The Presence against The Heart of the Infinite · Comic Book 'Versus' Forum

kgkg Vigilante

as for who wins this I won't comment 🙂

kgkg Vigilante

Originally posted by kgkg
Vertigo did not exist before 1993 hence swamp thing Spectre , Deadman , PS were shown.
So those are also Vertigo and where did you get the idea that they are two separate universes?
Presence has been used in vertigo also? also another question since you seem to base what your saying off scans have you read Lucifer from vertigo?

bump this for fangirl

Knowsbleed33 You know my name

Originally posted by kevdude
Also The Source > The Heart as well..

Awww that's precious.

cloud102 Senior Member

The Presence.

kevdude The Hooded Man

More info on The Source

The Beginning

http://img161.imageshack.us/my.php?image=oc170001yc7.jpg

http://img381.imageshack.us/my.php?image=oc170000vv4.jpg

Superman having a visit to the Wall and even more then that..

http://img381.imageshack.us/my.php?image=oc170002xt5.jpg

http://img359.imageshack.us/my.php?image=oc170006vf0.jpg

http://img359.imageshack.us/my.php?image=oc170003kz9.jpg

http://img359.imageshack.us/my.php?image=oc170004hq0.jpg

http://img359.imageshack.us/my.php?image=oc170005cr4.jpg

Mr Master Junior Member

Originally posted by kevdude
The Beginning
http://img161.imageshack.us/my.php?image=oc170001yc7.jpg

The Source created, but was also created by, the Universe.

The Alien Entity & even Reed were there (existing) before the Marvel Universe was created,
then afterwards,
the AE created the Marvel Universe from that nothingness.

That also goes for Sise-Neg-THOTI-Entropy/Eternity.

So not to burst your bubble, but technically these cats have one up on the Source. 🙂

Originally posted by kevdude
http://img359.imageshack.us/my.php?image=oc170004hq0.jpg

The Alien Entity created the Marvel Universe from nothingness
from beyond the beginning as well,
that also goes for Sise-Neg, THOTI-Entropy/Eternity,
they turned the Marvel Universe into nothingness,
then they re-birthed the Marvel Universe from nothingness as well just like the AE.

Allankles Kwisatz Haderach

Originally posted by Mr Master

The Alien Entity created the Marvel Universe from nothingness
from beyond the beginning as well,
that also goes for Sise-Neg, THOTI-Entropy/Eternity,
they turned the Marvel Universe into nothingness,
then they re-birthed the Marvel Universe from nothingness as well just like the AE.

This is what I was telling Enyalus. In Marvel THOTI's feat isn't anything special. However in DC such an event cannot occur without the intervention of the Presence and his aspects like the Source.

Mr Master Junior Member

Originally posted by Allankles
In Marvel THOTI's feat isn't anything special.

But this is special:

......................................................................................

(excerpt from the official Marvel Handbook 2006 - LT - bio)

"The Living Tribunal's ONLY superior is TOAA"

......................................................................................

Logic dictates that ONLY TOAA or a power = to or superior could defeat the LT:

LT gets stomped!

......................................................................................

swank

Originally posted by Allankles
However in DC such an event cannot occur
without the intervention of the Presence and his aspects like the Source.

Where was the Presence's, or the Source's intervention here?

"No more Infinite Earths,
no more Alternate Universes,
no more pasts and no more futures,
no more duperdopes, no more anything."

kevdude The Hooded Man

Originally posted by Mr Master
The Source created, but was also created by, the Universe.
The Alien Entity & even Reed were there (existing) before the Marvel Universe was created,
then afterwards,
the AE created the Marvel Universe from that nothingness.
That also goes for Sise-Neg-THOTI-Entropy/Eternity.
So not to burst your bubble, but technically these cats have one up on the Source. 🙂
The Alien Entity created the Marvel Universe from nothingness
from beyond the beginning as well,
that also goes for Sise-Neg, THOTI-Entropy/Eternity,
they turned the Marvel Universe into nothingness,
then they re-birthed the Marvel Universe from nothingness as well just like the AE.

They have nothing up on The Source and you know it 😕 . They entire point is The Source is self creating and all powerful and eternal, none of those beings you have showed come to that level though I agree they come extremely close, I have a few other scans to show.

fangirl101 Restricted

Originally posted by Mr Master
But this is special:
......................................................................................
(excerpt from the official Marvel Handbook 2006 - LT - bio)
"The Living Tribunal's ONLY superior is TOAA"
......................................................................................
Logic dictates that ONLY TOAA or a power = to or superior could defeat the LT:
LT gets stomped!
......................................................................................
swank
Where was the Presence's, or the Source's intervention here?
"No more Infinite Earths,
no more Alternate Universes,
no more pasts and no more futures,
no more duperdopes, no more anything."

