What power setting was it in "Chain of Command" when one used its phaser-II to punch through a tunnel? This is 15-20 GJ in 0.28 seconds. (You vaporized three tons of granite in that episode)
Therefore you'd have nearly unlimited phaser shots and you would destroy AT-ST joints (or AT-AT joints if they required 15-20 GJ to vaporize) with such a setting. I don't know how trained are redshirts compared to stormtroopers...
Originally posted by FE ExpertI don't know what power setting was used in that Ep, however Memory Alpha and Phasers.net both suggest it was setting 16.
What power setting was it in "Chain of Command" when one used its phaser-II to punch through a tunnel? This is 15-20 GJ in 0.28 seconds. (You vaporized three tons of granite in that episode)Therefore you'd have nearly unlimited phaser shots and you would destroy AT-ST joints (or AT-AT joints if they required 15-20 GJ to vaporize) with such a setting. I don't know how trained are redshirts compared to stormtroopers...
Who knows how redshirts would stack up against Stormtroopers? Its academic, really, since redshirts don't really exist in the 24th century and beyond. They were a product of Captain Kirk's era. Starfleet troops and Starfleet security officers don't wear red anymore.
I'd put money on Dominon War era Starfleet/Klingon troops over Stormtroopers. How many Empire-Era Stormtroopers have actually seen front line combat? I'd wager not that many, since there weren't many large scale conflicts in the Imperial era (just rebellions and uprisings).
In contrast, Starfleet troops have had numerous campaigns against the Klingons, the Cardassians, and the Dominion. Any military officer will tell you that widespread, front line experience is invaluable and a powerful asset for individual soldiers. Starfleet has that experience. The Klingons have it. The Cardassians have it. A good portion of the Dominion has it. And all of them would be fighting the Empire in a Trek vs Wars scenario.
If, for some reason, in a raid on an Imperial planet, Feds (or Cardassians for that matter) captured a lightsaber, reverse engineered it, would they be able to train lightsaber ops to an extent that they would effectively complement phasers in close quarters?
For some reason, I would be led to believe that Starfleet infantry, if they picked the right people with the right kind of Force-powers for this, could make Jedi (or Sith) that would be every bit as good as Vader or Sidious.
Originally posted by FE Expert
If, for some reason, in a raid on an Imperial planet, Feds (or Cardassians for that matter) captured a lightsaber, reverse engineered it, would they be able to train lightsaber ops to an extent that they would effectively complement phasers in close quarters?For some reason, I would be led to believe that Starfleet infantry, if they picked the right people with the right kind of Force-powers for this, could make Jedi (or Sith) that would be every bit as good as Vader or Sidious.
In the star wars universe there is the force, while there is no such thing in the star trek universe. Therefore, IMO, any federation member who tried to use a lighsaber would simple kill themselves. I think it takes a lot of the force to keep from cutting off your own arm.
Originally posted by FE Expert
Just that something was never even hinted to doesn't mean it doesn't exist...Even if they could train lightsaber ops, they would use holodecks to train the lightsaber-capable people in the lightsaber arts, just as you would standard infantry.
However, the ability to use the force is handed down from parent to child. The federation would have to start from ground level, and only after many generations could they have even the simplest fundamentalist of the jedi art.
Originally posted by FE Expert
If, for some reason, in a raid on an Imperial planet, Feds (or Cardassians for that matter) captured a lightsaber, reverse engineered it, would they be able to train lightsaber ops to an extent that they would effectively complement phasers in close quarters?For some reason, I would be led to believe that Starfleet infantry, if they picked the right people with the right kind of Force-powers for this, could make Jedi (or Sith) that would be every bit as good as Vader or Sidious.
Originally posted by ShakyamunisonTrue. There are no midichlorians in the Star Trek galaxy. The only way Starfleet and others could begin to produce jedi/sith would be to A) Technologically introduce midichlorians into Trek personnel, or B) Interbreed with Star Wars natives as Shakyamunison inferred.
However, the ability to use the force is handed down from parent to child. The federation would have to start from ground level, and only after many generations could they have even the simplest fundamentalist of the jedi art.
