Intelligence & cunning competition between Thanos and Darkseid

Originally posted by Allankles
He asked a question (minus the question mark); it wasn't a statement.

Read again:

Originally posted by Allankles
Pretty much. DS has him beat hands down in intelligence and cunning.

EDIT: That crap he pulled with Orion's assasination had me scratching my head for a moment. And his scheming? Countdown now FC, he seems to have played the DC heroes for patsies.

when he outwitted the source

Originally posted by beast1234
when he outwitted the source

Darksied was so cool, that he's never actually been seen in the DCU in true form. He's retconned himself so that the only canon appearance he has is Seven Soldiers. Tee hee.

Originally posted by fangirl101
Darksied was so cool, that he's never actually been seen in the DCU in true form. He's retconned himself so that the only canon appearance he has is Seven Soldiers. Tee hee.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Proof?

Originally posted by fangirl101
Final Crisis.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Where is your proof that everything else is retconned?

In Final Crisis it is mentioned that dark new gods have been on Earth masquerading as humans for some time. Seven soldiers already hinted at this, and final crisis further indicates that DS has been on Earth for some years.

A lot of his other recent showings could be avatars of course. I don't know where DONG fits into the continuity since FC clearly takes place after DONG but apart from getting trapped in the Source Wall in Supes/BM (and that may even have been an avatar although for story purposes it shouldn't), a lot of his recent Earth showings (Countdown was retconned by FC) may be retconned as avatars just because they are not consistent with the plan in FC.

For one the writers have stated DS true form has never been seen on Earth which seems to carry over what his avatar had mentioned in an earlier comic.

Morrison's idea with the New Gods (of Apokolips who've destroyed New Genesis) is that they are each actually Galactus level beings (another Kirby creation) and that each one of them represents some aspect of evil, with Darkseid being the god of all evil, so conceptually FC is retconning a lot of Darkseid's "top tier" type showings.

Morrison loves the concept of Darkseid's character calling him "DC's greatest villain", so expect bigger things with Darkseid as FC winds down. So far he's controlling all of Earth's population save for a few souls. And Earth is described as the foundation stone of all existence.

So far I've got to say FC is impressing me, especially for a major event series, if you compare it to Secret Invasion there's no comparison, FC is pretty damn good so far.

Originally posted by Allankles
SPAM

Originally posted by Allankles
In Final Crisis it is mentioned that dark new gods have been on Earth masquerading as humans for some time. Seven soldiers already hinted at this, and final crisis further indicates that DS has been on Earth for some years.

A lot of his other recent showings could be avatars of course. I don't know where DONG fits into the continuity since FC clearly takes place after DONG but apart from getting trapped in the Source Wall in Supes/BM (and that may even have been an avatar although for story purposes it shouldn't), a lot of his recent Earth showings (Countdown was retconned by FC) may be retconned as avatars just because they are not consistent with the plan in FC.

For one the writers have stated DS true form has never been seen on Earth which seems to carry over what his avatar had mentioned in an earlier comic.

Morrison's idea with the New Gods (of Apokolips who've destroyed New Genesis) is that they are each actually Galactus level beings (another Kirby creation) and that each one of them represents some aspect of evil, with Darkseid being the god of all evil, so conceptually FC is retconning a lot of Darkseid's "top tier" type showings.

Morrison loves the concept of Darkseid's character calling him "DC's greatest villain", so expect bigger things with Darkseid as FC winds down. So far he's controlling all of Earth's population save for a few souls. And Earth is described as the foundation stone of all existence.

So far I've got to say FC is impressing me, especially for a major event series, if you compare it to Secret Invasion there's no comparison, FC is pretty damn good so far.

DS couldn't tie his shoes until he was 20

Originally posted by quanchi112
Still all your own interpretations. Nothing in the comic actually has made it official yet. I have read fc and it isnt impressing me at all. Legion of worlds is blowing it away while fc is boring imo.

What have they done in Legion of Worlds? All that's happened is that Emo Supes has gone on another angsty feat and released prisoners just so that he can amp his rep and debase Superman's legacy. FC (main) and Revelations are the best part of Final Crisis at the moment.

