Rot Bane vs Rots Yoda

Started by Lightsnake12 pages
Lightsnake Senior Member
Originally posted by Lethal Rogue
As Exodus said, you underestimate Bane a lot. What proof do you have that Yoda is a faster, better opponent? And what proof do you have that Bane has never fought anyone that powerful?

Oh, either argue or concede, because you've done nothing but play cheerleader.
Yoda's demonstrated superior speed and skill. In that he's actually moved faster than the eyes of trained Jedi eyes can see. Guess what? When Bane, at his best, was fighting Farfalla, Raskta and Johun? They SEE HIM moving. Who's faster? Better? Let's think...Yoda's skill is such that he can best Mace Windu and Dooku, described as 'extraordinarily' skillful. To the point where he could easily take three masters, Depa Billaba one of them. And he can do it without the magical orbalisks shielding him from harm, because without those, Bane was nowhere NEAR skilled enough to take on even Raskta and Farfalla.

Power? Yoda's directly called the strongest Jedi to that point. He's on par with or more powerful with someone more powerful than Bane. Yes. He's more powerful than anyone Bane's ever met

Do you have ANY response to my earlier points or are you going to respond with "But...But...ORBALISKS! You UNDERESTIMATE HIM!"
Because that's getting tiresome. Start arguing or start conceding.

Because I'll say it again: Like Bane, Yoda needs one good hit on a small target. And Yoda is good enough to get it. He doesn't need to get past the orbalisks since he can see his target and he's maneuverable, fast and agile enough to get it, to say nothing of skill or strength.

Lethal Rogue Senior Member

You have no proof that w/ out orbalisks, Bane couldn't beat Farfalla or Raskta. But that doesn't matter, because he does have orbalisks.
Oh, and here's my argument:
Bane took on three jedi at once, and defeated them. He also has been noted to move faster than the eye can see. He is the Sith'ari and created the rule of two. He defeated Kas'im with less than two years of training, and that was when he moved faster than a force-user's eye could see! The orbalisks raise Bane's power an unimaginable amount, and create an unbreakable defense.
I'm not underestimating Yoda either. I already know how powerful he is and agree with all of his feats that you put down. But saying that he is a faster and more powerful fighter than Bane I do not agree with. I have put down all facts, and you haven't agreed with any of them. I think that you are so blinded by your own opinion that you refuse to acknowledge anything I have put down!

Lightsnake Senior Member

Originally posted by Lethal Rogue
You have no proof that w/ out orbalisks, Bane couldn't beat Farfalla or Raskta. But that doesn't matter, because he does have orbalisks.

Yeah, I do have proof, given Raskta dealt what would've been a mortal wound in the opening SECONDS of the fight and they're dealing numerous blows to his body throughout. Bane just had to focus on his head, how would he handle the entire body?


Oh, and here's my argument:
Bane took on three jedi at once, and defeated them.

No. He didn't. He needed Zannah to interfere for him.


He also has been noted to move faster than the eye can see.

When? In fact, at his best, at the fight of his life? He is SEEN moving by Johun Othone and Valenthyne Farfalla.

He is the Sith'ari and created the rule of two.

Bearing on combat...where?

He defeated Kas'im with less than two years of training, and that was when he moved faster than a force-user's eye could see!

Hahaha! Nope. Sorry, cite something or be quiet and one quick burst of speed that startled everyone with Sirak isn't enough to overrule Johun Othone seeing him move when Bane was fighting to his fullest. And 'defeated Kas'im?' You mean when he was totally outmatched in their saber fight and had to use trickery to win? You mean when Kas'im crushed him with Jar'Kai? THAT fight?

The orbalisks raise Bane's power an unimaginable amount, and create an unbreakable defense.

And guess what? He's STILL less powerful than Palpatine or Yoda and because your skull is too thick to GET IT: His defense is limited to his head, which Yoda is capable of attacking


I'm not underestimating Yoda either.

Yes you are.

I already know how powerful he is and agree with all of his feats that you put down. But saying that he is a faster and more powerful fighter than Bane I do not agree with.

Well, too bad, start arguing them instead of going on and on how Bane is so kewl and awesome, because you've refuted or challenged? Nothing. Especially given most of your feats are totally warped and aggrandized.


