Originally posted by Bardock42
I think no one denies that it is their damn fault. One might argue though that it is an immense portrayal of willpower to quit...for some at least.
That's true.
Will power, courage, forgiveness. It is all relative to the individual. To quit smoking for one may be quite trivial for another. etc....
Leon, if the best reply you've got is "But you've never been a smoker.", despite my arguments being fact and over-riding the mythical belief that you have to be a smoker to make such assertions, then let the adults talk and leave.
Originally posted by siriuswriter
I haven't had to quite smoking, but I was once addicted to rx drugs, and that was a hell of hard to get through.I'm not going to be like "oh that's so much more addictive," because i've never smoked and so don't know the withdrawl routine.
Then that's your own deal.
Smokers can quit if they choose to quit, end of story. There's no "step off" required. What I'm saying is right.
If you do not wish to quit, you won't. There are factual ways to quit and if you don't do them, you obviously don't want to. None of that "I want to but I can't.". No, you want to or you can't be bothered.
Throw all your cigarettes away, stop buying them, tell all your smoker friends to be courteous when around you etc.
Originally posted by siriuswriter
Mine was headaches, not being able to sleep, being paranoid, stomaches, stomach sickness... the list goes on. it ttook me about two months, so maybe it's a shorter time period? i dunno. mostly i just treated to the symptoms. take tylenol for headache, not tylenol three. take maalox or tums instead of some oxycontin to knock me out. for jitters and just the "it's not fair, this is so hard, just gimme some DRUGS" bit, i just went into a dark room and watched a movie i hadn't for a long time, not for getting, of course, an ice pack and a plain towel for the sweats.
Yeah, but that's not cigarettes.
Don't sit there illogically saying "You can't say that because it's different, for me it was really hard and I was addicted to different drugs.".
Wwwell yes, there's your point failing.
"You can't say cigarettes are easy to quit! I was addicted to coke and it wasn't easy.".
We're talking about cigarettes, not any other drug. Cigarettes are easy to quit as long as you TRULY WANT to quit.
People who don't want to quit or can't be bothered to try hard enough are the ones who fail, fact.
My father smoked for a bulk of his life, but when he decided to quit, he did. It took a lot of willpower, but he WANTED to do it. He took all the subtances out of the house, removed himself from atmospheres that may entice him to smoke, and he quit smoking.
So in the words of the immortal Mr. T; quit yo' gibber jabber.
Originally posted by siriuswriter
I got through it mainly with "sheer will." I didn't go off cold turkey, I asked someone to watch my progress, and I stll get the urge to "JUST TAKE SOMETHING" because I'm remember how nice it was was to have the slip away, dreamy feeling.
But?
But you want to quit, so you did.
Originally posted by siriuswriter
So keep up if you're trying, wean yourself off if you feel you can, that's a big help to be like, oh, i only smoked two cigs today and yesterday i smoked a pack.but whatevs. I congratulate those who have/are trying to quit.
Don't congratulate people for trying, anyone can "try".
If you try and fail, you obviously want to smoke.
Stop talking nonsense.
"Withdrawals for cigarettes", pfft.
When you see someone having violent and extreme physical reaction to quitting cigarettes, then we'll chat.
As for the Bill Hicks quotes, he died of cancer.
For all his genius and comedy when being pro-smoking, he actually knew it was a horrible, disgusting and dangerous habit. So it's not really a good stance.
Most non-smokers have legitimate reason to ***** about smoking, and it's not because we give a crap about smokers.
You wanna smoke? Smoke all you want. You chose to smoke, though, so don't force me to endure it. Smokers forget how damn lucky they are. They are one of the demographics using the deadliest of drugs, and it's legal, so they need to drink some shut up juice.
-AC
Originally posted by Alpha CentauriI was just saying that it's easy for a non smoker to say what you are saying. Unless you have been there, have been addicted to nicotine, you really have no frame of reference as to how hard it is.
