Children

Originally posted by Bardock42
Well, my girlfriend, for one, doesn't want children.

I have a few female friends that don't want children.

The generalization was idiotic on their part. And I stand by that.

Indeed...negroes and stuff.

Great that your current girlfriend doesn't currently want children. Enjoy that while you can.

How old is she?(rhetorical) What about when she's 25?

30?

What about another girlfriend's opinion if you don't stay with Sarah?

I read more in this thread and I realize that you weren't arguing about the modern women not having those base desires, rather, you were arguing a more neutral position that some want children and some don't. Cool. That's true.

However, it has been my experience that the vast majority of women want children at one point or another. Eventually, "that" conversation comes up and it can be do or die sometimes.

Looking back, I would have waited until I was 24 to start on the two children that I currently have. They are an m-er f-in hand full. I could go on with stories on why NOT to have children, but George gave and excellent reason of why no too.

Originally posted by chillmeistergen
Ah right, sorry if I misunderstood and for calling you a fool, dadudemon. I have had plenty of sleep, actually, so don't be worrying too much about that.

Cool. I thought that a mistake like that was below you and figured it could only be a lack of sleep because you don't sleep a full 8 hours all the time....you're up later than I am, sometimes.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Great that your current girlfriend doesn't currently want children. Enjoy that while you can.

How old is she?(rhetorical) What about when she's 25?

30?

What about another girlfriend's opinion if you don't stay with Sarah?

I read more in this thread and I realize that you weren't arguing about the modern women not having those base desires, rather, you were arguing a more neutral position that some want children and some don't. Cool. That's true.

However, it has been my experience that the vast majority of women want children at one point or another. Eventually, "that" conversation comes up and it can be do or die sometimes.

Looking back, I would have waited until I was 24 to start on the two children that I currently have. They are an m-er f-in hand full. I could go on with stories on why NOT to have children, but George gave and excellent reason of why no too.

Well, you hit the nail on the head. I was arguing against a generalization of all women, to desiring children as their highest goals. If you want to argue for that, please produce some evidence. Because there ARE women who never want children and don't regret it.

You apparently just jumped to conclusions based on my, initial, satirical post. No worries, I get you don't mean it.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Well, you hit the nail on the head. I was arguing against a generalization of all women, to desiring children as their highest goals. If you want to argue for that, please produce some evidence. Because there ARE women who never want children and don't regret it.

You apparently just jumped to conclusions based on my, initial, satirical post. No worries, I get you don't mean it.

My evidence is only anecdotal, as I've indicated already. However, any desire to be with the opposite sex, sexually, would be your scientific evidence for wanting children, regardless of the individual realizing that they're just falling for millions of years of evolutionary urges that preserve the species. True that the modern woman/man prevent and even mitigate pregnancies, but that doesn't change the fact that the sexes are driven to each other for reproductive purposes. I'm sure that there has to be some sort of physiological reason women desire children more vocally (or more often than naught) than men. Surely it's not all social mores, is it?

Also, initially, it looked like you were making a case for the "modern woman" who doesn't want children because it would cramp her style and career. My initial post should be clear that that was my interpretation of your original post.

Originally posted by dadudemon
My evidence is only anecdotal, as I've indicated already. However, any desire to be with the opposite sex, sexually, would be your scientific evidence for wanting children, regardless of the individual realizing that they're just falling for millions of years of evolutionary urges that preserve the species. True that the modern woman/man prevent and even mitigate pregnancies, but that doesn't change the fact that the sexes are driven to each other for reproductive purposes. I'm sure that there has to be some sort of physiological reason women desire children more vocally (or more often than naught) than men. Surely it's not all social mores, is it?

Also, initially, it looked like you were making a case for the "modern woman" who doesn't want children because it would cramp her style and career. My initial post should be clear that that was my interpretation of your original post.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Look, your anectodical evidence, doesn't mean much. Since I never said that there's not many girls that do feel getting children is a huge part in their lives. You, for some reason, by choosing to argue with me, took the chance that all or close to all are, that's an extraordinary claim.

No, I never claimed that all or close to all. In fact, I initially claimed that a majority desired children. (Evidenced by my "both right...more right" comment)

You're confusing me for the thread starter, holmes.

I later claimed that a vast majority desired children...based on my experiences.

Since your claim of NOT desiring children occurs primarily in developed countries*, and I live in a developed country surrounded by working women(despite the fact the IT is ridiculously male dominant), you'd think that I would have seen more of the "no children" types, right? I have...but they almost all later change their mind. Something happens to women as they get older...it's almost like a calm panic. I guess it's primarily psychological for them: wanting to have children before their junk stops working.