I have put down all facts, and you haven't agreed with any of them.

What are your facts? "LMAO BANE IS SO AWESOME HE HAS ORBALISKS!"
Unlike you, I'm responding point by point. You're not. What are the 'facts' you've put down, now?


I think that you are so blinded by your own opinion that you refuse to acknowledge anything I have put down!

Which is why I've answered everything you've put down?
go on, answer my points. If you're not too blinded. Because you're being both annoying and plainly idiotic. Go on, point out where Bane is a better fighter-I've refuted your points here. Or faster-refuted. Or more agile-refuted, or totally defended-refuted.

Are your points destroyed? Yes? Ok, then. I'll wait for your next post. Because you've argued just about? Nothing. Your entire thing is how Bane is awesome based on using feats that have NO BEARING ON COMBAT OR ON THIS FIGHT. Saying how Bane won a fight when he required his apprentice to STAB SOMEONE IN THE BACK DURING IT doesn't help your case.

Yoda annihilated an army on his own, he moved faster than Depa Billaba and two other Jedi Masters could perceive, a far cry from Bane who was seen moving by Valenthyne Farfalla when Bane was charging him with intent to kill and Yoda was only giving a mild demonstration at that point! He's the equal with the Force of someone more powerful than Bane, he's got far more experience, he defeated, on Vjun, while distracted, Count Dooku while Dooku was boosted in power.

He's strong enough to lift a gigantic gun in a gigantic crate on his back with no strain for a damn long time so Bane's physical strength? Not a factor. his agility and speed are unlike anything Bane has encountered before and Yoda is smart enough to process he'll need to go for the head and guess what? He's fast, good and quick enough to get to it, so stop acting like Bane has a guaranteed win here because Bane needs to *GASP* HIT YODA! And how is he gonna do that, now?

Lethal Rogue Senior Member

omg, you are not answering my statements. all you are saying to them is making up stuff that I never said! Yes, I have put down facts. I have never said, "Oh, Bane has orbalisks, that makes him pwn Yoda!" I have said that because of orbalisks, I don't see how Yoda is going to kill him. If you find a way and I agree with it, I will concede, but until then, I will not be convinced. saying that he can cut his head won't work, because that is such a small target (smaller than Yoda!!!) and he can spend his whole time just blocking that.

Anyway, I don't have time to argue with someone so stubborn and rude as you tonight. Other than that Ivalice guy, you are probably the biggest jerk on KMC i've met, so I would advise for you to lighten up, we are just debating battles, not trying to put eachother down. Please, just stay away from the insults and making up false things I never said. Now i'm tired and going to bed.

Lightsnake Senior Member

Originally posted by Lethal Rogue
omg, you are not answering my statements. all you are saying to them is making up stuff that I never said!

So I'm NOT responding to what you say line by line?

Yes, I have put down facts. I have never said, "Oh, Bane has orbalisks, that makes him pwn Yoda!" I have said that because of orbalisks, I don't see how Yoda is going to kill him.

You've constantly posted one liners how Yoda 'can't overcome the orbalisks.' Any reason I have to believe otherwise?


If you find a way and I agree with it, I will concede, but until then, I will not be convinced.

Are you even reading my posts? I've pointed out that way no less than three times! You keep ignoring it!


saying that he can cut his head won't work, because that is such a small target (smaller than Yoda!!!) and he can spend his whole time just blocking that.

Yeah, except Yoda is used to using absolute precision on single, small targets, and fast and skilled enough to leap up and take Bane's head off before he can recover from a missed swing, or find a gap in Bane's guard by leaping up and stabbing through Bane's skull. Stop ignoring Yoda's skill and speed and assuming Bane can infallibly block everything. What exactly will Bane do if Yoda leaps behind him, leaps up and slashes, when he moves too fast for Bane to track?


Anyway, I don't have time to argue with someone so stubborn and rude as you tonight. Other than that Ivalice guy, you are probably the biggest jerk on KMC i've met, so I would advise for you to lighten up, we are just debating battles, not trying to put eachother down. Please, just stay away from the insults and making up false things I never said. Now i'm tired and going to bed.