That doesn't work, does it? Because what I said is true. If you're lighting up cigarettes when you want to quit, you're the one to blame. Throw all your cigarettes out of the house, don't buy any. There are many ways to not smoke, and if you're not doing them then you obviously don't want to quit much.It's like suicide attempts. If you genuinely wanna die, there're ways to make it happen.
The fact that people quit heroin makes me laugh at people who say they can't quit smoking or don't know how. People just wanna have a massive pat on the back and feel like they've done great work.
-AC
But I agree, throw all the cigarettes out, make your mind up to quit for yourself.
And for the record, I'll give anyone who has quit smoking after being addicted a pat on the back. It's a bigger accomplishment than you think. For heavy smokers, the real addicts, it's a way of life. They aren't just quitting smoking, they are changing who they are as a person, at least to some extent.
IMO, make up your mind to do it for you. Buy nicorette patches AND nicoderm gum, use them together. Find a substitute for the hand to mouth oral fixation.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
I was just saying that it's easy for a non smoker to say what you are saying. Unless you have been there, have been addicted to nicotine, you really have no frame of reference as to how hard it is.But I agree, throw all the cigarettes out, make your mind up to quit for yourself.
And for the record, I'll give anyone who has quit smoking after being addicted a pat on the back. It's a bigger accomplishment than you think. For heavy smokers, the real addicts, it's a way of life. They aren't just quitting smoking, they are changing who they are as a person, at least to some extent.
IMO, make up your mind to do it for you. Buy nicorette patches AND nicoderm gum, use them together. Find a substitute for the hand to mouth oral fixation.
Not knowing what it's like does not render my opinion obsolete, since what I'm saying is true.
"It's not, you don't know how hard it is to quit.".
You can't indulge the habit if there are no cigarettes, if you don't BUY any cigarettes.
-AC
Originally posted by Alpha CentauriWell yeah, but saying to yourself "Do not buy any smokes" when you addicted is easier said than done. Very few people can quit cold turkey like that. Most need help.
Not knowing what it's like does not render my opinion obsolete, since what I'm saying is true."It's not, you don't know how hard it is to quit.".
You can't indulge the habit if there are no cigarettes, if you don't BUY any cigarettes.
-AC
i quit like 2 months ago. it was really hard for the first few days, after that you start to forget about it.
personally i didn't ween myself down or use the patch or anything. there were a couple of times that i decided 'ok, i'm gonna start smoking less and less and eventually it will be easy to quit' but then once i'd start smoking that would just lead to even more smoking. so i just continued to smoke.
i use to smoke 2-3 (black-n-mild) cigars a day (on average). then i had to quit and i smoked up until the hour i had to do so. i used guilt as my personal motivator and so far it seems to be pretty effective.
i still get dreams some times that i'm smoking a cigar having a great time, then i wake up and remember that i can't do that anymore. once in a while i think maybe it'd be ok if i smoke one for old times sake... since i've gone so long and proven that i can beat the addiction. but then i think about it and the more i think about it the more the guilt sets in, and i never seem to be able/willing to go through with it.
so overall i think guilt is the best possible method. if i promised to myself i wont smoke that means jack shit. promise to somebody who's opinion you value that you will not smoke and keep in mind that their opinion of you will sink if you fail and then you'll look weak and pathetic.
if you can get past the first 2-5 days of not smoking, the realistically you can probably quit for good. unless there are some terrible cravings coming up at the 2-3 month mark that i'm unaware of.
Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Well yeah, but saying to yourself "Do not buy any smokes" when you addicted is easier said than done. Very few people can quit cold turkey like that. Most need help.
The latin in your sig should actually read "In nomine patris, et filii, et spiritus sancti"
Yes, I am a multi-lingual grammar nazi.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Leon, if the best reply you've got is "But you've never been a smoker.", despite my arguments being fact and over-riding the mythical belief that you have to be a smoker to make such assertions, then let the adults talk and leave.Then that's your own deal.
Smokers can quit if they choose to quit, end of story. There's no "step off" required. What I'm saying is right.