*I ain't googlin' that shit. It's true, plain and simple. Look for your own evidence if it isn't obvious enough for you.

yea not all but the majority but its like almost all or anything, just more do want children at some point then dont.

Originally posted by jalek moye
yea not all but the majority but its like almost all or anything, just more do want children at some point then dont.

exactley, and my only question is what makes a women not want children (breaking through into independance) OR what makes a women want children so much? (social/instincual values), what ime wondering is there anyone who can give me reasons for a women to want children without it be instincual/social, and do they stillwant them to the extent that they are everything to them like the social/insintcual mums?

Originally posted by Bardock42
Well, my girlfriend, for one, doesn't want children.

I have a few female friends that don't want children.

Then why dont you simply ask them why they dont want children (unless you already know) and find out the reason why then I would have an answer to my question.

The facti s, the overall moral/social view is for a women to have a child and usually its seen as the most special thing, my answer is "why" this is, and if its actually any more than just insintcual social control, but i was also interested in reasons behind women not wanting children.

Originally posted by inimalist
lol, and what, to you, would constitute proof that a woman independantly wanted a child?

[b]what would you say the social influences of being unpopular are?

obviously I disagree with all of this. It is juvenille, especially in the light of the most basic developmental psychology.

For instance, you speak a language, you developed it from social interaction, thus, you are a drone. ta da!

so, I thought of a couple of ways about how to respond to this. I think the best way is to sort of explain how I think it is emblematic of how you respond to things.

For instance: I said the term "independant variable" almost specifically because I didn't think you would get it. And you didn't. An IV is the variable in an experiment (like you glibly said you were running) which is manipulated in order to produce changes in the Dependant variable (what is measured). You can be excused for not knowing this. I don't think its excuseable for you to have not even taken the 30 seconds that would have been necessary to look it up on wiki (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_variable).

Now, like I said, I can't expect you to know anything that I know, especially stuff that I know is rarified within certain fields of study, but you totally disregarded what I put, and answered it with some ambigious nonsense about "independents" and "choice". From any realistic stand point, what you said might as well have been "Durps are durp because they can durp to durp".

I know what it is like to be 19 and really smart, just calm down and keep reading. There really are people out there who are trying to, empirically look at what you are talking about. There are 1000s of articles, especially in feminist literature, about why women have children. You need to learn the barest of humility, lest you think, at 19, you have access to some knowledge or logic that nobody knows. [/B]

Human reasons, for example for sex, a guy who was a drone would simply say he wants to fulfill his sex drive, wheras a more indepenant less instinctual view would be he wanted to feel "love"from the person he was having sex with, and he could also state why he loves them, i.e, perhaps they were childhood friends, perhaps they were always there fro him, etc etc, not just "i want to have sex cuz it feels good". thats more of a instinct.

socail influences of being unpopulour would likely lead to less social ideals or simply a diffrent sect of popularity, this could branch into joining those like you who were rejected by a social group and so make your own group, often this is forming social groups like "Goths", "Emos" (there is actually a social group who call themslves this although their not the slitting wrists kind, their mostly just similiar to goths), or lets say it was a Nerd who was hated by the apprently "populour" group who then joined a Nerdy social group. This reflects more light on how the social view of popualrity is broken because obviously from diffrent points of view from diffrent social groups, other groups are less populour to them. Popularity on a whole is fake.

You are wrong, you are obviously looking at it crooked, ime talking about when a Human actually understands what its doing ,a baby for example you could say is the first stage when you start to learn various things from social interaction, but when your a baby, your simply a basic animal human organism, your mind is not a complicated system compared to a 12-16 year olds which could actually understand decision making. Its the same when your growing up into a toddler, very basic. Ime calling people who should be able to independantly learn/think/make their own decisions yet dont because they instead join social patterns completly, to an extent where you are a drone, a being who simply follows a social pattern and if it changes so do you regardless of how it effects you.

You said something that you didnt think I would get...that sounds useful..... 🙄

At 19 i do have access to information drones wouldnt know, simply because Drones would not be looking for it.

Dadudemon is argueing exactley what ime argueing, most women do indeed socially want children and to most women, you either have a child with them or your gone, you either see the children above all else, or your gone, you either change yourself so the children are happier even if you feel terrible, or your gone, etc etc, you know the drill (this answer is to both inimalist and Bardock)

Originally posted by dadudemon
Cool. I thought that a mistake like that was below you and figured it could only be a lack of sleep because you don't sleep a full 8 hours all the time....you're up later than I am, sometimes.