Sure, whatever. KMC has given me a really low tolerance for ignorance, so I'll 'lighten up' if you can stop this passive aggressive nonsense and start actually responding to what i say.

I'll wait for the response tomorrow.

DorianYates Restricted

Originally posted by Lethal Rogue

Anyway, I don't have time to argue with someone so stubborn and rude as you tonight. Other than that Ivalice guy, you are probably the biggest jerk on KMC i've met, so I would advise for you to lighten up, we are just debating battles, not trying to put eachother down.
Wow i barely ever "talk" to you and that gives you the right to label me the biggest jerk on KMC?

What ever you say mr keyboard warrior.

chilled monkey Senior Member
Originally posted by Lightsnake

Point out where he does so?

Gordon Bennet! Okay, for the 3rd time;

"They DON'T CARE about our soldiers and fleets anymore."

Here Kopecz says specifically that the AoL is not interested in fighting the 'regular' armies.

"All they want to do is wipe US out: the APPRENTICES, the ACOLYTES, the SITH MASTERS... and especially the DARK LORDS."

Read carefully. Kopecz clearly says US, and then explains that US specifically refers to the apprentices, acolytes, Sith Masters and Dark Lords.

Why is this so hard for you to grasp?

chilled monkey Senior Member
Originally posted by Lightsnake
Yeah, I do have proof, given Raskta dealt what would've been a mortal wound in the opening SECONDS of the fight and they're dealing numerous blows to his body throughout. Bane just had to focus on his head, how would he handle the entire body?

They are dealing numerous blows to his body because Bane knows he doesn't NEED to block said blows so he doesn't try. Are you telling me that if your body was covered by impenetrable armour, you would still try to block/parry blows that you knew wouldn't do any harm if they connected? You don't think that would be a waste of energy?

If Bane didn't have the orbalisks then he would have at least tried to block the attacks. As it is, he doesn't try, so we can't say for certain that he couldn't have blocked them if he had to.

Originally posted by Lightsnake
he moved faster than Depa Billaba and two other Jedi Masters could perceive

I find it interesting that I asked twice when this happened and the only poster who replied admitted that they weren't sure if they were right. So I'll say again, when did this actually occur?

Darth Exodus The Gr8est!!!!!!!!
Gotta love how the Bane fankids find a way to distort canon. Johun's speed is 'swifter than the eye can follow.' And it's described that as 'how he's moving.' So, really. Spare me.

So you concede the point? No arguments? Good.

'Faster than lightning, now?'

Yes. Not only did she get in front of Farfalla after Bane had unleashed a storm of lightning his way but when there 'her arms and blades became a blur as they carved figure eights in the air to catch and absorb the bolts of dark energy', meaning that that her arms would have to be moving at least as fast as lightning to be able to catch Banes lightning which has been described as having 'a dozen forks' as of POD.

As to the first point, the only way that it would be invalid would be of Raskta was already in front of Farfalla or pretty close, which isn't the case as she had just been blown far away by Banes Force wave. Not to mention that Banes FL attack comes directly after she regains her feet 'at the speed of thought', so its conclusive that she would have had to move quite far very fast to get in the way of Bane's attack.

And given Depa's speed is on par with Mace and enough to butcher an entire ship's crew in an incredibly short time...

And given that that is twenty years after the feat that we're talking about. And that that still isn't a match for Raskta's feat. Even Kopecz match's this feat. Not that it isn't an uber feat though.

And then there's Yoda's 'dodge the three masters faster than the eye can see' feat.

I agree with Chilled Monkey, you need to provide this example.

And what are these unexpected moves?

Being able to block with 90% of your body. I'd be surprised.

Like YODA, with more experience, combat ability and utter familiarity with anything Bane can throw out, won't be able to be 'unexpected' by utilizing a way of fighting Bane has never encountered? And having an imprecise fighting style against an utterly precise, faster, more agile, more skilled, more powerful opponent won't guarantee his loss. It'll just help it along.

The weakness of his Form won't give him a 100% fail ratio. Remember I did say Yoda would win 3, probably 4 times out of 10 (or at least I'm saying it now). The forms will be a contributing factor in this.