The Spectre intervened. The Source isn't going to intervene if the Spectre is on the seen. And he lost that one.

Mr Master Junior Member

Originally posted by kevdude
They have nothing up on The Source and you know it.

I already told you what I know, and it's not what you think I know. 😕

Originally posted by kevdude
They entire point is The Source is self creating
and all powerful
and eternal

The Alien Entity/Sise-Neg created all creation, before creation/universe existed.
(the Source was not created before the Universe/creation)

The Alien Entity/Sise-Neg is/were all powerful.

The Alien Entity was there before creation, so it's truly eternal:

Unlike the Source which was created with the Universe,

meaning the Source had a beginning.

Originally posted by kevdude
none of those beings you have showed come to that level
though I agree they come extremely close.

We're gonna have to disagree here big time.

It's the other way around imo.

The Source comes close to what the other three beings were.

Mr Master Junior Member

Originally posted by fangirl101
The Spectre intervened.
The Source isn't going to intervene if the Spectre is on the seen.
And he lost that one.

I have that issue right here,
please tell me on what page is the Spectre ever depicted as being even remotely responsible,
for what Mxy did.

Tell me where it shows Mxy erased DC because the Spectre intervened. 😐

Spectre came around backed by his boss and got stomped, end of story.

kgkg Vigilante

is this source vs something? people getting of topic

fangirl101 Restricted

In Death of the New Gods, I could have sworn the Source was there before The universe began.

Any Rate.

There are other beings in DC who are more powerful than the source.

The Ultimate Light
The GEB
The Voice
Michael (Of Both)
Lucifer of Vertigo
YWH of Vertigo
The Word
All come to mind.

kgkg Vigilante

How the source does creates and is created by the universe
Isn’t that a contradiction?

Mr Master Junior Member

Originally posted by fangirl101
There are other beings in DC who are more powerful than the source.
The Ultimate Light
The GEB
The Voice
Michael (Of Both)
Lucifer of Vertigo
YWH of Vertigo
The Word
All come to mind.

So when it's convenient you mesh DC and Vertigo together,
but when this surfaces:

Yahweh himself admits he was made by someone else:

"None of us can be our own maker."

..............................................................................

In fact, Yahweh outright states:

"I'm infinite and eternal, but even I was shaped by external forces"."

..............................................................................

Here Yahweh is asking Lucifer if they want to exchange memories
and he wants to know Lucifer better.

Omniscient? ... hm

That's why I want to know you better."

..............................................................................

You quickly separate the two factions. ... 🙄

Mr Master Junior Member

Originally posted by kgkg
How the source does creates and is created by the universe
Isn’t that a contradiction?

Another question is, what happened to imperiex?

I thought that was his job?

DC's cosmology is so convoluted.

kgkg Vigilante

Where are people getting the idea that Yahweh and Presence are different gods?

fangirl101 Restricted

Originally posted by Mr Master
So when it's convenient you mesh DC and Vertigo together,
but when this surfaces:
Yahweh himself admits he was made by someone else:
"[B]None of us can be our own maker."
..............................................................................
In fact, Yahweh outright states:
"I'm infinite and eternal, but even I was shaped by external forces"."
..............................................................................
Here Yahweh is asking Lucifer if they want to exchange memories
and he wants to know Lucifer better.
Omniscient? ... hm
That's why I want to know you better."
..............................................................................
You quickly separate the two factions. ... 🙄 [/B]

I didn't mesh the two together. I made a distinction of which characters are where.

Micheal happens to be uber in Both realities.
Lucifer only in the vertigo reality.
YWH is the creator of the vertigo reality. Not The DC one.
They are both owned by DC so they are all DC properties.

kgkg Vigilante

Originally posted by Mr Master
So when it's convenient you mesh DC and Vertigo together,
but when this surfaces:
Yahweh himself admits he was made by someone else:
"[B]None of us can be our own maker."
..............................................................................
In fact, Yahweh outright states:
"I'm infinite and eternal, but even I was shaped by external forces"."
..............................................................................
Here Yahweh is asking Lucifer if they want to exchange memories
and he wants to know Lucifer better.
Omniscient? ... hm
That's why I want to know you better."
..............................................................................
You quickly separate the two factions. ... 🙄 [/B]

Did you read the Lucifer series an excellent piece of work