EDIT: And it's Morrison who said the New Gods are Galactus level beings each one representing an aspect of evil with DS being the god of all evil.

And so far DS has control over Earth's population. Also it was Morrison who said Darkseid is "DC's greatest villain" - not my interpretation.

And it is Seven Soldiers and FC that have indicated that DS and the Apokolips gods have been on Earth for some time and that Orion was assasinated years ago with a dimension gun that was shot backwards through the time stream he only happened to die in the "present" because no one knew DS had already killed the last of New Genesis Gods potentially 50 years previous to FC (based on what GL found out about the bullet).

Mr Miracle is the only survivior of New Genesis.

So a lot of what I've said is basically based on FC and what Morrison has said.

Basically, The Gods Died a long while ago. How Superman factors in is a mystery since he also acts like he doesn't know what's going on with the New Gods.

What I think happened was that When the source killed all the New Gods, He retconned Them out and remade them into the 5th World beings. Thus starting thier time line over again from the beginning.

Then with these new more powerful versions of the New Gods, They've sent avatars to earth periodically. But Where we actually see the first true avatars is in Seven Soldiers. And Final Crisis Picks up where Seven Soldiers Mister Miracle Left off.

It is impossible for DS to have just died in that old man's body unless countdown and nearly every other New Gods appearance was retconned. Basically what Morrison Did was have two time lines run simultaneously. Using the Death of the New Gods to retcon the 4th world out of existance.

Originally posted by Allankles
What have they done in Legion of Worlds? All that's happened is that Emo Supes has gone on another angsty feat and released prisoners just so that he can amp his rep and debase Superman's legacy. FC (main) and Revelations are the best part of Final Crisis at the moment.

EDIT: And it's Morrison who said the New Gods are Galactus level beings each one representing an aspect of evil with DS being the god of all evil.

And so far DS has control over Earth's population. Also it was Morrison who said Darkseid is "DC's greatest villain" - not my interpretation.

And it is Seven Soldiers and FC that have indicated that DS and the Apokolips gods have been on Earth for some time and that Orion was assasinated years ago with a dimension gun that was shot backwards through the time stream he only happened to die in the "present" because no one knew DS had already killed the last of New Genesis Gods potentially 50 years previous to FC (based on what GL found out about the bullet).

Mr Miracle is the only survivior of New Genesis.

So a lot of what I've said is basically based on FC and what Morrison has said.

Prime,Mordru,Sodam Yat being the last green lantern. Bring other legions in to help them.

Far more exciting imo than brainwashing villains with the tired old ale. I wish they would try and use something else. They stick with the same lame ideas.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Its much more exciting than fc imo. Much more.

Prime,Mordru,Sodam Yat being the last green lantern. Bring other legions in to help them.

Far more exciting imo than brainwashing villains with the tired old ale. I wish they would try and use something else. They stick with the same lame ideas.

Originally posted by fangirl101
Yeah. you know, like a certain puple puss at marvel that keeps on getting the ultimate power and then losing it. Same lame ideas.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Different powerups in different ways. He isnt still using the ig. Been there and done that. Ds still is lustin over that silly ale. Lame.

DS hasn't lusted for the ALE in a years. He switched his goals long time ago, he's been interested in the Source for the longest time. This is characterized perfectly in DONG with DS only having partial knowledge of the ALE but using the SFE to gain domination over the Source.

In an older comic (I can't remember if it was Genesis or an earlier story arch, he pretty much tells his followers to screw the ALE he is going after the Source itself now. Besides he has the full ALE now for the second time, in FC.

Thanos isn't still using the IG because he's a relatively fringe character in Marvel whereas DS is one of the main villains in the DCU.

Thanos is a character who is given huge power ups via trinkets and then had them stripped away at the end of the mini, he isn't a guy Marvel use on a consistent basis.

That's why he gets killed off and put on the shelf for a few years collecting dust, before he's thrown back in to co star in another mini.

Conceptually he is a difficult character to use consistently mainly because his whole shtick is to impress death or do her work for her, an ok concept if you're doing a one-off tragic story, not so good as a consistent antagonist.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Its much more exciting than fc imo. Much more.