Well, gee, it only gives Dooku insight to how Yoda fights, his fighting style and all...

Irrelevant. This is nothing that won't be immediately obvious after the first 1 or 2 blows.

Able to utterly leave Dooku in the dust with his speed while Dooku is enhanced on Vjun and Yoda is distracted?

ROFL.

Now who's twisting canon. Yoda in no way was able to 'utterly leave Dooku in the dust'. Yoda won the fight but it was by no way a mega-stomp or a speedblitz. And distracted? If I recall correctly Yoda was absolutely set on killing Dooku at last. If Yoda is soooooo much greater than Dooku then why couldn't he take down the ba$tard on Geonosis?

Able to keep pace with Palpatine, able to effortlessly kill two of the best duelists in Jedi Order history before they could react?

It's already been proved that Bane would have been able to replicate this feat if not for Battle Meditation.

You don't want people to comment on you? Then fix your issues.

OK. Just name what must be done and I'll try my best. As long as it doesn't involve conceding the argument or somesuch.

How about superior skill?

Bane is unbelievably skillful, memorising thousands if not millions of attacks and sequences in a short time as well as, by Kas'im's admission 'moving far beyond sequences and forms' as well as out duel two of the greatest swordsmen in the galaxy, one of them while fighting two others at once. Yoda's good but I wouldn't be able to call his skill anything special, nor has it been heralded as such.

Unlike Bane, Yoda didn't need orbalisks to save him. And I'm gonna wager an entire planetary army of droids, plus a hailfire is a lot, lot larger than the technobeasts.

When was this by the way? Could you elaborate please, because otherwise I don't know if this is a speed feat, force powa etc.

Yes

Drat. When was it then?

' Palpatine's turned the larger Sith Wyrm to standing dust.

You speculated that it seemed to turn to dust. After stating that he just charred it. For my position it seems like an equal feat except in scale.

Unless you have proof Bane's force lightning increased in power and potency, then I'd advise you drop the point.

This is before Bane becomes encased in the orbalisks, which 'greatly increase[s] one's own command of the Force'. The first time Bane taps into the orbalisks power he describes 'Feeling an incredible surge of power beyond any he had known before'. This was just with two orbalisks, Bane is later covered in them. Not to mention that it's clear Bane's ultimate strength in the Force is obviously grown by the end of ROT. Bane's FL has obviously grown more potent, as shown when it tears through Grandmaster Farfalla's shield like it isn't even there.

Plus ten years of training and study obviously yields results, notwithstanding Bane's leaning rate, which I'm not going into.

Why am I not surprised on the former here? It's rather apparent that no amount of reasoning or logic will sway you. Nebaris has always said it and you fall into lock step.

Whatever.

EDIT: btw, when you see Yoda kicking Banes ass in the force, how does he do it. Because he wasn't able to beat Dooku, who is Banes inferior and was happy to play sabers with him. If he's so damn uber in the force, why not effortlessly snap his defences in half then do the same to Dooku? I'm genuinely interested in how you think Yoda'll do it. All I can see is the whole rediection of FL.

chilled monkey Senior Member

Originally posted by Darth Exodus

ROFL.

Now who's twisting canon. Yoda in no way was able to 'utterly leave Dooku in the dust'. Yoda won the fight but it was by no way a mega-stomp or a speedblitz. And distracted? If I recall correctly Yoda was absolutely set on killing Dooku at last. If Yoda is soooooo much greater than Dooku then why couldn't he take down the ba$tard on Geonosis?

Precisely. Two quotes:

"Slowly,slowly Dooku gave way."

"Sweat ran in streams through Dooku's beard as he countered Yoda's every move."

Does Yoda have the upper hand? Yes, but Dooku is holding his own. He's not being 'left in the dust' by any stretch.

Plus, Yoda was only 'distracted' at the start of the duel, when he had to save Whirry from falling to her death. As soon as she was out of harm's way, he was fully focused on the fight.

Lightsnake Senior Member

Originally posted by chilled monkey
Gordon Bennet! Okay, for the 3rd time;

"They DON'T CARE about our soldiers and fleets anymore."

Here Kopecz says specifically that the AoL is not interested in fighting the 'regular' armies.

