going full out?

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
And that was PIS too, and I have never seen Gray Fox punch through the hull of a tank that rockets could not dent...

He won cause the plot required it. By feats, Big Boss should NEVER beat Volgin.

The Snakes are humans who can take a decent amount of damage.

Dude, Volgin while pulling his punches had Snake dazed and beat in two blows, how in the FVCK does he beat Volgin going full out?

sigh, do you even understand REMOTELY why MGS is called a post modernist game?! its because it seemingly MELDS the natural with the supernatural among other things. the boss was human too correct? then how come, when snake shot her, the entire field of white petals around them turns blood red, and why is it that the scars on her body turn into snakes and crawl away???????? oh right i suppose thats PIS too. similarly, how did liquid snake survive the fall from the top of metal gear rex?! thats not humanly POSSIBLE DAMMIT SO IT MUST BE PIS!!!!!
honestly, you just dont GET metalk gear, going by your narrow minded reasoning.

gray fox, in the twin snakes was able to easily cut a huge block of concreate and kick it mid air hurling it at snake{who dodged it}, also, simply by throwing bodies of his victims, he was able to crack the reinforced walls of shadow moses. and he also was able to physically resist the hundreds of tons of rex's weight being STOMPED down on top of him. he probably is physicall stronger than volgin. and it wasnt pis, it was MGS. your just stubborn so you cant get it. you said it yourself, its upto the series to define what HUMANS can do and MGS defines it differently form the real world.

volgin didnt have snake beat, snake CQCd his ass and had him on the ground then the BOSS, came in and beat snake at CQC after which he was dazed and volgin had gotten up and then beat snake for an EXTENDED period of time with many many blows after which snake was still standing before he was hit in the back of the head. {it WASNT two blows, i can give u the video if u want}

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
Considering Chad been shown before hand to possess superhuman durability and strength, no. Hitting a hollow with a pole would not be PIS.

"Regular human" is subjective in a non-fictional universe. Regular human in the Kenshin-verse may not be as weak as regular humans are in our own reality.

No, you judge PIS by looking at their feats and their abilities. If Snake has not shown any abilities or has any feats that say he could even stand a chance against Volgin, then it's PIS if he does. Snake was incapacitated by Volgin by only a couple of punches. He then lost an eye. How chould a man who has been trained using two eyes his entire life and had gotten the ever living shit beaten out of him, manage to beat Volgin not even three days later when his depth perception is half as good as he's been used to his entire life, and he's shown zero feats and abilities that put him on Volgin's level aside from getting his ass handed to him on a platter by the Boss and Volgin on multiple occasions?

The answer is simple, because Snake needed to win in order for the plot to continue.

You don't think it should work that way. Too bad. That's how KMC battle rules work.

yes but chad was HUMAN, that alone is reason enough to call it PIS by your criteria.

you said it yourself, regular human is reletive, so go with it,

he wasnt incapacitated by volgin, he best volgin's ass to the ground and THEN was beaten by boss after which it took MANY punches to bring him down. and the eye didnt slow him down, thats how teh story goes, dont like it, take it up with kojima.

the answer is simple, you are imposing real world physics on a video game.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
1. With rockets. Solidus had a machine gun.

2. Kay...And that feat is far above Big Boss'.

3. I can't believe I actually have to tell you this, but Ray's turrets are>>>standard machine guns.

4. Kay...Solidus' feats are still better.

5. Who is not Big Boss. And Raiden even as a human was agile and quick.

6. ...It IS inconsistant with everything Big Boss has done.

1. solidus also had an exoskeleton

2. wrong

3. news flash, raiden can also block ray's turret fire with his high frequency blade, infact otacon advises him to do just that

4. no they arent

5. raiden is not superior to bog boss or snake for that matter, open your eyes

6. yea yea, like taking down two armies single handedly, desimating the entire cobra unit with its superhumans members, defeating gene, null, ursula and python in combat, yea yea, i can definately see how its inconsistant.