To be honest, I'm not sure that lightsabers would really be an asset to Trek, since there are so many weapons and techniques that lightsabers simply could not compete with (transporters, spread phasers, photon grenades, TR-116's). An army (or elite officers) of Force sensitive agents would be more practical.
Originally posted by Acrosurge
True. There are no midichlorians in the Star Trek galaxy. The only way Starfleet and others could begin to produce jedi/sith would be to A) Technologically introduce midichlorians into Trek personnel, or B) Interbreed with Star Wars natives as Shakyamunison inferred.To be honest, I'm not sure that lightsabers would really be an asset to Trek, since there are so many weapons and techniques that lightsabers simply could not compete with (transporters, spread phasers, photon grenades, TR-116's). An army (or elite officers) of Force sensitive agents would be more practical.
I didn't think about midichlorians, but I try not too. 😄
To be truthful, the idea of midichlorians and Darth not having a father (virgin birth) turned my stomach.
Originally posted by ShakyamunisonI can understand why a virgin birth wouldn't sit well with you, but why the midichlorians? Its a biological explaination for Force powers. The midichlorians generate the energy fields and then allow their host organism to manipulate said energy fields.
I didn't think about midichlorians, but I try not too. 😄To be truthful, the idea of midichlorians and Darth not having a father (virgin birth) turned my stomach.
That aside, I agree with you on both counts. Star Wars is a fantasy (as opposed to Sci-Fi), so it makes more sense for the Force to be a mystical/fantasy element. Either way, canon Star Trek would still stomp canon Star Wars in a galactic battle.
Originally posted by Acrosurge
I can understand why a virgin birth wouldn't sit well with you, but why the midichlorians? Its a biological explaination for Force powers. The midichlorians generate the energy fields and then allow their host organism to manipulate said energy fields.That aside, I agree with you on both counts. Star Wars is a fantasy (as opposed to Sci-Fi), so it makes more sense for the Force to be a mystical/fantasy element. Either way, canon Star Trek would still stomp canon Star Wars in a galactic battle.
Midichlorians were not needed, and in a way they made the Jedi more elitist. When I saw the first Star Wars, in the theater (yes I'm that old), I loved the idea of the force because anyone could use it if they had the training.
Originally posted by Symmetric ChaosApples to apples. The way I see it, the elements of the Star Wars story are fantasy. The setting is SciFi, but the actual components of the story are not driven by a particular scientific idea or concept.
No, Star Wars is SciFi story in the Space Opera mold from Lensmen.
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Midichlorians were not needed, and in a way they made the Jedi more elitist. When I saw the first Star Wars, in the theater (yes I'm that old), I loved the idea of the force because anyone could use it if they had the training.
Originally posted by Final Blaxican
And by the by, I'm not going to say this is definitive proof, but here's Stardestroyer. net, for a good read.
A borg cube is 4 times the size of a star destroyer, but the detroyers i think are more durable for their size.
Originally posted by zeelA Star Destroyer can have its entire bridge tower sheered off by a relatively small asteroid collision, as we saw in Empire Strikes Back. I'd have a very difficult time believing another asteroid of similar size would do any significant damage to a Borg Cube.
A borg cube is 4 times the size of a star destroyer, but the detroyers i think are more durable for their size.
Of course, their largest turbolaser hardpoints can match the largest shipboard phasers at close range (ca. 100 km) but they are less than effective at standard ST ranges (10-100k km)
Even fully shielded, their fighters can be shot down with even ST fighter weapons quite easily. SW fighter weapon yields are about in the top range of hand phasers (15-20 GJ) but not more than 30 or 50 GJ. End result: they would need an entire squadron to take out a type-8 shuttlecraft.
I always thought that was weird. I've been around, and in, this debate on and off for a while and when it comes to numbers they're always completely different. You get claims like a tie fighter can take out the Enterprise to the shuttle vs squadron, varying numbers on torpedo yields, etc. I've seen people instantly side with the sw-vs-st guy because he has a degree in physics, apparently, I never cared enough to check, but I can't help but see the glaring flaw that even if everyone's math was completely sound they're usually gathering their information by making estimations from on screen footage.