If you do not wish to quit, you won't. There are factual ways to quit and if you don't do them, you obviously don't want to. None of that "I want to but I can't.". No, you want to or you can't be bothered.
Throw all your cigarettes away, stop buying them, tell all your smoker friends to be courteous when around you etc.
[/b]
Yeah, but that's not cigarettes.
Don't sit there illogically saying "You can't say that because it's different, for me it was really hard and I was addicted to different drugs.".
Wwwell yes, there's your point failing.
"You can't say cigarettes are easy to quit! I was addicted to coke and it wasn't easy.".
We're talking about cigarettes, not any other drug. Cigarettes are easy to quit as long as you TRULY WANT to quit.
People who don't want to quit or can't be bothered to try hard enough are the ones who fail, fact.
My father smoked for a bulk of his life, but when he decided to quit, he did. It took a lot of willpower, but he WANTED to do it. He took all the subtances out of the house, removed himself from atmospheres that may entice him to smoke, and he quit smoking.
So in the words of the immortal Mr. T; quit yo' gibber jabber.
[/b]
But?
But you want to quit, so you did.
Don't congratulate people for trying, anyone can "try".
If you try and fail, you obviously want to smoke.
Stop talking nonsense.
"Withdrawals for cigarettes", pfft.
When you see someone having violent and extreme physical reaction to quitting cigarettes, then we'll chat.
As for the Bill Hicks quotes, he died of cancer.
For all his genius and comedy when being pro-smoking, he actually knew it was a horrible, disgusting and dangerous habit. So it's not really a good stance.
Most non-smokers have legitimate reason to ***** about smoking, and it's not because we give a crap about smokers.
You wanna smoke? Smoke all you want. You chose to smoke, though, so don't force me to endure it. Smokers forget how damn lucky they are. They are one of the demographics using the deadliest of drugs, and it's legal, so they need to drink some shut up juice.
-AC [/B]
how about i put it in a way youll be ABLE to understand. take ALL the arguments your making and apply them to sex and masturbation. COULD you stop having sex AND masturbating at the same time simply because you WANTED to or because sum1{like me} challenged you to?!?!?! see how ridiculous the stuff ur saying seems now, "if you really want to quite, youll quite, otherwise your too lazy or dont WANT to quit" . your coming from a place of ignorance.
Originally posted by leonheartmm
how about i put it in a way youll be ABLE to understand. take ALL the arguments your making and apply them to sex and masturbation. COULD you stop having sex AND masturbating at the same time simply because you WANTED to or because sum1{like me} challenged you to?!?!?! see how ridiculous the stuff ur saying seems now, "if you really want to quite, youll quite, otherwise your too lazy or dont WANT to quit" . your coming from a place of ignorance.
Uhh...yes.
It's actually that simple. Why is that hard for you to grasp?
It's absolutely nothing like sex or masturbation, we're talking about addictions, nor urges. Though, like smoking, I suppose you have to have done it to know that.
Oh wait, no you don't.
-AC
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Uhh...yes.It's actually that simple. Why is that hard for you to grasp?
It's absolutely nothing like sex or masturbation, we're talking about addictions, nor urges. Though, like smoking, I suppose you have to have done it to know that.
Oh wait, no you don't.
-AC
LOL?
Leon, you are partially correct. I agree with the logic. In fact, I do think some of the same "pleasure" receptors are modulated with the two. However, there are differences. I think they would fall under two different types of addictions.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Uhh...yes.It's actually that simple. Why is that hard for you to grasp?
It's absolutely nothing like sex or masturbation, we're talking about addictions, nor urges. Though, like smoking, I suppose you have to have done it to know that.
Oh wait, no you don't.
-AC
Eaaarrrmmm....
addiction is what causes urges. have you never heard of people being addicted to sex? being addicted to exercise, or to the computer, or addicted to self-harming?
but you keep on your "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" attitude. that's okay. i just want to be there when the nervous breakdown and/or heart attack hits.