I'm suffering with a pretty bad bout of bronchitis, which I am going to blame it on.

Originally posted by dadudemon
No, I never claimed that all or close to all. In fact, I initially claimed that a majority desired children. (Evidenced by my "both right...more right" comment)

You're confusing me for the thread starter, holmes.

I later claimed that a vast majority desired children...based on my experiences.

Since your claim of NOT desiring children occurs primarily in developed countries*, and I live in a developed country surrounded by working women(despite the fact the IT is ridiculously male dominant), you'd think that I would have seen more of the "no children" types, right? I have...but they almost all later change their mind. Something happens to women as they get older...it's almost like a calm panic. I guess it's primarily psychological for them: wanting to have children before their junk stops working.

*I ain't googlin' that shit. It's true, plain and simple. Look for your own evidence if it isn't obvious enough for you.

Burning Thought: Considering you don't quote or reference to which part of my post any of this is responding to, I'm a little bit lost at parts. I'm going to assume you just went top to bottom, and I'll tell you what I think you are addressing.

If you want to make a point about what I've said, just copy/paste the [ quote] [/ quote] tags at the beginning and end of the statement and respond to it directly, it is way more managable than a block of text that could refer to any part.

Originally posted by Burning thought
Human reasons, for example for sex, a guy who was a drone would simply say he wants to fulfill his sex drive, wheras a more indepenant less instinctual view would be he wanted to feel "love"from the person he was having sex with, and he could also state why he loves them, i.e, perhaps they were childhood friends, perhaps they were always there fro him, etc etc, not just "i want to have sex cuz it feels good". thats more of a instinct.

oh, ok, this is easy.

you don't understand human descision making processes. The explanations that we consciously have for our actions largely are not congruent with the reason our brain's produced those actions. The mind is incredible at lying to itself (a quality abscent in those with depression).

if all that it takes to show a woman had a baby for personal rather than social reasons, in your view, would be to find a woman who personally believes they wanted a child, then I know my mother fits this for one, and I would assume the vast majority of women who have children, have had children, and that are going to have children. Remember, most women rate their relationship with their child as more important than their spouse.

you bring up instinct as if you even know what it is about. So, in light of neuroplasticity, how do YOU distinguish between social and genetic influences of behaviour?

Originally posted by Burning thought
socail influences of being unpopulour would likely lead to less social ideals or simply a diffrent sect of popularity,

lol

I'm more inclined to think it might cause a person to, I don't know, think anyone who is popular is a drone?

I wont psychoanalyze you, as its not my schtick, however, you rant like someone who never made enough friends and people didn't like. As if that isn't going to be just as influencial on your personality as being popular would be.

Originally posted by Burning thought
this could branch into joining those like you who were rejected by a social group and so make your own group, often this is forming social groups like "Goths", "Emos" (there is actually a social group who call themslves this although their not the slitting wrists kind, their mostly just similiar to goths), or lets say it was a Nerd who was hated by the apprently "populour" group who then joined a Nerdy social group.

oh, would you please tell me more about your theories of social bonding and attachment!

needless to say, cliques, out-groups, social popularity, social skills and the like, are described much better in social psychological literature than they are above.

Originally posted by Burning thought
This reflects more light on how the social view of popualrity is broken because obviously from diffrent points of view from diffrent social groups, other groups are less populour to them.

again, not to seem like a dick, but is english your first language? I am having trouble discecting this...

Originally posted by Burning thought
Popularity on a whole is fake.

lol, fake in the way that it still has an effect on personal development?

real fake 🙄 or wait, why don't you define how you are using the term fake.

Originally posted by Burning thought
You are wrong, you are obviously looking at it crooked,

could you allude to the statement I made that was "wrong"?

Originally posted by Burning thought
ime talking about when a Human actually understands what its doing, a baby for example you could say is the first stage when you start to learn various things from social interaction, but when your a baby, your simply a basic animal human organism,

gibberish. All you have said of any worth in this passage is that babies are in their initial stages of learning. While I could point you to instances of some types of innate knowledge (categorical perception), the statement itself is nearly tautological.

also, all humans are humans, all humans are animals and all humans are organisms (also comprised of billions of organisms). The term "animal human organism" is doubly redundant.