"All they want to do is wipe US out: the APPRENTICES, the ACOLYTES, the SITH MASTERS... and especially the DARK LORDS."

Read carefully. Kopecz clearly says US, and then explains that US specifically refers to the apprentices, acolytes, Sith Masters and Dark Lords.

Why is this so hard for you to grasp?

You don't get it. I'm saying 'The Sith' STILL REFERS to their entire forces, hence why they're still called the Sith forces and sith fleet. Originally, Hoth's army was taking them all on and now with the ground they've made and the tide turning, they're aiming to decapitate the empire in destroying the Dark Lords and the rest of the Dark Siders. Was I unclear on any of this?

Tavern Restricted

Sock.

Lightsnake Senior Member

Originally posted by chilled monkey
They are dealing numerous blows to his body because Bane knows he doesn't NEED to block said blows so he doesn't try. Are you telling me that if your body was covered by impenetrable armour, you would still try to block/parry blows that you knew wouldn't do any harm if they connected? You don't think that would be a waste of energy?

Are you going to seriously argue that without the armor Bane would stand a chance in this fight?


If Bane didn't have the orbalisks then he would have at least tried to block the attacks. As it is, he doesn't try, so we can't say for certain that he couldn't have blocked them if he had to.

And he's displayed the speed to do so...when? He was having issues just defending his head, do you REALLY see him guarding his body well? No, at all?

I find it interesting that I asked twice when this happened and the only poster who replied admitted that they weren't sure if they were right. So I'll say again, when did this actually occur?


Darth Maul: Shadow Hunter, according to Gideon, Nai and others on this forum.

Darth Exodus The Gr8est!!!!!!!!
Darth Maul: Shadow Hunter, according to Gideon, Nai and others on this forum.

Yeah, but does he actually speedblitz them or did he just dodge their half-hearted attcks?

Tavern Restricted

It was a display of socky sock sock sockerson.

Tavern Restricted

yawn.

Tavern Restricted

There are two interpretations you can accept:

A. I have no life

B. I'm an idiot

Lightsnake Senior Member

Originally posted by Darth Exodus
So you concede the point? No arguments? Good.

No, I let the quote speak for itself and you whine how it means something different.


Yes. Not only did she get in front of Farfalla after Bane had unleashed a storm of lightning his way but when there 'her arms and blades became a blur as they carved figure eights in the air to catch and absorb the bolts of dark energy', meaning that that her arms would have to be moving at least as fast as lightning to be able to catch Banes lightning which has been described as having 'a dozen forks' as of POD.

So...Hetton moves faster than lightning as well given he dodges a 'storm' of lightning from Bane earlier in the book? Force lightning, in case you haven't noticed is a biiiit slower than normal lightning.
Ok, we've established Raskta's speed is on par with an old man with almost no Dark Side training. Anything else, kiddo?

As to the first point, the only way that it would be invalid would be of Raskta was already in front of Farfalla or pretty close, which isn't the case as she had just been blown far away by Banes Force wave. Not to mention that Banes FL attack comes directly after she regains her feet 'at the speed of thought', so its conclusive that she would have had to move quite far [b]very fast to get in the way of Bane's attack.

Again. This shows Raskta is fast. And she's not blown a massive distance away, given she's cushioned by the force there and is more easily able to regain herself as opposed to when Bane elbows her


And given that that is twenty years after the feat that we're talking about. And that that still isn't a match for Raskta's feat. Even Kopecz match's this feat. Not that it isn't an uber feat though.

An entire ship's crew is a bit greater than a small squad of republic troops. Or did you miss this? I'd be shocked if you didn't.


I agree with Chilled Monkey, you need to provide this example.

Do I need to keep saying 'Shatterpoint' until your tiny brain grasps it?


Being able to block with 90% of your body. I'd be surprised.

Yeah, and it took Raskta, what, moments to adjust and move out of the way? And in an era when freaking cortosis armor is widespread, I sincerely doubt a Jedi of Yoda's caliber is going to encounter many issues


The weakness of his Form won't give him a 100% fail ratio. Remember I did say Yoda would win 3, probably 4 times out of 10 (or at least I'm saying it now). The forms will be a contributing factor in this.