Originally posted by siriuswriter
Eaaarrrmmm....addiction is what causes urges. have you never heard of people being addicted to sex? being addicted to exercise, or to the computer, or addicted to self-harming?
but you keep on your "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" attitude. that's okay. i just want to be there when the nervous breakdown and/or heart attack hits.
Addiction causes urges? No, bodily functions cause urges.
Urge is a desire to do something, an addiction is a NEED to HAVE something/do something.
You may really, really want to bone a chick, but your body is not NEEDING it. You will not suffer negative bodily reactions if you do not acquire sex.
An addiction is where your body needs something. Nobody is physically addicted to sex, or exercise, or cutting. These are not physical addictions whereby if the body is not given what it has grown to NEED, it will suffer physical reactions.
These are MENTAL "addictions", o.k.a: ones that don't actually exist outside of the mind, and are simply people convincing themselves of something. So then we come back to my point; just stop doing it. If you are the only thing between quitting and not quitting, and you...don't quit, then YOU are the problem.
So no, they're not the same are they? Everyone can stop being ridiculous.
Now, say I didn't have a breakdown.
-AC
Originally posted by leonheartmm
^the withdrawel from heroin is much smaller in length than with smoking.
You what? For a start, do you have any idea how horrible opiate withdrawal can be? You should also have a chat to some ex heroin addicts, see how long the psychological addiction can actually last.
... and I was trying to explain earlier, there is a mental bond when someone becomes addicted to something physical. If you're used to having two packs a day, you'll keep on with two packs a day. It's become familiar to you. Equalling mental bond.
It's getting very annoying talking to you, you're probably just skimming over my posts, so that's you just keeping up your attitude and not willing to be open to other points of view. You witnessed one extremely internally strong person quit smoking cold turkey. Not everyone has that same inner grit. Some people need help to keep them on track. Maybe I have strong as steel will... you say that I quit because I wanted to... well, I didn't want to, but I know that bad things would happen if I kept on. But I had no job and school was out at the time so I didn't have to focus on "other" things, just on me getting better.
Gah, ramble ramble ramble. I could probably type all day and nothing would change your mind. That's okay. I'm not going to continue to lead you to water when you simply refuse to even think about drinking.
Originally posted by siriuswriter
... and I was trying to explain earlier, there is a mental bond when someone becomes addicted to something physical. If you're used to having two packs a day, you'll keep on with two packs a day. It's become familiar to you. Equalling mental bond.
You're calling THAT the addiction, though.
The addiction is to the substance, physically. If you decide, mentally, that you do not want that anymore, then you can and will overcome the addiction. End of story.
Don't give me "It's not that easy.". It is, isn't it? You can't smoke if you have no cigarettes and eventually you won't want them. Thus, the point.
Mental "addiction" is arguably addiction at all. Since you can overturn it by yourself with no negative effects. YOU are all that stands in your way, there're no physical elements.
Originally posted by siriuswriter
It's getting very annoying talking to you, you're probably just skimming over my posts, so that's you just keeping up your attitude and not willing to be open to other points of view. You witnessed one extremely internally strong person quit smoking cold turkey. Not everyone has that same inner grit. Some people need help to keep them on track. Maybe I have strong as steel will... you say that I quit because I wanted to... well, I didn't want to, but I know that bad things would happen if I kept on. But I had no job and school was out at the time so I didn't have to focus on "other" things, just on me getting better.
I'm reading your posts and I'm open to your point of view, you're just wrong in mine.
No, I've witnessed many people quit, cold turkey. It doesn't take anyone "extremely internally strong", it's not climbing Mt. Doom, give me a break. Stop making it out to be some act of heroism. It's stopping a thing you chose to do. Big whoop.
You obviously wanted to quit, or you wouldn't have quit. You wanted to use drugs, based on addiction. However, you wanted to quit because that's what was best and you chose to, so you did.
Originally posted by siriuswriter
Gah, ramble ramble ramble. I could probably type all day and nothing would change your mind. That's okay. I'm not going to continue to lead you to water when you simply refuse to even think about drinking.
I haven't touched a drink in years.
It's called choosing not to. Learn about it.
-AC