Originally posted by Burning thought
your mind is not a complicated system compared to a 12-16 year olds which could actually understand decision making.

amazingly enough, the mind of a developing infant is potentially orders of magnitude more complex than an adult or teenage mind.

if you don't believe me, just quote this and I'll get it in a reply. It has to do with neuroplasticity though 🙂

Originally posted by Burning thought
Its the same when your growing up into a toddler, very basic. Ime calling people who should be able to independantly learn/think/make their own decisions yet dont because they instead join social patterns completly, to an extent where you are a drone, a being who simply follows a social pattern and if it changes so do you regardless of how it effects you.

so you are making a personal values based judgement against people who do not conform to the way you view the world?

You remind me of these pins that some socialist group was giving out at my school. They had these "free your mind" pins. While freeing the mind (whatever that ambigious rhetoric actually means) is likely a good thing, they weren't actually proposing it at all. They thought all people with freed minds would think the way they did, much like you consider those who have come to different conclusions about life than you a drone.

also, not to drag different threads into eachother, but you chastisized me in the "Was Hitler Evil" thread for being so bold as to morally judge a child murder as evil. How is your subjective judgement of people as drones any different than that? How is this position you are taking here at all congruent with that?

lol, not that you will respond to any of this specifically. go for it, make another block post that I can go through, to which you will again overgeneralize with ambiguities (at least when I add extra words to a sentence they are the proper words that convey the desired meaning 😉)

Originally posted by Burning thought
You said something that you didnt think I would get...that sounds useful..... 🙄

actually very useful, as I used your response to point out one of the most lacking parts of your "argumentative" style. notice how you dodged my entire point in using it.

Originally posted by Burning thought
At 19 i do have access to information drones wouldnt know, simply because Drones would not be looking for it.

ya... stuff you make up is not really that valid, especially given that you don't have any formal qualifications to say things like that.

For instance, can you give me a working definition of who is a drone and who isn't? It seems like something you'd know, so how about it? How could I run an experiment to determine if someone is a drone or if someone is not? lol what would the independant variable be? 😉

Originally posted by Burning thought
Dadudemon is argueing exactley what ime argueing, most women do indeed socially want children and to most women, you either have a child with them or your gone, you either see the children above all else, or your gone, you either change yourself so the children are happier even if you feel terrible, or your gone, etc etc, you know the drill (this answer is to both inimalist and Bardock)

1) you have the authority to speak for most women?

2) anti-feminist literature makes the exact opposite argument, stating that in the modern world, women have more pressures to succeed in the ways normally associated with "maleness" (workplace, financially) and are less prone to live in the home and rise children. All demographic statistics support this (potentially ignoring immigrant populations). There are more women today than ever before leaving the home and postponing child bearing or not having children at all. The "Social brainwashing" of feminism, essentially, does what you point to as a sign of independance! omfg!

Originally posted by inimalist
oh, ok, this is easy.

you don't understand human descision making processes. The explanations that we consciously have for our actions largely are not congruent with the reason our brain's produced those actions. The mind is incredible at lying to itself (a quality abscent in those with depression).

if all that it takes to show a woman had a baby for personal rather than social reasons, in your view, would be to find a woman who personally believes they wanted a child, then I know my mother fits this for one, and I would assume the vast majority of women who have children, have had children, and that are going to have children. Remember, most women rate their relationship with their child as more important than their spouse.

Ofcourse I do, a human decision is when you can decide something for yourself, an instinct decision is not really a decision at all but more a feeling to do something yet if someone questions your motives you will not be able to explain completly or logically.

You would have to show me your mothers reasons for wanting the child, if she can give reasons why then perhaps she is not so intinctually/socially controlled. A women who can actually give her independant reasons may be more independant than a social drone. Yes they do rate it above their spouse, another instinct which usually branches on from the drone requirement to have the child.

Originally posted by inimalist
you bring up instinct as if you even know what it is about. So, in light of neuroplasticity, how do YOU distinguish between social and genetic influences of behaviour?

As i think ive explained a social influence is when someone does something because it is socially correct or because their social group does it, if they cannot bring about their own independant or logical reasons then they are a drone in this area.

Originally posted by inimalist
lol
[b]
I'm more inclined to think it might cause a person to, I don't know, think anyone who is popular is a drone?

I wont psychoanalyze you, as its not my schtick, however, you rant like someone who never made enough friends and people didn't like. As if that isn't going to be just as influencial on your personality as being popular would be. [/B]

I know you would be, it was so very obvious thats where you were trying to go but this is where you failed miserably since popularity is simply social, a fake ideal to control youth, popularity means little overall and is actually fake as ive said because those who belive their populour belive so just because the amount of contacts they would have on an instant messenger, a social site like bebo, or how many friends they bring to parties.