In other words, you consistently ignore logic in your tiny little fanboy brain. Sure, Bane has a weakness in form. And force power. and skill. And speed. But OMG ORBALISKS!
What else are 'contributing' factors? Naturally, you continuously ignore EVERYTHING hurting your case.
Yoda is just better than Bane. He beats him far more often than Bane can beat him and frankly, you can't provide a single counter argument.


Irrelevant. This is nothing that won't be immediately obvious after the first 1 or 2 blows.

I'm gonna say this again because you're clearly unable to understand it the first time:
Dooku was Yoda's student. They've sparred together numerous times. This makes something of a difference. IE: when you know how your opponents fight


ROFL.

Now who's twisting canon. Yoda in no way was able to 'utterly leave Dooku in the dust'. Yoda won the fight but it was by no way a mega-stomp or a speedblitz. And distracted? If I recall correctly Yoda was absolutely set on killing Dooku at last. If Yoda is soooooo much greater than Dooku then why couldn't he take down the ba$tard on Geonosis?


Now, either you've a bad memory or you're lying out your ass:
Yoda was kind of distracted by:
A. the massive darkside presence on Vjun
B. saving the innocent woman Dooku had FLUNG OUT THE WINDOW with the Force when Dooku assaults him.
C. Kill Dooku at last? Yoda was trying to TURN HIM BACK TO THE LIGHTSIDE and get through to him while fighting him and holding himself back. Why couldn't Yoda take Dooku down on Geonosis? Gee, let's think, maybe it's because Dooku distracted him by trying to kill Obi-wan and Anakin and Yoda was trying to take him alive?
So no, you don't recall correctly. And Dooku lost the fight on Vjun utterly. Y'know, Dooku? Able to, with incredible ease, handle Grievous at his best-y'know, the guy able to strike sixteen times a second, and defeat Tholme and Sora Bulq simultaneously.


It's already been proved that Bane would have been able to replicate this feat if not for Battle Meditation.

I'm sorry, when were Farfalla or Johun Othone two of the best duelists the Jedi order ever produced? Compared to Agen Kolar or Kit Fisto, AKA the guy capable of moving so fast that Obi-wan could barely follow him? And all this before Mace Windu can react? Mace Windu, who's able to quickly react to block Palpatine's lightning at point blank? Mace, able to utterly overwhelm General Grievous in a fight? Mace, fast enough to stab someone through the heart, deactivate his saber and begin to walk away before the dead man even realizes he's been stabbed (Star Wars: Tales), punch Kar Vastor, what, six times before he could complete a blink?


OK. Just name what must be done and I'll try my best. As long as it doesn't involve conceding the argument or somesuch.

How about, for a starter: Know what you're talking about, stop sticking your fingers in your ears whenever someone brings up a valid argument and stop taking after Nebaris. Also, realize when you're wrong.


Bane is unbelievably skillful, memorising thousands if not millions of attacks and sequences in a short time as well as, by Kas'im's admission 'moving far beyond sequences and forms' as well as out duel two of the greatest swordsmen in the galaxy, one of them while fighting two others at once. Yoda's good but I wouldn't be able to call his skill anything special, nor has it been heralded as such.

Oh, give me a break, 'millions?' Show proof. Yoda's 'good' but his skill's not anything special? Yeah, this is something you work on, because now you're moving to the realms of absurd.' In Dark Rendevzous it says the only Jedi who 'might' withstand Yoda on even ground is Mace Windu. Yoda's skills with a saber are consistently described as 'extraordinary,' and 'incredible' and 'without peer.' He's one of two Jedi able to even compete with Palpatine, someone described as an absolute master of every form and style of the saber, Yoda's able to easily elude Plo Koon, Saesee Tiin and Depa Billaba at once and frankly, Depa Billaba is likely easily comparable to Raskta, given her standing with Mace Windu. Is Yoda called in the ROTS novel's narration as the most devastatingly powerful foe the darkness has ever known because his skill's 'nothing special' or because he's an incredible duelist and a Jedi of, to quote the new encyclopedia as 'extraordinary power'

So yeah, this is why I have a hard time, Exodus. Because you just duplicate Nebaris's hate on for the PT and hard on for the ancients without regard for logic or reason or anything resembling an open mind.