Prime,Mordru,Sodam Yat being the last green lantern. Bring other legions in to help them.

Far more exciting imo than brainwashing villains with the tired old ale. I wish they would try and use something else. They stick with the same lame ideas.

Which lame ideas? The complete domination of Earth's inhabitants for the purpose of bringing about the end of an age and usher forth the 5th world?

A new existence in which Darkseid is lord? Existence reshaped in Darkseid's image by corrupting the offspring of the foundation stone of existence.

If only Thanos' ultimate power stories were written with this kind of imagination, he'd be a cooler character. As I said much earlier in the thread, Thanos is like a kiddie version of DS.

The plot of the IG story mainly involved punching a few elders to take gems that supposedly hold ultimate power, but wait... it gets even easier; two thirds of these elders don't even know the powers and full abilities of these gems.

Thanos' character is just inconsistent and that's partly because he's never been built up in a proper deliberate way. He gains ultimate power for ultimate powers sake, but the plots are never made to be clever or interesting.

He arrives at his goal too cheaply, what price has he paid for the ultimate prize? What intrigues has he worked through?

Then he has a thing for death and helps Annhilus with his plans for the power cosmic but there's never a definitive reason why he does this.

His claim to fame is the IG but he doesn't feel worthy of ruling the universe, so all we're left with is his school boy crush for lady Death, and what interesting plot can you make with that?

When DS was created by Kirby he created antagonists New Genesis, So that the character would always be interesting, so that the character would have to be clever, cunning and wise in his struggle for domination.

What he created was a compelling saga (as he intended it to have definitive conclusion). DC later expanded on this foundation to create one of the coolest villains in comicdom.

Not all of the expansions were great but enough of them were and DS continues to grow strong. DS doesn't do things for evil sake but he does what he does to defy fate - the Source trying to bring the gods to a final decisive conflagration so as to repair the flaw that is the darkness of Darkseid and Apokolips but in FC we discover that the wrong side wins.

And his second motivation once he overcomes fate, is to shape existence in his image because he finds it flawed and disordered in its current state.

What happens between these goals are what we call intrigues and Darkseid is in constant struggle with New Genesis as they have their own master schemer and keeper of mysteries, Highfather (Izaya). New Genesis are the wall protecting Earth from Darkseid. The alpha lanterns describe the New Gods as celestial beings, powerful cosmic beings.

It is a modern mythological saga. Kirby said the New Gods were an evolution of his previous works (Galactus, SS, Odin, Thor etc)

Originally posted by Allankles
DS hasn't lusted for the ALE in a years. He switched his goals long time ago, he's been interested in the Source for the longest time. This is characterized perfectly in DONG with DS only having partial knowledge of the ALE but using the SFE to gain domination over the Source.

In an older comic (I can't remember if it was Genesis or an earlier story arch, he pretty much tells his followers to screw the ALE he is going after the Source itself now. Besides he has the full ALE now for the second time, in FC.

Thanos isn't still using the IG because he's a relatively fringe character in Marvel whereas DS is one of the main villains in the DCU.

Thanos is a character who is given huge power ups via trinkets and then had them stripped away at the end of the mini, he isn't a guy Marvel use on a consistent basis.

That's why he gets killed off and put on the shelf for a few years collecting dust, before he's thrown back in to co star in another mini.

Conceptually he is a difficult character to use consistently mainly because his whole shtick is to impress death or do her work for her, an ok concept if you're doing a one-off tragic story, not so good as a consistent antagonist.

Darkseid seems to get used too often and has become a common Superman villain in years past. He was one of the main villains in countdown. He also is the main villain in fc.

Its all become so boring to me.

Dominating earth is no big deal imo. He is doing it secretly as well which is boring to me. Thanos has become so mpowerful before he could have enslaved earth with but a thought. That would have been boring imo.

Your opinion on Thanos is noted,but meh. You seem like like Darkseid who is an utter bore. Thanos has since moved on from acquiring powerups. Maybe when darkseid achieves his goals he will move on as well.