Originally posted by inimalist
oh, would you please tell me more about your theories of social bonding and attachment!

needless to say, cliques, out-groups, social popularity, social skills and the like, are described much better in social psychological literature than they are above.

Then please post some otherwise ime not sure what your saying here means much to the debate.

again, not to seem like a dick, but is english your first language? I am having trouble discecting this...

Not at all a dick, you dont understand something, at least you can point it out.

Ill explain it:

basically the ideal of popularity is splintered because there are so many diffrent social groups, Nerds, Goths etc etc, and they all have diffrent views of popularity.

Originally posted by inimalist
lol, fake in the way that it still has an effect on personal development?

real fake 🙄 or wait, why don't you define how you are using the term fake.

Fake in the way that it doesnt mean anything, a group of Nerds would think one of their friends or themselves are populour because they have other nerdy friends wheras a group of jocks, goths etc etc would think the same of their soceity yet belive the "nerd" to be unpopulour, the idea of popularity is fake because it makes people belive in something that doesnt excist, them being loved/liked beyond someone else reasures the arrogent yet in truth the people who they belive are love/liking them are free loaders, eg. a group of people invited to a party are added to the overall popularity gauge of a person, if that person belives the people he/she invites are going because of them which is often the case, they belive its popularit and they feel good about it. But ofcourse that is not the case, the people invited are going to enjoy themselves, it does not matter whos party it really is especially large parties. yet one of the goofy friends of the one who started the party is likely to think that the starter of the party is populour because of the amount of people they had been able to invite.

Originally posted by inimalist
could you allude to the statement I made that was "wrong"?

Your wrong because you said I would be a drone because I learnt a language from childhood, your wrong because a baby/toddler does not have the intelligence to truly make their own decisions yet, toddlers/babies are excempt from dronage.

Originally posted by inimalist
gibberish. All you have said of any worth in this passage is that babies are in their initial stages of learning. While I could point you to instances of some types of innate knowledge (categorical perception), the statement itself is nearly tautological.

also, all humans are humans, all humans are animals and all humans are organisms (also comprised of billions of organisms). The term "animal human organism" is doubly redundant.

Not at all, a baby has no idea of what its doing, it cannot be a drone since it never had the choice in the first place nor the intelligence to make it.

A basic human organism, the main thing is "basic" your simply basic as a baby because your an animal to the highest degree, a human baby is not far diffrent from any animals baby wheras older humans are vastly diffrent from adult animals.

Originally posted by inimalist
amazingly enough, the mind of a developing infant is potentially orders of magnitude more complex than an adult or teenage mind.

if you don't believe me, just quote this and I'll get it in a reply. It has to do with neuroplasticity though 🙂

You miss the point, the baby simply cannot understand a decision, nor make a real decison for itself....

Originally posted by inimalist
so you are making a personal values based judgement against people who do not conform to the way you view the world?

You remind me of these pins that some socialist group was giving out at my school. They had these "free your mind" pins. While freeing the mind (whatever that ambigious rhetoric actually means) is likely a good thing, they weren't actually proposing it at all. They thought all people with freed minds would think the way they did, much like you consider those who have come to different conclusions about life than you a drone.

also, not to drag different threads into eachother, but you chastisized me in the "Was Hitler Evil" thread for being so bold as to morally judge a child murder as evil. How is your subjective judgement of people as drones any different than that? How is this position you are taking here at all congruent with that?

Its nothing about viewing things diffrently, since those in the social group rarely do, thats the point isnt it, those people who simply follow a social ideal are not thinking for themselves.

Because you judged by use of social moral, people have no right to simply judge, however ime not judging them as drones, ime simply listning them as what they are under my own label of "drone". These people are the ones doing the actions, ime simply labeling them.

Originally posted by inimalist
actually very useful, as I used your response to point out one of the most lacking parts of your "argumentative" style. notice how you dodged my entire point in using it.

ya... stuff you make up is not really that valid, especially given that you don't have any formal qualifications to say things like that.

For instance, can you give me a working definition of who is a drone and who isn't? It seems like something you'd know, so how about it? How could I run an experiment to determine if someone is a drone or if someone is not? lol what would the independant variable be? 😉

1) you have the authority to speak for most women?