And Farfalla was one of the greatest swordsmen in the galaxy? This begs to be demonstrated.


When was this by the way? Could you elaborate please, because otherwise I don't know if this is a speed feat, force powa etc.

According to the NEC, when a group of clone troopers were left alone and abandoned, Yoda went to the planet by himself and with only his saber, turned the entire droid army into scrap metal, including the giant hailfires into scrap metal in a very short amount of time.


Drat. When was it then?

Before ROTS. Presumably during the Clone Wars

Lightsnake Senior Member


You speculated that it seemed to turn to dust. After stating that he just charred it. For my position it seems like an equal feat except in scale.

Palpatine allows the wyrm to swallow him, then lets loose with the lightning, leaving it standing as it was...then Palpatine just steps out from its stomach and it crumbles to ash behind him.


This is before Bane becomes encased in the orbalisks, which 'greatly increase[s] one's own command of the Force'.

AND? There's nothing indicating this is anything more than a casual exercise for Palpatine. And this doesn't really negate my argument.


The first time Bane taps into the orbalisks power he describes 'Feeling an incredible surge of power beyond any he had known before'. This was just with two orbalisks, Bane is later covered in them. Not to mention that it's clear Bane's ultimate strength in the Force is obviously grown by the end of ROT. Bane's FL has obviously grown more potent, as shown when it tears through Grandmaster Farfalla's shield like it isn't even there.

1. Farfalla isn't the grandmaster
2. Palpatine's lightning wouldn't rip through Farfalla's shield? Palpatine's far more powerful in the Force than Farfalla. Hell, Palpatine is more powerful than Bane.
3. At what point does it indicate Bane's potency with lightning has increased? Unless you can measure it, then you'd be wise to drop this point.


Plus ten years of training and study obviously yields results, notwithstanding Bane's leaning rate, which I'm not going into.

Ten years of studying what, exactly? He had Nadd's Holocron, but that was it and he wasn't continuously studying. And this compares to Yoda's centuries worth of studies and travels, learning about all the different ways of the Force, including accessing numerous Jedi holocrons including the Tedryn, Arca Jeth's, Vodo Baas's and numerous Holocrons besides, not to mention studying Sith Holocrons for the purpose of knowing how to fight the Dark Side.


Whatever.

EDIT: btw, when you see Yoda kicking Banes ass in the force, how does he do it. Because he wasn't able to beat Dooku, who is Banes inferior and was happy to play sabers with him.


You're aware Yoda's got a huge command of a lot of lightside techniques and really won't hesitate to kill a Sith, right? Given that he could reach out and if he wanted to, he could burst a vessel in Bane's brain, snap his neck, crush his heart, freeze his organs with Morichro or hit him with Sever Force.
And he wasn't able to beat Dooku? Oh, come on. Dooku decided to go to sabers and Yoda obliged. At no point did Yoda even struggle with Dooku's power. In the force, Yoda is far above Dooku and he realizes this later.


If he's so damn uber in the force, why not effortlessly snap his defences in half then do the same to Dooku? I'm genuinely interested in how you think Yoda'll do it. All I can see is the whole rediection of FL. [/B]

Probably because Yoda is letting Dooku expend himself. As he put it to Yoda: "Does Yoda stop teaching if the student doesn't wish to learn?"

By the same token, why does Bane not end the fight with Farfalla and Raskta instantly with the Force? Does he just not think to?

So yeah. Do you really still see Bane winning a majority of his at all?

Lightsnake Senior Member

Originally posted by chilled monkey
Precisely. Two quotes:

"Slowly,slowly Dooku gave way."

"Sweat ran in streams through Dooku's beard as he countered Yoda's every move."

Does Yoda have the upper hand? Yes, but Dooku is holding his own. He's not being 'left in the dust' by any stretch.

Plus, Yoda was only 'distracted' at the start of the duel, when he had to save Whirry from falling to her death. As soon as she was out of harm's way, he was fully focused on the fight.

Dooku is only 'holding his own' by virtue of the fact that Yoda's kinda, y'know, not trying to kill him.