2) anti-feminist literature makes the exact opposite argument, stating that in the modern world, women have more pressures to succeed in the ways normally associated with "maleness" (workplace, financially) and are less prone to live in the home and rise children. All demographic statistics support this (potentially ignoring immigrant populations). There are more women today than ever before leaving the home and postponing child bearing or not having children at all. The "Social brainwashing" of feminism, essentially, does what you point to as a sign of independance! omfg!

Ive made nothing up but the use of the word drone. Everything else can be seen by anyone who bothers looking at social patterns, you can see the way things are viewed socially just by watching a lot of film types, especially films for teens that involve sex,drugs etc, you can watch comedies like family guy which pokes fun at the way people act because thats the way they do.

A person who is a drone will follow social ideals, for example: Bobs friends smoke, so Bob decides to smoke because the ideal of popularity makes him feel like he wont fit in with the guys who all smoke, thus this leads Bob to smoke. Becci's friends follow Fashion A, but Fashion A changes to Fashion B, her friends change to Fashion B, so does Becci because her friends do, popularity can play a part in this as well, since obvously she would think herself unpopulour if shes not following fashion and so she wears Fashion B, regardless of many outside sources less interested in Fashion saying she looks ridiculous. In the end, that person, being a drone is Becci, since she is not only following these ideals but she could not answer why she follows them, obviously she would not admit to being a pack animal following the crowd because it sounds foolish but she could not say otherwise.

An independant thinks for itself, if Fashion B looks odd to them, they wont wear it, simple, if they like it, wear Fashion B but it changes to Fashion C, they wont chase after Fashion C unless it looks far nicer than B, they would also be able to give reasons for their preferances and they would not include the fact their friends changed in those reasons.

1) I have the authority to give my opinion, I have to authority to point people in the direction of where they should be able to see combinations of social behavior i.e a colledge/high school etc. The fact is, so far no women or defender of such can give reasons why a women would want a child without instinct/social beliefs taking a toll. The fact both of those things excist show that without explanation technically a woman who has a child and especially if they view it as far above anything else like their spouse is a drone.

2) Well obviously this literature needs to be seen, since both me and Dadudemon have shown that we both see so many women who want children even if its a little later than usual, they still dont feel apprently "complete" without them as danaoula hime mentioned something about in his/her first post.

Oh, so you are a renowned sociologist and psychologist?

so basically all he's saying is that if a women wants to have a child for the simple reason that they want to they are nothing more then a drone.

So if anybody does anything with out an over complicated reason they are drones 🙄

my God, at least quote some Asch at me or something... [Asch conformity experiments: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asch_conformity_experiments]

this may become another "sharia courts" thing for me, but I'll try to look up the stuff about social influences.

Burning Thought: ummm, if I post peer-reviewed empirical studies of human behaviour, is that a valid counter-point to your independant observations? Like, say I find a study that describes inter-personal bonding in relation to mere exposure and proximity, and not to things like "being cool", do you think it has more authority than your personal beliefs?

EDIT: Oh, I think you missed above. How could I run an experiment to determine if someone is a drone or not? What are objective characteristics of "drone" which both you and I could confirm. So like, there would be no disagreement if me and you observed someone whether or not they would meet your criteria.

Originally posted by jalek moye
So if anybody does anything with out an over complicated reason they are drones 🙄

heaven forbid they do something because they enjoy it or want to

how inferior those people must be

Originally posted by jalek moye
so basically all he's saying is that if a women wants to have a child for the simple reason that they want to they are nothing more then a drone.

So if anybody does anything with out an over complicated reason they are drones 🙄

Yes because if they "just want to" for no apprent reason, their following instinct...obviously....you dont just "want to" do something. Theres usually reasons.

Everything someone does they could be able to explain a reason why, if they dont then their doing it because of soceity or perhaps instinct.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Oh, so you are a renowned sociologist and psychologist?

Who needs renown?

theres a guy up in the Hadron collider project who is claimed to be as clever as Hawking, but hes nowhere near as famous. Fame is yet another one of those fake things that people throw around to try and impress people, it doesnt occur to them that many celebrities who are famous are complete idiots.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Oh, so you are a renowned sociologist and psychologist?

See, Strawhawkian, told you.

Originally posted by Burning thought

Who needs renown?

theres a guy up in the Hadron collider project who is claimed to be as clever as Hawking, but hes nowhere near as famous. Fame is yet another one of those fake things that people throw around to try and impress people, it doesnt occur to them that many celebrities who are famous are complete idiots.

Meh, I agree, generally, but since you have not produced anything close to proof of anything, but only statements based on **** all, I figured I'd go for the second best, which would be at least some professional acceptance.